Rue Posted July 11, 2017 Report Share Posted July 11, 2017 (edited) 10 minutes ago, drummindiver said: He spent 10 years in prison for killing and maiming and making weapons of mass destruction......10 years is clearly not enough. If there was any justice, he would be workibg in a hospital for the victims of terrorists cleaning their bed pans. Edited July 11, 2017 by Rue Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rue Posted July 11, 2017 Report Share Posted July 11, 2017 5 minutes ago, jacee said: Umm ... I'll have to get back to you on that. Lol. Smart move. Thanks. Th ehumour is needed. This is a hiot topic. I am blasting you out of total respect although it sounds personal. Its debate. I deeply respect your beliefs. I j ust disagree with them strongly. If they are too personal I apologize. I mean to attack the views not the person. Please believe that. Your love of humanitarian values is respected deeply. I just really believe something is deeply flawed in this one that someone is indirectly financially benefitting from having been a terrorist whatever the circumstances. I also Jacee understand if we don't recognize certain fundamental procedures with trials that did not exist in G Bay it could undermine the entire legal system. I get that. I still think we have to balance that consideration with the principle of not allowing anyone to benefit directly or indirectly from a crime. I think they both are in conflict and the best way to balance the two was to award a nominal value and/or just his legal fees. The rest is politics. Hard as it for you to believe I was a Trudeau Liberal. I am absolutely disgusted by his son and deeply disappointed in the Justice Minister who has allowe her Justice Ministry to be used to prejudice an on-going civil matter. Its far worse than any accusation delivered against Harper for trying to meddle in the legal system an supreme court of Canada. This government engages in the exact same things it challenged the Conservatives for doing in far shorter a time period of rule. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jacee Posted July 11, 2017 Report Share Posted July 11, 2017 11 minutes ago, drummindiver said: He spent 10 years in prison for killing and maiming and making weapons of mass destruction......10 years is clearly not enough. Actually ... 13-14 years. The only child soldier in the world to ever be convicted. I expect him to win his appeal. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Topaz Posted July 11, 2017 Report Share Posted July 11, 2017 What's the difference between him making weapons of mass destruction and corporations? Should countries sue them? The supreme Court made its decision and the gov't had to following the law. Let's move on....what about those fires burning in B.C? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jacee Posted July 11, 2017 Report Share Posted July 11, 2017 16 minutes ago, Rue said: Lol. Smart move. Thanks. Th ehumour is needed. This is a hiot topic. I am blasting you out of total respect although it sounds personal. Its debate. I deeply respect your beliefs. I j ust disagree with them strongly. If they are too personal I apologize. I mean to attack the views not the person. Please believe that. Your love of humanitarian values is respected deeply. I just really believe something is deeply flawed in this one that someone is indirectly financially benefitting from having been a terrorist whatever the circumstances. I also Jacee understand if we don't recognize certain fundamental procedures with trials that did not exist in G Bay it could undermine the entire legal system. I get that. I still think we have to balance that consideration with the principle of not allowing anyone to benefit directly or indirectly from a crime. I think they both are in conflict and the best way to balance the two was to award a nominal value and/or just his legal fees. The rest is politics. Hard as it for you to believe I was a Trudeau Liberal. I am absolutely disgusted by his son and deeply disappointed in the Justice Minister who has allowe her Justice Ministry to be used to prejudice an on-going civil matter. Its far worse than any accusation delivered against Harper for trying to meddle in the legal system an supreme court of Canada. This government engages in the exact same things it challenged the Conservatives for doing in far shorter a time period of rule. What absolutely disgusts me is Liberals and Conservatives trying to score political points on an issue like this. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
