The Coronavirus

New World Disorder · April 22, 2020

Just now, eyeball said:

Why?

I am really wondering who is going to be stuck with the bill?

eyeball · April 22, 2020

13 minutes ago, New World Disorder said:

I am really wondering who is going to be stuck with the bill?

What bill?

dialamah · April 22, 2020

3 hours ago, WestCanMan said:

Covid is killing people who are very near death.

My 28 year old niece-in-law in on a ventilator. She has a six month old son. She's more likely to survive than an 80 year old would be, but she might not survive. Her husband got it through delivering medical supplies to seniors homes; both he and the son got mild cases.

If only those least at risk are the ones you advocate putting at risk, they'll be the ones dying. You aren't just taking about sacrificing people "near death", but everybody of any age group.

Edited April 22, 2020 by dialamah

WestCanMan · April 22, 2020

5 minutes ago, dialamah said:

My 28 year old niece-in-law in on a ventilator. She has a six month old son. She's more likely to survive than an 80 year old would be, but she might not survive. Her husband got it through delivering medical supplies to seniors homes; both he and the son got mild cases.

If only those least at risk are the ones you advocate putting at risk, they'll be the ones dying. You aren't just taking about sacrificing people "near death", but everybody of any age group.

I'm really sorry to hear about that.I hope she gets better soon.

I have only heard anecdotal reports about young people being that sick with covid. I didn't know if it was real or BS.

I don't even know anyone at all who's sick with it.

eyeball · April 22, 2020

1 hour ago, WestCanMan said:

I have only heard anecdotal reports about young people being that sick with covid. I didn't know if it was real or BS.

Maybe sweeping away the clutter of post-it notes and string that dominates your perspective would help you discern a difference.

dialamah · April 22, 2020

1 hour ago, WestCanMan said:

I don't even know anyone at all who's sick with it.

I figured as much.

I had renos planned, everything set up and scheduled. Then businesses started closing and distancing became the newest trend. The contractor came by, checked some measurements, we discussed safety measures related to Covid. A few days later he let us know he was sick, did not say Covid, but symptoms match. That was two weeks ago, don't know how he's doing, hope to hear in the next few days.

A couple of my clients have had family members in the hospital; one was hospitalized for almost 3 weeks. None of these are "old people, near death". So far, nobody has died that I know even peripherally, but these people are being taken out of the work force for weeks at a time, even though they've taken precautions.

And people like you think that it's a good idea to assume that only old people are at risk, or that 10s of thousands of young (under 60) people getting sick and a few thousand of them dying will be "better" for the economy than what's happening now. As if the economy is worth any number of lives.

But I suppose until it happens to you or someone close to you, its just not real.

Edited April 22, 2020 by dialamah

WestCanMan · April 22, 2020

14 minutes ago, eyeball said:

Maybe sweeping away the clutter of post-it notes and string that dominates your perspective would help you discern a difference.

Do you ever feel like you have nothing to add to the conversation but you're just going to blab anyways?

I hope so, otherwise it's just weird.

eyeball · April 22, 2020

2 minutes ago, WestCanMan said:

Do you ever feel like you have nothing to add to the conversation but you're just going to blab anyways?

No, I get the feeling that no matter what I add to a discussion you'll go out of your way to avoid dealing with it.

Edited April 22, 2020 by eyeball

WestCanMan · April 22, 2020

13 minutes ago, dialamah said:

I figured as much.

I had renos planned, everything set up and scheduled. Then businesses started closing and distancing became the newest trend. The contractor came by, checked some measurements, we discussed safety measures related to Covid. A few days later he let us know he was sick, did not say Covid, but symptoms match. That was two weeks ago, don't know how he's doing, hope to hear in the next few days.

A couple of my clients have had family members in the hospital; one was hospitalized for almost 3 weeks. None of these are "old people, near death". So far, nobody has died that I know even peripherally, but these people are being taken out of the work force for weeks at a time, even though they've taken precautions.

And people like you think that it's a good idea to assume that only old people are at risk, or that 10s of thousands of young (under 60) people getting sick and a few thousand of them dying will be "better" for the economy than what's happening now. As if the economy is worth any number of lives.

But I suppose until it happens to you or someone close to you, its just not real.

