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Alberta awards $200 prize to essay that says sexes are not equal, women should pick babies over careers


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1 hour ago, BeaverFever said:

What about a “powerfully written persuasive piece” arguing  that Bin Laden was right to carry out 9/11 or Hitler was right to carry out the holocaust?  Would you give a prize for that?

I don’t fear knowledge.  Knowledge is power.  That’s basic Foucault.

Oh I get it.  The question of the essay’s content is a Rorsach test. What you expect is how you see the world.  

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15 hours ago, TreeBeard said:

Even the ones handing out the prizes now say they shouldn’t have rewarded those opinions. 
 

“In a follow-up statement later Tuesday, Armstrong-Homeniuk apologized after she said she heard concerns from her caucus and cabinet colleagues.

 

“It’s clear that the process failed, and I apologize for my role in that. The selection of this particular essay and awarding it with third prize was a failure on my part as the head of the judging panel,” she stated.”

https://edmontonjournal.com/news/politics/prize-winning-sexist-racist-essay-should-not-have-been-chosen-alberta-associate-minister

What a chicken this Armstrong-Homeniuk is...

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1 hour ago, BeaverFever said:

You didn’t answer the question. 

I don’t agree with the assumptions behind your question, so it doesn’t warrant my response.

Don’t compare this girl’s opinions to Nazism you divisive fake.  You’re so far to the left and so woke and into identity politics that you don’t know which way is up.  In your world saying woman is offensive and discussing how certain values may be preferable is racist, patriarchal, misogynist.  I don’t agree with your ridiculous views so I won’t dignify your question with a response.  

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1 hour ago, Zeitgeist said:

I don’t agree with the assumptions behind your question, so it doesn’t warrant my response.

Don’t compare this girl’s opinions to Nazism you divisive fake.  You’re so far to the left and so woke and into identity politics that you don’t know which way is up.  In your world saying woman is offensive and discussing how certain values may be preferable is racist, patriarchal, misogynist.  I don’t agree with your ridiculous views so I won’t dignify your question with a response.  

I’m not comparing them with nazism, you just can’t  grasp the obvious hole in your own argument which you can’t even see with your ideological blinders on  Now you’re changing your tune and suggesting that there ARE in fact some ideas that should be disqualified even if they are “powerfully written persuasive piece?”  Your earlier comment didn’t suggest that you draw the line anywhere  But you DO draw a line then?  Answer the question its yes or no. Please clarify  

Your childish accusations of what you claim I believe in and find offensive are also wrong, And your pivot to personal attack just shows you’re frustrated and flustered. 

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2 hours ago, BeaverFever said:

I’m not comparing them with nazism, you just can’t  grasp the obvious hole in your own argument which you can’t even see with your ideological blinders on  Now you’re changing your tune and suggesting that there ARE in fact some ideas that should be disqualified even if they are “powerfully written persuasive piece?”  Your earlier comment didn’t suggest that you draw the line anywhere  But you DO draw a line then?  Answer the question its yes or no. Please clarify  

Your childish accusations of what you claim I believe in and find offensive are also wrong, And your pivot to personal attack just shows you’re frustrated and flustered. 

My views are well documented and centrist.  It’s your narrow definition of free speech that I think is fake, hypocritical, and unfair.   So the girl thinks women should have more traditional roles.  I might agree with that.  Haven’t read the essay.  She thinks we should make Canada a good place for Canadians to raise kids and encourage it so we’re not constantly having to import people whose values may clash with Canadian values?   Again, it depends on the argument.   I do see a lot of challenges and social tensions arise when immigrants don’t speak one of the official languages or make an effort to integrate outside their ethnic enclaves.  It raises the question of why we have the immigration policies that we have.  I don’t assume her comments are racist and misogynist.  Sorry Trudeau.  Not sorry.  

