Hoser360 Posted February 19, 2016 Report Posted February 19, 2016 So you consider bomb makers to be terrorist leaders? Give me a name or two. The makers of bombs are not terrorist but those who use them might be. Please define what is a terrorist/terrorism?
jbg Posted February 19, 2016 Report Posted February 19, 2016 The comments is not directed at YOU to take it personal but rather the ideology behind thinking that it is OK to deprive certain people from certain land their basic rights and continue with expansionist policies of building illegal settlements in occupied land. Something that you don't seem to have a problem with to ignore the UN mandates and calls from the rest of the world. It is the Zionism dream of greater Israel.... If people didn't move to other places or take land, the Great Rift Valley of Africa would be a mighty crowded place. I g uess that all movements of people then were/are OK with you up till, oh, the late 1800's when it just happened to be the Jewish people that wanted a homeland in which to exercise self-determination. So I get it. When the Ottoman Empire was created and took over "Palestine" that was OK. When the Ottoman Empire imploded, it was OK for all other people to get their plot of land on which to kill people, but not the Jews? Keep in mind, there were always Jews there. The world's hypocrisy (not only yours) is overwhelming. Free speech: "You can say what you want, but I don't have to lend you my megaphone." Always remember that when you are in the right you can afford to keep your temper, and when you are in the wrong you cannot afford to lose it. - J.J. Reynolds. Will the steps anyone is proposing to fight "climate change" reduce a single temperature, by a single degree, at a single location? The mantra of "world opinion" or the views of the "international community" betrays flabby and weak reasoning (link).
Hoser360 Posted February 19, 2016 Report Posted February 19, 2016 If people didn't move to other places or take land, the Great Rift Valley of Africa would be a mighty crowded place. I g uess that all movements of people then were/are OK with you up till, oh, the late 1800's when it just happened to be the Jewish people that wanted a homeland in which to exercise self-determination. So I get it. When the Ottoman Empire was created and took over "Palestine" that was OK. When the Ottoman Empire imploded, it was OK for all other people to get their plot of land on which to kill people, but not the Jews? Keep in mind, there were always Jews there. The world's hypocrisy (not only yours) is overwhelming. Unfortunately the worlds ignorance is even greater. Jewish people lived in Palestine before Zionism reared it's ugly head. And why is it that so many people bring up history and even ancient history to justify the actions of people today. By your logic ISIL has every right to take over Syria or any other country if it pleases them. What Zionism is doing today is what is in question. Inch by inch they are taking over the West Bank and making life miserable for the Palestinians. The bombing and invasion of Gaza in 2014 was a horrible war crime and a true act of terrorism. If the American people actual knew how their tax dollars were being spent they might not be so willing to fork over the billions of dollars to Israel that they do.
jbg Posted February 19, 2016 Report Posted February 19, 2016 Do you know who pays most of the bills for the Palestinian government? The Americans. Europe pays them a ton too. Saudi Arabia is next. Iran only funds weapons. I'm shocked. I thought they paid their bills with their own ingenuity and economic productivity. Free speech: "You can say what you want, but I don't have to lend you my megaphone." Always remember that when you are in the right you can afford to keep your temper, and when you are in the wrong you cannot afford to lose it. - J.J. Reynolds. Will the steps anyone is proposing to fight "climate change" reduce a single temperature, by a single degree, at a single location? The mantra of "world opinion" or the views of the "international community" betrays flabby and weak reasoning (link).
Rue Posted February 19, 2016 Report Posted February 19, 2016 The makers of bombs are not terrorist but those who use them might be. Please define what is a terrorist/terrorism? If you need to ask such a question you think you already know the answer and its different than the one you ask Argus for , so do us all a favour, knock off the posturing and make your point. No one is coming on this forum to argue with you over what a terrorist is. Clearly you have a partisan view that terrorists are not terrorists when you say so save it. Beent here done that. Go defend terrorists as freedom fighters and get into a semantic argument about what terrorist is-me I witnessed them-unlike you I do not rely on an internet to tell me what it is. Move on.
