The Lawsuits

[-TSS-]

Trump has no choice but to hand over the keys of the White House (as well as the briefcase containing the nuclear weapons codes) to Biden on January 20th but there has been speculation that he will take on a role as some sort of a shadow president.

Namely, it doesn't matter whether there was fraud or not but that matters if there are enough people who genuinely believe there was fraud. They might be willing to follow such a shadow president rather than the actual president.

Hopefully that won't happen since it would set a very dangerous precedence undermining the public trust in the very system itself.

However, a narrative has been created whereby Biden has won the election. It is sheer fantasy to believe that some lawyers would overturn it.

[Infidel Dog]

4 minutes ago, Cannucklehead said:

They were dismissed because the courts know that there was no legitimacy to it.  

No they don't. Cases were dismissed on procedural grounds, whether some Obama judge pretended he'd considered evidence or not. If that happened (and I'd like to see a cite if you're saying it did) it was just big talk for the rubes. 

There hasn't been a court case yet where evidence is put on trial.

Edited December 18, 2020 by Infidel Dog

[Cannucklehead]

3 minutes ago, Infidel Dog said:

No they don't. Cases were dismissed on procedural grounds, whether some Obama judge pretended he'd considered evidence or not. If that happened (and I'd like to see a cite if you're saying it did) it was just big talk for the rubes. 

There hasn't been a court case yet where evidence is put on trial.

https://www.google.ca/amp/s/www.nbcnews.com/news/amp/ncna1248289

 

Rundown on most of the cases.  Some were dismissed, some withdrawn, some granted.  

[Infidel Dog]

2 minutes ago, Cannucklehead said:

https://www.google.ca/amp/s/www.nbcnews.com/news/amp/ncna1248289

 

Rundown on most of the cases.  Some were dismissed, some withdrawn, some granted.  

And I'm sure the easily impressed are impressed by the number.

But show me the case where evidence was considered in open court. Because I can't find it.

Isn't it interesting there are no links in your article.

You guys like to bad mouth the media of the right but when I'm reading something on say Red State or Townhall claims are usually cited.

[Infidel Dog]

I have seen judges make general claims about what they believe the evidence might be if they ever seriously considered it but I've yet to see where they tell us specifically what reason or counter evidence brought them to that conclusion.

I have heard the other side say stuff that translates into "Nothing to see here."

Too bad you can't have a jury trial on this. I'd love to see one.

[Cannucklehead]

7 minutes ago, Infidel Dog said:

And I'm sure the easily impressed are impressed by the number.

But show me the case where evidence was considered in open court. Because I can't find it.

Isn't it interesting there are no links in your article.

You guys like to bad mouth the media of the right but when I'm reading something on say Red State or Townhall claims are usually cited.

I'm not a judge or a lawyer but I doubt any court would provide a grant without having seen the evidence (in western civilization anyway) first.  

Is the problem that they were not significant enough to change the outcome of the election i wonder?  

[Infidel Dog]

From what I've heard if there was a case where evidence was actually considered it would be in the ones Sydney Powell was involved with. 

So I clicked through your list to find one then followed the case to the final resolution. Just skimming, of course but when I skimmed the decision most of the decision seemed to be on procedural grounds like standing. There was some judgement on evidence but it seemed to be going off on legalities of what could be considered.

Some evidence they don't like or consider to mean much but to me it looks like a lot of waffling. A lot of trying to find a way not to take it seriously.

I imagine Bidenites will see it differently. Go ahead then. Have a look:
 

https://www.courtlistener.com/recap/gov.uscourts.azd.1255923/gov.uscourts.azd.1255923.84.0_2.pdf

Apparently the case is being appealed.

Edited December 18, 2020 by Infidel Dog

[Cannucklehead]

11 minutes ago, Infidel Dog said:

From what I've heard if there was a case where evidence was actually considered it would be in the ones Sydney Powell was involved with. 

So I clicked through your list to find one then followed the case to the final resolution. Just skimming, of course but when I skimmed the decision most of the decision seemed to be on procedural grounds like standing. There was some judgement on evidence but it seemed to be going off on legalities of what could be considered.

Some evidence they don't like or consider to mean much but to me it looks like a lot of waffling. A lot of trying to find a way not to take it seriously.

