Russian Army collapsing - the unsurprising failure of a police-state

[BeaverFever]

On 10/25/2022 at 10:49 PM, WestCanMan said:

By your logic Kennedy had no right to oppose nukes in Cuba. 

Just say that you think the Cuban Missile Crisis was an affront to Cuban sovereignty then we can agree to disagree and I won't call you a worthless GD hypocrite.

Enough with your idiotic false comparisons to the Cuban missile crisis. Russias invasion of Ukraine is nothing like the Cuban missile crisis. It is like Hitler’s invasion of Poland. 
 

On 10/25/2022 at 10:49 PM, WestCanMan said:

No, in this world you can consent to physical violence.

Wrong. Learn the law.  
 

On 10/25/2022 at 10:49 PM, WestCanMan said:

I'm a conservative. We're law and order people almost to a man. You'll never understand.

You clearly know jack sh-t about law and order. Wanting to inflict sadistic cruelty on people you hate and selectively citing the law as an excuse to do so when it’s convenient doesn’t make you a “law amd order person.” It makes you the opposite.  True law and order people  wouldn’t support the BIG LIE and the Insurrection and the invasion of Ukraine, to name just a few.  

 

[BeaverFever]

On 10/25/2022 at 10:51 PM, WestCanMan said:

I don't give a rip.

The same people who blew up a Russian pipeline and blamed it on Putin probably killed Yushchenko. Maybe he was gonna lose anyways and they couldn't Biden that election for him. 

LMAO God you really don’t know sh-t about this topic do you?  And yet you somehow claim to be the expert on what’s happening there and demand we bow to to your shockingly ignorant opinion?  

Yuschenko survived the poisoning and won the election, genius. 
 

Sooper-smurt Profsr Westcan strikes again! Durp!

 

But you’re right the same person behind Yuschenkos poisoning probably blew up Nordstream… and that person was probably Putin 

[WestCanMan]

10 hours ago, BeaverFever said:

Enough with your idiotic false comparisons to the Cuban missile crisis. Russias invasion of Ukraine is nothing like the Cuban missile crisis. It is like Hitler’s invasion of Poland. 

That was a stupid comment. No need to wonder why.

[WestCanMan]

10 hours ago, BeaverFever said:

LMAO God you really don’t know sh-t about this topic do you?  

I don't care about an election from 2 decades ago. It's unimportant.

The FACT is that Russia will not allow NATO to their western border peacefully, nor should they. Period.

Just like Kennedy violently opposed nukes in Cuba, Putin violently opposes NATO in Ukraine. If you don't understand that then keep your head up your ass for all I care. 

Cry about fake collusion some more Beave. Cry about "the insurrection that's comparable to Pearl Harbour and 9/11!!!" Cry about stupid people winning stupid prizes in Ukraine.

Crimea river Beave. Your histrionics are unimportant. 

[Moonbox]

1 hour ago, WestCanMan said:

The FACT is that Russia will not allow NATO to their western border peacefully, nor should they. Period.

The actual FACT is that NATO is already on Russia's border and has been for a long time (peacefully), and that Putin's actions this year have directly led to Finland joining and therefore more than doubling Russia's direct abutment to NATO.  Russia cannot and will not stop this.  

He's also succeeded in making a generational enemy out of Ukraine, who he's failed to conquer, and cemented Russia's status as a pariah state in Europe for at least as long as he remains in power.  This is unfortunate for Russians because 75% of the Federation's population and urban centres are in Europe.  Russia trying to replace European trade through Asia would be like Canada trying to replace all of it's US trade overseas (not possible).  All of these are FACTS.  

TLDR:  Everything Putin's done lately has accomplished the exact opposite of what he intended.  

[WestCanMan]

2 minutes ago, Moonbox said:

The actual FACT is that NATO is already on Russia's border and has been for a long time (peacefully), and that Putin's actions this year have directly led to Finland joining and therefore more than doubling Russia's direct abutment to NATO.  Russia cannot and will not stop this.  

He's also succeeded in making a generational enemy out of Ukraine, who he's failed to conquer, and cemented Russia's status as a pariah state in Europe for at least as long as he remains in power.  This is unfortunate for Russians because 75% of the Federation's population and urban centres are in Europe.  Russia trying to replace European trade through Asia would be like Canada trying to replace all of it's US trade overseas (not possible).  All of these are FACTS.  