Rue Posted February 19, 2016 Report Posted February 19, 2016 (edited) Unfortunately the worlds ignorance is even greater. Jewish people lived in Palestine before Zionism reared it's ugly head. If the American people actual knew how their tax dollars were being spent they might not be so willing to fork over the billions of dollars to Israel that they do. You clearly have not a clue what you pose. 1-Don't lecture any Jew let alone me or JBG about how Jewish people lived in Palestine before Zionism was created. Don't. Don't pose as some patronizing gentile presuming to lecture we Jews on our history. Spare me the dripping, oozing, patronizing, tone. You know nothing of our people our our history Spare the ignorant presumptious white man routine on a gentile. Back off. 2-Jews lived in dhimmitude in the Muslim world. Don't lecture me or any Jew on what that means. You clearly don't. Dhimmitude. Go look it up Jewish history expert. Go on. Stop patronizing, posing, presuming to lecture we Jews about our history and go look it up. We know what khafir means, d you? We know what being dhimmi means, do you? Were you there-did you live as dhimmi? Do you have a clue how Jews were treated in the Muslim world? Of course you don't-don't lecture me on how my ancestors were treated-I know and you don't. 3-Taxayer's money? Bullsheeyit. Absolute bullsheeyit. Taxpayer's money? Millions of Americans are employed in the military industrial complex-they are hired and work and pay into the tax system of the US. Their salaries spin off and generate income, revenue and a tax basin for US governments and state governments to obtain taxes. That military industrial complex has an alliance with Israel that has Israel develop, research, perfect, add to, exchange information with the same industrial complex. You are absolutely and utterly wrong. US taxpayers do not pay for Israel. In fact the US and state governments depend on Israel to assist their own industrial businesses flourish. Its a win win. The US is not about to enter into any relationship with Israel that does not benefit it. You have Israel mixed up with China. Your lack of awareness of the tax sources in the US is clear. This canard you recycle about US taxpayers paying for Israel is a crock. Get over it. Come back when you have something a little more original to say to piss on Israel for existing. How about you start here US foreign policy expert: https://fas.org/sgp/crs/mideast/RL33222.pdf Edited February 19, 2016 by Rue
Rue Posted February 19, 2016 Report Posted February 19, 2016 (edited) Now Hoser when you are done wrongfully assuming the military aid to Israel is foreign aid and can figure out the difference (I won't hold my breath) understand that 75% -80% of the military aid given to Israel goes right back to purchasing US military equipment. Israel has not received foreign aid from the US since 2004. But hey you knew that. You of course are also aware that this military alliance enables numerous U.S. companies to have set up technology innovation and exchange centres in Israel to take advantage of Israeli technology. Oh yah you knew that Bill Gates stated in a speech in 2006 that and I quote the "innovation going on in Israel is critical to the future of the technology business." Yah you knew that Israeli high-tech firms and U.S. companies work as partners for joint production and marketing opportunities in the United States and elsewhere, creating tens of thousands of American jobs. Sure you knew that, Yah you also knew that while Israel is only 3% percent of the population of the Middle East, in 2011 alonem Israel was the destination of 25 percent of all U.S. exports to the region, more than even Saudi Arabia. Yes and of course Hoser you are well aware the names and of the U.S. companies dependent on Israel for its information technology. So for example you knew Intel's research and development centers in Israel, designed many of the company's most successful microprocessors, accounting for some 40 percent of the firm's revenues last year. Hey now Hoer stop using PayPal, its a Zionist invention made by Israeli IT researchers. Boycott it. So let's not finish there Hoser. Let's fund out all the technology Israel has created you use everyday and are oblivious to. Hey now Hoser, when you leave your tap running or flush your toilet keep this in mind, Israel recycles more than eighty percent of its wastewater -- the highest level in the world -- and has pioneered widely used techniques of conserving or purifying water, including drip irrigation and reverse osmosis desalination that are assisting third and fourth world nations and will assist China and India the two most populous nations with severe water shortages causing the movement of hundreds of millions. Hoser you better boycott; BrightSource Industries,the solar power plant in California using Israeli technology that will double the amount of solar thermal electricity produced in America. Go on Hoser join with the others on this forum whose raison d'etre is to piss on Israel and tell us how an alliance with Iran or Arab extremist regimes or Turkey is a better deal for the US. Please knock yourself out. Please explain how the following information from the military alliance with Israel that helped the US is not needed: 1-behavioral screening techniques for airport security 2-acquisition of an Israeli-produced tactical radar system to enhance force protection 3-the development of unmanned aerial systems, both for intelligence collection and combat 4- shared with the U.S. military advanced technology such as with armored vehicle