Time to ban third party advertising in Ontario

[Smallc]

Not sure that it should be prohibited completely - free speech and all that - but the spending should be limited. When we have police and fire associations using millions of dollars to secure the election of politicians who in return will repay them hundred fold - well - we have a problem.

(should be factual too )

The election is between political opponents. We don't need to clutter that with other info from special interests. Set the cap at zero.

[Bob Macadoo]

The election is between political opponents. We don't need to clutter that with other info from special interests. Set the cap at zero.

That's a view. Others contend elections have very little to do with 3 (or a couple more) individuals but is (or should) be about policy and what direction we want our community to go.

As it stands the person you vote for usually has nothing to do with name on you ballot, but on a political machine promoting him funded bypeople who know nothing about "Joe Blow" on the ballot. That is just as disgusting to me as a faceless union funding ads and really a distinction without a difference.

[Argus]

That's a view. Others contend elections have very little to do with 3 (or a couple more) individuals but is (or should) be about policy and what direction we want our community to go.

So if billionaires and corporations want to pour tens of millions into election funding to get 'their guys' into power you'd be fine with that, right?

[Bob Macadoo]

So if billionaires and corporations want to pour tens of millions into election funding to get 'their guys' into power you'd be fine with that, right?

See Post 50 & 52. I want limits....and billionaires already do through third parties (RE; "Institutes").

[scribblet]

So if the unions could run the same ads but for cheaper that'd be OK? Or are you saying set the cap so low that web ads will be all they could buy? I agree with limits but I think people here really don't, they mean "gag those unions" but know how that sounds.

Let's not stop there though, let's ban press releases for anything that a Fraser Institute, Cdn Taxpayer Federation, Centre for Policy Alternatives, and Broadbent Institute puts out. Their reports will be there if you want to find them but we stop the sensational headlines gotcha journalist write, these "white paper" synopses have too much influence.

I'm saying there should be limits on spending, how they spend it is their problem.

[scribblet]

These unions are lying they're Ass off in these ads.

It's kind of disheartening to see how low they'll stoop.

I've noticed that that, and then some !! The problem is a lot of people believe them.

[waldo]

Ekos made up a new likely voter model a few days ago because the old model had hudak ahead of wynne.

really? Strange then that the same 308 article being referenced has this statement: "Their likely voter model... increases the Liberal lead from five points to nine".

with just days before the election, the latest 308 aggregate poll that includes all new company polls released since Friday evening. Seat projection shows a tightening minority with Liberals still governing. Horwath... if this projection holds, just what did you accomplish???

[Smallc]

I'll be surprised if the Liberals win. The polls had the Liberals losing in BC and the PCs losing in Alberta, and those were wrong....the mood in Ontario, from what I can see, is one of change.

[Bob Macadoo]

I'll be surprised if the Liberals win. The polls had the Liberals losing in BC and the PCs losing in Alberta, and those were wrong....the mood in Ontario, from what I can see, is one of change.

The problem I have is that all 3 parties will be deep in debt and will be unwilling to hold the minority gov't (whoever "wins") to the fire lest they trigger another useless election. So either Wynne will crazily spend, Hudak will stupidly cut, or Horvath will ignorantly tax and no opposition will stop them out of selfishness. Great democracy we got there.

[scribblet]

I wouldn't be surprised to see a Liberal minority again but how could the NDP support them after refusing to support the budget so causing an election. Maybe they will work out some compromises

Maybe Elections Ontario will try again to do something about third party caps.

http://news.nationalpost.com/2013/04/08/curb-union-spending-ontario-chief-electoral-officer-considers-third-party-campaign-caps/

[Boges]

People accuse Hudak of being in the pockets of corporations. I don't see corporations lining up to do attack ads for the PCs. Every Public Sector union even ones that don't get provincial funding (sup Fire Fighters) can use forced union dues to fight election campaigns.

[GostHacked]

Michael, I'm very disappointed.

Free speech and freedom of association ... Of course we are free to collectively speak out via mass communication, advertising, however we like.

Your statement is absolutely ridiculous.

Anyone you like ... or you can speak for yourself.

Again, ridiculous statement.

.

Mike's statement is not ridiculous. We understand how the parties like to throw out attack ads on each other. We have unions and other groups trying to tell us who to vote for. And we can be suspicious of who is paying them to say that.

It does stifle free speech when you are constantly bombarded by a single or a very limited number of adverts. IN a sense, it can act as a conditioning tool. Repeat something often enough and it will stick in people's heads whether they like it or not. That is the purpose of advertising. Hijacking your thought process to fill your head with something else.

