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Baltimore Riots


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Why do you put "state killings" in "quotation marks"? Do you have an alternate theory to offer as to what happened to Freddie Gray?

No, I define "state killings" as killings sanctioned by the State.......in this case, not so much:

5538.jpg

I doubt a lot of research went into the exercise. Nonetheless, the precedent has been established. If you don't want anything to get done, stand there peacefully and hold a sign that says "I am a tad upset". If you want something to be done, burn stuff to the ground.

-k

Oh, like the Rodney King riots.......or the Watts and Detroit riots of the 60s......or the zoot suit riot of the 40s etc

Quite the precedent for change......clearly the rioters got everything they wanted....and went home to watch their new tv.

Peaceful sign holding never works:

50702738.jpg?itok=HZeJzUp2

:rolleyes:

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No...regular "black folk" love guns too. The U.S. Supreme Court restored their rights to own handguns in D.C. and Chicago. Sorry, I know it doesn't dovetail well with the liberal "white folk" agenda....especially from Canada.

Don't chya know liberal white folks know what's best for the colored man. They've been running Baltimore and Maryland for 100 years, and look how well it's gone!

Edited by Shady
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No, I define "state killings" as killings sanctioned by the State.......in this case, not so much:

We've got a police force with a proven history of maiming and killing people in their custody with these "nickel rides", but you don't see this as an abuse of state power?

Peaceful sign holding never works:

:rolleyes:

That's how you think it happened? MLK Jr and friends marched around with signs, and the world changed? That's funny.

-k

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We've got a police force with a proven history of maiming and killing people in their custody with these "nickel rides", but you don't see this as an abuse of state power?

I differentiate between isolated incidents of abuse and sanctioned state killings.

That's how you think it happened? MLK Jr and friends marched around with signs, and the world changed? That's funny.

-k

In not so many words....yeah. The Washington (and the Birmingham movement) march generated nationwide interest in MLK's cause and the following year, LBJ signed into law the Civil Rights Act.....so yeah, I'd point to the work of peaceful protesters, holding signs, as effective when contrasted with rioting, looting and torching ones own community, to achieve some measure of positive change.......

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I differentiate between isolated incidents of abuse and sanctioned state killings.

In not so many words....yeah. The Washington (and the Birmingham movement) march generated nationwide interest in MLK's cause and the following year, LBJ signed into law the Civil Rights Act.....so yeah, I'd point to the work of peaceful protesters, holding signs, as effective when contrasted with rioting, looting and torching ones own community, to achieve some measure of positive change.......

Sanctioned state killings happen at the electric chair. Rough rides happen at street level, and apparently arent all that isolated, else why would they be coined as such. Amazing how the right can spew excuse after excuse.

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I differentiate between isolated incidents of abuse and sanctioned state killings.

In not so many words....yeah. The Washington (and the Birmingham movement) march generated nationwide interest in MLK's cause and the following year, LBJ signed into law the Civil Rights Act.....so yeah, I'd point to the work of peaceful protesters, holding signs, as effective when contrasted with rioting, looting and torching ones own community, to achieve some measure of positive change.......

Perhaps kimmy has never seen the footage of the march on Washington, and King's I have a dream speech.
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I differentiate between isolated incidents of abuse and sanctioned state killings.

What's happened in Baltimore isn't an "isolated incident", it's an ongoing pattern of behavior.

In not so many words....yeah. The Washington (and the Birmingham movement) march generated nationwide interest in MLK's cause and the following year, LBJ signed into law the Civil Rights Act.....so yeah, I'd point to the work of peaceful protesters, holding signs, as effective when contrasted with rioting, looting and torching ones own community, to achieve some measure of positive change.......

You neglected to mention the part where the brutal attacks on demonstrators by state agents provoked massive public outcry that shamed the federal government into taking action against states that refused to accept LBJ's Civil Rights Act.

-k

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What's happened in Baltimore isn't an "isolated incident", it's an ongoing pattern of behavior.

But so is petty theft, rape and murder........

You neglected to mention the part where the brutal attacks on demonstrators by state agents provoked massive public outcry that shamed the federal government into taking action against states that refused to accept LBJ's Civil Rights Act.

-k

I don't recall said demonstrators pilfering RCA tvs and Kools though......

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But so is petty theft, rape and murder........

What's your argument here? The rapers keep raping, and the murderers keep murdering, so why shouldn't the cops keep killing people in custody? Is that what you're trying to say?

Aside from the obviously hilarious aspect of holding Baltimore cops up to the lofty standards set by rapists and killers, I think it should be pointed out that when rapists and killers get caught, they get prosecuted. Not so with cops, up until this week. These winners are the first cops who've actually been charged for this in Baltimore.

Clearly all of this was a big joke for the cops, and clearly they're not laughing anymore.

I don't recall said demonstrators pilfering RCA tvs and Kools though......

