Immigration of religious fanatics

[eyeball]

1 hour ago, Michael Hardner said:

You seem to have missed Argus' assertion that "in absence of any other explanation" religion must be blamed for bad behavior.  That gives you an opening to discuss other causes.  Sounds like that would produce some positive and civil repartee.  

Well, it's been explained at length that conservatism is the real root cause of religious extremism but...

[DogOnPorch]

1 minute ago, eyeball said:

Well, it's been explained at length that conservatism is the real root cause of religious extremism but...

I'll take your claim that it's all the Tory's fault under advisement.

[Guest]

19 minutes ago, eyeball said:

Well, it's been explained at length that conservatism is the real root cause of religious extremism but...

Yeah, but isn't it racist to tar all consertives with th..blah blah blah.zzzzzzzzzzzzzz

Edited December 22, 2016 by bcsapper
Men never do evil so completely and cheerfully as when they do it from religious conviction - Blaise Pascal

[Michael Hardner]

Just now, bcsapper said:

Yeah, but isn't it racist to tar all consertives with th..blah blah blah.zzzzzzzzzzzzzz

Well, following this tack, we're operating under an assumption that there is a root cause that may not be religion, and have accepted the premise that group characteristics are a potentially valid reason.  

[DogOnPorch]

1 minute ago, bcsapper said:

Yeah, but isn't it racist to tar all consertives with th..blah blah blah.zzzzzzzzzzzzzz

If we can stomach Nazis in North America due to free speech, Islam should also be allowed a voice. It doesn't mean we listen to that voice and do what it says...without question.

[Michael Hardner]

2 minutes ago, DogOnPorch said:

I'll take your claim that it's all the Tory's fault under advisement.

We're exploring alternative root causes, accepting the premise that group characteristics are a potential marker.

[DogOnPorch]

Just now, Michael Hardner said:

We're exploring alternative root causes, accepting the premise that group characteristics are a potential marker.

This has been eyeball's argument for years: it's Conservatives that are bad...not Islam, etc.

I don't accept that. Islam is older than all of us...has been killing longer than any of us have been alive.

[Michael Hardner]

How old is conservative thinking ?

[Guest]

15 minutes ago, Michael Hardner said:

Well, following this tack, we're operating under an assumption that there is a root cause that may not be religion, and have accepted the premise that group characteristics are a potentially valid reason.  

I don't think one can assume that religion is not a root cause of religious conservatism.  Regardless of how much blame for the actions of such one puts on the "conservatism".  It's just another way of saying the same thing.  That there are bad people doing bad things in the name of their religion.

Edited December 22, 2016 by bcsapper
Men never do evil so completely and cheerfully as when they do it from religious conviction - Blaise Pascal

[Michael Hardner]

2 minutes ago, bcsapper said:

It's just another way of saying the same thing.

Maybe it is, but the challenge came from a poster saying 'in absence of any other causes'.  I am wondering what other causes there are.  You seem to be saying conservatism is the same thing as religion, which is a new angle to our discussion.

[DogOnPorch]

4 minutes ago, Michael Hardner said:

How old is conservative thinking ?

 

Left and Right wing politics as we know it was born in the French Revolution.

[eyeball]

4 minutes ago, Michael Hardner said:

Maybe it is, but the challenge came from a poster saying 'in absence of any other causes'.  I am wondering what other causes there are.  You seem to be saying conservatism is the same thing as religion, which is a new angle to our discussion.

You can pretend you don't you don't understand English or context and that conservatism is a political party.

Stupidty is another cause of extremism.

Edited December 22, 2016 by eyeball

[eyeball]

4 minutes ago, DogOnPorch said:

 

Left and Right wing politics as we know it was born in the French Revolution.

The Tories are from France?

 

Who knew?

[dialamah]

20 minutes ago, DogOnPorch said:

This has been eyeball's argument for years: it's Conservatives that are bad...not Islam, etc.

I don't accept that. Islam is older than all of us...has been killing longer than any of us have been alive.

I think there is a difference between "Conservatives" in a political sense, and 'conservatism' in a sociological sense.    I read a lot of years ago that when there is a perceived threat, entire populations become a little more conservative, belief in God goes up, church attendance goes up, 'tradition' becomes more important, etc.   When things seem relatively safe and settled, progressivism (is that a word??) goes up - people become more willing to take social risks, consider new concepts and ideas, etc.

I think this concept is worth discussing along with the current situation in the Middle East and the worldwide terrorism it has spawned.   Certainly religion plays into all of that, but it's not the sole cause or reason.

Edited December 22, 2016 by dialamah
Removed repitiion

[DogOnPorch]

5 minutes ago, eyeball said:

The Tories are from France?

 

Who knew?

Left and Right wing politics are from France.

Anybody who took history classes knows that.

[DogOnPorch]

5 minutes ago, dialamah said:

I think there is a difference between "Conservatives" in a political sense, and 'conservatism' in a sociological sense.    I read a lot of years ago that when there is a perceived threat, entire populations become a little more conservative, belief in God goes up, church attendance goes up, 'tradition' becomes more important, etc.   When things seem relatively safe and settled, progressivism (is that a word??) goes up - people become more willing to take social risks, consider new concepts and ideas, etc.

