Free Speech vs Hate Speech

Evening Star · August 12, 2015

This issue is a bit puzzling to me. I generally agree with what Moonlight Graham has written. As far as I can tell, there is no reason why this person should be muzzled. The fact that people were petitioning to deny him entry only serves to illustrate the problems with our hate speech laws imo, unless there's something he has written that is far worse than anything that has been linked here or that is available in the first few posts on his page. However, I'm puzzled by the actions of the Toronto and Montreal mayors. Both Tory and Coderre have stated that he is not welcome in their cities but it doesn't seem to be stopping him. I don't really see how the mayors have actual legal authority over whether he enters those cities so it seems odd that they would make these statements for a symbolic purpose. What I do know is that I never heard of him until this controversy.

Big Guy · August 12, 2015

I agree with Evening Star. Tory should know better than to give this guy advertising for his lecture. With Tory making those statements and the aftermath social media response. he gave Roosh V $ hundreds of thousands in publicity.

Black Dog · August 12, 2015

I agree with Evening Star. Tory should know better than to give this guy advertising for his lecture. With Tory making those statements and the aftermath social media response. he gave Roosh V $ hundreds of thousands in publicity.

Yeah with all this exposure he might get as many as 50 people at his next event!

The_Squid · August 12, 2015

I think advocating for the legalization of rape can be considered hate-speech.

Ban him.

We have enough kooks like this in Canada without letting them in from the States. There is no right to cross the border. "Free speech" isn't a valid reason to get into Canada. If he's inadmissible, then too bad for that idiot.

Moonlight Graham · August 12, 2015

I agree with Evening Star. Tory should know better than to give this guy advertising for his lecture. With Tory making those statements and the aftermath social media response. he gave Roosh V $ hundreds of thousands in publicity.

I agree with this. All these articles and tweets by politician etc. are giving him extra exposure. Unless he's done something to break the law or is a danger to break the law in Canada, just let him come, speak, and leave. For whatever they're fighting for, the protesters have actually made their cause worse off by giving this guy huge media exposure. Even if he's banned, now we all know his name and he'll get more followers to read his books/blog.

Moonlight Graham · August 12, 2015

I think advocating for the legalization of rape can be considered hate-speech.

Ban him.

I don't really agree with his logic, but you have to read his full article and why he wants to legalize rape on private property. He's arguing that rape is bad, and legalizing rape on private property will actually reduce instances of rape. He's not arguing "legalize rape so men can rape more women".

The_Squid · August 12, 2015

I don't really agree with his logic, but you have to read his full article and why he wants to legalize rape on private property. He's arguing that rape is bad, and legalizing rape on private property will actually reduce instances of rape. He's not arguing "legalize rape so men can rape more women".

I've read it... it's possibly the stupidest notion I've ever read... but the actual article is besides the point.

His misogynistic views (hate speech) may make him inadmissible to Canada. Which is fine by me. No foreigner is guaranteed passage into Canada. And our reasons don't even need to be really good ones. If someone might be coming to Canada to espouse nonsense and hate, send them packing back to where they came from. We don't need to afford foreigners trying to come here the same rights we give Canadian citizens.

kimmy · August 12, 2015

I completely agree. This just helps him promote himself. Not just in terms of attention, but also building his reputation as some kind of a freedom-fighter. "The SJWs are trying to ban me! They're scared of my truth!" No different from how Ann Coulter thrived upon and relished this kind of attention during her triumphant tour of Canada.

If people are talking about this guy at all, the headline shouldn't be "Mayor denounces men's rights speaker", it should be "men's rights activist calls for legalization of rape on private property." If we're going to be talking about these idiots, we should be talking about what a bunch of pathetic losers they are. Calling for them to be banned just lets them claim to be victims.

-k

The_Squid · August 12, 2015

I agree Kimmy... if CBSA lets him in, it certainly doesn't help for the idiot mayor to make these kinds of headlines giving him free publicity.

Black Dog · August 12, 2015

If people are talking about this guy at all, the headline shouldn't be "Mayor denounces men's rights speaker", it should be "men's rights activist calls for legalization of rape on private property." If we're going to be talking about these idiots, we should be talking about what a bunch of pathetic losers they are. Calling for them to be banned just lets them claim to be victims.

-k

To that end, can we talk about the fact that he was wearing a wig when he got his beer bath? Like: what?

bush_cheney2004 · August 12, 2015

Ann Coulter made it easy to expose these official Canadian do-gooder rubes, like, in her words, "Provost Francois A-Houle".

