Feds pick a fight on refugees.

[Goddess]

12 minutes ago, dialamah said:

 

.....

Ok.  I didn't read your whole post, but I will say I don't think you are morally reprehensible.  Your concern and care for Syrian refugees and your work with women leaving JWs would certainly demonstrate where you care.

But if I say that its no reward for a woman to lose her family and potentially her child is met with "I have no sympathy for her", why am I wrong for considering that a heartless response?  Sure, she deserves to be deported but I don't think I am wrong for feeling empathy.  

Anyway, I am done ... Being attacked for presenting facts and expressing empathy is not my idea of a good time.

Again, I didn't say her reward was losing her family and child.  I said, why should she be rewarded with citizenship for breaking our laws?  Especially when there was no reason to do so.

And I didn't say I had no sympathy - I said I had "little sympathy" - about the same amount of sympathy I have for anyone who deliberately breaks the law and gets caught and suffers the consequences.

What you're feeling isn't empathy.  It's self-righteousness.

[dialamah]

1 minute ago, Goddess said:

What you're feeling isn't empathy.  It's self-righteousness.

*shrugs*.  Ok, I'm self righteous.  Feel better?

[taxme]

On 7/22/2018 at 9:51 AM, capricorn said:

The odds of being accepted as a refugee increase significantly if you bear a child on Canadian soil. I mean, as you know all you have to do is give birth in a plane over Canadian airspace and the kid is automatically a citizen.

This should never be allowed to continue on. Many of these people from the third world try and do this all the time. Where does this make any kind of sense where because some woman is pregnant and has her baby on another country's soil that she will get to stay? So, if the baby is born on Canadian soil then, I guess the baby could get to stay here but the baby's parents must go back to their own home country. They are not Canadian. Seems like the right thing to do to me because the parents are not Canadian citizen's.

This is all just another excuse by these people from the third world to try and get to sneak into Canada illegally and get to stay in Canada illegally. This silly ass bull chit needs to stop but will our asleep at the switch as always politicians decide to do something about this criminality? Personally, I doubt that they will do anything about it. Our politicians appear to be always asleep at the switch. What the hell and why are we the Canadian people paying these guys/gals for? They all appear to continue to want to make an ass out of Canada all the time. Disgusting. 

[Goddess]

14 minutes ago, dialamah said:

  Feel better?

 

[taxme]

4 hours ago, turningrite said:

Unending bitchfest? I think Canadians are remarkably stoic about (and, perhaps even more importantly, largely unaware of) the problems associated with our immigration and refugee programs. Once more-or-less a progressive myself, the biggest wakeup call I got on these issues was from a friend who used to work in the federal immigration and refugee system. His assessment of the system's weaknesses and problems was chilling. He got out of that bureaucracy. I wonder what he'd have to say about today's problems? My guess is that he'd raise an eyebrow and describe the situation as entirely predictable. Canadians, he'd no doubt conclude, have been sleepwalking for decades.

It is quite obvious that our politicians and the media have decided that the Canadian people should not be filled in on what is going on with our huge and immense legal and illegal refugee immigration that is going on in Canada and how it is being abused by so many people from around the world who are taking advantage of the Canadian people. I can go out on my patio and I can watch many workers in the trades and construction business working their asses off to try and get the building across my street completed in rain, snow or heat? I wonder if they were made aware of as to how their taxes that they have to pay is going to support a broken down immigration system and that there are tens of thousands of legal and illegal refugees pouring into Canada and being looked after at their expense? Maybe they should be asked about this and let's hear as to what they have to say about all this refugee bs going on. 

So true though. Many Canadian are aware of what is going on but the alarm bells in their heads has not gone off yet or if it has gone off they still are walking in their sleep so to speak and could careless. But in most cases thanks to political correctness this is going to continue on until we get a Trump like politician who will ring the bell to wake they the people up. 

[capricorn]

11 minutes ago, taxme said:

This silly ass bull chit needs to stop but will our asleep at the switch as always politicians decide to do something about this criminality? Personally, I doubt that they will do anything about it. Our politicians appear to be always asleep at the switch. What the hell and why are we the Canadian people paying these guys/gals for? They all appear to continue to want to make an ass out of Canada all the time. Disgusting. 