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On 8/11/2022 at 8:20 PM, Zeitgeist said:

My views are well documented and centrist.  It’s your narrow definition of free speech that I think is fake, hypocritical, and unfair.   So the girl thinks women should have more traditional roles.  I might agree with that.  Haven’t read the essay.  She thinks we should make Canada a good place for Canadians to raise kids and encourage it so we’re not constantly having to import people whose values may clash with Canadian values?   Again, it depends on the argument.   I do see a lot of challenges and social tensions arise when immigrants don’t speak one of the official languages or make an effort to integrate outside their ethnic enclaves.  It raises the question of why we have the immigration policies that we have.  I don’t assume her comments are racist and misogynist.  Sorry Trudeau.  Not sorry.  

They are overtly racist and misogynist.  You’re either a fool or being completely dishonest to claim anyone who believes government should not be awarding prizes to essays like this is attacking “free speech”. Nobody is calling for her to be arrested or silenced. 

 

EVERYONE on the left and the right believes “we should make Canada a good place for Canadians to raise kids” y its dishonest to suggest that’s all she is trying to do. In fact it is already a good place to raise kids. In fact most would agree that it would be less so if women were removed from the workforce and returned to their traditional role of unpaid domestic servant, completely dependent upon a male guardian  for their personal and financial wellbeing. 
 

The “immigrants who don’t speak an official language outside of their ethnic enclave” or “clash with our value” is a straw man argument especially given the irony that the sexist racist ideas harboured by this essay are more similar to such immigrants than they are to Canadians.  If you really want Canadians to keep their women out of the workplace and at home raising a large brood of kids amd washing your dirty underwear for you, then you should want to import MORE Taliban and tribal types from the third world because that’s where those distinctly un-Canadian ideas are still prevalent.  Sorry Bin Laden. Not Sorry. 

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1 hour ago, BeaverFever said:

They are overtly racist and misogynist.  You’re either a fool or being completely dishonest to claim anyone who believes government should not be awarding prizes to essays like this is attacking “free speech”. Nobody is calling for her to be arrested or silenced. 

 

EVERYONE on the left and the right believes “we should make Canada a good place for Canadians to raise kids” y its dishonest to suggest that’s all she is trying to do. In fact it is already a good place to raise kids. In fact most would agree that it would be less so if women were removed from the workforce and returned to their traditional role of unpaid domestic servant, completely dependent upon a male guardian  for their personal and financial wellbeing. 
 

The “immigrants who don’t speak an official language outside of their ethnic enclave” or “clash with our value” is a straw man argument especially given the irony that the sexist racist ideas harboured by this essay are more similar to such immigrants than they are to Canadians.  If you really want Canadians to keep their women out of the workplace and at home raising a large brood of kids amd washing your dirty underwear for you, then you should want to import MORE Taliban and tribal types from the third world because that’s where those distinctly un-Canadian ideas are still prevalent.  Sorry Bin Laden. Not Sorry. 

I think your views are racist because you don’t seem to think there’s a Canadian culture or that it has value and is worth protecting.  I think you’re misogynist because you can’t understand why a female might want to embrace maternal characteristics.  You seem to think women must embrace traditionally male roles to be valid people.  I find your views narrow minded.

I’ve learned and said more about the importance of opposing the Taliban than you probably will in your lifetime.  Nice failed try.

If you’re so intent on looking progressive (though I think you’re a fake hypocrite), why don’t you fight for affordable housing and greater opportunity for Canadians, as that will help address the plight of recent immigrants who are struggling.

With regard to women’s rights and equity.  More women are entering university now than men.  There are more females in med school now than men.  Despite long bouts of absence from the workforce and one of the most generous mat leave policies in the developed world, women earn on average almost the same as men.  Far fewer men take paternity leaves than women take maternity leaves. Women can remain without a career or education and still be respected as mothers snd/or homemakers.  Men generally are not.  In fact, the highest suicide rates are among middle aged men.

Quit with the totally shallow activist comments.  Go back to your cultural Marxist-nihilist training camp and get back to me in 20 years.  

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16 minutes ago, Zeitgeist said:

I think your views are racist because you don’t seem to think there’s a Canadian culture or that it has value and is worth protecting.


 

17 minutes ago, Zeitgeist said:

I think you’re misogynist because you can’t understand why a female might want to embrace maternal characteristics.


I think you’re redefining those terms to suit your argument.  

