Argus Posted July 12, 2017 Report Share Posted July 12, 2017 18 hours ago, Melanie_ said: Hal, I'm just trying to understand the law Army Guy referred to. Even if it's the law, I'm pretty sure most people in the scenario I described would try to defend themselves. Except it was the police who surrounded the house, and returned fire when fired upon, and in that case everyone in the house would be charged and convicted for any resulting deaths. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dialamah Posted July 12, 2017 Report Share Posted July 12, 2017 17 minutes ago, Goddess said: Potato/Potahto Canadian "citizens" who gleefully join the Taliban and fight for them as terrorists against Canadians and their allies, should not be considered Canadian citizens. My point is that Malala made a choice and so did Khadr. He choose poorly and should not be rewarded or shielded from the consequences of his choice. Not potato/potahto. As Canadians, we enjoy certain rights. Those rights exist even if we break the law. If our government is permitted to ignore those rights for people suspected of or even convicted of crimes, then what good are they really? We protect those rights for everyone, we have to also apply them to people we don't like, disapprove of or believe are guilty of crimes. Add to the above that the physical evidence at the scene, including pictures, doesn't actually support Khadr's guilt, and what we have is a witch hunt against Trudeau, led by the Conservative party. Their campaign is based on emotionalism and partisan politics and supported by a public that prefers to be outraged instead of thoughtful. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Argus Posted July 12, 2017 Report Share Posted July 12, 2017 18 hours ago, Melanie_ said: Hal, do you know what you do when you're 10 years old and your dad says you're moving to Afghanistan? You move to Afghanistan. He didn't choose to go there. Likewise if you're a young guy living in Nazi Germany, you join the Hitler youth, and then if you wind up working at, say, a concentration camp, you get charged with crimes against humanity, and the courts says "I was just obeying orders is not a defense". Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boges Posted July 12, 2017 Report Share Posted July 12, 2017 https://www.thestar.com/opinion/commentary/2017/07/12/khadr-has-become-the-liberal-millstone-moore.html Quote I’m not writing this to comfort these said elites. This is a warning: you are going to lose. The electors’ gut and opportunistic demagoguery are more potent political forces than any volume of carefully reasoned opinion pieces. Conservative leader Andrew Scheer knows this. Sun and Rebel Media figures who have started a fundraising campaign for the widow and children of the marine who died in that fateful firefight know it. Never mind the craven self promotion of running the campaign now instead of in 2002 when Sgt. Christopher Speer was killed. The Khadr settlement is going to be a political millstone for Justin Trudeau and the federal Liberals. It’s a scandal that can be invoked with the mere mention of Khadr’s name or incendiary sentences like: “You made a man who killed a marine rich.” It's all about optics. This may sink Trudeau. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Goddess Posted July 12, 2017 Report Share Posted July 12, 2017 1 minute ago, dialamah said: We protect those rights for everyone, we have to also apply them to people we don't like, disapprove of or believe are guilty of crimes. It's not about "liking" Khadr. It's about Khadr pissing all over the rights he is now demanding. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dialamah Posted July 12, 2017 Report Share Posted July 12, 2017 Just now, Goddess said: It's not about "liking" Khadr. It's about Khadr pissing all over the rights he is now demanding. Clearly you do not believe that the rights of Canadians should be upheld. Ok. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DogOnPorch Posted July 12, 2017 Report Share Posted July 12, 2017 1 minute ago, dialamah said: Clearly you do not believe that the rights of Canadians should be upheld. Ok. Omar isn't a Canadian. Spare me the prattle about being born here. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jacee Posted July 12, 2017 Report Share Posted July 12, 2017 26 minutes ago, capricorn said: Do I detect that you would like us to STFU and not discuss this matter any further? You do what you like, but we're definitely going in circles at this point. And it's pointless to me as there is still an appeal of his conviction to be heard. That could change the discussion significantly. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Argus Posted July 12, 2017 Report Share Posted July 12, 2017 3 minutes ago, dialamah said: Clearly you do not believe that the rights of Canadians should be upheld. Ok. Again, many of us don't think Khadr or his family are Canadians. We don't care about their rights. If our government wasn't so screwed up they'd all have been deported twenty years ago. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dialamah Posted July 12, 2017 Report Share Posted July 12, 2017 3 minutes ago, Boges said: https://www.thestar.com/opinion/commentary/2017/07/12/khadr-has-become-the-liberal-millstone-moore.html It's all about optics. This may sink Trudeau. Don't doubt that for a second. Facts are essentially irrelevant. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DogOnPorch Posted July 12, 2017 Report Share Posted July 12, 2017 29 minutes ago, capricorn said: Do I detect that you would like us to STFU and not discuss this matter any further? The future brides of Omar...heh. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jacee Posted July 12, 2017 Report Share Posted July 12, 2017 2 minutes ago, DogOnPorch said: Omar isn't a Canadian. Spare me the prattle about being born here. Neither are you, then. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DogOnPorch Posted July 12, 2017 Report Share Posted July 12, 2017 Just now, jacee said: Neither are you, then. I didn't join a Jihad against fellow Canadians and their Allies. Your hubby did. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jacee Posted July 12, 2017 Report Share Posted July 12, 2017 1 minute ago, Argus said: Again, many of us don't think Khadr or his family are Canadians. We don't care about their rights. If our government wasn't so screwed up they'd all have been deported twenty years ago. Then you're not 'really' a Canadian either. You clearly don't comprehend that the rights of citizenship apply equally to every citizen. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dialamah Posted July 12, 2017 Report Share Posted July 12, 2017 3 minutes ago, Argus said: Again, many of us don't think Khadr or his family are Canadians. We don't care about their rights. Emotions over facts. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boges Posted July 12, 2017 Report Share Posted July 12, 2017 3 minutes ago, dialamah said: Don't doubt that for a second. Facts are essentially irrelevant. Well the one fact may be relevant is that JT's Libs tried to expedite the settlement to help shield Khadr from being attacked by widow of the man he's accused of killing. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Goddess Posted July 12, 2017 Report Share Posted July 12, 2017 Just now, dialamah said: Emotions over facts. Common sense over emotions. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Argus Posted July 12, 2017 Report Share Posted July 12, 2017 Just now, jacee said: Then you're not 'really' a Canadian either. You clearly don't comprehend that the rights of citizenship apply equally to every citizen. Immigrants can be deprived of their newfound citizenship, unlike those born as Canadians. The Tories did bring in a law to that effect which the Liberals just got rid of. We should have that law back, only allowing even more latitude to remove citizenship and deport failed immigrants. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Argus Posted July 12, 2017 Report Share Posted July 12, 2017 1 minute ago, dialamah said: Emotions over facts. The fact is that Khadr and his family used Canada for welfare and free medical care for most of his life. He spent his formative years in terrorist training camps in the Muslim world. He probably didn't even speak much English before spending time at Gitmo. His miserable excuse for a family would have all been deported under any sane, reasonable immigration system. In fact, under a sensible immigration law they'd never have been allowed in in the first place. This is why, to borrow from another topic we should keep out people who believe women should wear bags over their heads. It would keep this kind of filth away. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jacee Posted July 12, 2017 Report Share Posted July 12, 2017 1 minute ago, DogOnPorch said: I didn't join a Jihad against fellow Canadians and their Allies. Your hubby did. Lol Wait ... I'll ask him ... nope, he says he didn't because he doesn't like being without his lazyboy chair & tv. It seems that in your opinion, some citizens have more rights than others. So, if I make judgements the way you do, I'd say you're not really Canadian. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jacee Posted July 12, 2017 Report Share Posted July 12, 2017 5 minutes ago, Argus said: Immigrants can be deprived of their newfound citizenship, unlike those born as Canadians. The Tories did bring in a law to that effect which the Liberals just got rid of. We should have that law back, only allowing even more latitude to remove citizenship and deport failed immigrants. Omar Khadr is not an immigrant. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DogOnPorch Posted July 12, 2017 Report Share Posted July 12, 2017 Just now, jacee said: Lol Wait ... I'll ask him ... nope, he says he didn't because he doesn't like being without his lazyboy chair & tv. It seems that in your opinion, some citizens have more rights than others. So, if I make judgements the way you do, I'd say you're not really Canadian. Your other hubby, Omar. He declared war on Canada making him not a citizen except to a scumbag lawyer and folks like yourself. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dialamah Posted July 12, 2017 Report Share Posted July 12, 2017 Just now, Boges said: Well the one fact may be relevant is that JT's Libs tried to expedite the settlement to help shield Khadr from being attacked by widow of the man he's accused of killing. Are all widows of war entitled to sue someone? I really don't understand this part of it; why should this one person be allowed to sue for compensation while other widows/widowers and orphans cannot? If Syrians catch a member of the Western coalition and torture him till he confesses to operating a drone that dropped a bomb on an apartment building, should an orphaned family who was in that apt building then be entitled to compensation from him? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DogOnPorch Posted July 12, 2017 Report Share Posted July 12, 2017 Just now, dialamah said: Are all widows of war entitled to sue someone? I really don't understand this part of it; why should this one person be allowed to sue for compensation while other widows/widowers and orphans cannot? If Syrians catch a member of the Western coalition and torture him till he confesses to operating a drone that dropped a bomb on an apartment building, should an orphaned family who was in that apt building then be entitled to compensation from him? Poor Omar. He's the real victim. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Goddess Posted July 12, 2017 Report Share Posted July 12, 2017 Just now, dialamah said: why should this one person be allowed to sue for compensation while other widows/widowers and orphans cannot? Because her husband was murdered by someone who was supposed to be their ally. Her husband signed up to fight terrorists, not be killed by a Canadian citizen on foreign soil. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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