Every immigrant and refugee accepted by Canada represents a vote for the political  party that oversaw their arrival here. That's quite an incentive for increasing those arrivals.

[-TSS-]

In this context the term net-migration is uded and while it is not false information it is still misleading and used as a purpose to show that immigration is not such a problem.

Immigration-emigration=Net migration.'

I don't know the actual migration figures of your country but as Canada is quite a wanted immigration-destiny I would estimate that the annual immigration is about 1% of your population which would be around 350000. How many people emigrate from Canada? 100-200k every year?

The problem with presenting the issue this way is that probably 95% of immigration to canada is by foreigners and only 5% by Canadians who lived abroad but now return to Canada when as of the emigrants 80% or so must be Canadians moving abroad, to the USA mostly but also to Europe, and only about 20% foreigners who leave Canada.

[bush_cheney2004]

5 minutes ago, -TSS- said:

....I don't know the actual migration figures of your country but as Canada is quite a wanted immigration-destiny I would estimate that the annual immigration is about 1% of your population which would be around 350000. How many people emigrate from Canada? 100-200k every year?

 

 

Canada has long been a revolving door for immigration-emigration.   Millions of Canadian nationals live outside of Canada.

Quote

Canada has always thought of itself as a nation of immigrants. But new research suggests that among wealthy immigrant-receiving nations, Canada is one of the likeliest to see its own citizens move abroad.

Nearly 2.8 million Canadians (9 per cent of the population) live in other countries, according to a study by the Asia Pacific Foundation, proportionally about five times higher than the United States and roughly the same as Britain.

https://www.theglobeandmail.com/news/national/time-to-lead/as-nation-of-immigrants-canada-must-now-confront-its-emigrants/article588140/

 

[Zeitgeist]

That's typical of smaller countries.  Certain jobs simply don't exist in Canada.  It's all relative though, as Canada has a very diverse job market for its size.  I'm sure New Zealanders find opportunities in Australia that don't exist in their home country, yet New Zealand is a very desirable place to live.  Depends what you're looking for.  Ireland has more ex-pats than it has Irish within its borders. 

[Argus]

5 hours ago, dialamah said:

Sure, just like why not roll the dice and overstay your visa or cross the border illegally in the hopes that you can beat the odds and be granted PR status.  But that's the point:  you have to beat the odds.  Regardless of claims made by some people, we don't simply throw our hands in the air and allow most people who flout our laws to stay. 

The acceptance rate for asylum claims in the last year of the Harper government was 35%

Now it's 70% As far as I'm concerned 70% is synonymous with "most".

[Argus]

5 hours ago, dialamah said:

Hey just cause you can't imagine having empathy for someone even while supporting consequences for their illegal actions doesn't mean others can't. 

I have plenty of empathy. In fact, I've often said if I was living in some shithole country I'd try to get into Canada or the US, too. I don't blame them in the least for taking advantage of the ridiculous stupid ass rules, regulations and loopholes we have in place. I blame government which won't tighten those rules, and I blame people like you, for putting pressure on government to not tighten those rules.

[Argus]

3 hours ago, dialamah said:

Anyway, I am done ... Being attacked for presenting facts and expressing empathy is not my idea of a good time.

Oh boo hoo! Your first step into this topic was to attack me, so pardon me if I don't sympathize with yet another of your whiny complaints about how "you" are constantly being attacked.

 

[dialamah]

5 minutes ago, Argus said:

I blame government which won't tighten those rules, and I blame people like you, for putting pressure on government to not tighten those rules.

Here's what I posted earlier in the thread:

I agree we could be faster at processing claims and more effectively follow through on deportation orders, but no doubt that would mean a change in government priorities to more effectively resource the entire system - that means tax dollars reallocated from somewhere else, or increased taxation.  May also mean a change in government, but if JT is paying attention he will have to at least present some plan to deal with the current migrant issue. 

