Full Autonomy For The Provinces. Yes or No

[Altai]

This is also planning to be done. Not only for Canada but for all the countries. US, China, Russia are going to be divided into 10-15 independent pieces. So there wont be military powers, the power will be manufacturing.

[JamesHackerMP]

35 minutes ago, Altai said:

This is also planning to be done. Not only for Canada but for all the countries. US, China, Russia are going to be divided into 10-15 independent pieces. So there wont be military powers, the power will be manufacturing.

???

[JamesHackerMP]

2 hours ago, dre said:

The provinces play a role in that yes. I don't know if my position is a liberal or conservative one... It just seems like common sense to me.

Care to explain to me how exactly that works? The provinces influencing foreign affairs???

[-TSS-]

5 hours ago, Altai said:

This is also planning to be done. Not only for Canada but for all the countries. US, China, Russia are going to be divided into 10-15 independent pieces. So there wont be military powers, the power will be manufacturing.

I don't think so. There won't be proliferation of countries, the development is heading exactly the opposite direction. The European super-state etc.

[dre]

5 hours ago, JamesHackerMP said:

Care to explain to me how exactly that works? The provinces influencing foreign affairs???

Sure. Different province produce different exports. So they have a stake in negotiating international agreements, so they participate.

[SpankyMcFarland]

On 2017-04-03 at 3:25 AM, blackbird said:

Where did you get that idea?   Harper left the economy in good shape.  In the last five years of the Conservatives from 2011 to 2015, the Conservatives paid off the deficit completely so when the Liberals were elected there was no deficit.  There is no recession right now so why have a deficit?

You make the deficit sound like the debt there. Harper prudently continued the policies of his predecessors but he mainly ran deficits. 

[SpankyMcFarland]

I'd like to see less autonomy for beer. Pretty sad situation for an alleged federation. 

[GritBusters]

On 4/2/2017 at 2:33 PM, Dick Tator said:

Ottawa has proven it can no longer govern Canada effectively and fairly. They constantly misrepresent the needs of Canadians as a whole. Canada is a very diverse country and it is unrealistic to believe that a central government can truly the diverse needs of all Canadians. Therefore it is only logical that each province have full autonomy yet still operate under the umbrella of Canada. 

I'm a left-wing populist and a fair weather New Democrat.

I identify more with Quebec Solidaire and the Pirate Party, but they were not viable options in Eastern Ontario.

I support the following:

Decentralizing powers to all provinces, not just Quebec, and limiting federal jurisdiction to the constitutional minimums outlined in the BNA/Canada Act.

Full status of nationhood for Quebec and the Quebecois. Given that power will be devolved to the provinces and First Nations communities, it will be trivially easy to give Quebec nationhood without any corresponding special powers and privileges that other provinces would lack.

Mixed member proportional representation and Senate abolition.

Decentralizing powers away from the Prime Minister, the Premiers, the PMO, and the PCO (and their provincial equivalents). No appointing judges, Senators (if we must keep them), or senior civil servants without full parliamentary oversight.

Fixed parliamentary terms and by-elections within 6 weeks of a riding's going vacant. No more leaving people without local representation in Parliament to manipulate the make-up or to create omnibus by-elections to serve as litmus tests for the government in power.

The right to referendums, popular initiatives, and the recall of elected officials.

Eliminating private moneys from political parties: let the government take care of the data mining and the campaign financing, and let the parties become philosophically coherent vehicles, dedicated to governing and to serving as factories from which ideas are generated.

The creating of an 11th province, Outaouais, comprised of the current City of Ottawa and Ville de Gatineau. The current cities will be de-amalgamated (as the amalgamations were imposed by Queen's Park and Quebec City) and powers will be shared between the new provincial governments and the re-established cities of Ottawa, Gloucester, Nepean, Kanata, Vanier, Hull-Aylmer, Gatineau, and the smaller communities I've forgotten.

The calling of a constitutional convention to correct the archaic, undemocratic processes through which our current one was crafted.

Edited May 2, 2017 by GritBusters

[-TSS-]

Don't the Canadian provinces actually have way more say in their own affairs compared to the US-states? At least that is what I have always thought to be the case.

[August1991]

On 4/3/2017 at 0:28 PM, Argus said:

I think the provinces should have LESS power, not more. They screw up almost everything they touch.

And yet the richest countries/societies in the world are all countries with small populations:

Norway, Andorra, Bermuda, Switzerland, UAE, Netherlands, Australia. 

https://www.cia.gov/library/publications/the-world-factbook/rankorder/2004rank.html

With one single exception: the United States.

So, what explains this weird result: I reckon that the United States is not in fact a country: it is rather, 50 small states.

====

China, India, Russia, Indonesia, Nigeria, Brazil may collectively be rich but they are filled with poor people.

