Cecil the Lion and the Phenomena of Public Shaming.

[Michael Hardner]

COLUMBIA, S.C. – The Confederate battle flag – a powerful symbol of slavery and the Old South that has roiled emotions in South Carolina for decades – was removed from the Statehouse grounds Friday in a brief ceremony observed by thousands kept at a distance behind metal barriers.

http://www.usatoday.com/story/news/nation/2015/07/10/south-carolina-confederate-flag/29952953/

There was some outrage at play here, and a decision was made.

[Michael Hardner]

He shot a lion...big deal. If I see a lion on the way home tonight, I hope somebody shoots his ass too !

Your opinion is noted. I don't have anybody in my facebook feed echoing your sentiments, but you always have this board to tell us how you feel.

[bush_cheney2004]

Well then today there's a dentist who needs your business!

He is just down the road from me in Bloomington, but I already have a dentist (over 30 years). He only shoots polar bears.

[On Guard for Thee]

Offensive to who though?

Is the Dongle joke I highlighted above really all that offensive?

Well it's not one I would tell in the first place, (sounds a bit childish) but I wouldn't bother with any such type joke where there was a chance that anyone but whom I intended to tell it to could hear it.

[bush_cheney2004]

Your opinion is noted. I don't have anybody in my facebook feed echoing your sentiments, but you always have this board to tell us how you feel.

Cry me a river....more people will be shot today than frickin' lions.

'My facebook feed' says it all....

Edited July 29, 2015 by bush_cheney2004

[jacee]

Sure, it's hard to feel bad for this guy. But the wrath that was inflicted on this guy could be inflicted on anyone if we're unlucky to say something that a SJW deems unpleasant within earshot.

Who the hell wants to be trapped in a work situation with some immature yahoo making 'big dongle' jokes behind you?

Grow up boys!

Your dongles are irrelevant at work.

.

[Boges]

Who the hell wants to be trapped in a work situation with some immature yahoo making 'big dongle' jokes behind you?

Grow up boys!

Your dongles are irrelevant at work.

.

And of course that immature person deserves to be fired right?

[On Guard for Thee]

He is just down the road from me in Bloomington, but I already have a dentist (over 30 years). He only shoots polar bears.

Does he mount their heads in the office for your enjoyment?

[Big Guy]

I have never understood the enjoyment of hunting but there must be something to it. We live in rural Southern Ontario and hunting is a rite of passage for most farmers. They also seem to look at animals in a very different way from me. A cat is a working animal who deals with barn mice and bullets are cheap methods of keeping the number of cats workable. Just because I do not understand it does not mean there is something wrong with it. What he did was legal and morality is a very subjective evaluation of reasons. What if we called the lion "killer" or "slasher" instead of Cecil?

On the other point, outing through video is a very dangerous method of making a point. It is very easy to misread actions if they are not placed in context. Placing a video on public social media with unsubstantiated subjective evaluation is like ringing a bell. If you are wrong you cannot "unring" a bell. There is a difference between public shaming and ruining a career.

[Boges]

What he did was legal and morality is a very subjective evaluation of reasons. What if we called the lion "killer" or "slasher" instead of Cecil?

Actually it wasn't legal. He lured the Lion out of a Nature Reserve. The Lion had a GPS tracker that they tried to destroy once they discovered it. The two guides are facing charges in Zimbabwe for taking this dude's bribe.

I think coming down on this behaviour is a good thing because poaching in these countries is a problem. Perhaps if people knew that making pictures of them killing a protected animal would result in public shaming, they wouldn't do it. We can only hope.

It's an example where public shaming may be a good thing. Often it's just people imposing their morality on others.

Edited July 29, 2015 by Boges

[Big Guy]

To Boges - What you state may indeed be the truth but the coverage I saw was that this guy is one of those big game hunters who gets off bagging "special" trophies. He claims that he did not know the animal was lured and set up and that is why the guides have been arrested and he has not. If he is part of this illegal action then I agree with your view.

[BC_chick]

Is there something that can be done to stop people trying to make themselves feel better by bringing down people who do things that the "internet" doesn't approve of? Or is this just the price of having the internet?

It's a brave new world that a lot of people are very uneasy about.

30 years ago the news would hit the newspapers and the person would be disgraced. Information age has increased public information so logically it follows that the level of humiliation increases.

[Boges]

To Boges - What you state may indeed be the truth but the coverage I saw was that this guy is one of those big game hunters who gets off bagging "special" trophies. He claims that he did not know the animal was lured and set up and that is why the guides have been arrested and he has not. If he is part of this illegal action then I agree with your view.

You'd have to be pretty gullible to believe him. He also tracked him for 40 hours after wounding him with an arrow. What type of hunter uses a truck and a carcass to bait an animal like that? It's a Lion, not a Trout.

[drummindiver]

It was reported the Zimbabwe government was actively looking for Palmer.

Many people appear very cavalier about the destruction of beautiful animals for entertainment, which is one of the reasons many of them are extinct or on their way.

You can't reason empathy, so those of you that don't get it will never get it.

[Freddy]

It would seem , that everything wrong with this world is due to humans. What a nice place this planet must have been without humans.

Edited July 29, 2015 by Freddy

[drummindiver]

It would seem , that everything wrong with this world is due to humans. What a nice place this planet must have been without humans.[

"I'm sick of this back slapping isn't humanity great bullshit. Humans are a virus with shoes"

Bill Hicks

what would you like to blame animals for?

