PM IN HOT WATER; The Prime Minister apologizes.

[Smallc]

He's not allowed to cross to the other side, it's against the procedure. The Liberal whip, Leslie could've taken his seat at which time the voting could've started.

Maybe, Brown didn't want to push or manhandle anyone to get through, he was being polite, unlike Trudeau who needs some anger management.

I just wanted to say my earlier opinion was wrong, and you were right - Leslie could have simple sat down. Apparently he and Trudeau were as unaware as I was. Sorry for the confusion.

[waldo]

I just wanted to say my earlier opinion was wrong, and you were right - Leslie could have simple sat down. Apparently he and Trudeau were as unaware as I was. Sorry for the confusion.

no - not according to procedural details provided within the formal House of Commons Procedure and Practice... as I read/interpret there is no normal procedure that speaks to a single Whip seating to effect the Speaker calling the House to order and putting forward the question. Procedure details, of course, describe the normal traditional/symbolic actions where both the Government Whip and the Opposition Whip enter the House/chamber, walk up the aisle on their respective sides, meet each other near the Speaker, bow to the Speaker and to each other and then resume their seats. The only other described scenario reflects upon a protest condition:

On occasion, a vote has been taken although one of the Whips had not appeared after the bells rang for the maximum prescribed length of time In most cases, the Government Whip re‑entered the Chamber while the Opposition Whip, as an act of protest, remained outside the Chamber (sometimes with the entire caucus).

clearly Conservative Opposition Whip (Brown) wasn't protesting and had entered the House/chamber

.

Edited May 23, 2016 by waldo

[Smallc]

That's interesting, as that's what I had originally believed. That's not the Speaker's interpretation, apparently:

Not according to Speaker Geoff Regan. As he said after the incident, “Members ought to know, first of all, that if one whip walks down before the other and takes his or her seat, and that is either whip, the Speaker then reads the question and the voting process begins. Nothing else is required. That is what happens. That has happened before.”

http://www.macleans.ca/politics/ottawa/macleans-explains-bells-whips-vote-calls-and-time-constraints/

I'm unclear on proper procedure, given this.

[waldo]

That's interesting, as that's what I had originally believed. That's not the Speaker's interpretation, apparently:

Not according to Speaker Geoff Regan. As he said after the incident, “Members ought to know, first of all, that if one whip walks down before the other and takes his or her seat, and that is either whip, the Speaker then reads the question and the voting process begins. Nothing else is required. That is what happens. That has happened before.”

http://www.macleans.ca/politics/ottawa/macleans-explains-bells-whips-vote-calls-and-time-constraints/

I'm unclear on proper procedure, given this.

ya, Rona Conservatives are really pumping-up that statement; unfortunately, it has no basis in the procedural details as linked previously. Regan was voted in as Speaker in Dec, 2015... it's not like the guy has a wealth of experience to presume to draw from and speak to a scenario not described formally in those procedural details. Again, Conservative Opposition Whip (Brown) was not protesting... he had entered the House/chamber with the full intention to play out the traditional/symbolic act - until he hit the NDP Blockade and had to deal with the Mulcair/Brosseau led antics.

.

[dre]

He's not allowed to cross to the other side, it's against the procedure. The Liberal whip, Leslie could've taken his seat at which time the voting could've started.

Maybe, Brown didn't want to push or manhandle anyone to get through, he was being polite, unlike Trudeau who needs some anger management.

It looks to me like Brown and the NDP obstructors were collaborating.

[waldo]

It looks to me like Brown and the NDP obstructors were collaborating.

wait... I thought that first we get them to state Rona Conservatives and Whip (Brown) weren't protesting... weren't collaborating with the nefarious Mulcair/Brosseau in the NDP blockade! Hold on - I'll check back with HQ.

.

[scribblet]

It looks to me like Brown and the NDP obstructors were collaborating.

I don't think there's any evidence of that, the video clearly shows him trying to get through as an NDPer deliberately blocks his way.

Either way, Trudeau was still way out of line crossing the floor and grabbing his arm, he did apologize for his 'disgraceful' behaviour. There's no spinning what Trudeau did as being justified, no matter what mischief the NDP where up to, the PM chose to act the way he did.

[dre]

I don't think there's any evidence of that, the video clearly shows him trying to get through as an NDPer deliberately blocks his way.

Right but watch it again.. its the weakest attempt to get through that's even humanly possible.

Either way, Trudeau was still way out of line crossing the floor and grabbing his arm, he did apologize for his 'disgraceful' behaviour. There's no spinning what Trudeau did as being justified, no matter what mischief the NDP where up to, the PM chose to act the way he did.

Yes he committed a minor violation of etiquette and he apologized. But was he supposed to just allow Brown and the NDP to carry on their little charade for three minutes?

Overall I think that what Brown and the NDP were trying to do is worse than what Trudeau did.

Edited May 23, 2016 by dre

[scribblet]

Right but watch it again.. its the weakest attempt to get through that's even humanly possible.

Yes he committed a minor violation of etiquette and he apologized. But was he supposed to just allow Brown and the NDP to carry on their little charade for three minutes?

Overall I think that what Brown and the NDP were trying to do is worse than what Trudeau did.

That's your opinion only, he obviously didn't want to manhandle someone to get through, I don't think I've read anywhere else that their behaviour was worse than his. Liberal partisans may believe it was only a minor violation of etiquette but it was a lot more than that. One thing for sure, it was a temper tantrum from an entitled trust fund baby who generally seems to like physicality.

Edited May 23, 2016 by scribblet

[dre]

That's your opinion only, he obviously didn't want to manhandle someone to get through. One thing for sure, it was a temper tantrum from an entitled trust fund baby who generally seems to like physicality.

