Truth and Reconciliation... Legitimacy

[On Guard for Thee]

None of your definitions fit. It wasn't genocide. The only people who 'deem' it genocide are ideological zealots of the far left who are always yapping their stupid mouths about how horrible Canada, the US and all western countries are, along with each and every single White person who lives in them.

If you guys want to give all your possessions to some natives put on a hair shirt and go live in a shack somewhere, begging forgiveness that's up to you. The problem is most of you don't HAVE much in the way of possessions so you want to give my stuff away instead.

I see the bigotry has not left this thread.

[On Guard for Thee]

Yeah, we only killed in the range of 80%, right?

And 80% has what to do with anything..

[Argus]

I see the bigotry has not left this thread.

LOL. There wasn't a single thing there even ABOUT natives. It was about idiotic left wing zealots. But if you want to consider I'm bigoted towards idiots, feel free.

[jacee]

Read it already. Do have the people at the UN and they still havent called this genocide.

Keep trying....

Did Canada try to get rid of Aboriginal people and their rights to the land ... or not?

[jacee]

Move out of the way is not genocide, sorry.

How do you mean "move out of the way"?

You mean get rid of their rights to the land?

How?

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[jacee]

For those kids however I would say it was forced assimilation

Agreed.

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[jacee]

Granted. But how do you assimilate people living by themselves on a reserve who don't speak any English?

You don't.

It's their choice.

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[jacee]

If we'd performed genocide we wouldn't be having this discussion now because there'd be no Indians left.

Are there no Jews left?

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[jacee]

It wasn't even forced assimilation. It was forced education. In areas where there were enough kids they went to local schools. In areas with small populations they had to go to these residential schools the churches ran.

Education is fine, even in another language and culture ... by choice.

However they were punished severely for any attempt to practice their own culture - prayers, songs, language.

It is that destruction of culture and the severe physical and emotional abuse that is the issue.

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[jacee]

None of your definitions fit. It wasn't genocide. The only people who 'deem' it genocide are ideological zealots of the far left who are always yapping their stupid mouths about how horrible Canada, the US and all western countries are, along with each and every single White person who lives in them.

And the Truth and Reconciliation Commission.

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[PIK]

It was a terrible thing, but that was then and this is now. And the only problems they have now is their own leadership.

[jacee]

It was a terrible thing, but that was then and this is now.

And "now" is Truth and Reconciliation time.

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[PIK]

We all know what happened and that is it. What they need to do is clean up their own back yard. If they just want more money thrown at them ,that tells me they are not to concerned about it themselves.

[eyeball]

None of your definitions fit. It wasn't genocide. The only people who 'deem' it genocide are ideological zealots of the far left who are always yapping their stupid mouths about how horrible Canada, the US and all western countries are, along with each and every single White person who lives in them.

Actually it's the governments running them that are horrible...which doesn't excuse why we keep electing them over and over again but...

If you guys want to give all your possessions to some natives put on a hair shirt and go live in a shack somewhere, begging forgiveness that's up to you. The problem is most of you don't HAVE much in the way of possessions so you want to give my stuff away instead.

Speaking for myself what I really want to take away is the perennial ability of governments to tilt economic playing field towards the few, whom you apparently want to be identified with. I'd definitely be interested in taxing the living snot out of you to facilitate and pay for our country's re-constitution. BTW under any other circumstance wouldn't you normally be jumping at the chance to have a crack at creating a new constitution?

That said I bet just levelling the playing field alone, maybe by outlawing in-camera lobbying, would help everyone get over the inequities of the past a lot more happily notwithstanding the few who've benefited the most from the status quo.

[On Guard for Thee]

LOL. There wasn't a single thing there even ABOUT natives. It was about idiotic left wing zealots. But if you want to consider I'm bigoted towards idiots, feel free.

So if you think saying that people who are offended by genocide should give all their stuff away and go live in a shack because they are zealots is not bigotry, perhaps you need a primer on the meaning of the word.

[eyeball]

Are there no Jews left?

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Yes and I notice they also got their country back. I guess natives noticed that too.

[bush_cheney2004]

It's a fair question...where were all the guilt ridden activists long before the TRC ? What were they doing besides exploiting and benefiting from the status quo ? Easy to just blame "the government".

