How Chrétien’s gutsy call on Iraq put him on the right side of history

[Army Guy]

18 hours ago, BeaverFever said:

I think toure mixinf up the 2 gulf wars there. The famous incident with the AA missile and Iraqi PT boat is from Desert storm. It didn’t work thought he ended up strafing it setting it on fire and then a US plane eventually took it out 

RCN was deployed to the gulf didn’t do much because Canadian ships back then had no air defence capabilities. Our forces we’re officially part of the coalition but far from the front 

 

For Iraq war 2 Bush Jr Boogaloo weee sent nobody and nothing   We could have scraped up a smal tole rear echelon contingent or redirect a company of soldiers from Afghanistan or sent a ship or something symbolically like so many other countries sid. We could have just sent money or a good luck card like most of the contributors to Bushs “coalition” did just to be counted. But we refused. 

I did get the Gulf wars mixed up...thanks for that pick up.

Air defense was being provided by Air defense soldiers armed with Manpads on board each ship, plus i think there was some other new systems that were purchased not sure if they were sea whiz or some gun platform. 

Javelin portable anti-aircraft missile system | Missilery.info

Gulf war II however did see Canadian soldiers imbedded in US army units. Walter Natynczyk being the most recognized one, one of 70 plus Canadian soldiers detached to US army units, during Operation Iraqi freedom.
 

And i was sure there was a naval presence under some other operation...searching ships for weapons' and arms smuggling. can't find the reference yet...

there were also these operations ongoing in Iraq during operation freedom as listed below, Iraqi freedom, Iris, and NATO training Missions... all had Canadian soldiers taking part. 

 Past operations - Canada.ca

Quote

including the Deputy Commanding General of the Multi-National Corps – Iraq during Operation Iraqi Freedom.^[9][10] Natynczyk led the Corps' 35,000 soldiers, consisting of 10 separate brigades, stationed throughout the Iraq Theatre of Operations.^[3][11] He was later awarded the Meritorious Service Cross specifically for his combat efforts in Operation Iraqi Freedom January 2004 to January 2005.^[12]

 

[blackbird]

Just for the record, this is what Chretien said about the Chinese Communist interference in Canadian elections:

quote

It’s also all to the good that the spotlight has been bright on the dirty work of Beijing’s agents of influence in efforts to monkey-wrench the outcome of the 2019 and 2021 federal elections to the advantage of Justin Trudeau’s Liberals, and that Canadian tempers have not been so easily soothed by former prime minister Jean Chrétien’s cavalier assessment : “Ten or 15 constituencies in Canada at most? I don’t think it’s a very big problem.” "

Terry Glavin: Why we may have finally reached a tipping point on Chinese interference (msn.com)

You be the judge.

 

[BeaverFever]

5 hours ago, Army Guy said:

I did get the Gulf wars mixed up...thanks for that pick up.

Air defense was being provided by Air defense soldiers armed with Manpads on board each ship, plus i think there was some other new systems that were purchased not sure if they were sea whiz or some gun platform. 

Javelin portable anti-aircraft missile system | Missilery.info

Gulf war II however did see Canadian soldiers imbedded in US army units. Walter Natynczyk being the most recognized one, one of 70 plus Canadian soldiers detached to US army units, during Operation Iraqi freedom.
 

And i was sure there was a naval presence under some other operation...searching ships for weapons' and arms smuggling. can't find the reference yet...

there were also these operations ongoing in Iraq during operation freedom as listed below, Iraqi freedom, Iris, and NATO training Missions... all had Canadian soldiers taking part. 

 Past operations - Canada.ca

 

Yep the AD troops dispatched to the ships originally had Blowpipes brought out of storage specifically for the mission, which were a more primitive version of the javelin. But so many Blowpipes malfunctioned that emergency Javelins were bought in a hurry. The whole thing was regarded as a bit of a joke though, a MANPAD can’t really provide effective aor defence for a ship. You’re not going to shoot down an Exocet missile with a Javelin or maybe any MANPAD while the ship is taking evasive maneuvers  and bobbing in the waves. Moreover The blowpipe fired a remote control missile- not a self guided missile mind you, you actually have a joystick and after launch try to fly the missile after your target and it had a terrible performance history in the Falkland War. The Javelin upgrade ditched the joystick and used optical tracking like a wireless TOW missile but still probably not a practical air defence at sea. 
 

I don’t count embedded Canadian troops, it wasn’t Canada sending them there and the naval operation in the ME were separate from Iraq invasion

 

Yes since 2014-2015 we have supported missions in Iraq against ISIS and to stabilize Iraq but that’s like a decade after the Iraq invasion and also after the US withdrawal and end of the occupation  That’s not Bush’s invasion and occupation under Operation Iraqi Freedom which was 2003-2011  

 

 

[OftenWrong]

1 hour ago, Contrarian said:

Even @OftenWrong as moderator, the man I saw him, has principles, he only attacks you -> if you attack him.