I imagine Bidenites will see it differently. Go ahead then. Have a look:
 

https://www.courtlistener.com/recap/gov.uscourts.azd.1255923/gov.uscourts.azd.1255923.84.0_2.pdf

Apparently the case is being appealed.

https://rumble.com/vbyvln-a-close-look-at-the-data-arizona.html

 

Cue the video Gosar is so excited about:

“We’ve identified 790,175 laundered votes that were injected into the system," it says.

Among those 790,175 votes, 409,486 Pima County votes were stolen from Trump and given to Biden, we are told.

This is a particularly neat trick, given that Biden only won 304,981 total votes in Pima County.

 

Seriously, its getting kinda sad.  

[Infidel Dog]

Who's Gosar?

The case I was looking through was Bowyer v Ducey.

I'm still skimming it.

The impression I'm getting is nobody wants to deal with these cases in the lower courts. They're a hot potato. It's like they're desperate to find any procedural reason to get the case out of their court and pass it up the line.

I'm thinking the defense has to expect that. I'm thinking that's what these case have really been about. Getting passed up the line. 

I hear Powell has one docketed in the Supreme Court now. Let's see what happens there.

[Infidel Dog]

I have some spare time today so I looked up "Gosar."

Is it the 3% thing you're concerned witht?

 Yeah I'll give you that one. It was an error rate in a sample amount of ballots, right? That one never seemed to mean much. Ten or so ballots with errors extrapolated into hundred of thousands or something like that, right?

Edited December 18, 2020 by Infidel Dog

[Argus]

1 hour ago, -TSS- said:

Trump has no choice but to hand over the keys of the White House (as well as the briefcase containing the nuclear weapons codes) to Biden on January 20th but there has been speculation that he will take on a role as some sort of a shadow president.

Well, he certainly has experience at that, given he's done virtually nothing the last four years but golf, tweet, brag, and attend assorted ego-boosting rallies. He doesn't attend briefings. He doesn't read briefing materials or reports. He has no interest in the day-to-day running of the country governed by his administration. Pence does all that while he sleeps in, tweets, and watches TV.

[Cannucklehead]

10 minutes ago, Infidel Dog said:

Who's Gosar?

The case I was looking through was Bowyer v Ducey.

I'm still skimming it.

The impression I'm getting is nobody wants to deal with these cases in the lower courts. They're a hot potato. It's like they're desperate to find any procedural reason to get the case out of their court and pass it up the line.

I'm thinking the defense has to expect that. I'm thinking that's what these case have really been about. Getting passed up the line. 

I hear Powell has one docketed in the Supreme Court now. Let's see what happens there.

Bowyer v. Ducey

On December 2, 2020, Arizona voters and one candidate for Republican Arizona presidential elector, filed a lawsuit in federal court against the governor, secretary of state, and other Arizona election officials. Plaintiffs alleged, according to the Stanford-MIT Healthy Elections Project, "that poll watchers failed to adequately verify signatures on ballots, that Maricopa County ballot dispute referees were partisan, that Dominion backups had no chain of custody, and the Dominion machines themselves suffered from errors during state evaluations." The plaintiffs asked the court to decertify Arizona's election results, or order that Arizona certify Trump electors.  Sidney Powell litigated on behalf of the plaintiffs.

 

On December 9, federal judge Diane Humetewa ruled that the plaintiffs lacked legal standing, and the allegations of impropriety brought were "sorely wanting of relevant or reliable evidence", instead being "largely based on anonymous witnesses, hearsay, and irrelevant analysis of unrelated elections". The judge singled out the fraud allegations being put forth, writing that they "fail in their particularity and plausibility". The judge ruled that there would be "extreme, and entirely unprecedented" harm to Arizona's 3+ million voters to entertain the lawsuit "at this late date".

Burk v. Ducey

On December 7, 2020, an Arizona resident filed a lawsuit in Pinal County Superior Court against state officials, including Governor Doug Ducey and Secretary of State Katie Hobbs.  The plaintiff alleged "massive election fraud" involving inadequate security for election processes and foreign interference, and asked for an audit and to block the transmission of the state's election results to the electoral college.  Judge Kevin White dismissed the lawsuit on December 15, concluding that the plaintiff had brought the suit too late and lacked standing because she was not registered to vote.