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16 minutes ago, TreeBeard said:

We agree.  And I bet @BeaverFever agrees too.   Except you labelled them as misogynist. And racist.  Redefining both those terms to mean something that they’re not. 

Then I’ve made my point about the problem of throwing around accusations of racism and misogyny.  Accusing the girl who wrote that essay of both of these quality is presumptuous and unfair.   Look at her arguments and judge them on their power of persuasion.  Leave the character assassination out.  It’s a common tactic of the left that I’ve learned can only be nullified by illustrating the hypocrisy and leaps of logic.  Such accusations can also lead to cancellation.  They are in poor taste.  It needs to stop.  

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5 minutes ago, Zeitgeist said:

Then I’ve made my point about the problem of throwing around accusations of racism and misogyny.  Accusing the girl who wrote that essay of both of these quality is presumptuous and unfair.   Look at her arguments and judge them on their power of persuasion.  Leave the character assassination out.  It’s a common tactic of the left that I’ve learned can only be nullified by illustrating the hypocrisy and leaps of logic.  Such accusations can also lead to cancellation.  They are in poor taste.  It needs to stop.  

Except the comments from the essay did seem to be racist.   The “white replacement theory” garbage deserves to be called out as racist nonsense. 

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53 minutes ago, TreeBeard said:

Except the comments from the essay did seem to be racist.   The “white replacement theory” garbage deserves to be called out as racist nonsense. 

I didn’t see any language like that.  Immigration in any country is always a threat to the home culture if it’s not managed well.  Not all cultures support democracy or would be considered progressive by your standards.  It’s important to be able to have serious conversations about this without knee-jerk self-loathing accusations of racism. We’re exceptional in the world to be so self-effacing.  Countries like Japan could never embrace our level of immigration.  While immigration has many advantages, it can skew markets like housing to exorbitant prices and lead to social tensions and ghettoization without integration, including on the language front.  

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Just now, Zeitgeist said:

I didn’t see any language like that.  Immigration in any country is always a threat to the home culture if it’s not managed well.  Not all cultures support democracy or would be considered progressive by your standards.  It important to be able to have serious conversations about this without knee-jerk self-loathing accusations of racism. We’re exceptional in the world to be so self-effacing.  Countries like Japan could never embrace our level of immigration.  While immigration has many advantages, it can skew markets like housing to exorbitant prices and lead to social tensions and ghettoization without integration, including on the language front.  

The essay definitely mentioned it.  Are you intentionally ignoring that part?  
 

ok, let’s pretend that part isn’t in the essay.  Now we agree that, if the racist parts are ignored, then the essay is no longer racist.  

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1 hour ago, TreeBeard said:

The essay definitely mentioned it.  Are you intentionally ignoring that part?  
 

ok, let’s pretend that part isn’t in the essay.  Now we agree that, if the racist parts are ignored, then the essay is no longer racist.  

No you’re not getting away with that.  The essay isn’t racist.  Even if it was, everyone has unconscious bias and is a bit racist, including BIPOC.  People are naturally more comfortable with their in-groups according to psychological research.  Everyone feels at least a little uncertainty and discomfort around people who don’t look, sound or act like them.  That’s basic human nature.  We can consciously counter it when making decisions that may favour or disfavour people.

There are also people who are intentionally, consciously racist, including BIPOC.    The question of how to change attitudes (as there is already equality under the law) is complex.  Do you imprison people for their beliefs?  Clearly no.  Do you ridicule them?  Well that might destroy reputations and employment, but it may not change attitudes.  It could harden them, especially if people feel they have nothing to lose because they’re already outsiders.

These are complicated issues also because there’s plenty of evidence to point to of disenfranchised people from all backgrounds and genders.  It’s arguable that men are doing worse than women these days in terms of depression, social rejection, education, etc.   Creating new forms of oppression to replace old ones isn’t the answer, which is why we have to be wary of the new notion that colour blindness is racist and we should see race and make much of it.  Colour is one aspect of a person that indicates nothing about their character.  Ethnicity is a characteristic of a person, but far from definitive of someone’s identity, unless one chooses to make it so.  Sex is genetically permanent (even after a gender change) and there are important hormonal and physical differences that can’t be dismissed as socially conditioned.  Unless we have honest open discussions in which people say what they think and mean and unless we can listen to people’s stories and worries without fear of cancellation, we won’t find compromise.

