eyeball Posted January 29, 2022 Report Share Posted January 29, 2022 32 minutes ago, WestCanMan said: Calling for people to walk to the Capitol is not the same as cheering on rioting after it started. He said march and fight - before it started. So maybe cheering is the wrong word - inciting is more appropriate. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WestCanMan Posted January 29, 2022 Report Share Posted January 29, 2022 6 minutes ago, eyeball said: He said march and fight - before it started. So maybe cheering is the wrong word - inciting is more appropriate. You need to use direct quotes, because what you're doing is being conveniently inaccurate enough to lie and trying to get away with it. I already had to explain to one of you guys (you or Beave) the magnitude of the difference between the idiom "march on the capitol" and the words "let's walk to the capitol". Your accusation, without a direct quote, or a cite, is worthless. In a world where accuracy matters, your comment was pedestrian/stupid. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eyeball Posted January 29, 2022 Report Share Posted January 29, 2022 (edited) 39 minutes ago, WestCanMan said: You need to use direct quotes, because what you're doing is being conveniently inaccurate enough to lie and trying to get away with it. I already had to explain to one of you guys (you or Beave) the magnitude of the difference between the idiom "march on the capitol" and the words "let's walk to the capitol". Your accusation, without a direct quote, or a cite, is worthless. In a world where accuracy matters, your comment was pedestrian/stupid. Okay so how about the magnitude of difference between “Big protest in DC on January 6th. Be there, will be wild!” and “remain peaceful.”? Bear in mind of course that he didn't say "remain peaceful" until after the....bus tour. Edited January 29, 2022 by eyeball Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WestCanMan Posted January 29, 2022 Report Share Posted January 29, 2022 32 minutes ago, eyeball said: Okay so how about the magnitude of difference between “Big protest in DC on January 6th. Be there, will be wild!” and “remain peaceful.”? Bear in mind of course that he didn't say "remain peaceful" until after the....bus tour. Can you provide some direct quotes for these comments? I really have no idea what you're going on about. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eyeball Posted January 29, 2022 Report Share Posted January 29, 2022 49 minutes ago, WestCanMan said: Can you provide some direct quotes for these comments? I really have no idea what you're going on about. I found some that Reuters reported, can you handle that? You really don't know that these are things Trump said? You could just highlight these direct quotes and duck go duck or whatever the fuck them yourself - we both know you won't believe anything I link you to. You probably even think I hack your account and go back to edit in the lies I catch you making. Oh well here's hoping... https://www.reuters.com/article/us-usa-election-protests-idUSKBN29B24S 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Hardner Posted January 29, 2022 Report Share Posted January 29, 2022 9 minutes ago, eyeball said: we both know you won't believe anything I link you to. I also know this. People with open minds can talk to others with open minds and have a nice conversation, or they can talk to lamp-posts, retarded dogs, or brainwashed MLW zealots who call anybody who isn't a Trump a Communist. How bored are you in Northern BC exactly ? You could always read the back of your Quaker Oats box... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eyeball Posted January 29, 2022 Report Share Posted January 29, 2022 (edited) 5 minutes ago, Michael Hardner said: I also know this. People with open minds can talk to others with open minds and have a nice conversation, or they can talk to lamp-posts, retarded dogs, or brainwashed MLW zealots who call anybody who isn't a Trump a Communist. How bored are you in Northern BC exactly ? You could always read the back of your Quaker Oats box... I had planned to go cut a load of firewood and check my crab trap today but the weather's kinda crappy so... Getting Waste Can Man to shoot himself in his barrel again is a cheap thrill I know but...maybe the weather will improve later. Edited January 29, 2022 by eyeball 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Winston Posted January 29, 2022 Report Share Posted January 29, 2022 (edited) 1 hour ago, WestCanMan said: Can you provide some direct quotes for these comments? I really have no idea what you're going on about. https://www.documentcloud.org/documents/20475169-trump-speech-jan6, t P15 "And we fight. We fight like hell and if you don’t fight like hell, you’re not going to have a country anymore." This is potentially vague, however when a public figure ( president) speaks publicly they must be careful, using the exact wording to define and communicate their exact intent. The definition of "Fight" in Trumps speech would be? Trump may have wanted a peaceful protest, however using the term "fight" may have indicated otherwise, depending upon ones definition of fight, unless you can point to other places in the speech where it is used different to the general definition? Edited January 29, 2022 by Winston Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WestCanMan Posted January 30, 2022 Report Share Posted January 30, 2022 4 hours ago, eyeball said: He said march and fight - before it started. So maybe cheering is the wrong word - inciting is more appropriate. 2 hours ago, eyeball said: I found some that Reuters reported, can you handle that? You really don't know that these are things Trump said? You could just highlight these direct quotes and duck go duck or whatever the fuck them yourself - we both know you won't believe anything I link you to. You probably even think I hack your account and go back to edit in the lies I catch you making. Oh well here's hoping... https://www.reuters.com/article/us-usa-election-protests-idUSKBN29B24S So you said that Trump said "march and fight" but you still haven't provided a link that quotes him saying that. Were you lying again eyeball? Honestly it's no big deal anymore. You lie all the time. Here's a Trump quote for your own article, if you'd like help understanding it I'm here to help. Quote “We’re going to walk down to the Capitol and we’re going to cheer on our brave senators and Congressmen and women,” Trump told the crowd, speaking with the White House as a backdrop. Ooooh, sounds like insurrection talk, right buddy? I know that I'd probably bring Apache helicopters and stealth fighters if I heard such dreadful talk. (That was just a joke. Don't take that seriously. I don't own any Apache helicopters or stealth fighters eyeball. No one in Canada does.) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WestCanMan Posted January 30, 2022 Report Share Posted January 30, 2022 2 hours ago, eyeball said: I had planned to go cut a load of firewood and check my crab trap today but the weather's kinda crappy so... Getting Waste Can Man to shoot himself in his barrel again is a cheap thrill I know but...maybe the weather will improve later. Don't talk about me behind my back eyeball. You got busted lying and weaselling again today, and I apologize for speaking to you like a child, but that's life. Bring some adult material next time and I'll try to be kinder. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Charles Anthony Posted January 30, 2022 Report Share Posted January 30, 2022 Folks, Avoid thread drift. None of you are the topic of this discussion. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
myata Posted January 30, 2022 Author Report Share Posted January 30, 2022 Canadian media is reporting: - traffic problems - some stores in Ottawa downtown closing - some hotels may lose business - someone anonymous said something bad - some in the protest have something bad about them - defacing of monuments did I miss anything important? Does anyone want to report, or even notice arbitrary and chaotic bureaucratic hand management that's into third year now, starting with travel from Wuhan is great for our system!" (2020) and we should improve preparedness to a possible pandemic (2003)? How are these decisions: a) reviewed and verified for soundness, effectiveness and proportionality b) how are they monitored and corrected c) what mechanisms exist to identify ineffective and not working practices d) what happens to incompetent bureaucrats that imposed and keep imposing them on the society regardless of the result? Is anyone interested, hello? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Hardner Posted January 30, 2022 Report Share Posted January 30, 2022 49 minutes ago, myata said: 1. 0did I miss anything important? 2. Does anyone want to report, or even notice arbitrary and chaotic bureaucratic hand management that's into third year now, starting with travel from Wuhan is great for our system!" (2020) and we should improve preparedness to a possible pandemic (2003)? 3. How are these decisions: a) reviewed and verified for soundness, effectiveness and proportionality b) how are they monitored and corrected c) what mechanisms exist to identify ineffective and not working practices d) what happens to incompetent bureaucrats that imposed and keep imposing them on the society regardless of the result? Is anyone interested, hello? 1. Yes, crowd reported as generally well behaved. Protest was well attended. No major issues. Most importantly the key message - the "F*** TRUDEAU" flags were seen by thousands 2. That's been reported since the start - embedded in the events since 2019 and well understood by people who pay attention to details. 3. Bureaucracy is very very boring. If you want proof, please witness the coverage of this convoy - now THAT gets attention. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
myata Posted January 30, 2022 Author Report Share Posted January 30, 2022 16 minutes ago, Michael Hardner said: 3. Bureaucracy is very very boring. If you want proof, please witness the coverage of this convoy - now THAT gets attention. You mean, none right? Or wouldn't there have been reports (of bureaucratic overreach; of ineffectiveness of measures; of the need of proof of necessity and proportionality; of fired bureaucrats repeatedly producing patent nonsense given the seriousness of the problem etc no point in repeating all)? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Hardner Posted January 30, 2022 Report Share Posted January 30, 2022 22 minutes ago, myata said: 1. You mean, none right? Or wouldn't there have been reports (of bureaucratic overreach; of ineffectiveness of measures; of the need of proof of necessity and proportionality; of fired bureaucrats repeatedly producing patent nonsense given the seriousness of the problem etc no point in repeating all)? 1. Yeah, they don't cover bureaucracy. You want a world where decisions are vetted and actually shared with stakeholders ? Talk to @eyeball he has some front-row perspective on how that went with the Fisheries department. I've come to agree with his assertion that in-camera lobbying is a problem, and a starting point for redesigning a political engagement that would make bureaucrats accountable. Be careful what you wish for, though. Just because they ask the people, doesn't mean you get what you want. I keep having to explain this to folks whose favourite candidates lose election after election... 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
myata Posted January 30, 2022 Author Report Share Posted January 30, 2022 9 minutes ago, Michael Hardner said: Be careful what you wish for, though. Just because they ask the people, doesn't mean you get what you want. I keep having to explain this to folks whose favourite candidates lose election after election... I don't think or can expect reasonably that there would be quick band-aid fixes here. Imagine a washroom that has been left on its own, to run as it likes and take care of itself for say, 160 years... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