 

Edited May 29, 2017 by August1991

[Hydraboss]

On 4/2/2017 at 1:24 PM, taxme said:

I believe that the Western provinces should go it alone. Western Canada has nothing in common with the east

Canada is far, far more aligned north-south with the States than it is east-west.  Seattle and Vancouver are basically twins, the southern part of Ontario is barely distinguishable from the area all around the great lakes.  Alberta and Sask are not that different in mindset from Montana, the Dakotas, Texas, etc.  The Maritime provinces are pretty much....Maine.

And Kwebek is aligned with absolutely no one.  They are "special" you know.

I could see BC standing alone, Alberta and Sask together, the eastern part of Manitoba joining Ontario minus the GTA, the GTA joining Kwebek, and the eastern provinces becoming one state.  The northern territories could either stand alone, join together or join with the "states" on their southern borders.  Nobody would care either way.

[taxme]

2 hours ago, Hydraboss said:

Canada is far, far more aligned north-south with the States than it is east-west.  Seattle and Vancouver are basically twins, the southern part of Ontario is barely distinguishable from the area all around the great lakes.  Alberta and Sask are not that different in mindset from Montana, the Dakotas, Texas, etc.  The Maritime provinces are pretty much....Maine.

And Kwebek is aligned with absolutely no one.  They are "special" you know.

I could see BC standing alone, Alberta and Sask together, the eastern part of Manitoba joining Ontario minus the GTA, the GTA joining Kwebek, and the eastern provinces becoming one state.  The northern territories could either stand alone, join together or join with the "states" on their southern borders.  Nobody would care either way.

I could not have explained it better myself than what you just wrote. I think that you have worked it out quite well as to how all the provinces should separate, and how to go their separate ways. Better do it fast though because with all those new immigrants coming from all those third world ethnic countries they just might one day decide, and hold the balance of power as to whether Canada breaks up or not. You and I will have no say by then. 

We all should know by now that kweebec is the darling of the federal government, and most loved by all of it's lacky politicians. Kwebec goes unilingual french speaking only, and not one politician in da attawa says anything nor has fought for the Anglophones rights in kwebec. So much for calling this country bilingual, eh? Billions of tax dollars blown for nothing just to please a province that has no love or loyalty to the rest of Canada. Kwebec gives the finger to the rest of Canada, and Canadians take it without a whimper.

It's the politicians that have destroyed this once great nation because I don't believe that any of them really do care about Canada. Kwebec, and those other foreign people immigrating to Canada seems to be all they are concerned and interested about.  

 

 

[PIK]

On 4/2/2017 at 3:11 PM, hernanday said:

Well how far does that division go? Because Tthe federal government is doing alot better job than alot of the premiers, especially Wynne. should Ontario divide into multiple provinces, because those of us in the gta are tired of supporting northern ontario which is poor and jobless.

The 416 and most of the 905 should be separated from the rest of the province. Outside of that area has been forgotten by this government.

[H10]

3 hours ago, PIK said:

The 416 and most of the 905 should be separated from the rest of the province. Outside of that area has been forgotten by this government.

It really should.  then we don't have to pay taxes to support the large welfare class in the jobless north and east and west and central regions.  Those people pay no taxes, they are all welfare queens, why should they get anything but crumbs?

[-TSS-]

I'm sure that I'm not the only one who was wondering a long time ago that why are there so many different countries in South-America and Central-America though they are all Spanish-speaking except of course Brazil and a couple of others.

later on of course I learned that they are still totally different countries and there just could not be any United States of South-America or other such union.

However, has it ever occured to anyone to think about that instead of having two vast English-speaking countries in North-America there could have been, say, 15-20 different sovereign countries?

[August1991]

6 hours ago, -TSS- said:

I'm sure that I'm not the only one who was wondering a long time ago that why are there so many different countries in South-America and Central-America though they are all Spanish-speaking except of course Brazil and a couple of others.

later on of course I learned that they are still totally different countries and there just could not be any United States of South-America or other such union.

However, has it ever occured to anyone to think about that instead of having two vast English-speaking countries in North-America there could have been, say, 15-20 different sovereign countries?

In fact, North America is a collection of many different "countries" - states, sovereign in their ways. North America is a confederation of small, independent states - and this largely, IMHO, explains the economic success of North America.

South America, to compare, has largely been an economic disaster - despite its natural resources. (OTOH, compared to Europe, modern South Americans have avoided horrific ethnic wars.)

======

South America? How about, uh, north America? It is sometimes hard to federate a Missouri to a South Carolina, a Virginia to a West Virginia. It is arguably even harder, if less tragic, to connect an Alberta to a New Brunswick. PEI, like Monaco or Hamburg, is its own place.  And yet, PEI is a full-fledged province - just like Rhode Island is a State; and Virginia, I believe, is a Commonwealth.

Nationalistic Argentinians/Chileans/Venezualans etc have never been able to create a confederal state.

Edited June 1, 2017 by August1991