protection, defense against short-range rockets, and the techniques and procedures of robotics 5-advanced X-band radar systems technology 6-counter-terrorism and intelligence cooperation Where do you think the above came from Hoser? Let's deal directly with the misrepresentation the relationship with Israel is one sided because we hear this claim once a month on this forum. Go on spit it out with Hudson Jones et al, Jews conspiring through AIPAC control congress and suck the American taxpayers like vampires in a one sided parasitical relationship. Never mind during the last 8 years this supposed Jew cabal control has allows the most anti Israel President to run the show and finance ISIL, anti semites like Erdogan and Morsi and get into bed with Iran let alone refer now to Hezbollah and Hamas as legitimate peace partners, Jews control the US. Hmmm> Spit it out. You want to give me a list of Jew names to prove they own the press, movie industry and banks? Spare me. Been there done that. While you spit out th estale and lame Israel parasite claims the U.S. military industries including Boeing and General Dynamics directlu because of Israel maintain a competitive edge compared to their European ocmpetitors an d, increased American military production which in turn has produced American jobs, and improved America's national security. Oh hell no, Americans are stupid morons. They have been hyonotized by Jews. We put matzah balls in their soup to do this. Say Hoser you know Japan and South Korea purchase the "Hawkeye" spy plane and the MD-500 chopper from the US-who the hell you think upgraded it and made it preferable to comparable British and French aircraft. Here's a hint the country starts with an I and it isn't Iran or Iraq. Israel. Yah you know, Israel. Do you even have a clue where thebulk of the $1.8 billion in annual U.S. military aid to Israel goes? Uh no not sinister Jew banks. It must be spent in the United States. Yah you knew that, Yah you know that $1.2 billion of the 1.8 billion in annual military aid goes for repayment of debt to the United States, incurred from military purchases dating back many years and that this debt is now close to being liquidated. You know what Hoser you need to get a grasp on reality and find out what Israeli technology has done and how dependent on it you may be before you think you represent US taxpayers: (source: http://www.israel21c.org/israel-facts/technology/) "Technology Intel's new game-changing processor, Skylake, which experts believe will significantly advance the computing industry, was developed at the multinational corporations offices in Haifa. Amazon’s Kindle device was largely developed in the heart of Israel’s high-tech center in Herzliya.Two Arab-Israeli engineers have developed a 2x2x2-inch computer, which is the smallest in the world. The CuBox-i, sells for just $55 and is made by Israeli company, SolidRun. Developers of Israel's missile defense system, Iron Dome, which became the hero of the 2014 conflict in Gaza, used some components from a toy car bought at Toys R Us to make the first prototype. An Israeli startup, StoreDot, has developed a technology that can charge a mobile phone in just 30 seconds. Trucks will be a lot safer and greener thanks to an Israeli company, Neomatix, which has developed a device to check tire pressure remotely, when trucks park for the night. Improperly inflated tires waste energy, wear down tire treads, and are a safety hazard.Israel has designed the first flight system to protect passenger and freighter aircraft against missile attack.Israel produces more scientific papers per capita than any other nation by a large margin – 109 per 10,000 people – as well as one of the highest percapita rates of patents filed. In proportion to its population, Israel has the largest number of startup companies in the world. In absolute terms, Israel has the largest number of startup companies than any other country in the world, except the US (3,500 companies mostly in hi-tech). Israel is ranked #2 in the world for venture capital funds right behind the US. According to industry officials, Israel designed the airline industry’s most impenetrable flight security. U.S. officials now look to Israel for advice on how to handle airborne security threats. Israel has the highest percentage in the world of home computers per capita. Israel leads the world in the number of scientists and technicians in the workforce, with 145 per 10,000, as opposed to 85 in the U.S., over 70 in Japan, and less than 60 in Germany. With over 25% of its work force employed in technical professions. Israel places first in this category as well. The first PC anti-virus software was developed in Israel in 1979. AirTrain JFK –; the 8.1-mile light rail labrynthe that connects JFK Airport to New York City’s mass transit – is protected by the Israeli-developed Nextiva surveillance system. An Israeli company M-Systems was the first to patent and introduce the disk on key. A team of Israeli and US researchers has designed a watermelon-picking robot endowed with artificial vision to do the job of harvesting. A small Israel company called Lenslet has developed a revolutionary electro-optic processor which operates one thousand times faster than any known Digital Signal Processor. An Israeli-developed alogrithm enabled NASA to transmit images from Mars. Israel hosts IBM’s largest R&D facilities outside the United States. Israeli researchers have developed an engineless, nano-RPV (remote piloted vehicle). The U.S. Marines in Iraq are using an Israel-developed hand-held computer for communication purposes. Israel