Notice how I acknowledge a problem and suggest that either a change in gov't or some real action by JT would be needed to address it?  See, you have put me in a box and decided what I do or do not believe based on that box and not what I actually think or even what I post.  You make most of your mistakes because you make hese kinds of broad based assumptions about people.  

(Wonder if Goddess will leap to my defense for the "lie" you just posted about me, as she did for you).

18 minutes ago, Argus said:

Oh boo hoo! Your first step into this topic was to attack me, so pardon me if I don't sympathize with yet another of your whiny complaints about how "you" are constantly being attacked.

 

Attack you?  Nope, just clarifying for a new poster where your interests lie.  A poster, BTW, who you continue to personally attack because their language skills identify him/her as an immigrant.  

 

[Argus]

1 minute ago, dialamah said:

Here's what I posted earlier in the thread: Notice how I acknowledge a problem

Nope. The only problem you acknowledged was how long it takes to process refugees. Not the 70% acceptance rate, or taking in tens of thousands of people who don't even qualify under the UN refugee definition, ie, Syrians, or not screening people for their compatibility with Canadian society.

1 minute ago, dialamah said:

.  Attack you?  Nope, just clarifying for a new poster where your interests lie.  A poster, BTW, who you continue to personally attack because their language skills identify him/her as an immigrant.  

Bullshit. You lied about my views, and as for my 'attacking' a poster because of his immigration, you're just reveling your own bigotry again. The poster in question has been jeering at, mocking, insulting and ridiculing everyone on this topic since he arrived. 

[dialamah]

4 minutes ago, Argus said:

Nope. The only problem you acknowledged was how long it takes to process refugees. .

Correct, you were wrong about my views.  Changing the goalposts now doesn't make you any less wrong, but nice try. 

Quote

Not the 70% acceptance rate,

Which claim I have only seen from you and given how often I have caught you presenting misleading information, I am not likely to accept it till I have verified it and I am currently too lazy to do so.

Quote

or taking in tens of thousands of people who don't even qualify under the UN refugee definition, ie, Syrians,

Your understanding of the UN refugee definition appears to be lacking from other discussions I have seen so I am discounting this from you as well.

Quote

or not screening people for their compatibility with Canadian society

I've proven you wrong multiple times over two forums regarding cultural compatibility of immigrants/refugees but clearly you are unable to accept logic or evidence that contradicts your anti-Muslim bigotry.

[-TSS-]

2 hours ago, Zeitgeist said:

That's typical of smaller countries.  Certain jobs simply don't exist in Canada.  It's all relative though, as Canada has a very diverse job market for its size.  I'm sure New Zealanders find opportunities in Australia that don't exist in their home country, yet New Zealand is a very desirable place to live.  Depends what you're looking for.  Ireland has more ex-pats than it has Irish within its borders. 

There must be tens of millions of people all across the USA, Canada, Australia and New Zealand who could claim some Irish ancestry but how many actual current Irish citizens are there living outside Ireland?

I'm sure plenty of those too but not exactly more than living in Ireland.

[Centerpiece]

3 hours ago, bush_cheney2004 said:

 

Canada has long been a revolving door for immigration-emigration.   Millions of Canadian nationals live outside of Canada.

 

I'd hazard a guess that a significant number of those are dual citizens. I can't find a cite to support such a claim but perhaps someone else can find some data. As an example, remember Lebanon's troubles back in 2006? 15,000 Lebanese Canadians were brought back to Canada at a cost of $94 million. At the time, about 25,000 Lebanese residents held Canadian citizenship.

Link: https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/94m-for-lebanon-rescue-but-canadian-evacuee-grateful-1.627646

Edited July 24, 2018 by Centerpiece

[Argus]

44 minutes ago, dialamah said:

Correct, you were wrong about my views.  Changing the goalposts now doesn't make you any less wrong, but nice try. 

I didn't change the goalposts, you did. Your views are highly pro immigration and pro refugees while being opposed to any checks on these people first to see if they will assimilate.

44 minutes ago, dialamah said:

Which claim I have only seen from you and given how often I have caught you presenting misleading information, I am not likely to accept it till I have verified it and I am currently too lazy to do so.

