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Is love altruistic?


myata

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Opened another book read the line "to love one is to love the Universe". Actually the question is not is, rather why?

Why do we insist that it could be? Like what is not obvious about it, where? Or does it illustrate the length and depth of self-deception we are willing to go to voluntarily to preserve our illusions and beliefs?

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  • 7 months later...
  • 2 months later...

We might like to think so, but in the end it is always transactional when it comes to our spouses.  Love at first sight is a delusion sadly too many young men fall into, as I did when I was young.  We yearn to have those feelings we had when we first met, but that utopian feeling we once had does not last long and doesn't generally repeat.  Instead we love our spouse based on a list of who they are and what they do for us.  

The closest thing to altruistic love would be the love we have for our children.  

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  • 2 weeks later...

I had a rich uncle who used to say, "Son...Love is an abscess of the heart, that grows to a head at the crotch."

I always found that shallow. Today I have a 30+ year marriage and mostly-baked spawn, and I have come to this conclusion;

Love encompasses a wide array of feelings and causes. My wife is a tiny little Czech woman who grew up under communist Czechoslovakia. She's a very strong-willed woman who can make paint peel with her scream. She's also incredibly healthy. The woman had breast cancer and would go for chemo and go straight to work afterwards. Never up-chucked or had any side affects aside from the hair thing. I figure The Rona catches her scent, and runs away. I never seem to get sick. When I do...I sneeze, eat a box of oranges, sleep and done. Our kids are all in shape, strong and healthy.

My love for her WAS lust. Then it WAS the adoration of a man who'd been given 3 amazing kids and a new reason for living. Now...its thankfulness for driving me to be my best at all times. In the future, when we retire, she'll be the doll who makes me peanutbutter and honey sandwiches for my golf rounds... ;)

 

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  • 4 weeks later...

John 15:13 — "Greater love has no one than this, that someone lay down his life for his friends."

 

Homosexual love is disordered love, not real love, therefore their appeal to love is moot.

Edited by Great American
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On 5/8/2022 at 10:41 AM, Great American said:

John 15:13 — "Greater love has no one than this, that someone lay down his life for his friends."

 

Homosexual love is disordered love, not real love, therefore their appeal to love is moot.

I hope you're wrong about this. I have a gay son...

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On 5/10/2022 at 9:10 AM, Nationalist said:

I hope you're wrong about this. I have a gay son...

Thats okay. We are ALL disordered due to Original Sin. Some are overeaters, drunkards, gluttons, anger issues . . . whatever. Many folks have a variety of sexual disorders too.

Your son only has to do something that is very simple, but very unpopular: He must admit to himself that he has a problem, and practice abstinence.

Much like the alcoholic who is in denial for years, then finally admits to himself that he has a problem and seeks support to stay clean, the homosexual also must finally admit to himself that he has a problem and seek support to stay clean. Its really no different.

We are all sinners who need a savior. Your sons only real problem is that the world is telling him that his sin is not a sin, and he might be believing them.

 

 

Edited by Great American
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1 hour ago, Great American said:

Thats okay. We are ALL disordered due to Original Sin. Some are overeaters, drunkards, gluttons, anger issues . . . whatever. Many folks have a variety of sexual disorders too.

Your son only has to do something that is very simple, but very unpopular: He must admit to himself that he has a problem, and practice abstinence.

Much like the alcoholic who is in denial for years, then finally admits to himself that he has a problem and seeks support to stay clean, the homosexual also must finally admit to himself that he has a problem and seek support to stay clean. Its really no different.

We are all sinners who need a savior. Your sons only real problem is that the world is telling him that his sin is not a sin, and he might be believing them.

 

 

I don't think the lad feels any remorse. Or that he needs any help.

When he told me I asked how long he'd known he's gay? He said all his life. Homosexuals are born homosexuals. It's nothing like being a lush.

You can't "cure" nature. Trying to is begging for bad outcomes. 

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8 hours ago, Nationalist said:

I don't think the lad feels any remorse. Or that he needs any help

Well, I won't argue with you about your son. Such an argument would be bear no fruit.

All I can say as a Christian is that we are all fallen, and we all have our particular weaknesses to different sins, and we are called to not give in to those weaknesses and to not sin. As Jesus said to the woman caught in adultery, Go and sin no more.

And if you are a Christian, know that sodomy is indeed a sin, a grievous sin. Sin can always be forgiven, but only if one repents.

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On 5/12/2022 at 5:42 PM, Great American said:
On 5/10/2022 at 7:10 AM, Nationalist said:

I hope you're wrong about this. I have a gay son...

Thats okay. We are ALL disordered due to Original Sin. Some are overeaters, drunkards, gluttons, anger issues . . . whatever. Many folks have a variety of sexual disorders too.

Your son only has to do something that is very simple, but very unpopular: He must admit to himself that he has a problem, and practice abstinence.

Much like the alcoholic who is in denial for years, then finally admits to himself that he has a problem and seeks support to stay clean, the homosexual also must finally admit to himself that he has a problem and seek support to stay clean. Its really no different.

We are all sinners who need a savior. Your sons only real problem is that the world is telling him that his sin is not a sin, and he might be believing them.