engineers are behind the development of the largest communications router in the world, launched by Cisco. Israeli air force pilot technology is being used to train American college basketball and hockey players. Millions of American youngsters will soon be able to surf safely in Internet chat rooms thanks to Israeli technology. Jerusalem-based SnapKeys is bringing smartphone users a whole new way to type with an invisible keyboard. A new Israeli iPhone and iPad app called GroupShot flawlessly cobbles together the best images from a variety of group shots where somebody’s blinking, yawning or clowning. A winning proposal by Israel’s Technion Institute of Technology and Cornell University will form the basis of the future NYTechinstitute in the Big Apple. An Israeli smartphone app already in use worldwide enables drivers to avoid jams, and navigate their way through crowded city streets, using data from their phone’s GPS. The new American state-of-the-art F-35 Joint Strike Fighter aircraft will be equipped with Israeli-developed mounted display systems in their helmets which incorporate and display all vital flight data. Israeli mini-unmanned aerial vehicles are being used by US forces in Iraq and Afghanistan. Intel has sold more than $5 billion worth of the Israeli-developed Centrino chipsets since they were introduced in March 2003. An Israeli company has developed the world’s first video ringtones for cell phones – the Vringo. Voice over internet protocol (VoIP) technology was pioneered in Israel. Bill Gates called Israel a major player in the high tech world. Intel’s new multi-core processor was completely developed at its facilities in Israel. Motorola has its largest R&D center outside of the US in Israel. Most of the Windows NT operating system was developed by Microsoft-Israel. The Pentium MMX Chip technology was designed in Israel at Intel. Voice mail technology was developed in Israel. Both Microsoft and Cisco built their only R&D facilities outside the US in Israel. The technology for AOL Instant Messenger was developed in 1996 by four young Israelis. With more than 3,000 high-tech companies and start-ups, Israel has the highest concentration of high-tech companies in the world (apart from the Silicon Valley). Prof. Robert Aumann is the fourth Israeli in the last four years to win a Nobel prize. Israeli technology is behind the successful testing of in-flight cell phone use. New Yorkers are finding parking in their city a great deal easier with a new Israeli app called Pango that lets users locate, book and pay for parking spots via their smartphone. Other US cities in Arizona and Pennsylvania are also using the system. Israeli company Project RAY has developed the world’s first smartphone for people with visual disabilities, opening up the benefits of digital access to a population excluded up to now. Already in use in Israel, the smartphone is now launching in the US." Yah you listen to Big Guy's recycle line at the end of his posts saying Canada should cut its ties with Israel and turn to Iran and sk yourself what Iran does for you and the world you live in an dtake for granted. You think I a done Hoser? I wish it were that easy but Israel does more than suck US taxpayers money or finance terrorism as Iran does go on look at what its working on and I ask you, take the whole lot of you anti Israelis and please boycott these technologies: source for below:http://nocamels.com/2013/10/10-israeli-technologies-that-are-changing-the-world/ " -3d printing-no company has more 3D printing technology in its arsenal than Israeli-American giant Stratasys who continue to invent new and innovative 3rd technology with printing Predicting the future A graduate of the Technion, 27-year -old Dr. Kira Radinsky has developed software that can predict pandemics and genocides several months in advance. By scanning 500-years-worth of literature, including all the materials published in the New York Times from 1880 onwards, she was able to find strong correlations between various historical events. Among her other findings, Radinsky also discovered that the combination of droughts and storms is a good indicator to a potential Cholera outbreak. Already, her software predicted the Cholera pandemic in Cuba last year, several months before it actually happened. Radinsky started university at 15, earned her PhD at 26 and founded two startups on the side. She even landed a spot in this year’s MIT list of Top 35 Innovators Under 35, alongside the likes of Google’s Larry Page and Sergey Brin and Facebook’s Mark Zuckerberg. “Disk-On-Key” (USB flash drive) Yes, that USB memory stick you just saved your assignment on hails from the Holy Land. This world-famous portable storage device was first made by M-System’s, the company of now legendary Israeli entrepreneur Dov Moran as an upgraded version of disk and diskette technology. Moran went on to sell it to SanDisk for a cool $1.6 billion. This miniature life-saver, rescuing us from panic on many occasions, uses flash memory and USB interface for connection to personal computers. Not only can it fit our pockets, but the USB flash drive can store up to 11,830 times more data than the floppy disk (remember that?). This invention made our computer files infinitely more portable and secure. Yay for USB! ReWalk The ReWalk aims to give those with lower limb disabilities, such as paraplegia, an experience that resembles walking. ReWalk consists of an exoskeleton suit, developed by a granduate of the Technion, Israel’s Institute of Tcehnology, which uses patented technology with motorized legs to power knee