Argus Posted March 23, 2019 Report Posted March 23, 2019 3 hours ago, jacee said: I have NO interest in your nonsensical battle-of-the-books. It's how people behave to others that matters. Agreed. And in every Muslim country people behave horribly. Every Muslim country is an awful place I would never want to visit, much less live. And so I am extremely unenthusiastic about bringing masses of the people from those countries here. Especially without assessing their views and beliefs. 3 "A liberal is someone who claims to be open to all points of view — and then is surprised and offended to find there are other points of view.” William F Buckley
DogOnPorch Posted March 23, 2019 Report Posted March 23, 2019 10 minutes ago, Argus said: Agreed. And in every Muslim country people behave horribly. Every Muslim country is an awful place I would never want to visit, much less live. And so I am extremely unenthusiastic about bringing masses of the people from those countries here. Especially without assessing their views and beliefs. Well...the Quran is rather an important part of Islam. Quote O you who have believed, do not take the Jews and the Christians as allies. They are [in fact] allies of one another. And whoever is an ally to them among you - then indeed, he is [one] of them. Indeed, Allah guides not the wrongdoing people. So you see those in whose hearts is disease hastening into [association with] them, saying, "We are afraid a misfortune may strike us." But perhaps Allah will bring conquest or a decision from Him, and they will become, over what they have been concealing within themselves, regretful. And those who believe will say, "Are these the ones who swore by Allah their strongest oaths that indeed they were with you?" Their deeds have become worthless, and they have become losers. O you who have believed, whoever of you should revert from his religion - Allah will bring forth [in place of them] a people He will love and who will love Him [who are] humble toward the believers, powerful against the disbelievers; they strive in the cause of Allah and do not fear the blame of a critic. That is the favor of Allah ; He bestows it upon whom He wills. And Allah is all-Encompassing and Knowing. Your ally is none but Allah and [therefore] His Messenger and those who have believed - those who establish prayer and give zakah, and they bow [in worship]. https://quran.com/5/51-61?translations=20 Nothing cracks a turtle like Leon Uris.
Michael Hardner Posted March 23, 2019 Report Posted March 23, 2019 10 hours ago, Argus said: And so I am extremely unenthusiastic about bringing masses of the people from those countries here. Especially without assessing their views and beliefs. Why ? They don't want to live there either ! 1 Looks like someone has a new patronizing catch phrase ! Michael Hardner
Michael Hardner Posted March 23, 2019 Report Posted March 23, 2019 10 hours ago, Argus said: So you got nothing. Lots of fringe right groups... Yellow Vests Canada... Soldiers of Odin... Proud Boys Canada... etc. Looks like someone has a new patronizing catch phrase ! Michael Hardner
DogOnPorch Posted March 23, 2019 Report Posted March 23, 2019 1 minute ago, Michael Hardner said: Lots of fringe right groups... Yellow Vests Canada... Soldiers of Odin... Proud Boys Canada... etc. Can you provide a list of these terrorist group's terrorist attacks? 1 Nothing cracks a turtle like Leon Uris.
bush_cheney2004 Posted March 23, 2019 Report Posted March 23, 2019 2 minutes ago, Michael Hardner said: Lots of fringe right groups... Yellow Vests Canada... Soldiers of Odin... Proud Boys Canada... etc. Indeed...lots of fringe groups all over the political spectrum. So when did they give up their Charter Rights ? 1 Economics trumps Virtue.
DogOnPorch Posted March 23, 2019 Report Posted March 23, 2019 1 minute ago, bush_cheney2004 said: Indeed...lots of fringe groups all over the political spectrum. So when did they give up their Charter Rights ? The one terror attack in my city was a pro-Palestinian one...oddly enough. In a city without any Jews living in it. Years ago... Hey...they aren't smart. Nothing cracks a turtle like Leon Uris.