Yeah cuz I've only posted this numerous times, including cites. https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/asylum-seekers-overview-data-1.4503825

Canada is accepting a higher proportion of asylum seekers than it has at any time in nearly three decades, a CBC News investigation has found. The acceptance rate increased significantly in the past five years, to 70 per cent in the first nine months of 2017, up from 44 per cent in 2013.

44 minutes ago, dialamah said:

Your understanding of the UN refugee definition appears to be lacking from other discussions I have seen so I am discounting this from you as well.

Yeah, cuz I've only posted the direct quote with cites numerous times, including on many threads you have been heavily involved in.

"A person who owing to a well-founded fear of being persecuted for reasons of race, religion, nationality, membership of a particular social group or political opinion is outside the country of his nationality and is unable or, owing to such fear, is unwilling to avail himself of the protection of that country; or who, not having a nationality and being outside the country of his former habitual residence as a result of such events, is unable or, owing to such fear, is unwilling to return to it."

https://www.cbc.ca/news/world/who-is-a-refugee-1.1191503

44 minutes ago, dialamah said:

I've proven you wrong multiple times 

That you ignore citations from valid sources, and simply continue to parrot brainless progressive drivel about how wonderful multiculturalism and diversity are does not mean you have proven anyone wrong. It only means you are incapable of rational thought.

[Argus]

36 minutes ago, Centerpiece said:

I'd hazard a guess that a significant number of those are dual citizens. I can't find a cite to support such a claim but perhaps someone else can find some data. As an example, remember Lebanon's troubles back in 2006? 15,000 Lebanese Canadians were brought back to Canada at a cost of $94 million. At the time, about 25,000 Lebanese residents held Canadian citizenship.

Link: https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/94m-for-lebanon-rescue-but-canadian-evacuee-grateful-1.627646

And most went back to Lebanon when the trouble was over. Unfortunately, and much to my astonishment when I learned of it, Canada has only just begun keeping records for when Canadians leave the country. You would have thought that was a basic, elementary thing, but no, we'd never done it before. Which allows so many "Canadians" to go home and collect their benefit cheques while sunning it up in Lebanon or India or other locales.

[turningrite]

1 hour ago, Argus said:

And most went back to Lebanon when the trouble was over. Unfortunately, and much to my astonishment when I learned of it, Canada has only just begun keeping records for when Canadians leave the country. You would have thought that was a basic, elementary thing, but no, we'd never done it before. Which allows so many "Canadians" to go home and collect their benefit cheques while sunning it up in Lebanon or India or other locales.

Have we yet implemented exit controls? I heard there was discussion about this but was unaware we had formally opted to do it. I think it's a great idea. They've had exited controls in Europe for quite some time. Every time a person enters or exits the country should be documented. But I suspect the Charter cheerleaders will find a way to attack such a system if it's ever fully developed.

[taxme]

20 hours ago, bush_cheney2004 said:

 

Canada has long been a revolving door for immigration-emigration.   Millions of Canadian nationals live outside of Canada.

 

I believe that what is going on here is that once many of these new immigrants receive their Canadian citizenship many of them then return back to the country that they left and go live there and set up a business. Many immigrants only want to immigrate to Canada to get their citizenship papers and then many of them leave. But when they may be of need of our social or medical services they are able to come back to Canada and start to suck off of those social or medical services.. At least this is what I read many moons ago. I can believe it. 

[taxme]

18 hours ago, dialamah said:

Correct, you were wrong about my views.  Changing the goalposts now doesn't make you any less wrong, but nice try. 

Which claim I have only seen from you and given how often I have caught you presenting misleading information, I am not likely to accept it till I have verified it and I am currently too lazy to do so.

Your understanding of the UN refugee definition appears to be lacking from other discussions I have seen so I am discounting this from you as well.

I've proven you wrong multiple times over two forums regarding cultural compatibility of immigrants/refugees but clearly you are unable to accept logic or evidence that contradicts your anti-Muslim bigotry.