and hip movement. Battery-powered to allow all-day use, ReWalk is controlled by on-board computers and motion sensors, restoring self-initiated walking and stepping without the need of tethers or switches. ReWalk controls movement using subtle changes in center of gravity, mimics natural gait and provides functional walking speed. The system senses a forward tilt of the upper body, which triggers the first step. Repeated body shifting generates a sequence of steps, which allows natural and efficient walking. The ReWalk also sits, stands, turns and can even climb and descend stairs. ReWalk does more than make people walk – it gives hope. “It is an amazing feeling to be walking again,” said Dan Webb, a client from the US, who is paralyzed. “Doing the Rewalk, it’s cutting edge, it’s very exciting for me that I’m part of something that might be the future.” Dan was paralyzed after a spinal cord injury and is now on his feet again. Storing Electricity In The Air Phinergy has created an aluminum-air battery designed for electric vehicles, which allows a significant increase in travel range (three times that of a regular electric vehicle). With this more eco-friendly and efficient battery, Phinergy‘s technology could allow for a dramatic reduction in global oil consumption and greenhouse gas emissions. The system is based on metal air technology, including aluminum air and zinc air. A metal-air battery contains an air-electrode that breathes oxygen from the surrounding air, instead of the conventional cathode. This means that the battery consumes only the required oxygen from the air, rather than having heavy materials that bound oxygen inside it. Metal-air batteries therefore have a huge potential for delivering high capacity with low weight. Some other advantages of the technology are zero CO2 emissions, full recyclability, safety and low cost. The company has currently developed metal-air batteries that are customizable and can provide energy solutions for a wide range of applications, such as cars, boats, portable electronic devices and smart grid storage. Imagine a world with zero CO2 emissions and multiplied efficiency. Drought-resistant “superplant” Israeli researchers at the Technion in Haifa have engineered drought-resistant plants that could be game-changers in the current global food crisis. Currently, 40 countries worldwide are suffering from food shortage and 870 million people, or one in eight, are chronically undernourished. Many of these countries’ food shortages are linked with drought. It appears as though the time is right for a change of strategy. The engineered plants require less water, yield bigger harvests and stay fresh for longer. They can go on for a month without water and only need 30 percent of the amount of liquid that normal plants do, so are therefore able to survive droughts. Could this be a big step in the direction of a hungry-free world? Car-to-car communication Do talking cars seem like a thing of the future? Well, the era where cars communicate with each other in order to enhance driving safety is nigh. Autotalks, founded by Nir Sasson and Onn Haran, has developed a smart chipset that enables cars and traffic infrastructure to literally “speak” via electronic messages. This technology should be able to predict the chances of road accidents and traffic jams, with vehicle-to-vehicle alerts being sent in real time to notify incoming drivers to slow down or to stop the driver entering the junction. The system is set to be in use by 2015. Ever Lasting Solar Battery A battery with infinite power…yup, we’ve got it. Haifa-based company Sol Chip has developed the world’s first solar battery that is able to recharge itself to power wireless sensors and mobile electronics devices. Through a cross pollination of solar-cell and microchip technologies, the company now offers the missing technology that will improve batteries’ life or in many cases completely eliminate the need to recharge or replace the power source. Although currently limited to an output of 8.4 volts of power, the solar battery can provide power to a vast array of outdoor devices. Right now, the company is working on integrating their technology into the fields of agriculture, farming, weather testing and security-related applications. Robot Snake Rescuing victims of natural disasters is a lot easier than before with the Robot Snake. This robot is designed to enter spaces in collapsed buildings and assist in location and rescue operations. Developed in association with the Technion, the machine is unique in its manner of crawling and is very flexible thanks to its large number of segments. Each joint is equipped with a motor, a computer, sensors, wireless communications and batteries. The head carries a camera. Thanks to its flexible structure, the robot can crawl through wreckage without further damaging the collapsed structure and provide vital information about inaccessible areas, including the status of people who might be trapped or the location of hazardous materials. Hacking the human brain ElMindA has developed Brain Network Activation technology (BNA) in association with Bar Ilan University. Basically, this technology is a major step towards “hacking” the human brain, and gaining control over specific brain functionalities, such as rehabilitation from injuries, reactions to treatment, psychiatric and neurological problems and pain. The company has made significant progress in drug research, utilizing the BNA technology in detecting and quantifying drug-induced neural response and changes in brain network activity. They’ve also used the technology to reveal differences between the effects of a drug and a placebo. All in all, ElMindA has opened our eyes to a never-before-seen dimension of our brains. All the above is a result of the very technology the US of course has formed a working alliance with. Yah go on Hoser you and Hudson and Bug Guy and the rest explain how Iran when its not financing terrorists benefits the world with its technology like Israel does. Go on explain how the whole lot of you will boycott your very lifestyles because it comes from Zionist parasites. Knock yourself out. Edited February 19, 2016 by Rue