Like I said, sad.  

[Argus]

1 hour ago, Infidel Dog said:

No they don't. Cases were dismissed on procedural grounds, whether some Obama judge pretended he'd considered evidence or not. If that happened (and I'd like to see a cite if you're saying it did) it was just big talk for the rubes. 

There hasn't been a court case yet where evidence is put on trial.

 

Brann also admonished the Trump campaign for presenting no factual proof of voter fraud or other allegations -- evidence that Giuliani and Trump's supporters have repeatedly said is in the works but has never materialized. Elections officials in multiple states as well as judges have said there was no widespread fraud in the 2020 election.

"One might expect that when seeking such a startling outcome, a plaintiff would come formidably armed with compelling legal arguments and factual proof of rampant corruption, such that this Court would have no option but to regrettably grant the proposed injunctive relief despite the impact it would have on such a large group of citizens. That has not happened," Brann added. "Instead, this Court has been presented with strained legal arguments without merit and speculative accusations, unpled in the operative complaint and unsupported by evidence."

https://www.cnn.com/2020/11/21/politics/federal-judge-dismisses-trump-pennsylvania-lawsuit/index.html

 

[sharkman]

On 12/3/2020 at 12:18 PM, sharkman said:

...

In my opinion, the courts are not going to be the short term solution to this mess.  The only way the voter fraud will be taken seriously is if it's found out that a foreign power had a hand in this.  Hard evidence of this is needed, or it simply won't be addressed.  I wait with interest to see what was captured on the hard drives in Germany.

 

When I said this, I had no idea that a massive cyber attack has been carried out against the US for the last several months.   It’s a devastating blow to a beleaguered nation, and no doubt they are digging furiously to find out who did it.  Flip a coin.  China or Russia, or one of their close friends.

if they find evidence that the election apparatus was hacked, then this election will be null and void.

[Cannucklehead]

2 hours ago, sharkman said:

When I said this, I had no idea that a massive cyber attack has been carried out against the US for the last several months.   It’s a devastating blow to a beleaguered nation, and no doubt they are digging furiously to find out who did it.  Flip a coin.  China or Russia, or one of their close friends.

if they find evidence that the election apparatus was hacked, then this election will be null and void.

 

https://www.google.ca/amp/s/www.republicworld.com/amp/technology-news/apps/solarwinds-orion-platform-hacked-does-dominion-voting-systems-use-solarwinds.html

 

Does Dominion Voting Systems use SolarWinds'

According to a statement by Dominion spokesperson to The Wall Street Journal, 'Dominion Voting Systems does not now nor has it ever used the SolarWinds Orion Platform, which was subject of the DHS emergency directive dated December 13, 2020." This states that the organisation does not use the Orion Platform which was attacked by the hackers. However, Dominion Voting is also facing a lot of problems dealing with conspiracy theories arising after the recent 2020 Presidential elections, and the reports of a breach make it even harder for the organisation to handle it.

 

[BeaverFever]

Here is a great synopsis of the great Trump failure:

Donald Trump’s lengthy humiliation is a necessary gift to the world
 

The past six weeks have provided many of us the enjoyable experience of watching Donald Trump losing – badly – in a drawn-out series of public humiliations and serial self-abasements. 

This spectacle has grown tiresome to some, especially to Americans who face the constant horror of more than 3,000 daily deaths resulting from their President’s incompetent pandemic response. They’d like someone to shut him up, or cancel his social-media feeds, or at least teleport us to Jan. 21, when he will once again become part of the U.S. background noise. 

But we should resist the temptation to change the channel. It is vitally important that the entire world witnesses his loss and humiliation, his embarrassing tantrums, and his flailing displays of impotence and weakness. 

To see Donald Trump as a pathetic loser is the most effective imaginable challenge to the phenomenon that’s become known as “global Trumpism.” It has nothing to do with political beliefs or actual leadership styles; strongman leaders drawing on distrust and intolerance have been a 21st-century phenomenon for a decade, most of them inspired and supported by Russian President Vladimir Putin. 