[Keepitsimple]

TRC or not, I still don't have a clue what the vision is for these 630 nations.....as put forward by the Nations themselves - not the Canadian government. Given the proper resources, what would these 630 Nations look like in 30 years? What is the practical 10 step roadmap and where does it lead? Again - a roadmap defined by Aboriginals. If you don't know where you're going, any road will get you there.

[Accountability Now]

Did Canada try to get rid of Aboriginal people and their rights to the land ... or not?

They didn't have to....the aboriginals ceded and surrendered the land. Again...if you read the treaties you'd know this. They had a right to use the land but it was no longer theirs

[Accountability Now]

If you look up what boarding/residential schools were like back then, they were pretty regimented places. You'll see lines of little kids in tight, uncomfortable suits and dresses standing at attention at their desks, sitting up very straight, knowing they'll get beaten for the slightest lapse. Like I said, if they'd cage a naked young prince Charles and leave him under a cold shower what do you think they'd do to regular kids?

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Yes....I read your posts on Charles and other boarding schools and agree that they used similar tactics to try and change them. In many ways I would say they are using forced assimilation as well. Perhaps not to the level it was used against the natives but still forced nonetheless

Edited June 5, 2015 by Accountability Now

[Smallc]

But the rule that you don't speak your own language while learning another is not unique to residential schools.

Very true, and if you want to see an example, go to any university campus where an English language program is happening.

[Smallc]

How do you mean "move out of the way"?

You mean get rid of their rights to the land?

the treaties did that...but you already know that.

[Smallc]

And "now" is Truth and Reconciliation time.

For something I didn't do?

[Big Guy]

Lots of issues being muddled together here - land rights, reparations, child abuse, forced loss of culture etc. I would like to address one of those. I attended an elementary school in Southern Ontario in the late 1940's. I was part of the DP immigration into Canada as Germany and Russia were carving Europe up.

In the school, there were 5 little young DP's ranging from 7 to 10 years old. They put us all in the same class. Every time we tried to speak in our "native" language, we were belted with a strap or a backhand. We were shunned and it took years until we were accepted by the surrounding Canadian community. The discipline was the same for ALL students; corporal punishment was the norm - strap for being late, a ruler across your knuckles for talking, a kick in the rear for fooling around during recess. sitting in the "dummy" chair in the front left corner of the room for not paying attention or not knowing your work.

Do I deserve an apology or remuneration for pain and suffering? Hell no!

That was then and this is now. I was treated the way that all young kids were treated in rural Southern Ontario of the time.

We all learned English very quickly, assimilated into Canadian traditions (but still maintained European traditions during holidays) and became self sustaining Canadian citizens. I chose a fairly successful career in Secondary School education for about 35 years.

Sometimes life is not fair. To create inequalities of today to make up for inequalities of the past, does not make anything equal.

Focus on the future and not the past.

[On Guard for Thee]

Lots of issues being muddled together here - land rights, reparations, child abuse, forced loss of culture etc. I would like to address one of those. I attended an elementary school in Southern Ontario in the late 1940's. I was part of the DP immigration into Canada as Germany and Russia were carving Europe up.

In the school, there were 5 little young DP's ranging from 7 to 10 years old. They put us all in the same class. Every time we tried to speak in our "native" language, we were belted with a strap or a backhand. We were shunned and it took years until we were accepted by the surrounding Canadian community. The discipline was the same for ALL students; corporal punishment was the norm - strap for being late, a ruler across your knuckles for talking, a kick in the rear for fooling around during recess. sitting in the "dummy" chair in the front left corner of the room for not paying attention or not knowing your work.

Do I deserve an apology or remuneration for pain and suffering? Hell no!

That was then and this is now. I was treated the way that all young kids were treated in rural Southern Ontario of the time.

We all learned English very quickly, assimilated into Canadian traditions (but still maintained European traditions during holidays) and became self sustaining Canadian citizens. I chose a fairly successful career in Secondary School education for about 35 years.

Sometimes life is not fair. To create inequalities of today to make up for inequalities of the past, does not make anything equal.

Focus on the future and not the past.

That is what the Reconciliation part of the TRC is meant to do.