Edited August 12, 2015 by bush_cheney2004

-1=e^ipi · August 12, 2015

If people are talking about this guy at all, the headline shouldn't be "Mayor denounces men's rights speaker", it should be "men's rights activist calls for legalization of rape on private property." If we're going to be talking about these idiots, we should be talking about what a bunch of pathetic losers they are. Calling for them to be banned just lets them claim to be victims.

Exactly. Let this idiot speak, and then explain why he is wrong.

Our of curiousity, does this guy count as a men's rights activist? Has he claimed to be a men's rights activist? Because I don't see him making such a claim and his wikipedia page does not support this claim.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Roosh_V

cybercoma · August 12, 2015

I don't really agree with his logic, but you have to read his full article and why he wants to legalize rape on private property. He's arguing that rape is bad, and legalizing rape on private property will actually reduce instances of rape. He's not arguing "legalize rape so men can rape more women".

He's arguing that rape should be legalized on private property because women are pathetic and weak and don't protect themselves from being raped. If it was legal, they would be more vigilant or so he says. He's a real scum bag for holding victims accountable for their rapes and not even remotely denouncing the rapists, who are 100% responsible for rapes.

Evening Star · August 12, 2015

He's arguing that rape should be legalized on private property because women are pathetic and weak and don't protect themselves from being raped. If it was legal, they would be more vigilant or so he says. He's a real scum bag for holding victims accountable for their rapes and not even remotely denouncing the rapists, who are 100% responsible for rapes.

I don't disagree with you but this is still different from actively advocating and promoting the rape of women, which might justify a hate speech charge.

Hal 9000 · August 13, 2015

Maybe he just needs to be more subtle in his approach or his delivery of ideas.

On Guard for Thee · August 13, 2015

Ann Coulter made it easy to expose these official Canadian do-gooder rubes, like, in her words, "Provost Francois A-Houle".

Why did I seem to anticipate you would be a Coulter supporter? Does she get any gigs outside of faux news anymore?

Black Dog · August 13, 2015

Maybe he just needs to be more subtle in his approach or his delivery of ideas.

But the over the top stuff is the whole point, not the ideas.

cybercoma · August 13, 2015

But the over the top stuff is the whole point, not the ideas.

Exactly. He fancies himself a comedian, whose entire purpose is to get a rise out of people and amuse others who find it funny.

Hal 9000 · August 13, 2015

Remember this quote; "I do not agree with what you have to say, but I'll defend to the death your right to say it."

The_Squid · August 13, 2015

Remember this quote; "I do not agree with what you have to say, but I'll defend to the death your right to say it."

You do know that he's a foreigner, correct? We have no obligation to foreigners or their free speech "rights".

Hal 9000 · August 13, 2015

You do know that he's a foreigner, correct? We have no obligation to foreigners or their free speech "rights".

That's classic, I'm gonna add this to my signature so I'll never forget it!

The_Squid · August 13, 2015

That's classic, I'm gonna add this to my signature so I'll never forget it!

Very wise of you. We have no obligation to let him come here and spew hate-speech.

kimmy · August 13, 2015

Exactly. Let this idiot speak, and then explain why he is wrong.

Our of curiousity, does this guy count as a men's rights activist? Has he claimed to be a men's rights activist? Because I don't see him making such a claim and his wikipedia page does not support this claim.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Roosh_V

Is what he himself claims really relevant? The first words out of every bigot's mouth are "I'm not a bigot, but..."

I confess that I fail to grasp the distinction. All of these MRA/anti-feminist/Red Pill/MGTOW/manosphere types have all blended into a single entity that I can't really distinguish from each other.

-k

Bonam · August 13, 2015

All of these MRA/anti-feminist/Red Pill/MGTOW/manosphere types have all blended into a single entity that I can't really distinguish from each other.

-k

That's unfortunate, because there are legitimate issues/areas where men face discrimination or disadvantage that should not simply be ignored. This guy is obviously not a representative of any real/legitimate issues and the fact that otherwise reasonable people, like yourself, would be unable to distinguish a crazy like this from people who reasonably advocate about legitimate issues is a sad sign of the times.

-1=e^ipi · August 13, 2015

Remember this quote; "I do not agree with what you have to say, but I'll defend to the death your right to say it."

That was classical liberalism. Today's liberalism, i.e. progressivism, is all about throwing classical liberalism out the window and in some cases trying to ban classical liberalism (example: microaggressions).