Michael Hardner Posted March 23, 2019 Report Posted March 23, 2019 1 hour ago, bush_cheney2004 said: Indeed...lots of fringe groups all over the political spectrum. So when did they give up their Charter Rights ? They didn't, but they should be taken away from some of them. Looks like someone has a new patronizing catch phrase ! Michael Hardner
Michael Hardner Posted March 23, 2019 Report Posted March 23, 2019 11 hours ago, Argus said: So you got nothing. Not sure @jacee didn't see the need to back her claim and I'm reluctant to help people who don't do that, but it's so obvious that it irritates me for this to be out there.... https://www.680news.com/video/2019/03/22/expert-says-hate-groups-on-the-rise-in-canada/?hootPostID=e74180ae9e294db3885fb6b560437261 "Barbara Perry, a professor at the Ontario Institute of Technology, has been studying hate groups and says there’s been a rise of white nationalist rhetoric. She estimates more than 200 hate groups exist in the country and says social media is a vital tool for them." Looks like someone has a new patronizing catch phrase ! Michael Hardner
cannuck Posted March 23, 2019 Report Posted March 23, 2019 12 hours ago, Argus said: Agreed. And in every Muslim country people behave horribly. Every Muslim country is an awful place I would never want to visit, much less live. And so I am extremely unenthusiastic about bringing masses of the people from those countries here. Especially without assessing their views and beliefs. I have spent a lot of time in muslim countries, and have to tell you, from MY point of view, they are not awful places at all. A lot of the rhetoric we in the West hear about them is based on lack of understanding of what is REALLY going on there. I get along just fine there, BUT: I do so because I make every effort to respect THEIR values while I am in THEIR country - and that works very well for myself and my hosts. What does not work worth a damn is bringing people here who are not anxious to make the effort to get in harmony with OUR values. I can adapt pretty much anywhere because I am not at all religious - no beliefs of any kind. When you bring Muslims here, they are often constrained by being "true believers" in something very different from traditional Can/USA "true beliefs" (that I must add are also a total crock of shit). While bringing them is a BIG mistake, once they are here, what I find in my grand survey database of my own experience is that their children and especially those borne here do a fairly good job of integrating. BUT: my experience is mostly with educated and accomplished immigrants, not political and economic "refugees", nor but a few genuine refugees.
jacee Posted March 23, 2019 Author Report Posted March 23, 2019 (edited) 1 hour ago, Michael Hardner said: They didn't, but they should be taken away from some of them. There isn't any need (or justification) for that. Freedom of expression does not include inciting or promoting hatred: That's a crime in Canada. https://laws-lois.justice.gc.ca/eng/acts/c-46/section-319.html Edited March 23, 2019 by jacee
DogOnPorch Posted March 23, 2019 Report Posted March 23, 2019 1 minute ago, jacee said: There isn't any need (or justification) for that. Inciting or promoting hatred is not 'freedom of expression': It's a crime in Canada. Is this hate speech? Is this man to be stopped at all costs? If so...why? https://nationalpost.com/news/canada/calgary-university-cancels-event-by-ex-muslim-citing-sensitivity-after-new-zealand-attacks Nothing cracks a turtle like Leon Uris.
Michael Hardner Posted March 23, 2019 Report Posted March 23, 2019 7 minutes ago, jacee said: There isn't any need (or justification) for that. Freedom of expression does not include inciting or promoting hatred: That's a crime in Canada. https://laws-lois.justice.gc.ca/eng/acts/c-46/section-319.html They will pussyfoot around the laws... just put them in jail maybe Looks like someone has a new patronizing catch phrase ! Michael Hardner
DogOnPorch Posted March 23, 2019 Report Posted March 23, 2019 1 minute ago, Michael Hardner said: They will pussyfoot around the laws... just put them in jail maybe Oh...so the ex-Muslim wanting to "spread hate" at the universities should be jailed rather than just de-platformed? Good to know where us non-Muslims stand in your Brave New World. Nothing cracks a turtle like Leon Uris.
Michael Hardner Posted March 23, 2019 Report Posted March 23, 2019 22 minutes ago, DogOnPorch said: Oh...so the ex-Muslim wanting to "spread hate" at the universities should be jailed rather than just de-platformed? Yeah, well if you're spreading hate then you're breaking the law, so... you know... 22 minutes ago, DogOnPorch said: Good to know where us non-Muslims stand in your Brave New World. Not all non-Muslims just those who break my laws. Looks like someone has a new patronizing catch phrase ! Michael Hardner
Argus Posted March 23, 2019 Report Posted March 23, 2019 3 hours ago, Michael Hardner said: Lots of fringe right groups... Yellow Vests Canada... Soldiers of Odin... Proud Boys Canada... etc. None of which are white supremacists. "A liberal is someone who claims to be open to all points of view — and then is surprised and offended to find there are other points of view.” William F Buckley
DogOnPorch Posted March 23, 2019 Report Posted March 23, 2019 3 minutes ago, Michael Hardner said: Yeah, well if you're spreading hate then you're breaking the law, so... you know... Not all non-Muslims just those who break my laws. Is he "spreading hate"? Nothing cracks a turtle like Leon Uris.