I think this concept is worth discussing along with the current situation in the Middle East and the worldwide terrorism it has spawned.   Certainly religion plays into all of that, but it's not the sole cause or reason.

 

Your only goal is to deflect criticism away from your preferred religious group...due to family connections, I'll assume.

This I understand.

It will not stop me.

[drummindiver]

38 minutes ago, bcsapper said:

Actually it goes back long before that.  The killing of Jews is centuries old.  From my home county, for instance:

On March 16th 1190 a wave of anti-Semitic riots culminated in the massacre of an estimated 150 Jews – the entire Jewish community of York – who had taken refuge in the royal castle where Clifford’s Tower now stands. The chronicler William of Newburgh described the rioters as York acting “without any scruple of Christian conscientiousness” in wiping out the Jewish community. And William was not the only chronicler to record these lamentable acts, as the Chronicles of the Abbey of Meaux in East Yorkshire, and Roger of Howden include accounts.

Nazi Germany didn't just pick the Jews out of a hat for persecution. 

 

Pogroms were hoing on way before that. 

[DogOnPorch]

Just now, drummindiver said:

Pogroms were hoing on way before that. 

 

Certainly. But Christian antisemitism only really got going in the High Middle Ages.

[dialamah]

Just now, DogOnPorch said:

 

Your only goal is to deflect criticism away from your preferred religious group...due to family connections, I'll assume.

This I understand.

It will not stop me.

My 'family connections' are a hell of a lot more at risk from terrorism than you are and that's a fact that's on my mind daily.   But hey, you wrongly assume my motivations because you prefer to spew your hateful rhetoric, instead of doing a little thinking out of the box.   

[DogOnPorch]

Just now, dialamah said:

My 'family connections' are a hell of a lot more at risk from terrorism than you are and that's a fact that's on my mind daily.   But hey, you wrongly assume my motivations because you prefer to spew your hateful rhetoric, instead of doing a little thinking out of the box.   

 

I don't know you...nor care to know you.

I have been 'a victim of terrorism'. Though as a young lad, one doesn't view one's self as a victim...high adventure, more like. The parents were less impressed...obviously.

Islam is very clear on its goals: fight them until religion...all of it...is for Allah.

https://quran.com/8/39

Or do you again advise me to ignore that bit as you have before?

 

[drummindiver]

17 hours ago, Canadianjim said:

Look when your country gets back to democratic principles you can talk to a people from a free nation. Until then stick to  your banana  republic.

What principles would those be? The oppspite of what happens in the majority of muslim countries?

16 hours ago, bush_cheney2004 said:

 

Canadian immigration and refugee games are well known around the world....sucker nation.

....and getting sucker. 

20 hours ago, eyeball said:

You very clearly said I support pedophilia.   In any case it's every bit as reprehensible of you to suggest that I 'merely' sympathize with pedophiles.

 

What does that mean exactly?

lol. I hate using this tired cliche,   but reading isn't your strong suite. Saying your support Islam which allows pedophilia in no way says you yourself are a pedophile. Same with the priest and abuse you mentioned. 

19 hours ago, bcsapper said:

No they are not. (my choice)  If you mean they are my country's ally, I would not call that convenient.  I would call that realpolitik and I have no say in the matter.

And if we opposed being allies with them it would be because we are xenophobes.

 

19 hours ago, Canadianjim said:

No I don't since the majority of Muslims aren't terrorists.

Even a small majority of 1.6 billion is a lot  Or are you implying there are no Islamic terrorists? 

[drummindiver]

8 minutes ago, DogOnPorch said:

 

Certainly. But Christian antisemitism only really got going in the High Middle Ages.

My point exactly. We know where antisemitism comes from,  don't we,  though we aren't allowed to say so.

[DogOnPorch]

1 minute ago, drummindiver said:

 

Even a small majority of 1.6 billion is a lot  Or are you implying there are no Islamic terrorists? 

 

Agreed. One death due to Islam's fascism is too many.

It's the ol' Oskar Schindler was a nice Nazi argument.

1 minute ago, drummindiver said:

My point exactly. We know where antisemitism comes from,  don't we,  though we aren't allowed to say so.

Easter makes Jews nervous.

[Canadianjim]

9 minutes ago, drummindiver said:

What principles would those be? The oppspite of what happens in the majority of muslim countries?

.

You could start with democratic elections.

[dialamah]

3 minutes ago, DogOnPorch said:

 

I don't know you...nor care to know you.

I have been 'a victim of terrorism'. Though as a young lad, one doesn't view one's self as a victim...high adventure, more like. The parents were less impressed...obviously.

Islam is very clear on its goals: fight them until religion...all of it...is for Allah.

https://quran.com/8/39

Or do you again advise me to ignore that bit as you have before?

 

Yes the quran says that.   But most Muslims choose the auranic verses that instruct people to be peaceful and tolerant.  I know, peaceful and tolerant Muslims do not fit your agenda, but they exist and are actually the mainstream.  The kind of rhetoric you push is what enables extremist behavior.  Doesn't matter its Islamists calling Westerners hostorical enemies, and citing Western news sources to support it or you making the same claims about Islam, its all the same hateful, demonizing rhetoric.