So hung up on the looting. So you conservative types are ok with revolt against unjust authority provided that certain rules of etiquette are followed? Like, the Boston Tea Party was ok, provided that they threw creme and sugar in after the tea? The Colorado Coalfield War was ok because the miners just burned everything to the ground and didn't take home any coal for themselves?

-k

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What's your argument here? The rapers keep raping, and the murderers keep murdering, so why shouldn't the cops keep killing people in custody? Is that what you're trying to say?

That within a civil society, a segment of said society, will break the law......that includes police.

Aside from the obviously hilarious aspect of holding Baltimore cops up to the lofty standards set by rapists and killers, I think it should be pointed out that when rapists and killers get caught, they get prosecuted. Not so with cops, up until this week. These winners are the first cops who've actually been charged for this in Baltimore.

First cops ever charged with a violent crime in Baltimore? Don't suppose you have a cite?

So hung up on the looting. So you conservative types are ok with revolt against unjust authority provided that certain rules of etiquette are followed? Like, the Boston Tea Party was ok, provided that they threw creme and sugar in after the tea? The Colorado Coalfield War was ok because the miners just burned everything to the ground and didn't take home any coal for themselves?

You're of the assumption that we're of the same opinion as the rioters, in that we're in agreement over an unjust authority worthy of a revolt........Of course, we're also leery of those that crap where they eat.

Frankly, I'm quite fine with those that would burn and steal from their own local community having diminished input over governance of society as whole. Likewise, I think to tie this to the unjust society meme makes a mockery of those peaceful demonstrators of the Civil Rights era.

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Sanctioned state killings happen at the electric chair. Rough rides happen at street level, and apparently arent all that isolated, else why would they be coined as such. Amazing how the right can spew excuse after excuse.

So you need to be able to produce the subsection of the police training material that specifically points to this as a sanctioned police technique.
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That within a civil society, a segment of said society, will break the law......that includes police.

This isn't "a few bad apples", this is a cultural problem within the police.

First cops ever charged with a violent crime in Baltimore? Don't suppose you have a cite?

I was referring specifically to the "nickel rides", not violent crime in general. Not counting Freddie Gray, there's two dead, two left crippled, numerous less severe injuries, ongoing lawsuits, and millions of dollars in compensation paid out to victims by the city of Baltimore. And no police have been charge or disciplined for any of these injuries. These lawsuits have all been settled without any admission of liability by the cops.

You're of the assumption that we're of the same opinion as the rioters, in that we're in agreement over an unjust authority worthy of a revolt........Of course, we're also leery of those that crap where they eat.

I'm not exactly sure what you're trying to say. Are you actually in agreement that unjust authority is worth of a revolt?

As for crapping where they eat: look, I'm not arguing that a great deal of thought and planning went into the decisions by some portion of the protesters to loot and destroy. Just the opposite. It was a result of blind rage, not carefully planned strategy.

What I'm arguing is first off, that that rage is completely justified. The cops have been doing this crap for a long time with no remorse and no consequences. How can people not be angry over this?

And secondly, that violence seems to be the only thing that gets results. They've had peaceful protests, nothing changed. They went to the polls, nothing changed. They went to the courts and won, and nothing changed.

They smashed and looted and burned, and suddenly the whole country was paying attention.

There's only one reason we're talking about this. There's only one reason news cameras from all over America were in Baltimore. There's only one reason the state investigators and the federal government got involved. It's right there in the thread title.

People saw the picture of the burning store on the news and it shocked them into action.

Frankly, I'm quite fine with those that would burn and steal from their own local community having diminished input over governance of society as whole. Likewise, I think to tie this to the unjust society meme makes a mockery of those peaceful demonstrators of the Civil Rights era.

rFjR3qU.jpg

ypCce0g.jpg

50 years ago, people saw these pictures and it shocked them into taking action.

-k

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You're of the assumption that we're of the same opinion as the rioters, in that we're in agreement over an unjust authority worthy of a revolt........Of course, we're also leery of those that crap where they eat.

I guess the answer is to go into predominately white areas and smash those up.

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Only if you think racism is exclusively a consciously held individual belief and not an unconscious set of assumptions that colour one's behaviours.

How many times does the difference between institutional racism and personal prejudice have to be explained on this damn forum?

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while I haven't hesitated to criticize police for going over the line (as in the G20 for example) I don't believe rioting is the best means to make changes to their procedures.

People riot when they believe that they have no other means of being heard.

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I'm just trying to figure out why a bunch of rednecks helping out a withered old deadbeat who doesn't feel like paying his grazing fees inspires Sean Hannity and the Breitbart crew to have freedomgasms, while revolting against extrajudicial killings by government agents is causes those same people shock and revulsion.

Surely standing up against unlawful use of force by the state is far closer to the spirit of 1776 than some wealthy rancher welching on debts.

Perhaps they couldn't find an East India Company ship loaded with tea on short notice.

There's a well established precedent for this: the powers-that-be don't care until well-off peoples' shit gets wrecked.

-k

I assume you're being rhetorical because the answer is pretty black and white.

Try the veal.

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