myata Posted January 30, 2022 Author Report Share Posted January 30, 2022 (edited) This is a serious question: where can we find the record; and if it in fact exists, request or demand from the CBC journalist (presumably, till indicated otherwise) what grounds the claims were based on? As a democratic society we have to be able to know the objective truth. Otherwise we may just wake in a 1984 society, one morning. P.S. I do not know what True North is, nor subscribe to it. I spent about 1/2 hour of my time trying to locate the original record of the interview (Marco Mendicino, Nil Koksal, CBC interview Friday 28.01.2022). https://twitter.com/i/status/1487465754668810240 Anchor: "there's concern that Russian actors could be continuing to fuel things, as this protest grows but perhaps even instigating it from the outset" A question of journalism ethics; standard; and mispractice or malpractice? Journalism is not about claiming something out of thin air. Not as I understand it, hopefully not me only. Edited January 30, 2022 by myata Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
myata Posted January 30, 2022 Author Report Share Posted January 30, 2022 CBC Power & Politics, Friday 28.01.2022 at 13.39. At this point there are exactly two possibilities: 1. An extraordinary claim made on public media, by presumably a journalist, is substantiated and supported by evidence. 2. It's false and deliberately misleading misinformation. Either we are a democratic country that has free and independent responsible mass media. Or we are a country on the way to 1984. Yes, it's this close already. The claim is either substantiated or is an unprecedented example of public disinformation. Yes or no, one or the other. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
myata Posted January 31, 2022 Author Report Share Posted January 31, 2022 (edited) How did Canadian media cover protests in Hong Kong? What did it say? Do we remember? Do we want to remember? Who "expressed concerns" about Russia's instigating peaceful protest against mandates? Where? What evidence is it supported by? Is it supported by any evidence? This is no journalism and hasn't lied close to it. This is something entirely different. Something that one can see routinely in countries like Iran, China and Russia. Ironic, no? Astounding. And disgusting. To such a low in such a record time. Certainly the pandemic caused by a minuscule semi-living being is bringing into the open so much - about ourselves. Maybe some that we already knew or suspected but did not need to acknowledge and admit. Till it came out into the open, painfully obvious. Till now. Edited January 31, 2022 by myata Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Faramir Posted January 31, 2022 Report Share Posted January 31, 2022 Journalists don't have ethics. That is why at least in the USA journalists are relegated to more hated than Congress. If it leads it bleeds and to hell with facts. They don't even offer any skepticism in regards to global warming and other popular movements. As for Canada how do you choose between Global and CBC. Spews all the same rhetoric. Canadians media deserves to die. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Faramir Posted January 31, 2022 Report Share Posted January 31, 2022 On 1/26/2022 at 3:56 PM, Aristides said: Why would anyone think foreign media doesn't have the same issues? Because Canada has a state sponsored media group. It gets 1 billion free dollars. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Faramir Posted January 31, 2022 Report Share Posted January 31, 2022 On 1/28/2022 at 4:10 AM, myata said: Maybe if we include the absence of a news, or spin on the news, or news with a spin, or mostly spin with a tiny bit of news as a "perspective" and sure, left especially is world-famous for this sort of creative language. Take for example the news on US Supreme Court on mandatory vaccinations - it barely appeared in some of this country's main news" services. The problem is much bigger than that. The problem is we don't trust each other and for good reason. I mean if I see something from CNN, or VOX, or Huffington Post I know its going to be some biased crap. And the left will doubt anything even slightly right of MSNBC. In Canada, if its Global I already know they worship the global warming and LGBT Gods. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Faramir Posted January 31, 2022 Report Share Posted January 31, 2022 On 1/28/2022 at 12:31 PM, Michael Hardner said: From the guy who said "Man-made climate change is a joke." You may get more of a sense that your views are on the fringe as you get older... It IS a joke. No one has proven that it is even man made. Why is showing skepticism a joke? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Faramir Posted January 31, 2022 Report Share Posted January 31, 2022 On 1/28/2022 at 2:37 PM, WestCanMan said: That's what I originally thought about CNN, back when they were putting out incendiary lies to keep the Michael Brown riots going, but after the rioting went away and the lying continued unabated I had to consider other reasons. Sadly I've come to the conclusion that news organizations are affiliated with political parties and their coverage of daily events isn't centred around truth, information or accuracy at all, it's about supporting the political narratives of their chosen party. Believe it or not, people are happier being lied to than they are to find out that the other party was right about something. Depending on what news station you watch the Suleimani drone strike was either a brilliant success or patricide. The Afghan withdrawal was a debacle or a stroke of military brilliance. Profits are the same regardless of which side a news corp takes because the stories are compelling enough either way. Riots are compelling. Whether they're awesome or criminal depends on your political stripe. At least they are if you're a leftist. If you're a conservative, riots are always bad. Zucker at CNN made it his mission to take down Donald Trump. The only people that actually watch CNN are.....Canadians. LOL Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Faramir Posted January 31, 2022 Report Share Posted January 31, 2022 On 1/28/2022 at 9:08 PM, eyeball said: Unless it's the Proud Boys or Q-anon on a bus tour of Capitol Hill. Then it's just exuberance or something. Proud Boys is an anti-ANTIFA terrorist group. They go to events to stop the violence perpetuated by white liberals of ANTIFA. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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