TLDR:  Everything Putin's done lately has accomplished the exact opposite of what he intended.  

We've all known for a long time that Latvia and Estonia were NATO members. They joined back when Russia was in complete turmoil and unable to do anything about it. 

Russia doesn't have to play nice with Ukraine dude. They just don''t, and I don't know what makes you think they should.

The US bombs countries all the time for much less of a reason than "Bringing a hostile military alliance to our border." In fact, aside from when Trump was POTUS, it's been a long time since a POTUS didn't start a war. 

Hopefully for all of our sakes, Biden doesn't manage to get his chemical/nuclear war with Russia up and running. 

[Moonbox]

1 hour ago, WestCanMan said:

We've all known for a long time that Latvia and Estonia were NATO members. They joined back when Russia was in complete turmoil and unable to do anything about it.

and now Finland is joining and Russia also can't do anything about it. 

1 hour ago, WestCanMan said:

Russia doesn't have to play nice with Ukraine dude. They just don''t, and I don't know what makes you think they should.

Why they should have is self-evident.  Russia's lost the majority of their professional army and loads of equipment and gained almost nothing from 8 months of war.  

NATO don't have to sit on their hands and let Russia bully who they please. They just don't.  

1 hour ago, WestCanMan said:

Hopefully for all of our sakes, Biden doesn't manage to get his chemical/nuclear war with Russia up and running. 

Sure, but the only madman who'd risk starting one is Putin, and he's the one you should be worried about.  The threat that he may start one is not logical rationale for acquiescing to his will either.  Letting villains and dictators take what they please because they threaten to push the red button is a blueprint for a shittier world, following the same logic as "we don't negotiate with terrorists".  

[WestCanMan]

12 minutes ago, Moonbox said:

and now Finland is joining and Russia also can't do anything about it. 

Finland applied. As far as I know they haven't been accepted by all 30 members yet.

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Why they should have is self-evident.  Russia's lost the majority of their professional army and loads of equipment and gained almost nothing from 8 months of war.  

OK, sure moonbox.

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NATO don't have to sit on their hands and let Russia bully who they please. They just don't.  

Yeah, they actually do.

Right nw NATO has no actual reason for joining that fight.

[Moonbox]

1 hour ago, WestCanMan said:

Finland applied. As far as I know they haven't been accepted by all 30 members yet.

It's been accepted by everyone but Hungary (who have absolutely no clout whatsoever and will ratify eventually after some limp Viktor posturing) and then Turkey, who will jockey for the next year or so but also also accede. Finland and Sweden will be part of NATO within the next 2-3 years max and if by some bizarre twist Turkey and Hungary decide to go rogue, a new defensive apparatus can always be assembled which they'll be left out of.   

1 hour ago, WestCanMan said:

Yeah, they actually do.

Yet they're not sitting on their hands, and so they very obviously don't have to do anything you're saying ?.  

1 hour ago, WestCanMan said:

Right nw NATO has no actual reason for joining that fight. 

Except virtually every country in the alliance disagrees with that assessment, despite your complaints.  Too bad.  

[WestCanMan]

3 minutes ago, Moonbox said:

Yet they're not sitting on their hands, and so they very obviously don't have to do anything you're saying ?.  

I didn't say they can't do anything at all, and you could always make war on anyone you want, they just don't have any real cause right now. Russia is just fighting some Nazis again.

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Except virtually every country in the alliance disagrees with that assessment, despite your complaints.  Too bad.  

Yeah, it's all for show. 

"Let's quickly get a bunch of yeses without doing anything that's Biden-level stupid, like start a nuclear war."

[Moonbox]

7 minutes ago, WestCanMan said:

I didn't say they can't do anything at all, and you could always make war on anyone you want, they just don't have any real cause right now. Russia is just fighting some Nazis again.

The Nazi argument is low effort garbage - the same thing as the satanic pedophile cabals.  Point at the "others", call them the worst thing you can possibly think of, then see how many susceptible and gullible mooks bite. 

Even the Russian soldiers in Ukraine don't believe it, else they'd have more than a thimble-full of fighting spirit and would have done more than surrender, retreat or stall for the last 4 months.  ?