But electoral support for such leaders, in those countries that still have functioning democratic systems, has been given a serious boost by Mr. Trump’s ascent. A vote for whatever party in your country that believes in a byzantine global conspiracy of immigrants, media, elites and religious minorities was previously a fringe protest move, a withdrawal from the mainstream. After 2016, it felt as though you were joining the winners. 

The most powerful job in the world had been won by one such guy, and you could see him every day, raining rhetorical blows upon all those liberals and foreigners and TV hosts. It was both enviably American and a form of anti-Americanism, and for many people, it affirmed their prejudices and justified a vote. 

In response, a number of world leaders built their candidacies in Mr. Trump’s image. Some, such as Brazilian President Jair Bolsonaro, modelled themselves directly upon the reality-TV star, even going so far as to dismiss the COVID-19 pandemic as “fake news,” with deadly consequences. 

Figures such as Mr. Bolsonaro may still retain power for years, but their extremism will no longer receive mainstream sanction from powerful countries. The Bolsonaros of the world are left alone. 

“If he loses his main partner, his role model – because that’s what Donald Trump is – then he will be all alone,” Brazilian political scientist Dawisson Belem Lopes told The Washington Post. “Brazil has become an environmental villain. ... It will be a nightmare for Bolsonaro.” 

The appeal of Mr. Trump, and of his imitators in other countries, is not generally ideological. When I spoke to Trump voters in Florida and Ohio in his first successful election, they did not tend to parrot his elaborate conspiracy theories; rather, they talked about Mr. Trump as a successful businessman and as an effective leader. None of that was true, but as long as he was winning, it felt right. 

That’s equally true abroad. When two political scientists this year surveyed voters in Albania – a Muslim-majority country with a surprisingly large bloc of voters, around 30 per cent, who like Mr. Trump and want a local imitator – they found that what united those voters were these measured characteristics: “tolerance for strongman rule, homophobia, sympathy for Russian President Vladimir Putin, Euroskepticism, low levels of education, and perceptions that Trump has positive personal leadership qualities.” Other countries produced different results, but “tolerance for strongman rule” and “positive personal leadership qualities” remain big attractions. 

More important than Mr. Trump’s highly visible failure is the way it was delivered to him – not through impeachment or criminal charges, which would have looked to much of the world like political revenge and confirmation of his conspiracy theories. Rather, it was delivered through a functioning democratic system, in which his daily humiliations have been meted out not by a nebulous “deep state” but by senior figures in his own political party, by judges he had appointed, by trusted aides trying to break it gently to him, by voters who had abandoned him. 

For the past four years, state-controlled media in China, Hungary and other countries with authoritarian rulers have feasted on the daily spectacle of Trumpism. It sent a dual message: “They are no better than us,” and “There is no longer any point to the old struggle for democracy, for it leads to the same place.” 

The lasting lesson of Trumpism, for voters around the world, is no longer that it succeeded. It is that it ended in total failure, having accomplished none of what it promised, having left its supporters far worse off and having revealed the man himself to be a big-time loser.
 

https://www.theglobeandmail.com/opinion/article-donald-trumps-lengthy-humiliation-is-a-necessary-gift-to-the-world/

[sharkman]

7 hours ago, Cannucklehead said:

 

https://www.google.ca/amp/s/www.republicworld.com/amp/technology-news/apps/solarwinds-orion-platform-hacked-does-dominion-voting-systems-use-solarwinds.html

 

Does Dominion Voting Systems use SolarWinds'

According to a statement by Dominion spokesperson to The Wall Street Journal, 'Dominion Voting Systems does not now nor has it ever used the SolarWinds Orion Platform, which was subject of the DHS emergency directive dated December 13, 2020." This states that the organisation does not use the Orion Platform which was attacked by the hackers. However, Dominion Voting is also facing a lot of problems dealing with conspiracy theories arising after the recent 2020 Presidential elections, and the reports of a breach make it even harder for the organisation to handle it.

 

Well, here's what we know.  

Quote

 

A forensic audit of the presidential vote tally by Dominion Voting Systems software used in Antrim County, Michigan, showed a more than 68% error rate, with auditors claiming the system intentionally creates the errors so the machine can have them "adjudicated" – allowing individuals to change the result.

The error rate is astounding considering the Federal Election Commission allows a maximum error rate of just 0.0008 percent for computerized voting systems.