That's what the stats say, from hundreds of thousands of victims, so yeah. https://www.worldometers.info/coronavirus/coronavirus-age-sex-demographics/

AGE	DEATH RATE confirmed cases	DEATH RATE all cases
80+ years old	21.9%	14.8%
70-79 years old		8.0%
60-69 years old		3.6%
50-59 years old		1.3%
40-49 years old		0.4%
30-39 years old		0.2%
20-29 years old		0.2%
10-19 years old		0.2%
0-9 years old		no fatalities

WestCanMan · April 22, 2020

8 minutes ago, eyeball said:

No, I get the feeling that no matter what I add to a discussion you'll go out of your way to avoid dealing with it.

I never fail to put your childish posts to rest eyeball. If you want to talk about dodged posts just look back through today's posts. You're just not relevant today.

SpankyMcFarland · April 22, 2020

What I really want is for this whole nightmare to be over with as few of my many vulnerable relatives and friends, and Canadians and humans for that matter, to die from it as possible. As the right-wing journal NRO remarked, stats can tell you many things but look at the direct evidence from New York, Italy and China. This is not the flu.

eyeball · April 22, 2020

18 minutes ago, WestCanMan said:

I never fail to put your childish posts to rest eyeball. If you want to talk about dodged posts just look back through today's posts. You're just not relevant today.

I've never dodged a single one of your posts ever, I've simply ignored the deflections and strawmen they contain.

SpankyMcFarland · April 22, 2020

2 hours ago, dialamah said:

My 28 year old niece-in-law in on a ventilator. She has a six month old son. She's more likely to survive than an 80 year old would be, but she might not survive. Her husband got it through delivering medical supplies to seniors homes; both he and the son got mild cases.

That is just awful. I hope she recovers.

WestCanMan · April 23, 2020

3 minutes ago, eyeball said:

I've never dodged a single one of your posts ever, I've simply ignored the deflections and strawmen they contain.

P46 of "Will it be the virus that takes Trump down?" just as an example. You say a bunch of things which are all wrong, you get the corrections, you simmer down. As usual.

Sorry but it's not my fault that you choose bad sources or that you don't have the ability to see through their BS. I've told you probably 1,000x now which media to avoid, you're like their energizer bunny of propagating their inaccurate news & views.

eyeball · April 23, 2020

2 minutes ago, WestCanMan said:

P46 of "Will it be the virus that takes Trump down?" just as an example.

Cite the specific post.

Quote

I've told you probably 1,000x now which media to avoid

Yes I'm well aware of that and whenever I've asked why, you've explained that it's because the Washington Post, New York Times, CBC, BBC, CTV, Vanity Fair etc etc etc etc are all publishing and broadcasting what CNN says. Fair enough. The next painfully obvious and logical question, that you always dodge, is exactly how CNN gets them to do that?

marcus · April 23, 2020

6 hours ago, dialamah said:

My 28 year old niece-in-law in on a ventilator. She has a six month old son. She's more likely to survive than an 80 year old would be, but she might not survive. Her husband got it through delivering medical supplies to seniors homes; both he and the son got mild cases.

If only those least at risk are the ones you advocate putting at risk, they'll be the ones dying. You aren't just taking about sacrificing people "near death", but everybody of any age group.

Does she smoke, have any conditions and a weak immune?

marcus · April 23, 2020

So Sweden's relaxed method vs Canada's method

Not going to compare the numbers due to population. What I'm curious about is the decline. Too early to tell now, but in a week or two, we'll be able to compare and question whether the measures taken in Canada were necessary.

Source

SpankyMcFarland · April 23, 2020

I know mere mention of the New York Times is liable to send some of you into fits of apoplexy but it has been doing a good job covering the pandemic, in my opinion. Here’s an article that proposes an answer to a central puzzle of this disease: why many people with COVID-19 pneumonia can feel relatively well despite alarmingly low oxygen blood levels and why they suddenly crash afterwards. There’s also a suggestion as to how one might monitor this hazard more effectively in COVID-19 patients:

Quote

The coronavirus attacks lung cells that make surfactant. This substance helps the air sacs in the lungs stay open between breaths and is critical to normal lung function. As the inflammation from Covid pneumonia starts, it causes the air sacs to collapse, and oxygen levels fall. Yet the lungs initially remain “compliant,” not yet stiff or heavy with fluid. This means patients can still expel carbon dioxide — and without a buildup of carbon dioxide, patients do not feel short of breath.