betsy Posted July 11, 2017 Author Report Share Posted July 11, 2017 (edited) Quote U.S. soldier’s widow to ask Canadian court to freeze Omar Khadr’s assets https://www.thestar.com/news/canada/2017/07/10/us-soldiers-widow-to-ask-canada-to-freeze-omar-khadrs-assets.html Too late. This is what the Liberals shielded Khadr from - expediting his reward paid asap, so that the widow will never get a dime. The money's now hidden. Good luck finding and following that money. Edited July 11, 2017 by betsy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jacee Posted July 11, 2017 Report Share Posted July 11, 2017 1 minute ago, Topaz said: What's the difference between him making weapons of mass destruction and corporations? Should countries sue them? The supreme Court made its decision and the gov't had to following the law. Let's move on....what about those fires burning in B.C? There's a germ of an idea there ... sue weapons manufacturers ... hmm ... ! Yes, BC ... no thread started yet? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jacee Posted July 11, 2017 Report Share Posted July 11, 2017 (edited) 13 minutes ago, betsy said: https://www.thestar.com/news/canada/2017/07/10/us-soldiers-widow-to-ask-canada-to-freeze-omar-khadrs-assets.html Too late. This is what the Liberals shielded Khadr from - expediting his reward paid asap, so that the widow will never get a dime. Good luck finding and following that money. How many people have ever before been convicted and sued for damages in the death of a US soldier in active combat? How many other war widows demand a $134m payout? Edited July 11, 2017 by jacee Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
drummindiver Posted July 11, 2017 Report Share Posted July 11, 2017 28 minutes ago, jacee said: Actually ... 13-14 years. The only child soldier in the world to ever be convicted. I expect him to win his appeal. With libs at the helm of course. Is that you I see on Greenhulk.net starting Ibrahim threads? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
drummindiver Posted July 11, 2017 Report Share Posted July 11, 2017 20 hours ago, Omni said: It's been im the court for years. Amm OoC settlement was reached to end the case. The SCOC has never once said Khadr deserves money. Brokered deal.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
capricorn Posted July 11, 2017 Report Share Posted July 11, 2017 3 minutes ago, betsy said: https://www.thestar.com/news/canada/2017/07/10/us-soldiers-widow-to-ask-canada-to-freeze-omar-khadrs-assets.html Too late. This is what the Liberals shielded Khadr from - expediting his reward paid asap, so that the widow will never get a dime. Good luck finding and following that money. I heard one lawyer interviewed who said if the money was placed in a trust fund for Khadr this move would shield it from the lawsuit. It's also possible the money was transferred to offshore accounts. I can just see Trudeau's lawyers brainstorming with Khadr's team on the best way to assure that the Americans get nothing. In any case, I hope the widow and injured soldier continue their efforts with regard to their lawsuit. This will keep the Khadr matter in the public domain much to the discomfort of the scheming Liberals. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Army Guy Posted July 11, 2017 Report Share Posted July 11, 2017 14 hours ago, GostHacked said: So next time you walk by a crime scene you are as guilty as who ever committed the crime? What kind of logic is that? Also WEAPON , not WPN.. nxt tm gnn s n vwls. That is not what I am saying at all, even you know that....he is guilty by association, the men he was with ambushed those Afghanis army soldiers, meaning they already had made the decision to fight before hand...Omar was part of this group...part of that decision. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
betsy Posted July 11, 2017 Author Report Share Posted July 11, 2017 (edited) 16 minutes ago, jacee said: How many people have ever before been convicted and sued for the death of a US soldier in active combat? How many wrongfully convicted innocent people (due to negligent investigation) spent years - some decades - behind bars before being released, had ever received 10 million in compensation? Trudeau doesn't want to bring up the past of Khadr. Because Khadr is guilty! The USA made a big mistake in handing Khadr over to the Canadian government. Mind you, it wasn't a mistake since it was Obama who did it. Edited July 11, 2017 by betsy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jacee Posted July 11, 2017 Report Share Posted July 11, 2017 5 minutes ago, drummindiver said: With libs at the helm of course. Is that you I see on Greenhulk.net starting Ibrahim threads? His appeal of his conviction will be in the US. Nothing to do with Canadian politics, and politicians don't tell the courts what to do anyway. Try to learn how the system works, eh?! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jacee Posted July 11, 2017 Report Share Posted July 11, 2017 (edited) 33 minutes ago, betsy said: How many wrongfully convicted innocent people (due to negligent investigation) spent years - some decades - behind bars before being released, had ever received 10 million in compensation? Trudeau doesn't want to bring up the past of Khadr. Because Khadr is guilty! The USA made a big mistake in handing Khadr over to the Canadian government. Mind you, it wasn't a mistake since it was Obama who did it. Why are you avoiding answering my question? Q: How many people have ever before been convicted and sued for the death of a US soldier in active combat? Edited July 11, 2017 by jacee Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jacee Posted July 11, 2017 Report Share Posted July 11, 2017 (edited) 18 minutes ago, capricorn