jbg Posted February 19, 2016 Report Posted February 19, 2016 Unfortunately the worlds ignorance is even greater. Jewish people lived in Palestine before Zionism reared it's ugly head. And how is Zionism different from every other movement for “self-determination”? Hint, Israel, the end-product of Zionism, accomplishes something in addition to indiscriminate killing. Israel, the end-product of Zionism, accomplishes something in addition to soaking up international subsidies and channeling them to Swiss bank accounts or murder. Zionism has one other critical distinction that really makes people squirm; it is a Jewish movement. And why is it that so many people bring up history and even ancient history to justify the actions of people today. Why do people like you bring up and make up an alleged “Palestinian” identity for what really are groups of Arabs similar to those in multiple other states? By your logic ISIL has every right to take over Syria or any other country if it pleases them. That is unfortunately what happens when Syria, Iraq and Libya are unable to govern themselves with efficient, decent government. What Zionism is doing today is what is in question. Inch by inch they are taking over the West Bank and making life miserable for the Palestinians. What about the unprovoked Egyptian blockade of the Straits of Tiran that triggered the Mideast war? Was Israel supposed to let itself be cut off from vital imports such as oil? What about the Khartoum declaration? Hint, that was “no peace, no recognition, no negotiations. What about the steady refusal to recognize Israel as a Jewish state? Do you realize that the Arabs had plenty of opportunities that they passed up? As Abba Eban said, “the Arabs never miss an opportunity to miss an opportunity.” The bombing and invasion of Gaza in 2014 was a horrible war crime and a true act of terrorism. The building of the terror tunnels and the kidnapping and murder of three random students wasn’t? If the American people actual knew how their tax dollars were being spent they might not be so willing to fork over the billions of dollars to Israel that they do. Maybe the U.S. needs a stable, reliable ally in that part of the world. One that isn’t one bullet or gasoline bomb away from being wiped out? Free speech: "You can say what you want, but I don't have to lend you my megaphone." Always remember that when you are in the right you can afford to keep your temper, and when you are in the wrong you cannot afford to lose it. - J.J. Reynolds. Will the steps anyone is proposing to fight "climate change" reduce a single temperature, by a single degree, at a single location? The mantra of "world opinion" or the views of the "international community" betrays flabby and weak reasoning (link).
Argus Posted February 19, 2016 Report Posted February 19, 2016 The makers of bombs are not terrorist but those who use them might be. Please define what is a terrorist/terrorism? Why don't you define what you consider an Arab leader is, and give me a name or two of those assassinated by Israel. "A liberal is someone who claims to be open to all points of view — and then is surprised and offended to find there are other points of view.” William F Buckley
eyeball Posted February 19, 2016 Report Posted February 19, 2016 That is unfortunately what happens when Syria, Iraq and Libya are unable to govern themselves with efficient, decent government.Unfortunate stuff like ISIS happens?Really, who would have imagined? A government without public oversight is like a nuclear plant without lead shielding.
jbg Posted February 19, 2016 Report Posted February 19, 2016 Unfortunate stuff like ISIS happens? Really, who would have imagined? I don't think things were going too well before ISIS. Do you? Free speech: "You can say what you want, but I don't have to lend you my megaphone." Always remember that when you are in the right you can afford to keep your temper, and when you are in the wrong you cannot afford to lose it. - J.J. Reynolds. Will the steps anyone is proposing to fight "climate change" reduce a single temperature, by a single degree, at a single location? The mantra of "world opinion" or the views of the "international community" betrays flabby and weak reasoning (link).
eyeball Posted February 19, 2016 Report Posted February 19, 2016 Things weren't going so bad that you couldn't see ISIS coming in time to prevent them from arriving but...ce la vie right? Not. A government without public oversight is like a nuclear plant without lead shielding.
Big Guy Posted February 19, 2016 Report Posted February 19, 2016 I don't think things were going too well before ISIS. Do you? Before ISIS there was chaos and anarchy. Before there was chaos and anarchy there were dictatorships. Do you really believe that Iraqis, Syrians, Afghans, Libyans and Yemenis are better off to-day than before 9/11? Note - For those expecting a response from Big Guy: I generally do not read or respond to posts longer then 300 words nor to parsed comments.
