Goh Shenas Posted May 25, 2017 Report Share Posted May 25, 2017 32 minutes ago, dialamah said: ISIS applauds DoP and Gohs for spreading their message of violence and denying the right of Muslims to choose peace and still call themselves Muslim. ISIS worshippers do not need to listen to me. They are recruiting home grown moderate muslims willing to die for their cause. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Goh Shenas Posted May 25, 2017 Report Share Posted May 25, 2017 5 minutes ago, bcsapper said: See below Cherry picking an example does not warrant to question attitude. Whilst the actions of that jewish gentleman was wrong and I admit to it, it is wrong to compare it to a mindset of a muslim. It goes beyond attitude. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted May 25, 2017 Report Share Posted May 25, 2017 3 minutes ago, Goh Shenas said: So what he refused to sit next to a woman. It is not exactly as if he inflicted bodily damage to that woman. Can you stop diverting from topic and turn this into bashing jews? Obviously I'm not bashing Jews. That is another deflection, and one employed by many to restrict criticism of other religions, such as Islam. What I'm doing is trying to get you to acknowledge that some proponents of a religion have different views of how they, and others, should behave, from other proponents of the same religion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Argus Posted May 25, 2017 Report Share Posted May 25, 2017 35 minutes ago, dialamah said: ISIS applauds DoP and Gohs for spreading their message of violence and denying the right of Muslims to choose peace and still call themselves Muslim. Yeah this is an ongoing meme for Islamophiles, that the violence is not being inspired by Islam but by us. It's OUR fault, you see, for not being kind enough and expressing our admiration for Islam enough. The problem with this brutally ignorant belief is that it's completely out of touch with reality and unsupported by a single shred of evidence. Islamic terrorists are not shy about why they do what they do. They often even record messages before they die. None of them ever say it's because people online are mean to Islam. In fact ISIS makes it very clear that they hate us, and why they hate us. 1. We hate you, first and foremost, because you are disbelievers; you reject the oneness of Allah – whether you realize it or not – by making partners for Him in worship, you blaspheme against Him, claiming that He has a son, you fabricate lies against His prophets and messengers, and you indulge in all manner of devilish practices. It is for this reason that we were commanded to openly declare our hatred for you and our enmity towards you. “There has already been for you an excellent example in Abraham and those with him, when they said to their people, ‘Indeed, we are disassociated from you and from whatever you worship other than Allah. We have rejected you, and there has arisen, between us and you, enmity and hatred forever until you believe in Allah alone’” (Al-Mumtahanah 4). Furthermore, just as your disbelief is the primary reason we hate you, your disbelief is the primary reason we fight you, as we have been commanded to fight the disbelievers until they submit to the authority of Islam, either by becoming Muslims, or by paying jizyah – for those afforded this option – and living in humiliation under the rule of the Muslims. Thus, even if you were to stop fighting us, your best-case scenario in a state of war would be that we would suspend our attacks against you – if we deemed it necessary – in order to focus on the closer and more immediate threats, before eventually resuming our campaigns against you. Apart from the option of a temporary truce, this is the only likely scenario that would bring you fleeting respite from our attacks. So in the end, you cannot bring an indefinite halt to our war against you. At most, you could only delay it temporarily. “And fight them until there is no fitnah [paganism] and [until] the religion, all of it, is for Allah” (Al-Baqarah 193). http://www.occidentaldissent.com/2016/07/31/isis-why-we-hate-you-why-we-fight-you/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DogOnPorch Posted May 25, 2017 Report Share Posted May 25, 2017 22 minutes ago, bcsapper said: I didn't find these. I copied them from an argument I'm having against lefties who say there is nothing wrong with Islam and the Manchester bombings had nothing to do with religion. I haven't opened a single one, so I make no claims as to their contents. I just post them because they were posted in response to a question similar to yours. http://www.hartlepoolmail.co.uk/…/hartlepool-muslims-condem…https://leamingtonobserver.co.uk/…/muslims-in-leamington-c…/ 3. https://www.google.co.uk/…/la-fg-britain-muslim-manchester-… 4. http://www.arabnews.com/node/1103936/saudi-arabia 5. http://stepfeed.com/muslim-leaders-express-solidarity-with-… 6. http://m.hulldailymail.co.uk/…/story-30349351-de…/story.html 7. http://norwaytoday.info/…/british-muslims-condemn-manchest…/ 8. http://m.grimsbytelegraph.co.uk/…/story-30348785…/story.html 9. https://www.express.co.uk/…/Manchester-terror-attack-Mu…/amp 10. https://www.birminghammail.co.uk/…/manchester-attack-job-de… 11. https://www.walesonline.co.uk/…/attacker-manchester-condemn… 12. http://www.hartlepoolmail.co.uk/…/hartlepool-muslims-condem… 13. https://www.google.co.uk/…/thinkprogress…/amp/p/eb42d242501a 14. http://aboutislam.net/…/…/muslims-condemn-manchester-attack/ 15. http://www.mediatalkover.com/…/muslims-unite-to-condemn-ar…/ Oskar Schindler was a good Nazi. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Argus Posted May 25, 2017 Report Share Posted May 25, 2017 2. We hate you because your secular, liberal societies permit the very things that Allah has prohibited while banning many of the things He has permitted, a matter that doesn’t concern you because you separate between religion and state, thereby granting supreme authority to your whims and desires via the legislators you vote into power. In doing so, you desire to rob Allah of His right to be obeyed and you wish to usurp that right for yourselves. “Legislation is not but for Allah” (Yusuf 40). Your secular liberalism has led you to tolerate and even support “gay rights,” to allow alcohol, drugs, fornication, gambling, and usury to become widespread, and to encourage the people to mock those who denounce these filthy sins and vices. As such, we wage war against you to stop you from spreading your disbelief and debauchery – your secularism and nationalism, your perverted liberal values, your Christianity and atheism – and all the depravity and corruption they entail. You’ve made it your mission to “liberate” Muslim societies; we’ve made it our mission to fight off your influence and protect mankind from your misguided concepts and your deviant way of life. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Goddess Posted May 25, 2017 Report Share Posted May 25, 2017 (edited) I believe Islam is both a political AND a religious ideology. Terrorists are championing the political ideology and "moderates" are championing the religious end of things - demanding no pork products in school cafeterias, segregation of women and men in various institutions, wanting separate Sharia courts, etc. - all the while expressing no tolerance for other beliefs. They work hand-in-hand, towards the same goal. They just have different methods. But Islam, the religion, is at the root of it all. I don't understand how you can separate the two. There are probably many many Muslims who fall somewhere in between, but they seem content to just close their eyes and ears and insist that none of it has anything to do with Islam at all. Almost like they don't really care which political ideology wins out - if radical Islam wins out, they will come out on top because governments and religion will all be Islamic. (I don't think they fully understand the slippery slope of that, since Islam doesn't have any main doctrine and Islamic governments are free to interpret and impose the religious doctrines however they want to). And if Western philosophies win out, well......they reap the benefits of that too. I disagree that anything the "West' has done makes them entirely responsible for the mess Islam is today. I believe the religion and its adherants also bear responsibility for it. Some here keep saying that its the West promoting radical Islamic terrorism and playing into its' hands by reporting on what it's doing. Do you not see how individual Muslims also promote and play into its' hands? No, instead you lambast anyone who points this out, as has been done to Ayaan Hirsi Ali. I'm positive the islamic concept of "ummah" causes some cognitive dissonance amongst some Muslims. Edited May 25, 2017 by Goddess Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted May 25, 2017 Report Share Posted May 25, 2017 Just now, DogOnPorch said: Oskar Schindler was a good Nazi. Yeah I know. That's my point. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DogOnPorch Posted May 25, 2017 Report Share Posted May 25, 2017 40 minutes ago, dialamah said: ISIS applauds DoP and Gohs for spreading their message of violence and denying the right of Muslims to choose peace and still call themselves Muslim. Care to point out the violent bits of my "message"? Or are you just slandering for slander's sake? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Argus Posted May 25, 2017 Report Share Posted May 25, 2017 I would like to ask if anyone thinks Douglas Murray is an Islamophobe for his campaign against Islamism and accommodation in the UK. He is, after all, a gay man, and polls posted here have shown more than half of British Muslims think all homosexuals should be in prison. So is his dislike of Islam 'unreasonable and unfounded'? 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Goh Shenas Posted May 25, 2017 Report Share Posted May 25, 2017 3 minutes ago, bcsapper said: Obviously I'm not bashing Jews. That is another deflection, and one employed by many to restrict criticism of other religions, such as Islam. What I'm doing is trying to get you to acknowledge that some proponents of a religion have different views of how they, and others, should behave, from other proponents of the same religion. The old testament has already seen the transition of change. Muslims are still accustomed to savagary and barbaric actions. Critisise judaism all you like but if you attach criticism towards jews unfounded then I will question your motives. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DogOnPorch Posted May 25, 2017 Report Share Posted May 25, 2017 Just now, bcsapper said: Yeah I know. That's my point. Fine...some folks still like and admire the Nazis. It is not the social pariah it used to be. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DogOnPorch Posted May 25, 2017 Report Share Posted May 25, 2017 1 minute ago, Argus said: I would like to ask if anyone thinks Douglas Murray is an Islamophobe for his campaign against Islamism and accommodation in the UK. He is, after all, a gay man, and polls posted here have shown more than half of British Muslims think all homosexuals should be in prison. So is his dislike of Islam 'unreasonable and unfounded'? The left routinely denigrate Douglas as an Islamophobe. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Goh Shenas Posted May 25, 2017 Report Share Posted May 25, 2017 Just now, DogOnPorch said: Fine...some folks still like and admire the Nazis. It is not the social pariah it used to be. Exactly! A lot of so called moderate muslims still admire Mufti. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DogOnPorch Posted May 25, 2017 Report Share Posted May 25, 2017 Just now, Goh Shenas said: Exactly! A lot of so called moderate muslims still admire Mufti. Nazism found a common denominator in Islam which proved very useful during the final stages of the Holocaust. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted May 25, 2017 Report Share Posted May 25, 2017 1 minute ago, DogOnPorch said: Fine...some folks still like and admire the Nazis. It is not the social pariah it used to be. Well, I doubt Oskar would have. That is, after all, still the point I am making. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Argus Posted May 25, 2017 Report Share Posted May 25, 2017 1 minute ago, DogOnPorch said: The left routinely denigrate Douglas as an Islamophobe. Yes, I know. What I'm looking for is how a gay man can possibly be accused of having an unreasonable fear of or dislike for Muslims when so many Muslims want him in prison or dead. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DogOnPorch Posted May 25, 2017 Report Share Posted May 25, 2017 Just now, bcsapper said: Well, I doubt Oskar would have. That is, after all, still the point I am making. Oskar wasn't a Nazi in your books? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DogOnPorch Posted May 25, 2017 Report Share Posted May 25, 2017 1 minute ago, Argus said: Yes, I know. What I'm looking for is how a gay man can possibly be accused of having an unreasonable fear of or dislike for Muslims when so many Muslims want him in prison or dead. It is far more important to protect Islam from criticism than to protect homosexuals from Islam...bottom line. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted May 25, 2017 Report Share Posted May 25, 2017 Just now, DogOnPorch said: Oskar wasn't a Nazi in your books? He might have been. I never saw the movie. He obviously made his own mind up about which bits he was going to subscribe to and which bits he wasn't. Much like any individual, he made choices. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Omni Posted May 25, 2017 Report Share Posted May 25, 2017 5 hours ago, DogOnPorch said: Show me how I have what I read in the Quran WRONG.... Tell us which version has caught your undivided attention and someone may be able to advise you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Goh Shenas Posted May 25, 2017 Report Share Posted May 25, 2017 Islam is not compatible with our values in the West and people who practise this religion cannot be trusted. How many more deaths would you liberal lefties want to see before you change your mind that Islam is the biggest enemy of western civilisation? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DogOnPorch Posted May 25, 2017 Report Share Posted May 25, 2017 Just now, bcsapper said: He might have been. I never saw the movie. He obviously made his own mind up about which bits he was going to subscribe to and which bits he wasn't. Much like any individual, he made choices. So you'd play "wait and see" with the National Socialists? I think your view is flawed, my friend. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted May 25, 2017 Report Share Posted May 25, 2017 Just now, Goh Shenas said: Islam is not compatible with our values in the West and people who practise this religion cannot be trusted. How many more deaths would you liberal lefties want to see before you change your mind that Islam is the biggest enemy of western civilisation? It's pretty much the only enemy right now, isn't it? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DogOnPorch Posted May 25, 2017 Report Share Posted May 25, 2017 1 minute ago, Omni said: Tell us which version has caught your undivided attention and someone may be able to advise you. https://quran.com/ Fire away. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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