The original 'sin' is a precursor to the meaning of 'sin' as some evil refers to the 'shun'-ing of the Tree of Wisdom. It did not connote something necessarily bad but a promise that they will not like to learn what the gods knew. The tree symbolizes the secrets of Nature (or for the religious, God), which came from meaning the part of nature that is DEFINES  'good'). The word, Eve, means "All that follows" and so evil means "that which 'fell' " ["fell" describes the sun as it falls in every evening and how it 'follows' each day.] So....

'sin' is what defines 'evil (that which fell) from paradise. That this happens to be interpreted as something bad is only about how no one could interpret God (the 'good' source of Nature) as defined the 'bad' reality of our inevitable DEATH. Jesus, 'salvation' was about permitting deserving people an eternal life in Heaven ("heaven" is originally from what 'follows' above Adam, the word for that which is below.)  [And where the Greeks "atom" also comes from as meaning the most elemental earch.]

Now you no doubt think that the above is 'crap', right? But when you get more mature and curious to grow up, try to take time to notice that it demonstrates what the ORIGINAL authors of Genesis were using the story to explain: that when young, we are naive and unable to handle discovering the actual truths regarding God, Nature, or ideal 'goodness' because it is an illusion for children being cared for by those matured loving adults not wanting to scare them but who are themselves cursed as adults to KNOW that Nature is actually more 'cruel' than good and that we are all going to die necessarily. And, ....that there is no fairygodfathers anymore than there is a God! 

So, 

You only have to do something that is very simple, but very unpopular: YOU must admit to yourself that you have a problem, and practice abstaining from religious beliefs.

Much like the junky who needs to first admit he even has an addiction,the religious extremist must first recognize their religious immature beliefs are extreme before they have a reason to want to stop being extreme. This goes witout saying. 

Then you can take a bite of that fruit ....learn the actual truth about what is or is not real, and the irrational child may then BECOME a rational adult.  Its really no different.

We all shun hearing that we are all going to suffer and die and so we need some myths to make children not become too fearful from having to grow up. Your very real problem is that you are no longer a 'child' but still believe that playng pretend and shunning intelligence IS a sound and appropriate decision. The 'we all sin' point is moot if you think that you are the wiser for shunning wisdom and leave the cradle of your childhood playpen (Eden.) Its' time to learn to wipe your own ass. 

 

Note that if you want to argue againt homosexuality, you can't use your selfish religious authoritarianism to dictate how others should behave. I ALSO happen to disagree to those assuming gender is something one is born while still believing people should not be shunned for their choice to be in a consenting relationship. But you are not seeking rational arguments but proselytizing like a cult recruiter serving his leader in absolute blind faith.

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16 hours ago, Scott Mayers said:

The original 'sin' is a precursor to the meaning of 'sin' as some evil refers to the 'shun'-ing of the Tree of Wisdom. It did not connote something necessarily bad but a promise that they will not like to learn what the gods knew. The tree symbolizes the secrets of Nature (or for the religious, God), which came from meaning the part of nature that is DEFINES  'good'). The word, Eve, means "All that follows" and so evil means "that which 'fell' " ["fell" describes the sun as it falls in every evening and how it 'follows' each day.] So....

'sin' is what defines 'evil (that which fell) from paradise. That this happens to be interpreted as something bad is only about how no one could interpret God (the 'good' source of Nature) as defined the 'bad' reality of our inevitable DEATH. Jesus, 'salvation' was about permitting deserving people an eternal life in Heaven ("heaven" is originally from what 'follows' above Adam, the word for that which is below.)  [And where the Greeks "atom" also comes from as meaning the most elemental earch.]

Now you no doubt think that the above is 'crap', right? But when you get more mature and curious to grow up, try to take time to notice that it demonstrates what the ORIGINAL authors of Genesis were using the story to explain: that when young, we are naive and unable to handle discovering the actual truths regarding God, Nature, or ideal 'goodness' because it is an illusion for children being cared for by those matured loving adults not wanting to scare them but who are themselves cursed as adults to KNOW that Nature is actually more 'cruel' than good and that we are all going to die necessarily. And, ....that there is no fairygodfathers anymore than there is a God! 

So, 

You only have to do something that is very simple, but very unpopular: YOU must admit to yourself that you have a problem, and practice abstaining from religious beliefs.

Much like the junky who needs to first admit he even has an addiction,the religious extremist must first recognize their religious immature beliefs are extreme before they have a reason to want to stop being extreme. This goes witout saying. 

Then you can take a bite of that fruit ....learn the actual truth about what is or is not real, and the irrational child may then BECOME a rational adult.  Its really no different.

We all shun hearing that we are all going to suffer and die and so we need some myths to make children not become too fearful from having to grow up. Your very real problem is that you are no longer a 'child' but still believe that playng pretend and shunning intelligence IS a sound and appropriate decision. The 'we all sin' point is moot if you think that you are the wiser for shunning wisdom and leave the cradle of your childhood playpen (Eden.) Its' time to learn to wipe your own ass. 

 

Note that if you want to argue againt homosexuality, you can't use your selfish religious authoritarianism to dictate how others should behave. I ALSO happen to disagree to those assuming gender is something one is born while still believing people should not be shunned for their choice to be in a consenting relationship. But you are not seeking rational arguments but proselytizing like a cult recruiter serving his leader in absolute blind faith.

Nice soliloquy.  I think you responded to the wrong person though.

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