Hoser360 Posted February 19, 2016 Report Posted February 19, 2016 (edited) Now Hoser when you are done wrongfully assuming the military aid to Israel is foreign aid and can figure out the difference (I won't hold my breath) understand that 75% -80% of the military aid given to Israel goes right back to purchasing US military equipment. Israel has not received foreign aid from the US since 2004. But hey you knew that. Ok, to start, I will apologize for not choosing my words more carefully because in all honesty I am sorry if I have offended you (our others) that was not my intent. I concede that the initial formation of Zionism by its founder Theodor Herzil was not a bad idea, evil or otherwise. So I retract my statement "reared its ugly head", that was wrong of me to say and I am sorry. Let me go on to say, that I have no issue with Israel in and of itself and absolutely no issue with Judaism (Jewish people) what so ever; that I assure you (for what it is worth, if I had to choose between the 3 religions of the middle east, I would choose to be Jewish - Jews have never knocked on my door and tried to convince me to join their faith and I respect that immensely). Let me shed some light on my perspective Since I was born in 1970, lets say that I recognize the boarders as set in 1967, as that seems reasonable to me. From that point I have built my perception, understanding, of how things are today. I do not subscribe to any particular religion. To call ones self a Zionist, does not describe ones religious beliefs or ethnic heritage. I do not believe that church and state should ever be as one. I have absolutely no respect for what the US, its allies and/or NATO has done to Afghanistan, Iraq, Libya and by proxy to Syria. I am Canadian. What I am strongly against is the continued Israeli expansion into the occupied West Bank and most definitely the bombing of Gaza in 2014. The result of the bombing in Gaza most likely created a hole new generation of Palestinians who hate Israel even more than they already did and served more to bread the very extremism the Israeli's hoped to stamp out. I do not believe that someones holy scripture should be the basis for occupying land that they have no immediate family ownership of. Military or foreign aid? I did not make that distinction, in fact the former is much worse than the latter. Just because Israel turns the money around to buy weapons and invest in weapon technology actually only serves my point, regardless of how many Americans benefit from this. Perhaps if the US stopped its endless wars, they could have invested in their own education system and produced the same level of expertise you describe Israel as having, for themselves. Edited February 19, 2016 by Hoser360
bush_cheney2004 Posted February 19, 2016 Report Posted February 19, 2016 (edited) I am Canadian... Military or foreign aid? I did not make that distinction, in fact the former is much worse than the latter. Just because Israel turns the money around to buy weapons and invest in weapon technology actually only serves my point, regardless of how many Americans benefit from this. Perhaps if the US stopped its endless wars, they could have invested in their own education system and produced the same level of expertise you describe Israel as having, for themselves. The USA did....Canada buys from the U.S. because it still can't do it. The aircraft and bombs that Canada uses to attack other nations across the sea came from the....USA....just like Israel's. Funny how that works, huh ? Edited February 19, 2016 by bush_cheney2004 Economics trumps Virtue.
Hoser360 Posted February 19, 2016 Report Posted February 19, 2016 The USA did....Canada buys from the U.S. because it still can't do it. The aircraft and bombs that Canada uses to attack other nations across the sea came from the....USA....just like Israel's. Funny how that works, huh ? Sad actually, since we could have been making our own and selling them to the US... At least if the Avro Arrow program was what so many have made it out be.
Bonam Posted February 20, 2016 Report Posted February 20, 2016 What I am strongly against is the continued Israeli expansion into the occupied West Bank and most definitely the bombing of Gaza in 2014. Given that the Arab-Israeli conflict wasn't gonna be resolved right then and there, what do you think would have been the more proper Israeli response to the barrage of rocket attacks directed at it from Gaza in 2014?
Hoser360 Posted February 20, 2016 Report Posted February 20, 2016 (edited) Oh, you mean those pre ww II technology rockets, that I could make here in my little apartment in Canada? Please, you are a senior member, try to at least come up an argument a little more substantial than that to try to justify the killing of 18 hundred human beings and the constant expansion of settlers (colonizers) into the West Bank. I have a lot more respect for the arguments put forth by Rue, Argus and even BC than this kind of BS. Your logic is like, if you take my home and kill my family and I throw a stone at you, you then have the right to be the victim and so are justified in killing everyone in my neighborhood, women and children included.? Those so called rockets are nothing compared to what Israel unleashed on Gaza, to say other wise is bent delusion of your own mind. So many of the current Israeli government think o f the Palestinians a vermin it is scary yet historically given other fascist states of the 20th century, not without precedent. https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/worldviews/wp/2015/05/07/israels-new-justice-minister-considers-all-palestinians-to-be-the-enemy/ And, three teens killed hiking in the occupied West Bank, still doe not justify the slaughter of over 18 hundred humans in Gaza. Gaza today is a complete prison. Recently I've heard that they can not even import Portland cement, because it could be used to make tunnels..? http://www.ifamericansknew.org/stat/deaths.html Edited February 20, 2016 by Hoser360
Bonam Posted February 20, 2016 Report Posted February 20, 2016 Oh, you mean those pre ww II technology rockets, that I could make here in my little apartment in Canada? Please, you are a senior member, try to at least come up an argument a little more substantial than that to try to justify the killing of 18 hundred human beings and the constant expansion of settlers (colonizers) into the West Bank. I am aware that the rockets are technologically inferior. You may also note that I said nothing about settlements (I do not support settlement expansion). Nonetheless, even though the rockets are primitive, that does not mean they can simply be ignored. Would you agree? Or is your position that Israel should simply ignore rocket attacks so long as the rockets are primitive enough? You still haven't answered the question. What do you think would have been the appropriate response?