 

With an error rate of 68% of ballots that had to be manually adjudicated by the same types of democrat activists that were counting unsigned mail in ballots, bringing out suitcases of hidden ballots after hours, etc(And I know the BS theories regarding this that abound, but it still smells).  My point is, there was no oversight, and no watchers able to observe who they gave the 68% to.  

So you may be right, maybe dominion hasn't been hacked.  But not because lying dominion officials say so.  Anything that comes out of their mouths at this point is debatable, after they closed down their North American offices, wiped their web pages and sent some of their employees into hiding(innocent people don't do this.  I don't care what theories apologists come up with.  Innocent people don't do this.)

But there is no telling, at this point, how far and how deep the hack was.  And no telling whether the Dominion hard drives in Germany were hacked.  And not by the same malware with Solarwinds, but some other method.  

 

Edited December 19, 2020 by sharkman

[sharkman]

2 hours ago, BeaverFever said:

Here is a great synopsis of the great Trump failure:

Donald Trump’s lengthy humiliation is a necessary gift to the world
 

The past six weeks have provided many of us the enjoyable experience of watching Donald Trump losing – badly – in a drawn-out series of public humiliations and serial self-abasements. 

This spectacle has grown tiresome to some, especially to Americans who face the constant horror of more than 3,000 daily deaths resulting from their President’s incompetent pandemic response. They’d like someone to shut him up, or cancel his social-media feeds, or at least teleport us to Jan. 21, when he will once again become part of the U.S. background noise. 

But we should resist the temptation to change the channel. It is vitally important that the entire world witnesses his loss and humiliation, his embarrassing tantrums, and his flailing displays of impotence and weakness. 

To see Donald Trump as a pathetic loser is the most effective imaginable challenge to the phenomenon that’s become known as “global Trumpism.” It has nothing to do with political beliefs or actual leadership styles; strongman leaders drawing on distrust and intolerance have been a 21st-century phenomenon for a decade, most of them inspired and supported by Russian President Vladimir Putin. 

But electoral support for such leaders, in those countries that still have functioning democratic systems, has been given a serious boost by Mr. Trump’s ascent. A vote for whatever party in your country that believes in a byzantine global conspiracy of immigrants, media, elites and religious minorities was previously a fringe protest move, a withdrawal from the mainstream. After 2016, it felt as though you were joining the winners. 

The most powerful job in the world had been won by one such guy, and you could see him every day, raining rhetorical blows upon all those liberals and foreigners and TV hosts. It was both enviably American and a form of anti-Americanism, and for many people, it affirmed their prejudices and justified a vote. 

In response, a number of world leaders built their candidacies in Mr. Trump’s image. Some, such as Brazilian President Jair Bolsonaro, modelled themselves directly upon the reality-TV star, even going so far as to dismiss the COVID-19 pandemic as “fake news,” with deadly consequences. 

Figures such as Mr. Bolsonaro may still retain power for years, but their extremism will no longer receive mainstream sanction from powerful countries. The Bolsonaros of the world are left alone. 

“If he loses his main partner, his role model – because that’s what Donald Trump is – then he will be all alone,” Brazilian political scientist Dawisson Belem Lopes told The Washington Post. “Brazil has become an environmental villain. ... It will be a nightmare for Bolsonaro.” 

The appeal of Mr. Trump, and of his imitators in other countries, is not generally ideological. When I spoke to Trump voters in Florida and Ohio in his first successful election, they did not tend to parrot his elaborate conspiracy theories; rather, they talked about Mr. Trump as a successful businessman and as an effective leader. None of that was true, but as long as he was winning, it felt right. 

That’s equally true abroad. When two political scientists this year surveyed voters in Albania – a Muslim-majority country with a surprisingly large bloc of voters, around 30 per cent, who like Mr. Trump and want a local imitator – they found that what united those voters were these measured characteristics: “tolerance for strongman rule, homophobia, sympathy for Russian President Vladimir Putin, Euroskepticism, low levels of education, and perceptions that Trump has positive personal leadership qualities.” Other countries produced different results, but “tolerance for strongman rule” and “positive personal leadership qualities” remain big attractions. 