Argus Posted March 23, 2019 Report Posted March 23, 2019 3 hours ago, Michael Hardner said: Why ? They don't want to live there either ! Demonstrably untrue. "A liberal is someone who claims to be open to all points of view — and then is surprised and offended to find there are other points of view.” William F Buckley
Argus Posted March 23, 2019 Report Posted March 23, 2019 (edited) 2 hours ago, Michael Hardner said: Not sure @jacee didn't see the need to back her claim and I'm reluctant to help people who don't do that, but it's so obvious that it irritates me for this to be out there.... https://www.680news.com/video/2019/03/22/expert-says-hate-groups-on-the-rise-in-canada/?hootPostID=e74180ae9e294db3885fb6b560437261 "Barbara Perry, a professor at the Ontario Institute of Technology, has been studying hate groups and says there’s been a rise of white nationalist rhetoric. She estimates more than 200 hate groups exist in the country and says social media is a vital tool for them." I'm still waiting for the names of such 'hate groups'. I'm still waiting for examples of their violence. Some leftist professor making a claim on TV is not evidence. Leftist professors probably think the conservative party is a hate group. Hundreds of hate groups but not a single name or example? Phhht. And no, this isn't anti-intellectualism. Academics have basically done away with the respect they used to be accorded by allowing extreme ideological biases to so strongly influence their work and its outcomes. I need evidence, not someone from 'the Canadian Centre for policy alternatives' simply telling me so. Edited March 23, 2019 by Argus "A liberal is someone who claims to be open to all points of view — and then is surprised and offended to find there are other points of view.” William F Buckley
Argus Posted March 23, 2019 Report Posted March 23, 2019 1 hour ago, cannuck said: I have spent a lot of time in muslim countries, and have to tell you, from MY point of view, they are not awful places at all. A lot of the rhetoric we in the West hear about them is based on lack of understanding of what is REALLY going on there. I get along just fine there, BUT: I do so because I make every effort to respect THEIR values while I am in THEIR country - and that works very well for myself and my hosts. A nice place to visit but you wouldn't want to live there. Because if you lived there and you said anything, even by mistake, which could be construed as being against the government, or Islamic values you would probably discover just how awful they could be. If you lived there you would find your freedoms severely limited, especially if you were a woman. You would also find in any legal entanglement, that you., as a non-Muslim, are not treated as well as a Muslim. And if it became broadly known you were an atheist you could be imprisoned. "A liberal is someone who claims to be open to all points of view — and then is surprised and offended to find there are other points of view.” William F Buckley
Michael Hardner Posted March 23, 2019 Report Posted March 23, 2019 55 minutes ago, Argus said: None of which are white supremacists. What are they then ? Looks like someone has a new patronizing catch phrase ! Michael Hardner
Michael Hardner Posted March 23, 2019 Report Posted March 23, 2019 56 minutes ago, Argus said: Demonstrably untrue. The ones who come to Canada don't want to come to Canada? Demonstrate that truth. Looks like someone has a new patronizing catch phrase ! Michael Hardner
Michael Hardner Posted March 23, 2019 Report Posted March 23, 2019 49 minutes ago, Argus said: I'm still waiting for the names of such 'hate groups'. I'm still waiting for examples of their violence. Some leftist professor making a claim on TV is not evidence. Leftist professors probably think the conservative party is a hate group. Hundreds of hate groups but not a single name or example? Phhht. And no, this isn't anti-intellectualism. Academics have basically done away with the respect they used to be accorded by allowing extreme ideological biases to so strongly influence their work and its outcomes. I need evidence, not someone from 'the Canadian Centre for policy alternatives' simply telling me so. Sorry, we might as well give up jumping through hoops on the obvious since you will just demand we display our conservative purity certificate at the end of the discussion. Looks like someone has a new patronizing catch phrase ! Michael Hardner
DogOnPorch Posted March 23, 2019 Report Posted March 23, 2019 3 minutes ago, Michael Hardner said: What are they then ? Islam a supremacist religion. Nothing cracks a turtle like Leon Uris.
Argus Posted March 23, 2019 Report Posted March 23, 2019 4 minutes ago, Michael Hardner said: What are they then ? The yellow Vests seem to be a blue collar oil worker type response to the french version, mostly upset at Trudeau for not pushing through pipelines and for blocking resource development. The Soldiers of Odin and the Proud Boys appear to be a response to ANTIFA and their violence towards conservatives. None, so far as I'm aware, has a white nationalist philosophy, nor is only open to whites. None are organized to hate any particular group ( other than ANTIFA). 1 1 "A liberal is someone who claims to be open to all points of view — and then is surprised and offended to find there are other points of view.” William F Buckley
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