 

[WestCanMan]

54 minutes ago, Moonbox said:

The Nazi argument is low effort garbage 

I think that you'd have a pretty stern opinion of a conservative who ran with actual Nazis. You just don't think this is a big deal because leftists are traditionally ok with fascism.

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 the same thing as the satanic pedophile cabals. 

That's your thing. You can believe what you want about it. 

I only speak to actual facts.

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 Point at the "others", call them the worst thing you can possibly think of, then see how many susceptible and gullible mooks bite. 

This is clearly not a case of "calling them the worst thing I can possibly think of" and FYI  it's not credulous mooks that are saying the Azovs are Nazis. It's the Azovs that are saying they're Nazis, and it's credulous mooks like you that are denying it. 

You leftards are such GD liars it's insane.

You'll believe that a man is a woman if they just say it's so, but if a group of men say that they're Nazis, wear Nazi symbols, and get Nazi symbols tattooed on their bodies, commit actual war crimes, and are accepted to be an actual Nazi military unit by their own government, you'll say things like: "I actually approve of the war crimes that they committed - these guys aren't actual Nazis and it's ridiculous to pretend that they are!"

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Even the Russian soldiers in Ukraine don't believe it, else they'd have more than a thimble-full of fighting spirit and would have done more than surrender, retreat or stall for the last 4 months.  ?  

It's weird how the Russians have been losing every day, since day 1, and yet they always have territory to lose. Have te Nazis pushed their way into Gorky Park now? 

Edited October 27, 2022 by WestCanMan

[Nationalist]

Speaking of military collapse...

"810. That is how many German reservist soldiers have asked to resign from the military this year, four times the amount in a normal year. Der Spiegel reports that many do not want to fight in the escalated war in Ukraine."

redacted.inc

 

[Moonbox]

21 hours ago, WestCanMan said:

I think that you'd have a pretty stern opinion of a conservative who ran with actual Nazis. You just don't think this is a big deal because leftists are traditionally ok with fascism.

Fascism is a far-right ideology by definition, goof. 

21 hours ago, WestCanMan said:

That's your thing. You can believe what you want about it. 

I only speak to actual facts.

Your relationship with facts and reality is...distant.  

[Moonbox]

7 hours ago, Nationalist said:

Speaking of military collapse...

"810. That is how many German reservist soldiers have asked to resign from the military this year, four times the amount in a normal year. Der Spiegel reports that many do not want to fight in the escalated war in Ukraine."

redacted.inc

If 810 resignations constitutes "military collapse", what would you call +80,000 Russian casualties in Ukraine?  ?

[eyeball]

On 10/17/2022 at 7:26 AM, DogOnPorch said:

People are very flippant about nuclear weapons these days. More than a few really seem to think that a nuclear exchange would be survivable.

Maybe the flippant attitude people show towards climate change is rubbing off.  In any case we'll never make progress against the latter until we do something about all the dictators now standing in the way.

What were we thinking when we helped so many of them up in the first place?

[Nationalist]

3 hours ago, Moonbox said:

If 810 resignations constitutes "military collapse", what would you call +80,000 Russian casualties in Ukraine?  ?

War.

[Moonbox]

11 minutes ago, Nationalist said:

War.

You mean:

Losing at war  ?

[WestCanMan]

3 hours ago, Moonbox said:

Fascism is a far-right ideology by definition, goof. 

Yet the Nazis called themselves socialists, and Trudeau is well on his way to being a fascist as well, genius.

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Your relationship with facts and reality is...

A real pain in your neck. I know. All leftards hate facts, you're not unique. 

[BeaverFever]

On 10/27/2022 at 10:32 AM, WestCanMan said:

That was a stupid comment. No need to wonder why.

Agree, your comment trying to compare Putin’s invasion to Cuban missile crisis WAS stupid. Glad you take it back. 

[BeaverFever]

On 10/27/2022 at 10:37 AM, WestCanMan said:

I don't care about an election from 2 decades ago. 

Refusing to make yourself aware of relevant information is the definition of ignorance. ALL CURRENT EVENTS ARE THE RESULT OF PRECEDING EVENTS 

 

On 10/27/2022 at 10:37 AM, WestCanMan said:

The FACT is that Russia will not allow NATO to their western border peacefully, nor should they. Period….