Seen him even in direct conversation, I think OftenWrong with a stick will make this board better. The man can leave his personal battles aside, I even read that he was an idealist once, I believe it, some give up and rant. 

Why thank you, I think. It's ironic because you would probably be the first one to be immediately dismissed, under my regime...  

 

The real problem with me as moderator is you might all get banned eventually.

 

[OftenWrong]

I don't think Dougie is a troll

any more than I think anyone here is a troll

since we are all anonymous

there is no need for anyone to be truthful

about who they really are

people can say whatever you want

besides I like his style

in my mind

there is only one rule that should matter here

and that is

no bad writing

no bad writing

[Dougie93]

6 hours ago, Contrarian said:

I forgot to add an attachment, for the new people as to who this element is, read below: 

again, you simply do not understand what the Commonwealth is

the Commonwealth is not a state, the Commonwealth is not an alliance

there is no Commonwealth treaty, the Commonwealth has no legal basis

the Commonwealth is a cultural organization

for example, the two largest members of the Commonwealth are India and Pakistan

and they are nuclear armed mortal enemies who have fought five wars against each other

I am not bound to fight for the Commonwealth against America

the only relevant alliance Canada is signatory to is the United Kingdom United States of America agreement

which would actually bind Canadians to fight for America against a Commonwealth member as necessary

[Dougie93]

9 minutes ago, Contrarian said:

Of course, you do not, always, always, the same ilk group together when they are called upon their bullying, trolling, and harassment. 

Is called the pack. ?

you are the one violating the rules of the forum

you spam up every thread castigating members with defamatory attacks

that's actually prohibited by the rules of the forum

[Dougie93]

12 minutes ago, Contrarian said:

I don't care what you think bully troll. I am just exposing the information to the public as to what kind of element you are.

You are just an example that I am using. ?

sounds like you are a narcissistic egomaniac

[Dougie93]

4 minutes ago, Contrarian said:

That's ok, because I want to shake the status quo so much here for some rules to be established against bully trolls like you that polluted this board for so long. How the powers that be don't see how toxic you are, you bring nothing of value, no original threads, just repeat the same messages as a broken tape. 

If I get banned in the process for my style, that's ok, I can have my own website running within 1 hour with all my ideas from here and will make sure you will be featured as the number 1 example for the bully troll that you are. 

You are lecturing me about the rules of the forum. You are just upset that I came in here and challenged you on the bullying that you got away with for so long. The fun is just getting started, you better stop drinking the cheap stuff and behave yourself, bully troll. 

 I am not bullying anyone, I am not engaging in any personal attacks at all

that would be you who is doing that

[Dougie93]

5 minutes ago, Contrarian said:

Just like you, troll. Except, I use the anger, and instinct to do harm by channeling my energy towards offering something in the process. 

You are like a mad dog brother, you chose a thread and pollute it with 5-10 consecutive posts about nonsense and destroy the flow of conversation in the process. 

If the admin or the powers that be don't see you as an issue, all I am doing is you challenging you on your bullying and lack of producitvity. 

I only post for my friends & followers here

anyone not wishing to read it can simply use the ignore function

[Dougie93]

6 minutes ago, Contrarian said:

For a simple thread about hockey on this website, you managed to bring politics and nonsense into that one, when one man just wanted to talk about hockey. I don't have emotional problems to keep doing this to you, but is time some rules to be established or I will be banned, start my own website, use you still as an example, and you can have this space to yourself to continue doing what you are doing. For "followers" and "friends". Rap Man. ?

Iceni Warrior started that thread

he has no quarrel with me

because he is my personal friend who I have known for years

[Dougie93]

1 minute ago, Contrarian said:

Who cares who started it? You were lecturing me about forum rules. I just provided an example of how you pollute this platform.

you are the one hijacking the threads

you are hijacking this thread to go on a rapid fire posting self aggrandizing tirade

[Dougie93]

Just now, Contrarian said:

Yes, panic:

You can't be a bully anymore, don't you get it? You were king here for so long with people being afraid of you, but not anymore. Who is here to support you? 1-3 people? That's it? Weak Rap Man. 

Go listen to Drake and rap, that is what you are good for you. 

Here, the first few pages were reasonable discussions and just like the hockey thread, you came in and polluted. I am just the reaction, until rules get established, is that easy, bully troll. 

all you do is going around from thread to thread calling people "Nazis"

you make a dozen threads a day, when they don't get any attention

you then hijack other threads so you can launch into personal attacks to get attention

 

[Dougie93]

Just now, Contrarian said:

No such thing, that is someone else, I never called anyone "Nazis" that is a fringe left-wing tactics, from someone else that can't hold to ideas form the left. 

Neo-Nazis, yes, you, but nobody else on this board, except a weak troll like you. Why? Because of your messages when the German National Socialist tried to take over and then you deleted them. 