More important than Mr. Trump’s highly visible failure is the way it was delivered to him – not through impeachment or criminal charges, which would have looked to much of the world like political revenge and confirmation of his conspiracy theories. Rather, it was delivered through a functioning democratic system, in which his daily humiliations have been meted out not by a nebulous “deep state” but by senior figures in his own political party, by judges he had appointed, by trusted aides trying to break it gently to him, by voters who had abandoned him. 

For the past four years, state-controlled media in China, Hungary and other countries with authoritarian rulers have feasted on the daily spectacle of Trumpism. It sent a dual message: “They are no better than us,” and “There is no longer any point to the old struggle for democracy, for it leads to the same place.” 

The lasting lesson of Trumpism, for voters around the world, is no longer that it succeeded. It is that it ended in total failure, having accomplished none of what it promised, having left its supporters far worse off and having revealed the man himself to be a big-time loser.
 

https://www.theglobeandmail.com/opinion/article-donald-trumps-lengthy-humiliation-is-a-necessary-gift-to-the-world/

Wow Beaver, another hatchet job on Trump, this time by the Globe and Mail.  I'm sure there are a lot of hatchet swingers out there, but for them to claim that he's accomplished nothing illustrates clearly how blind they are.  I'm not going to list his accomplishments and get into this with you as it would be a waste of both of our time. 

When this is over, one of us is going to be $100 poorer.  Do you have a short list of organizations you want the money to go to?  I've got a list of one.

Edited December 19, 2020 by sharkman

[Cannucklehead]

13 minutes ago, sharkman said:

Well, here's what we know.  

With an error rate of 68% of ballots that had to be manually adjudicated by the same types of democrat activists that were counting unsigned mail in ballots, bringing out suitcases of hidden ballots after hours, etc(And I know the BS theories regarding this that abound, but it still smells).  My point is, there was no oversight, and no watchers able to observe who they gave the 68% to.  

So you may be right, maybe dominion hasn't been hacked.  But not because lying dominion officials say so.  Anything that comes out of their mouths at this point is debatable, after they closed down their North American offices, wiped their web pages and sent some of their employees into hiding(innocent people don't do this.  I don't care what theories apologists come up with.  Innocent people don't do this.)

But there is no telling, at this point, how far and how deep the hack was.  And no telling whether the Dominion hard drives in Germany were hacked.  And not by the same malware with Solarwinds, but some other method.  

 

From your link:

 

Initial results in the reliably Republican county in northern Michigan showed Joe Biden with a 7,769-4,509 lead, which was changed to a 9,783-7,289 Trump lead two days later and eventually a 9,748-5,960 margin for Trump.
 

Seems to me if your going to rig the system to give Biden a win you wouldn't rig it to give more votes to trump.  

[WestCanMan]

20 hours ago, Cannucklehead said:

Is the problem that they were not significant enough to change the outcome of the election i wonder?  

Keep in mind that the leftists have been saying for four years straight that $100K worth of FB ads from Russia won the election for Trump lol. 

Now you're taking the position that all of these things don't add up to much:

- machines counting thousands of ballots incorrectly,

- widespread evidence of several types of mail-in ballot fraud (dead people voting, people who live out-of-state voting, mysterious boxes of ballots counted for hours after GOP observers are conned into leaving), 

- Dem agitators kicking GOP observers out of counting rooms without cause,

- Dem agitators physically preventing GOP poll watchers from access to viewpoints,

- MSM and big tech corporations blocking factual information from the public so that millions of voters aren't aware of te magnitude of Joe's scandal....

 

Just remember that disinformation abut Russian collusion was pushed unchecked by the MSM and on social media for over a year after it was already known to be a farce. That went on right through the mid-term elections.

Disinformation is a huge part of the alt-left's election strategy. Tens of millions of people in the US and Canada are completely oblivious to just how deceptive the MSM actually is. Unless you like being lied to and manipulated like a chump, they are not your friend. 

[Infidel Dog]

  

31 minutes ago, Cannucklehead said:

From your link:

 

Initial results in the reliably Republican county in northern Michigan showed Joe Biden with a 7,769-4,509 lead, which was changed to a 9,783-7,289 Trump lead two days later and eventually a 9,748-5,960 margin for Trump.
 

Seems to me if your going to rig the system to give Biden a win you wouldn't rig it to give more votes to trump.  