No, the FACT is that under INTERNATIONAL LAW Russia doesn’t get to make decisions for other sovereign countries. Period.  And it’s also a fact that the only reason Ukraine is interested in NATO is because of decades of Russian aggression which you conveniently know nothing about and claim is “unimportant”. 
 

On 10/27/2022 at 10:37 AM, WestCanMan said:

Just like Kennedy

LMAO your murderous dictator Putin is nothing like Kennedy, February 2022 was nothing like the peak Cold War, Ukraine’s slow moving low level talk of maybe some day joining NATO was nothing like USSR putting nukes in Cuba and Putin’s brutal invasion is nothing like the Cuba embargo. Enough with your desperate pathetic and shockingly idiotic false comparisons. 

Edited October 28, 2022 by BeaverFever

[WestCanMan]

57 minutes ago, BeaverFever said:

Agree, your comment trying to compare Putin’s invasion to Cuban missile crisis WAS stupid. Glad you take it back. 

It's a straight-up, simple comparison. 

You think that "Murica can go Defcon 1 because there are some missiles 1,400 miles away, but Russia has to sit by and let Ukraine park NATO on their doorstep." I get it. That's why I place no value whatsoever on your opinion.

[WestCanMan]

45 minutes ago, BeaverFever said:

Refusing to make yourself aware of relevant information is the definition of ignorance. ALL CURRENT EVENTS ARE THE RESULT OF PRECEDING EVENTS 

 

No, the FACT is that under INTERNATIONAL LAW Russia doesn’t get to make decisions for other sovereign countries. Period.  And it’s also a fact that the only reason Ukraine is interested in NATO is because of decades of Russian aggression which you conveniently know nothing about and claim is “unimportant”. 
 

 

What is Russia doing in Ukraine that the CIA and FBI haven't done in 50 countries? Was the Bay of Pigs any more legal than when the US poisoned Yuckabunko and blamed it on Russia? 

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LMAO your murderous dictator Putin is nothing like Kennedy, February 2022 was nothing like the peak Cold War, Ukraine’s slow moving low level talk of maybe some day joining NATO was nothing like USSR putting nukes in Cuba and Putin’s brutal invasion is nothing like the Cuba embargo. Enough with your desperate pathetic and shockingly idiotic false comparisons. 

Ukraine's "slow-moving low-level talk involved Biden, the VPOTUS at the time, going there to "clean up Ukrainian corruption" (with a big bucket for hauling away cash) so that Ukraine could get into NATO. 

That's not "low-level". You could argue that when the VPOTUS is taking the lead on a project, and flying across the planet several times in his ongoing efforts, it's not "low-level".

I'm gonna go ahead and guess that you still think it's low-level.

Oh, would you look at that, I'm right. (I just time-travelled to get that answer. Either that or somehow I just know that you're gonna say something stupid or tell another lie).

"Embargo"? The word they used was "quarantine" fwiw. The "quarantine" involved dropping depth charges on Russian subs to force them to the surface, where they were at the mercy of the entire Atlantic fleet (FYI those are bad odds for a sub, just so ya know).

FYI embargo was the word that they used for the economic sanctioning of Cuba, long after this near-nuclear episode unfolded. 

This is how close the world came to nuclear war in '62: 

 

 

[Nationalist]

4 hours ago, Moonbox said:

You mean:

Losing at war  ?

Perhaps. If that would end it tomorrow...sure.

Unlike you, I don't care who wins or loses.

[BeaverFever]

3 hours ago, WestCanMan said:

It's a straight-up, simple comparison. 

You think that "Murica can go Defcon 1 because there are some missiles 1,400 miles away, but Russia has to sit by and let Ukraine park NATO on their doorstep." I get it. That's why I place no value whatsoever on your opinion.

I repeat:

LMAO your murderous dictator Putin is nothing like Kennedy, February 2022 was nothing like the peak Cold War, Ukraine’s slow moving low level talk of maybe some day joining NATO was nothing like USSR putting nukes in Cuba and Putin’s brutal invasion is nothing like the Cuba embargo. Enough with your desperate pathetic and shockingly idiotic false comparisons.