You are not worthy to be a "nazi" brother, I met and know people from the OG "Nazis" those people are grounded in their insanity, they would look at you as a servent, use you for a few tasks and disregard you as an element that you are.  

I have never posted anything in support of National Socialism

and you are exactly like some far leftist Antifah troll spamming up every thread to call people "Nazis"

[Dougie93]

Just now, Contrarian said:

⬆️ Fact Check. People can read my messages and see that I challenge both trolls Antifa and people like you. Reverseve psychology desperation from the bully troll. 

Another manipulation in desperation. I like that nobody is here to support you, it gets to show me that people know you are a bully troll and all you have left is the sugar from the government that people like me pay towards. 

nobody is here to support you

you've been told to knock it off by many long standing members of the forum

[Dougie93]

1 minute ago, Contrarian said:

I don't want people to support me. If I wanted to do that, would have played Rap and yell nonsense, then the mob would come. 

My goal is not support or popularity, that's just you, an insecure troll that society isolated and now you think you are some sort of King here through lies. Not anymore. ?

you are the one appointing yourself king of the forum

I post in one or two threads here & there, and I get a lot of support & agreement when I do

you post in practically every single thread, you spam up the entire forum with your self aggrandizing tirades

[Dougie93]

3 minutes ago, Contrarian said:

Anyhow, the above is my reasonable contribution to this thread, then I encourage people to read your arrival @Dougie93 on this thread and see the level of discussion after. 

Remember, sugar is not unlimited. There is so much you can do without physics coming after you. 

nobody is coming after me

I have many friends & followers here, the number of members who quarrel with me is a tiny minority

[Dougie93]

2 minutes ago, Contrarian said:

I posted several free courses on my thread, why don't you take a course on cyber or something new instead of what you are doing?! It might help you. 

again, you are the one acting as if this is your personal forum

every thread here is about you now, since you have hijacked the entire forum with your ceaseless tirades

 

[Dougie93]

9 minutes ago, Contrarian said:

 or you call it "weed" in your rap circles.

in my "rao" circles ?

take that one to the public

quite sure you will be spotted for being an anti-black racist therein

[Dougie93]

4 minutes ago, Contrarian said:

Rap Circles, yes, you post about Rap which I consider low-IQ music that does not contribute to society. Do you want me to start a thread about it and debate via original and civilized language? I will do it, good idea, you see even in your anger you deliver me ideas. 

I see now you are trying the Antifa tactic on me, talking about racism, wow, weakness, when everything fails you run to communist tactics from Antifa for not agreeing with a style of low-graded music.  ?

Drake, rap music, and weed

those are three very popular things indeed

I don't think the public is onside with your tirades against them

[Dougie93]

1 minute ago, Contrarian said:

I will start a thread + poll and as in a democracy, we will see. I disagree, my view is that most people don't like rap, I think black Conservatives don't like rap,  they are just afraid to say it because the left-wing mobs come running with racist accusations or "Uncle Tom", which is a tactic that you are employing now too. 

I like all types of music

I concede that I prefer gospel, bluegrass, country & rock mostly

but I like rap music too

I was raised on hip hop after all

I am Generation X

we are the hip hop generation

[Dougie93]

10 minutes ago, Contrarian said:

 my view is that most people don't like rap, I think black Conservatives don't like rap,

I like what I like

it never occurs to me what "black Conservatives" like or don't like , I don't speak for them

[Dougie93]

1 minute ago, Contrarian said:

Man, I told you already I will start the thread, working on it, you responded once to me, why do you need to send consecutive messages to pollute this thread? You are just making my point ?

Even brought a message here so we can discuss the main thread, nothing, the drink and the weed brother + the rap, makes you lose reason. 

you have hijacked this thread rapid fire posting your self aggrandizing tirade

you started off by calling me a "Nazi" again

when that didn't get any traction

 you have become increasingly desperate, now attacking me for liking rap music

because Nazi's are well known for their love of rap music of course

[Dougie93]

1 minute ago, Contrarian said:

⬆️ Fack Check. People should read this thread, the first few pages, and then when the troll arrived. Never once I used the word "nazi" which is left-wing fringes tactics that you engage in, weakling. 

Now, I am starting an original thread about rap, while the troll keeps wanting to have the last word as he wants to "win". 

?

you are the one who said you would "never back down" just a few posts ago

so you have openly stated that you are trying to win something

I was talking about Jean Chretien in this thread, before you came along

 

[Dougie93]

Just now, Contrarian said:

Yes, shake your echo chamber of a troll. Don't care about popularity and traction.

of course you do

your attacks on this forum are the classic tactics of females

you desperately engage in GSR

Gossiping, Shaming & Rallying

you are desperately trying to rally "the public" around you, by gossiping & shaming

but that really only works on females