Hoser360 Posted February 20, 2016 Report Posted February 20, 2016 I am aware that the rockets are technologically inferior. You may also note that I said nothing about settlements (I do not support settlement expansion). Nonetheless, even though the rockets are primitive, that does not mean they can simply be ignored. Would you agree? Or is your position that Israel should simply ignore rocket attacks so long as the rockets are primitive enough? You still haven't answered the question. What do you think would have been the appropriate response? It's late here, but I'm happy to hear that you do not support the settlements. As for the best way to deal with the rocket attacks (since those rockets could do little more than minimal damage and so served no military purpose...) (kind of like pissing into the wind), I think a more measured response would have been more productive. The obvious dominance of the IDF over the situation did not need to result in the 1800+ killed and a hole neighborhood blasted back into the stone age. Even two eyes for an eye, would have been better. But now a a new generation of children have it in their heads that Israel is the ultimate evil and in the not to distant future this could lead to more innocent lives destroyed, Israeli and Palestinians alike. The actions of the IDF is like a self full filling prophecy, aimed at guaranteeing future wars. If I was a resident of Gaza today, I would be thinking of everything I could do to stop Israeli expansion. If I had lost my family do to the bombing, well I guess I would not care much for my own life if it meant an eye for an eye. Please, for Israel to prosper no one else has to die, but, if there is continual expansion of the settlers and the OTT bombing of Gaza than millions of Palestinians are going to die with a marginal few Israeli's along the way. The long and short of it is, that many innocent people are dying and or are being taken from their land. This has to stop. If it doesn't millions of people are going to die in that region over the next few decades and the vast majority of them will be Palestinians. Israel has done some great things as nation but sadly it is over shadowed by the extremist who by no accounts are any better than than those they oppose.
bush_cheney2004 Posted February 20, 2016 Report Posted February 20, 2016 Sad actually, since we could have been making our own and selling them to the US... At least if the Avro Arrow program was what so many have made it out be. The point being that Canada procures strike aircraft and attack munitions from the USA just like Israel, and uses these weapons systems to attack "enemies" in other nations without facing the existential threat that Israel faces each day. BTW, the United State also directly supported the development of the Avro Arrow (wind tunnel testing, PW engines, Nike rockets, B-47 test bed, fire control, and missile). "War crimes" will continue to be politically motivated, human rights nonsense that seemingly always apply to Israel, but never Palestinian terrorists or even Canada/NATO interventions. Economics trumps Virtue.
Argus Posted February 20, 2016 Report Posted February 20, 2016 Top three human rights abusers in he world. North Korea Sudan Eritrea Number of indignant posts in the past five years decrying the plight of the people of North Korea, Sudan and Eritrea: 11 Number of indignant posts in the past five years decrying the plight of Palestinians: 186,531 One wonders what can be inspiring such desperate concern about what those Jews are up to. "A liberal is someone who claims to be open to all points of view — and then is surprised and offended to find there are other points of view.” William F Buckley
sharkman Posted February 20, 2016 Report Posted February 20, 2016 Jew haters have always been around this forum. It's too bad that the mods make allowances for them, but at least their nonsense is easy to spot.
dre Posted February 20, 2016 Report Posted February 20, 2016 I am aware that the rockets are technologically inferior. You may also note that I said nothing about settlements (I do not support settlement expansion). Nonetheless, even though the rockets are primitive, that does not mean they can simply be ignored. Would you agree? Or is your position that Israel should simply ignore rocket attacks so long as the rockets are primitive enough? You still haven't answered the question. What do you think would have been the appropriate response? I admit its not an easy question to answer. Maybe a combination of taking out targets with little chance of collateral damage, and shooting down rockets that have a chance of hitting populated areas. The real question is though is was Israel trying to mitigate a real threat, or were they trying to collectively punish Gaza residents for the actions of Hamas militants. One of those things is something they SHOULD do, and one of them is something they should not. I question things because I am human. And call no one my father who's no closer than a stranger
TimG Posted February 20, 2016 Report Posted February 20, 2016 (edited) I admit its not an easy question to answer. Maybe a combination of taking out targets with little chance of collateral damage, and shooting down rockets that have a chance of hitting populated areas.Hamas hides its rockets in areas where collateral damage is likely because it helps their propaganda game. So you are saying Israelis should just let Hamas fire as many rockets as it wants and hope their missile defense system is 100%. The real question is though is was Israel trying to mitigate a real threat, or were they trying to collectively punish Gaza residents for the actions of Hamas militants. One of those things is something they SHOULD do, and one of them is something they should not.Any attempt to ensure security is going to have the effect of "punishing innocents". Just look at all of the innocent people put through hassles to get on a plane because of a tiny number of terrorists. So if someone is determined to criticize Isreal there is nothing that Isreal can do to make them happy other than simply letting Hamas kill as many people as it wants. If you want to make that criticism you have to be very specific about the measures which you think are not necessary given then real threat of people out to murder Israelis. Edited February 20, 2016 by TimG
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