 

There was a case in Coffee county Georgia where the county refused to send in the vote count because they found defects in the machines that allowed cheating. There's a video of one of the vote counters showing one way it can be done.

So there may be a broad method of cheating with machines but individual county officials of a republican county might suspect something fishy is going on, and double-check.

You forgot to give the following paragraph, CH.

Quote

The discrepancy was attributed to a clerk's failure to update the programming in the tabulators. Russell James Ramsland Jr., who conducted the audit and has worked with NASA and the Massachusetts Institute of Technology, disputed the claim.

"We disagree and conclude that the vote flip occurred because of machine error built into the voting software designed to create error," he wrote in the report.

 

Edited December 19, 2020 by Infidel Dog

[Infidel Dog]

9 minutes ago, WestCanMan said:

Keep in mind that the leftists have been saying for four years straight that $100K worth of FB ads from Russia won the election for Trump lol. 

Now you're taking the position that all of these things don't add up to much:

- machines counting thousands of ballots incorrectly,

- widespread evidence of several types of mail-in ballot fraud (dead people voting, people who live out-of-state voting, mysterious boxes of ballots counted for hours after GOP observers are conned into leaving), 

- Dem agitators kicking GOP observers out of counting rooms without cause,

- Dem agitators physically preventing GOP poll watchers from access to viewpoints,

- MSM and big tech corporations blocking factual information from the public so that millions of voters aren't aware of te magnitude of Joe's scandal....

And there's another one following in that vein of hypocrisy by choosing to ignore that doesn't get any attention.

Rich leftist donors found ways of getting around election laws. Zuckerberg was the most blatant example because he found a way of using a "charity" to finance how the election took place and thus hire agents to manage the process. But the mainstream media doesn't think you need to know about that.

Dinesh D'Zouza explains:

 

[WestCanMan]

31 minutes ago, Cannucklehead said:

From your link:

 

Initial results in the reliably Republican county in northern Michigan showed Joe Biden with a 7,769-4,509 lead, which was changed to a 9,783-7,289 Trump lead two days later and eventually a 9,748-5,960 margin for Trump.
 

Seems to me if your going to rig the system to give Biden a win you wouldn't rig it to give more votes to trump.  

The voting machines had Biden ahead. The 'software glitch' in the machines had given thousands of Trump votes to Biden.

How would you like it if your single, solitary vote for Trudeau wound up counting for the Conservatives? What about those of your whole family, and all of your left-leaning friends? You'd be irate.

 

The main fact to keep in mind is that no one would have even noticed this if the error would have been less noticeable.

If the 9,748-5,960 margin for Trump came out of the machines as 9,000-6,600 it may have stood.

748 down for Trump, 640 extra votes for Biden, that's 1,388 extra votes for Biden in a state with only 15,700 votes. That's 12%. That's far more than the margin of victory, but the machines were actually off by far more than that.

 

If you do the math, they had Joe with 7,769 out of 12,278 votes, or 63% of the vote (he ended up with only 38% there, that's 25% less than the pace the machines had him on).

Biden didn't even get 7,769 votes out of the final tally of 15,708 votes. He ended up with 1,800 votes less than that after 3,500 more votes came in. 

If the machines ratio had held up, Biden would have ended up with an extra 3,900 ballots in Antrim county alone. 

 

In short, the machines were off by 25% in Antrim, and the difference in the whole state was less than 3%. And voting machines were just one part of the problem. There were several other serious issues with the votes there.

[WestCanMan]

16 minutes ago, Infidel Dog said:

And there's another one following in that vein of hypocrisy by choosing to ignore that doesn't get any attention.

Rich leftist donors found ways of getting around election laws. Zuckerberg was the most blatant example because he found a way of using a "charity" to finance how the election took place and thus hire agents to manage the process. But the mainstream media doesn't think you need to know about that.

Dinesh D'Zouza explains:

 

Holy crap. If the info from 2:09 - 2:40 in that video is legit, the election was not.

[Guest]

2 minutes ago, WestCanMan said:

Holy crap. If the info from 2:09 - 2:40 in that video is legit, the election was not.

Let's face it, if any of the claims made so far are legit, the election is not.

The election is, so they are not.