Here is a very simple solution. Canada should not take in any more refugees period. Short, sweet and simple. Canadians have been forced and have had to accept tens of thousands of so called refugees for decades now and so far it has cost the Canadian taxpayer billions of their tax dollars to try and feed, clothe and house the rest of the world's poor coming to Canada, and not only here at home but also billions of our Canadian tax dollars being handed over in foreign aid to all the world's poor. The list of refugees is endless. It is said that there is suppose to be millions of refugees in the world.

Simple solution here also? Give them birth control pills. Easy peasy. To put it rather bluntly, they need to stop breeding like flies. That is their dam problem. They don't know when to stop having babies. What goes on in other countries is not my gawd dam problem and why I have to continue to pay out of my taxes for their problems is beyond me. If a Canadian gives a dam about poor refugee people in other countries well go take your own dollars and spend all you want on them. Have fun. Just leave me out of this refugee game. I do not want to play this phony refugee game anymore. Got it? As far as the UN goes my feelings about that one world order outfit is that they can go take a flying leap off a 1000 foot high mountain. Enough already. Works for me. 

[taxme]

15 hours ago, turningrite said:

Have we yet implemented exit controls? I heard there was discussion about this but was unaware we had formally opted to do it. I think it's a great idea. They've had exited controls in Europe for quite some time. Every time a person enters or exits the country should be documented. But I suspect the Charter cheerleaders will find a way to attack such a system if it's ever fully developed.

I think that it is high time to get rid of some if not all of these pro, bring them all in by the hundreds of thousands, politically correct politicians and replace them with people who will start to show that Canada will not be a sucker country anymore for all this legal and illegal so called refugee nonsense going on anymore and start to give a shit as to what is going on in regards to our Canadian immigration policy and the tax dollars being wasted on it. Canadians are being made fools of every day by these screw ball politicians, and the rest of the world, who really do show no love for Canada but show more love for the rest of the world. Enough already. I am fed up with being made a fool of by these fools we call politicians who could careless as to what and how my tax dollars are being blown. We are being invaded by foreigners who have no right to be here. The majority of Canadians did not ask for this. A tiny minority did and they are getting their way, AGAIN. If this were Mexico those illegal refugees would here today and gone tomorrow. The Mexican government does not fool around or waste their time with illegals entering their country. It's jail time and then out of the country. Our politicians do not want any kinds of controls on immigration. They just want to continue on with no controls so they can continue to waste taxpayer's tax dollars on more of it. Disgusting indeed. 

[Argus]

16 hours ago, turningrite said:

Have we yet implemented exit controls? I heard there was discussion about this but was unaware we had formally opted to do it. I think it's a great idea. They've had exited controls in Europe for quite some time. Every time a person enters or exits the country should be documented. But I suspect the Charter cheerleaders will find a way to attack such a system if it's ever fully developed.

According to an article I found we started recording exit data in late 2016. Although we get it second hand, from the airlines, when they fly out, or from the US when they leave that way. 

[Goddess]

http://www.msn.com/en-ca/news/parliamenthill/entering-canada-no-free-ticket-goodale/ar-AAAlyAz?li=AAggv0m

Quote

 

Canada's Safe Third Country agreement with the U.S. stipulates that asylum seekers are required to make their claims in the first "safe" country where they arrive — meaning those who come into Canada at an official land crossing are sent back to make their claim in the U.S.

The agreement does not cover "irregular" or "illegal" asylum seekers — those entering Canada at unofficial points, most notably in Quebec.

According to the most recent numbers, the RCMP intercepted 1,263 people at the border in June, which is down from 1,869 in May.

Conservative immigration critic Michelle Rempel is urging the Liberals to come up with a better plan to deal with the asylum seekers.

During the committee meeting, she pressed the government about extending the Safe Third Country agreement to the entire border.

 

Goodale is being deliberately deceptive, IMO.

It may not be a "free ticket" to just waltz across our border, but it is definitely 5-10 years of freeloading while you apply and appeal and appeal and appeal and appeal...... and that's plenty of time to have a Canadian baby and start a life here and then you just go to the media and everyone feels sorry for you and you can't be kicked out on "humanitarian" grounds.

Goodale knows this.  The Liberal government knows this.  The illegal border crossers know this.

However they get here, it's a win/win for everyone but the Canadian taxpayer.