said: I heard one lawyer interviewed who said if the money was placed in a trust fund for Khadr this move would shield it from the lawsuit. It's also possible the money was transferred to offshore accounts. I can just see Trudeau's lawyers brainstorming with Khadr's team on the best way to assure that the Americans get nothing. In any case, I hope the widow and injured soldier continue their efforts with regard to their lawsuit. This will keep the Khadr matter in the public domain much to the discomfort of the scheming Liberals. How many other war widows demand a $134m payout? Edited July 11, 2017 by jacee Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Topaz Posted July 11, 2017 Report Share Posted July 11, 2017 "Johnny Walker" who is an American that helped the enemy in Afghanistan in 2003 and was put in jail for 20 years because he killed a FBI agent. and will be out of jail within 5 years. The widow of the FBI, as far as I know, never sued Walker but he and his family can't profit from any book but there's are ways around that too, so why is the widow suing, it won't bring her hubby back, it it revenge, will it make her feel better? IF its all money, than IF every American sent her $, she would be set for her life and her kids. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/John_Walker_Lindh Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jacee Posted July 11, 2017 Report Share Posted July 11, 2017 22 minutes ago, Topaz said: "Johnny Walker" who is an American that helped the enemy in Afghanistan in 2003 and was put in jail for 20 years because he killed a FBI agent. and will be out of jail within 5 years. The widow of the FBI, as far as I know, never sued Walker but he and his family can't profit from any book but there's are ways around that too, so why is the widow suing, it won't bring her hubby back, it it revenge, will it make her feel better? IF its all money, than IF every American sent her $, she would be set for her life and her kids. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/John_Walker_Lindh Lindh ... I'm surprised he survived. I wonder what he'll do when he gets out. Looks like he'll be out before Leonard Peltier. Mrs. Speer ... Her husband's been gone 15 years, kids are likely adults by now. Seems a bit odd that a court would award a huge settlement like that. It remains to be seen whether she can collect any of it. I read somewhere this morning that it's likely any decision about her settlement will be delayed until after Omar Khadr's appeal of his conviction. Makes sense. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
capricorn Posted July 11, 2017 Report Share Posted July 11, 2017 1 minute ago, jacee said: Mrs. Speer ... Her husband's been gone 15 years, kids are likely adults by now. One child was 2, the other 10 months. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Army Guy Posted July 11, 2017 Report Share Posted July 11, 2017 13 hours ago, jacee said: Army Guy, You seem to expect the Supreme Court to 'do something' independently without anyone asking them for a ruling. We've already explained that that is not how the Supreme Court works. It was up to the government to act on the ScoC findings, and they didn't ... until they finally did agree to let him serve the last of his sentence in Canada. Canada is now being held accountable for violating his rights, with the settlement just made. I want to acknowledge something here: Child soldiers are dangerous in the war zone, were dangerous to you and other Canadian soldiers. You had to deal with them as necessary in those situations. I understand that. But after the fact is a different story. They can be rescued and rehabilitated. That is the way they are dealt with. They are not convicted of crimes committed in war, because they had no choice. The child soldiers of Boko Haram were brutal, sadistic killers as they were forced and trained to be. However, great efforts were put into rehabilitating them and several of them live in Canada now. I respect your reasons for having intense emotions about this. But this is after the fact now, and we do have a responsibility to focus on rehabilitation and moving on beyond the battlefields, recognizing that Omar Khadr and other children did not have a choice about being there. You might have been equally miserable in the war zone, but you made that choice freely as an adult. On the issue of resentment that he's getting a settlement that no injured soldier ever gets ... I hear you. But, like in union negotiations, you can't build yourself up by tearing someone else down. Instead, you use it as a precedent to go after more. Both had already made the ruling , that the military commission was bogus.....what they failed to do was follow up on the ruling and enforce it.....neither of them did any of that...what they did do was no more than offer an opinion ( my opinion)....to the media, ....OMAR served the rest of his sentence 3 years......until released on bail. Yes Canada is being held accountable , but it was not Canada that violated his rights it was a few individuals, that held positions within our governments organization.......that is one problem with this whole issue.....Those