Yeah, he obviously didn't seem that interested in getting through at all.

One thing for sure, it was a temper tantrum from an entitled trust fund baby who generally seems to like physicality.

Is it possible that you're just a tremendous wimp? Like the lady that had a full blown panic attack because someone brushed against her breast?

[taxme]

Intuition...I'm not a racist. You on the other hand don't know this because, well, do I really have to say it?

I have to be a white racist because I stand up for my Caucasian race.Then I guess that I must assume that you are a racist also for standing up for your Jewishness. And I must be antisemitic and hate Jews because I question some of the things that they do. Makes sense to me, I think!

But go ahead and say it anyway. I want to hear it from you for all to read.

[taxme]

I apologize on behalf of the aboriginals who stormed settlers settlements, scalped them and took their wares. I also apologize for the settlers who shot aboriginals at random and took their land.

There, we are even!

Lets get on with getting those developments going!

I agree. Let's just get on with life, and leave the past behind. If all we are going to do is keep bringing up and fighting past fights, nothing is going to get done. It's 2016, not 1816.

[taxme]

The British shot them.

Link, please.

[Smallc]

I have to be a white racist because I stand up for my Caucasian race.

Yes, you do have to be.

[taxme]

I saw the video. Now come on here, let's get real. I have no love for Trudeau, but I think that the bump mistake in the boob by Trudeau was not done on purpose, and I think that this whole episode is nothing but a bunch of nonsense, and a waste of time by the lame duck childish responses by some of our illustrious politicians, and the silly good for nothing Canadian media. I have made that same bump mistake a few times in my life. No big deal.This just shows that in Canada, politicians and the media will look for anything even if it is silly to report on, and then make a big deal out of. I pay my politicians to use common sense and logic when doing their job for Canada and Canadians. Not use emotionalism and foolishness, and try to make it appear as though they are doing something good when all they are doing in my opinion is continuing to make themselves appear to be ridiculous and stupid.

[taxme]

Yes, you do have to be.

So, if an Asian or a Black or a Muslim said that they were proud of who they are would you call them racist also?

[scribblet]

Yeah, he obviously didn't seem that interested in getting through at all.

Is it possible that you're just a tremendous wimp? Like the lady that had a full blown panic attack because someone brushed against her breast?

Seriously... a tremendous wimp... now that is funny... I don't care about the NDP lady that was an accident... it's only your opinion he didn't seem interested.. The fact of the matter is that the PM blew his cool and got physical. Try to spin it anyway you like, that's what happened.

[Argus]

Yes, you do have to be.

Well, you don't HAVE to be.... Unless you're willing to say all those Black/Hispanic rights people are racists. Not to mention all Quebec nationalists.

Edited May 24, 2016 by Argus

[Smallc]

So, if an Asian or a Black or a Muslim said that they were proud of who they are would you call them racist also?

If they said they were proud of their race, I'd certainly question their judgement. There is only one race.

[Argus]

If they said they were proud of their race, I'd certainly question their judgement. There is only one race.

You're being pedantic.

[Smallc]

You're being pedantic.

Not at all - colour is not an important determinant of anything. Culture is a different story.

[taxme]

If they said they were proud of their race, I'd certainly question their judgement. There is only one race.

"Question their judgement"? LOL. Your reply says to me that you would not dare call them racist, eh? But because I am white you have no problem with calling me a racist, do you? Your anti-white bias is showing. I am some what confused as to why a white person has to somehow always be called a racist, but others are not deemed so. Their judgement apparently needs to be questioned.

[Smallc]

"Question their judgement"? LOL. Your reply says to me that you would not dare call them racist, eh?

I'd call them racist - a lot of people would challenge me on that, as there are differing definitions. I didn't feel the need to get into that.

But because I am white you have no problem with calling me a racist, do you? Your anti-white bias is showing. I am some what confused as to why a white person has to somehow always be called a racist, but others are not deemed so. Their judgement apparently needs to be questioned.

There are many that would argue that racism has to involve a power relationship. I wouldn't be one of those people. I question your judgement as well.

[poochy]

Yeah, he obviously didn't seem that interested in getting through at all.

Is it possible that you're just a tremendous wimp? Like the lady that had a full blown panic attack because someone brushed against her breast?

Wow, hey, why don't you do us a favor, angrily walk towards a group of people in your office, while cursing at someone, and then grab someone by the arm, and pull the through the crowd, maybe accidentally bump others while doing so. Let us know how the lawsuit, or the assault charge, or the suspension, and the complete and total loss of respect works out for you. Since you're a tough guy, maybe choose the person you think will be most likely to respond by knocking you on your ass for your trouble, let us wimps know how that works out for you tough guy, in my progressive, modern, just workplace (because isn't that what things are supposed be now?) it gets you at least suspended, 50/50, it gets you fired.

Considering how things are now supposed to work in our modern world, and how he presented himself as the poster boy for that, it's difficult to imagine how depraved you need to be to defend him by alleging other people simply aren't tough enough, just where anywhere do you think that's going to work as a defense?

Can anyone here imagine talking to your employer and explaining that you should be excused for your behavior because the people you physically intervened with, while angrily cursing, simply aren't tough? What planet are you on right now?

[poochy]

Cool story bro! Problem its just more of you quoting imaginary voices in your head. I didn't vote liberal, don't have any opinion on Trudeau either way, and haven't voted liberal for about 15 years. And I haven't defended Trudeau on this board or anywhere else either. If I HAD then of course you could link to that, but you cant... so you wont.

Don't assume that everyone else is a rabid partisan hack just because you are.

OK, so just out to lunch then.