[AngusThermopyle]

This guy is a true douche nozzle. If you hunt for food and use what you kill that's one thing. This guy doesn't do that. He hunts for trophies and the thrill of the kill. By most peoples standards that's just wrong, even sick. He's been convicted of a felony in the past related to his hunting. He lured a bear from a protected area then shot it. He then colluded with others to lie about what he'd done. Sound familiar? He has shot and posed with one of the most endangered of the large species on Earth, a White Rhino, because...you know...he's a conservationist. He also settled a sexual harassment case out of court with a former employee of his to the tune of $127,000. Real piece of work this guy is.

If you look into this you'll also see that he's drawn the wrath of Hunters down upon himself. Many of them are revolted with the so called hobby of trophy hunting. They condemn the trophy/ thrill kill aspect of hunting stating quite rightly that a true hunter kills only what he must and uses what he kills. Those who wish can defend him all they want but it would appear they are in a tiny minority. Most people find his actions revolting. Karma really is a bitch.

I almost forgot to add, they also attempted to destroy the GPS tracking collar Cecil wore. They also lured him out at night then trained spotlights on him while he ate the provided bait so Palmer could take his time with his kill. Even so Mr. Killy McKillster only wounded him and he suffered for forty hours before being killed. And some of you wonder why people are angry. Really? Are those wondering truly so obtuse?

Edited July 29, 2015 by AngusThermopyle

[BC_chick]

An undesirable trend

Wildlife conservationists see what they describe as an undesirable trend.

According to data from the International Fund for Animal Welfare, the U.S. is the world's largest importer of African lion parts for trophies and for commercial purposes. Between 1999 and 2008, U.S. citizens claimed 64% of the international market for lion parts. The data show that number has been increasing.

http://www.msn.com/en-ca/news/world/dentist-accused-of-killing-cecil-is-not-alone-trophy-hunters-are-mostly-americans/ar-AAdFYRd?ocid=AARDHP

Why is this not very surprising?

[drummindiver]

Why is this not very surprising?

The same rasp. Why this isn't surprising?

http://www.theatlantic.com/business/archive/2013/05/why-does-a-rhino-horn-cost-300-000-because-vietnam-thinks-it-cures-cancer-and-hangovers/275881/#

Edited July 29, 2015 by drummindiver

[Derek 2.0]

Actually it wasn't legal. He lured the Lion out of a Nature Reserve. The Lion had a GPS tracker that they tried to destroy once they discovered it. The two guides are facing charges in Zimbabwe for taking this dude's bribe.

Did he lure the Lion or did the guides? Likewise, do you have a source that they attempted to destroy the tracker after the fact, or that there was a bribe involved?

[Derek 2.0]

You'd have to be pretty gullible to believe him. He also tracked him for 40 hours after wounding him with an arrow. What type of hunter uses a truck and a carcass to bait an animal like that? It's a Lion, not a Trout.

Most Canadian hunters use a form of bait.... be it salt licks, sents, lures, calls etc...Many Bear hunters in Canada will use store bought meat or even other smaller game carcass, including beaver.......as to the use of a truck? So what? Canadian hunters are legally allowed to hunt game with quads, trucks, dirt bikes, boats and even helicopters...one can't shoot an animal from a motorized form a transport (Horses, canoes etc are ok), but the use of a truck shouldn't be a cause for concern to follow a dying animal.

[kimmy]

Did he lure the Lion or did the guides? Likewise, do you have a source that they attempted to destroy the tracker after the fact, or that there was a bribe involved?

They tried to destroy the tracker.

The two arrested Zimbabwean men — a professional hunter and a farm owner — face poaching charges, the Zimbabwe National Parks and Wildlife Authority and the Safari Operators Association said in a joint statement. Killing the lion was illegal because the farm owner did not have a hunting permit, the joint statement said. The lion was skinned and beheaded. The hunters tried to destroy the lion's collar, fitted with a tracking device, but failed, the statement said.

It doesn't specifically state who specifically lured the lion; one suspects "the men" includes both the guides and Mr Palmer:

The Zimbabwe Conservation Task Force said in a statement that an American paid the $50,000 for the hunt. During a nighttime hunt, the men tied a dead animal to their car to lure the lion out of a national park, said Johnny Rodrigues, chairman of the Zimbabwe Conservation Task Force. The American is believed to have shot it with a crossbow, injuring the animal. The wounded lion was found 40 hours later, and shot dead with a gun, Rodrigues said in the statement.

No mention of bribes; it sounds to me like he gave his $50,000 to some shady mooks rather than to a legitimate organization that could secure the proper permits.

-k

Edited July 30, 2015 by kimmy

[bush_cheney2004]

Clue for Cecil the Lion lovers...for Africa..."if it pays...it stays". And that includes trophy hunting. Nothing special about lions in the competition for land and resources. Wanna buy some bush meat ?

[kimmy]

There are 7 billion humans on the planet, give or take a few.

There are about 15,000 lions left. There were 200,000 lions 30 years ago.

There's just a handful of white rhinos left, because some dumb-ass Asians think that powdered rhino horn will give you a larger dong.

Given the choice between killing some dumb-ass poachers or seeing species go extinct, I won't shed any tears for the poachers.

There's a group of US Army veterans in Africa training African rangers to deal with poachers, by force if necessary.

I say, rock on.

-k

[bush_cheney2004]

...Given the choice between killing some dumb-ass poachers or seeing species go extinct, I won't shed any tears for the poachers.

Irrelevant....encroachment and safety for humans by/for the people who actually have to scratch out a living means more dead lions. It's easy to sit in a comfy "North American" city and preach that crap to sub-Saharan Africans desperate to survive by any means necessary.