that made the decisions are not held responsible..... And while Canada is being held to account for a few wing nuts......we have forgotten Omar and his crimes or charges that could have been levied here in Canada.....That is my point....those are also being swept under the carpet....because he was been through enough, or his crimes were committed while he was a child.....Canada has sentenced children under the age of 15 for serious crimes with adult sentences before, what is the problem now. It is not the same thing, nobody forced omar to do anything....nobody put a gun to his head and forced him to kill.....if you had seen his tape his smiling face, bragging how he wanted to collect on a bounty from any Coalition soldier body.....Ya nice guy, And while the UN came up with this program, they also relieve that not all of them get a free pass, that provisions were made in that program to charge children with adult crimes if the case warranted it....in Omars case it was about a rich spoiled Canadian kid wanting tom play terrorist in the real world...not some kid from Africa that was torn from his family and force at gun point to commit crimes.... Omar always had a choice.....he could have walked up to any Coalition soldier and told him who he was ....and his whole world would have changed.....we all have choices to make, regardless of our age.....he made his, and it cost him his freedom.... I did make a choice to serve my nation, in Afghanistan to help the average Afghanis over come people like Omar and his buddies, that only wanted to force everyone to live under their brutal and oppressive rules... I don't want to rehabilitate Omars kind, I want them punished to send the message that we do not tolerate those actions......to give them a reason to take a pause and rethink their actions..... The resentment is much larger than just "our injured" the resentment stems from everything these guys did....not only to us, but to the Afghan people, the pain and suffering brought to them, on a daily basis.....they are still living with this pain and suffering....and what is Omar dealing with a few bad dreams, a couple of scars....while he lives a comfortable life here in the west, with access to food, clean water, sanitation, toilets, air conditioned homes, ..... lets not forget he took part in a action that claimed the life of a US service man.....Ya I get it he was an American soldier and he was doing his job.....He was also a father , to his children and a husband to his wife and a son to his parents....but we also sweep him and his under the same carpet, because here in Canada the US war machine is the Bad guy..... Omar and his merry band of buddies cause nothing but pain.....his group mostly made up of foreigners had no dog in the fight other than their hatred for all western nations....And Still here in Canada ....Canadians want to ensure we don't trample on any one's human rights, a noble cause, but one that has to be also put into perspective....we have been continuing to trample on anyone's rights, since day one and no sign of stopping our history is full of examples, and no one has even slowed down their busy lives to ensure they are treated with the same kid gloves as Omar.....I also get it , we need to start some where....or is this just what we do for now, to make the bad man and media go away.....Our government will be looking at each other in a few weeks going wheuuuuu crises averted and it only cost us 5 mil in fees, and 10.5 mils...in payouts.....who is next on the list for payouts.... As for the looking after our vets, That will remain the same as only our nations citizens can change that.....and they are to busy.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jacee Posted July 11, 2017 Report Share Posted July 11, 2017 1 minute ago, capricorn said: One child was 2, the other 10 months. I see. So not quite grown up yet. I mean no disrespect. The death of a soldier, father is a tragic thing. It's equally tragic for all the others who have died too. I've just never heard of a war widow suing an 'enemy' before. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Army Guy Posted July 11, 2017 Report Share Posted July 11, 2017 12 hours ago, Omni said: And I thought you claimed to be something of a lawyer? You just exposed that as a fallacy. I've never claimed to be a lawyer or anything of the sort....do you have a lawyers degree..... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jacee Posted July 11, 2017 Report Share Posted July 11, 2017 (edited) 16 minutes ago, Army Guy said: Both had already made the ruling , that the military commission was bogus.....what they failed to do was follow up on the ruling and enforce it.....neither of them did any of that...what they did do was no more than offer an opinion ( my opinion)....to the media, ....OMAR served the rest of his sentence 3 years......until released on bail. Yes Canada is being held accountable , but it was not Canada that violated his rights it was a few individuals, that held positions within our governments organization.......that is one problem with this whole issue.....Those that made the decisions are not held responsible..... And while