Patients compensate for the low oxygen in their blood by breathing faster and deeper — and this happens without their realizing it. This silent hypoxia, and the patient’s physiological response to it, causes even more inflammation and more air sacs to collapse, and the pneumonia worsens until oxygen levels plummet. In effect, patients are injuring their own lungs by breathing harder and harder. Twenty percent of Covid pneumonia patients then go on to a second and deadlier phase of lung injury. Fluid builds up and the lungs become stiff, carbon dioxide rises, and patients develop acute respiratory failure.

...Pulse oximetry is no more complicated than using a thermometer. These small devices turn on with one button and are placed on a fingertip. In a few seconds, two numbers are displayed: oxygen saturation and pulse rate. Pulse oximeters are extremely reliable in detecting oxygenation problems and elevated heart rates.

Pulse oximeters helped save the lives of two emergency physicians I know, alerting them early on to the need for treatment. When they noticed their oxygen levels declining, both went to the hospital and recovered (though one waited longer and required more treatment). Detection of hypoxia, early treatment and close monitoring apparently also worked for Boris Johnson, the British prime minister.

https://www.nytimes.com/2020/04/20/opinion/coronavirus-testing-pneumonia.html?algo=top_conversion&fellback=false&imp_id=130263923&imp_id=852022415&action=click&module=trending&pgtype=Article&region=Footer

Edited April 23, 2020 by SpankyMcFarland

WestCanMan · April 23, 2020

4 hours ago, eyeball said:

The next painfully obvious and logical question, that you always dodge, is exactly how CNN gets them to do that?

They get talking points from Dem media liaisons.
You’ll notice from time to time that they all “randomly” end up using the exact same unique catch-phrase, or asking the same stupid question, like: “When Trump asked Russia to help find the emails, was it treason?”

CNN and MSNBC are the troglodytes of the leftist mob. They make the dumbest arguments which appeal to the lowest level of leftists, the rest of the leftist media back them up but they try to maintain the appearance of not being retarded.

eyeball · April 23, 2020

20 minutes ago, WestCanMan said:

They get talking points from Dem media liaisons.
You’ll notice from time to time that they all “randomly” end up using the exact same unique catch-phrase, or asking the same stupid question, like: “When Trump asked Russia to help find the emails, was it treason?”

But you're saying these catch-phrases and questions aren't random, that they're deliberate and being distributed in an organized systematic way to media outlets around the world by the Democratic Party. Do they do this by email, courier, fax or just phone them?

Quote

CNN and MSNBC are the troglodytes of the leftist mob. They make the dumbest arguments which appeal to the lowest level of leftists, the rest of the leftist media back them up but they try to maintain the appearance of not being retarded.

How many people are involved in this mob do you think? It must take a fair bit of orchestration with teams working on catch-phrases then testing them on people, project managers to run these by Hillary or Biden or whoever's in charge for approval, then there's all that emailing, phoning, faxing, couriering then double checking to ensure everyone got it right or wrong as the case may be. Given the global scope of the project and all the news outlets it has to contend with it must be running 24 hours a day with offices in every country.

Do you have any whistleblowers with any evidence of all this or are post-it notes, maps, big red Sharpie and string all you need? Does that all come in a kit or something?

SpankyMcFarland · April 23, 2020

Pulse oximeters are not expensive:

Quote

https://www.businessinsider.com/coronavirus-pneumonia-signs-over-the-counter-pulse-oximeter-2020-4

BTW I have no financial interest in them. Honest.

Edited April 23, 2020 by SpankyMcFarland

SpankyMcFarland · April 23, 2020

I heard a Scandinavian on BBC radio making a crucial semantic distinction in our English language; physical distancing should not mean social distancing. We must endeavour to stay close to each other while we are separated.

Edited April 23, 2020 by SpankyMcFarland

OftenWrong · April 23, 2020

5 hours ago, SpankyMcFarland said:

I heard a Scandinavian on BBC radio making a crucial semantic distinction in our English language; physical distancing should not mean social distancing. We must endeavour to stay close to each other while we are separated.

Sounds important. This concern about people's psychological well-being is absent from our media and from our politician's lousy mouths.

Was reading Swedish news, in English. Here's a good one from from one of their news outlets, the Local. Americans living in Sweden:
An American perspective on the Swedish Coronavirus Strategy

Quote

the Swedish method of achieving this goal is clearly different from the countries that rely upon a "lockdown" strategy enforced by police and the military, or that have limited movement to "essential" workers.