The other thing is that the adverts political parties throw out are the same recycled formulated garbage that we have seen for the past few decades. Promised and more promises and telling us that Candidate Z is great while all others have run this place into the ground. It creates a huge divide which prevents us on the whole from moving forward.

It can and does alienate people. One reason is that many do not want to get into the nitty gritty of most politicians. No time to vet them. I for one am turned off by attack ads. If you cannot clearly state your position and plan without resorting to slandering the other candidate (unless it was an obvious blunder like a scandal or something). then you can really make some headway. But that does not seem to sit well with people. People want politicians to tell them who and what they should hate or fear, instead of showing positives of our government.

I am GH and I approve of this message. Always a nice tag line.

[Argus]

Ontario Teachers, who are behind the dubiously named "Working Families Coallition" are flouting the law in Ottawa by posting anti-Hudak signs all over the city. City officials are tearing them down as they find them, but a spokesman for the group said on local television last night they're going to continue to post them no matter what anyone says.

http://ottawacitizen.com/news/local-news/0609-elxn-signs

[GostHacked]

I'd say we ban political advertising period. The amount of waste and garbage and litter that happens when all these damn signs are put up.

[Argus]

I'd say we ban political advertising period. The amount of waste and garbage and litter that happens when all these damn signs are put up.

We can't ban election advertising. It's a necessary evil. But we can ban third party interference. In fact, I believe the federal government should extend its current legislation against third party advertising, and political donations to the provincial level.

[GostHacked]

We can't ban election advertising. It's a necessary evil. But we can ban third party interference. In fact, I believe the federal government should extend its current legislation against third party advertising, and political donations to the provincial level.

After thinking about it. I support the 3rd party advertising. They may tell us something that these leaders do not want us to know about.

[Boges]

These Working Families ads are so shitty.

The latest one says Hudak is responsible for job losses. HE ISN'T THE PREMIERE YET!!!

[MiddleClassCentrist]

The thing about union ads is that it tends to be very obvious when they do it. So people can identify the purpose of the ad and understand the context of where it is coming from very easily.

Corporations can do things like astroturf discussions with faulty or misleading studies, make sure articles that favour their view are published in their friendly corporate news, and run programs meant to stifle and bully opposing ideas like Sun News. On an ongoing basis the corporate world/elite spend money shaping the minds of people before the election even happens, without the people even being aware that they have been manipulated. Years before Dalton took on the teachers, editorials all over ontario were attacking banked sick day plans and retirement gratuity to prepare the public battlefield. Only someone who is paying critical attention would know where those messages were coming from and be able to put a value to the credibility of the source.

Unions and the Koch Brothers alike should have be able to spend on informing the public on issues elections with the requirement that they must personally have their names on it so that people know where the message is coming from. Right now, the wealthy elite make sure to create "grass roots" movements that sound credible but are really just fronts so that the wealthy don't have to attach their name to the message. Because if people knew who was sending the message, it would likely backfire.

I favour ads that come from an obvious source, regardless of funding. The union ads obviously come from public sector unions. I don't think that the union ads are working in their favour since they are all doing it. It looks like a public sector beatdown on Hudak and I think that most people would realize the context.

I believe it has backfired if you look at the EKOS polling that started since the launch of most of the ads really hit the airwaves.

Edited June 9, 2014 by MiddleClassCentrist

[Boges]

Except when the Union ads are telling bold face lies.

[MiddleClassCentrist]

Except when the Union ads are telling bold face lies.

So are most corporate sponsored "grass roots" ads and corporate sponsored "news"media.

[waldo]

I'll be surprised if the Liberals win. The polls had the Liberals losing in BC and the PCs losing in Alberta, and those were wrong....the mood in Ontario, from what I can see, is one of change.

with additional polls released, the latest 308 aggregate polling... for you to reject - cause apparently, no polling is worth anything... anymore!

[Boges]

So are most corporate sponsored "grass roots" ads and corporate sponsored "news"media.

You talk all about corporations. Name a corporation that has come out and put money down to advertise for Hudak.

[jacee]

After thinking about it. I support the 3rd party advertising. They may tell us something that these leaders do not want us to know about.

I agree, though with reasonable limits on spending.

.

[overthere]

If the Liberals win, does that mean that Ontarians are happy with their ongoing leadership on the economy?

[Boges]

If the Liberals win, does that mean that Ontarians are happy with their ongoing leadership on the economy?

Or they believe the lies.

What 308 says acknowledged, I can't see how a team that's ahead in the polls can have such a fear-mongering narrative. It's almost like the Troops in the Streets days of Federal Liberals.