Canada is being held to account for a few wing nuts......we have forgotten Omar and his crimes or charges that could have been levied here in Canada.....That is my point....those are also being swept under the carpet....because he was been through enough, or his crimes were committed while he was a child.....Canada has sentenced children under the age of 15 for serious crimes with adult sentences before, what is the problem now. It is not the same thing, nobody forced omar to do anything....nobody put a gun to his head and forced him to kill.....if you had seen his tape his smiling face, bragging how he wanted to collect on a bounty from any Coalition soldier body.....Ya nice guy, And while the UN came up with this program, they also relieve that not all of them get a free pass, that provisions were made in that program to charge children with adult crimes if the case warranted it....in Omars case it was about a rich spoiled Canadian kid wanting tom play terrorist in the real world...not some kid from Africa that was torn from his family and force at gun point to commit crimes.... Omar always had a choice.....he could have walked up to any Coalition soldier and told him who he was ....and his whole world would have changed.....we all have choices to make, regardless of our age.....he made his, and it cost him his freedom.... I did make a choice to serve my nation, in Afghanistan to help the average Afghanis over come people like Omar and his buddies, that only wanted to force everyone to live under their brutal and oppressive rules... I don't want to rehabilitate Omars kind, I want them punished to send the message that we do not tolerate those actions......to give them a reason to take a pause and rethink their actions..... The resentment is much larger than just "our injured" the resentment stems from everything these guys did....not only to us, but to the Afghan people, the pain and suffering brought to them, on a daily basis.....they are still living with this pain and suffering....and what is Omar dealing with a few bad dreams, a couple of scars....while he lives a comfortable life here in the west, with access to food, clean water, sanitation, toilets, air conditioned homes, ..... lets not forget he took part in a action that claimed the life of a US service man.....Ya I get it he was an American soldier and he was doing his job.....He was also a father , to his children and a husband to his wife and a son to his parents....but we also sweep him and his under the same carpet, because here in Canada the US war machine is the Bad guy..... Omar and his merry band of buddies cause nothing but pain.....his group mostly made up of foreigners had no dog in the fight other than their hatred for all western nations....And Still here in Canada ....Canadians want to ensure we don't trample on any one's human rights, a noble cause, but one that has to be also put into perspective....we have been continuing to trample on anyone's rights, since day one and no sign of stopping our history is full of examples, and no one has even slowed down their busy lives to ensure they are treated with the same kid gloves as Omar.....I also get it , we need to start some where....or is this just what we do for now, to make the bad man and media go away.....Our government will be looking at each other in a few weeks going wheuuuuu crises averted and it only cost us 5 mil in fees, and 10.5 mils...in payouts.....who is next on the list for payouts.... As for the looking after our vets, That will remain the same as only our nations citizens can change that.....and they are to busy.... I can't make much sense of all that, except a lot of hatred and resentment of a 15 year old kid who was still very much under the care and influence of his very scary father at the time. His father had already threatened one son that he'd make him a suicide bomber because that son tried to defy him. I can tell you right now that you are not going to like how this turns out. The SCOTUS ruling makes it very likely that Omar Khadr's appeal of his conviction will be successful, and Mrs. Speer's lawsuit will not be paid out. You need to get a hobby ... or get active lobbying for better benefits for our veterans. Many Canadians have and will support vets in such endeavours. Strangely, though, the Conservative warmongers like Harper et al, who loved sending you into battle, will not be the ones supporting your demands for better benefits. They'll be fighting you all the way. Edited July 11, 2017 by jacee Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DogOnPorch Posted July 11, 2017 Report Share Posted July 11, 2017 Omar wanted to go to Afghanistan so as to not be left behind with the women. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jacee Posted July 11, 2017 Report Share Posted July 11, 2017 4 minutes ago, DogOnPorch said: Omar wanted to go to Afghanistan so as to not be left behind with the women. So fckng what?! He was 10! Grown fckng men on here sh!tting on a child who thought he was going on an 'adventure'. What the hell is wrong with you???!!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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