You think black people are inherently less traditional or conservative than white people?   Ever talked to Leslyn Lewis?   It’s about values and what kind of children we want to raise.  There are good reasons to be concerned about current trends in our modern society.  It doesn’t make someone racist or evil to have questions and concerns.

What happens when the state undermines parents and the family unit through imposed views on abortion. homosexuality, gender transition, etc.?  What happens when women are shunned for wanting a more traditional family life?

Our government is far too interventionist and dictatorial.  When you ask what underlies government policies, it doesn’t seem to be constitutional rights, as those have been shunted aside for other priorities.  Is it feminism?  What brand of it?   The radical restockings think reproduction should be taken over by the state.

Let people have open honest exchanges without rushing to judgment, even if the views sound or clearly are racist.  The truth shall set you free.  It was open debate that caused liberation.  How else do people learn what racism is and the difference between right and wrong?

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12 minutes ago, TreeBeard said:

White replacement theory, which was alluded to in the essay, is an inherently racist crackpot nonsense.  
 

Your long, nonsensical post trying to justify racist ideas was all a red herring. 

No you’re a narrow minded person.  I don’t think she’s referring to that theory and don’t care if she is.  I don’t know if such a theory is racist or simply a sense of fear over being overwhelmed by the influx of other groups.  Is it really racist? Maybe.  If it is, what exactly makes it racist?   What’s more, how are you going to debunk such a view if, according to you, there are people who hold it, including young women or girls?   Are the French racist for wanting to preserve French language and culture?   Are Muslim countries racist for requiring women tourists to wear face coverings? Maybe.  Don’t pretend that you aren’t a little racist because everyone has biases.  Are there pretty good people who are also a bit racist?   I hope so because that’s everyone I’ve ever met, including BIPOC and including all the progressive university activists I’ve known.  What’s that biblical passage about removing the log from the eyes you use to cast judgment?

So many Phillistine fake hypocrites.

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11 minutes ago, TreeBeard said:

Said by racists to deflect from their vile views.  

I think you’re more racist and misogynist than the girl who wrote the essay.  I appreciate her honesty.  It starts a discussion.  I find your comments disingenuous.  Piling on against this girl doesn’t make you a good person.  It was an easy win, huh?  She’s already canceled.  The government threw her under the bus, which makes them good people like you, right?  

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13 minutes ago, Zeitgeist said:

I think you’re more racist and misogynist than the girl who wrote the essay.

I know you do.  Because you change the definition of words to suit whatever you’re arguing. 
 

But, I didn’t say the writer was a racist.  I said the writings in the essay are racist ideas.  
 

15 minutes ago, Zeitgeist said:

The government threw her under the bus, which makes them good people like you, right?  

No.  Good people don’t award racist and misogynistic writings to begin with and only backtrack when they’re caught.  The UCP who did the selection are not good people.  They seem to like these writings, but are too cowardly to admit it when the more sensible public (and some of their own MLAs) turn against them. 

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8 minutes ago, TreeBeard said:

I know you do.  Because you change the definition of words to suit whatever you’re arguing. 
 

But, I didn’t say the writer was a racist.  I said the writings in the essay are racist ideas.  
 

No.  Good people don’t award racist and misogynistic writings to begin with and only backtrack when they’re caught.  The UCP who did the selection are not good people.  They seem to like these writings, but are too cowardly to admit it when the more sensible public (and some of their own MLAs) turn against them. 

The dishonour was in backtracking rather than explaining why the essay placed 3rd.

With regard to your puritanical “my way or the highway” interpretations, I can only say that you’re emblematic of our current social cohesion problems.  Calling someone a racist is a cheap and dismissive way of appearing to be correct.  It doesn’t work that way.  You have to discuss the issues and arguments to have well-formed opinions.  What you seek is censorship and a quick easy judgment that’s highly likely to be unfair.  

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