sharkman Posted January 15, 2016 Report Posted January 15, 2016 Well, when your leanings are similar to the mindset of this forum, then the rules are applied accordingly. It's too bad, but there you are.
msj Posted January 15, 2016 Report Posted January 15, 2016 Yadda, yadda, yadda, everyone is a troll but me... If a believer demands that I, as a non-believer, observe his taboos in the public domain, he is not asking for my respect but for my submission. And that is incompatible with a secular democracy. Flemming Rose (Dutch journalist) My biggest takeaway from economics is that the past wasn't as good as you remember, the present isn't as bad as you think, and the future will be better than you anticipate. Morgan Housel http://www.fool.com/investing/general/2016/01/14/things-im-pretty-sure-about.aspx
waldo Posted January 15, 2016 Report Posted January 15, 2016 Well, when your leanings are similar to the mindset of this forum, then the rules are applied accordingly. It's too bad, but there you are. what is the 'mindset' of this forum? ... from your perspective.
msj Posted January 15, 2016 Report Posted January 15, 2016 what is the 'mindset' of this forum? ... from your perspective. I'm sure he has responded to you but it has already been deleted by the mods because the mindset is all wrong. If a believer demands that I, as a non-believer, observe his taboos in the public domain, he is not asking for my respect but for my submission. And that is incompatible with a secular democracy. Flemming Rose (Dutch journalist) My biggest takeaway from economics is that the past wasn't as good as you remember, the present isn't as bad as you think, and the future will be better than you anticipate. Morgan Housel http://www.fool.com/investing/general/2016/01/14/things-im-pretty-sure-about.aspx
WestCoastRunner Posted January 15, 2016 Report Posted January 15, 2016 here's a thought: is the "complaining banter" over PMs between the new moderator and a member meaningful to this thread? as for reduced images... potentially moving to no images in threads? What a stooopid decision - imagine that, conveying information by a graphical means! Over the interweeb yet! What a concept. Perhaps someone should lighten up and realize forums have moved beyond the days of modems and BBS' A picture tells a thousand words. I would rather view a graph than read a rambling post that goes on and on and on..... I love to see a young girl go out and grab the world by the lapels. Life's a bitch. You've got to go out and kick ass. - Maya Angelou
waldo Posted February 1, 2016 Report Posted February 1, 2016 per moderator direction in regards to exchanges between many MLW members in this thread: Ok - I appreciate the input but as was pointed out, this is drifting the thread. Please take it to support & questions if you still disagree. re: the interpreted purposeful denigration attaching the generational suffix 'Jr' to Justin Trudeau. The moderator qualification for doing so: The 'Trudeau Jr.' reference was reported in the past, and the moderators decided that it was used in good faith. "Bush Jr." and "Bush Sr." were used as terms here with no complaint - that's the precedent we followed in determining whether this term was pejorative. I'm sorry you don't agree but we do have to rely on past practices for consistency, in order to try to be objective about such things. per wiki (with qualified source attachments there)... other like information is available on through to extensions of usage within a legal context: Generational suffixes are used to distinguish persons who share the same name within a family. A generational suffix can be used informally (for disambiguation purposes, or as nicknames) and is often incorporated in legal documents.In the United States the most common name suffixes are senior and junior, which are written with a capital first letter ("Jr." and "Sr.") with or without an interceding comma. In Britain these are more rare, but when they are used the abbreviations are "Jnr" and "Snr", respectively. The term "junior" is correctly used only if a child's first, middle, and last names are identical to his or her parent's names.Sons with a different middle name or initial may also be called Junior as a nickname (such as in the case of George Walker Bush and his father George Herbert Walker Bush), but unless the names are identical, the Jr. suffix is never used as I pointed out in the thread, in a post now hidden by the moderator, the qualification using the "Bush example" is warranted given like first names of George... it is not warranted in regards the differing first names, Pierre versus Justin. please advise - thanks in advance .
Michael Hardner Posted February 1, 2016 Report Posted February 1, 2016 Well, I didn't realize that the correct use of the term was for cases where the first name also matches. That being what it may be, posters at MLW have asked to continue using the term (albeit incorrectly) and I don't see why we should deny them. The common usage may not be correct but it's also not pejorative. MLW posters may henceforth distinguish themselves grammatically from their unwashed brethren by NOT using 'Trudeau Jr' however they will not be admonished or prevented from doing so since this [common] misuse of the term is in all likelihood not meant to be pejorative. There is such a thing as over-policing in moderation, and when I find myself guessing at motives too much then I consider it over-policing. And as dreary as this topic was, it still registers as one of the more interesting moderating topics so far this year, so for that I thank you Waldo. Click to learn why Climate Change is caused by HUMANS Michael Hardner
Big Guy Posted February 1, 2016 Report Posted February 1, 2016 Perhaps we might refer to JT as ""He-Who-Must-Not-Be-Named". At least that would satisfy those posters who are not too crazy about JT. Note - For those expecting a response from Big Guy: I generally do not read or respond to posts longer then 300 words nor to parsed comments.
waldo Posted February 1, 2016 Report Posted February 1, 2016 (edited) Well, I didn't realize that the correct use of the term was for cases where the first name also matches. That being what it may be, posters at MLW have asked to continue using the term (albeit incorrectly) and I don't see why we should deny them. The common usage may not be correct but it's also not pejorative. MLW posters may henceforth distinguish themselves grammatically from their unwashed brethren by NOT using 'Trudeau Jr' however they will not be admonished or prevented from doing so since this [common] misuse of the term is in all likelihood not meant to be pejorative. There is such a thing as over-policing in moderation, and when I find myself guessing at motives too much then I consider it over-policing. And as dreary as this topic was, it still registers as one of the more interesting moderating topics so far this year, so for that I thank you Waldo. you should "deny" them, as you say... because, as you've been presented, it's improper grammatical usage of the generational suffix... that do extend into legalities of usage. And no, it's not "may not be correct"; it is NOT correct. And you make a blanket assessment that usage... any usage... is not intended pejoratively. And you do so, how? How? please provide the MLW definition of how/when the generational suffixes, Jr. versus Sr., are acceptable, are warranted? . Edited February 1, 2016 by waldo
Michael Hardner Posted February 1, 2016 Report Posted February 1, 2016 IF I have to guess whether it's pejorative then it probably isn't. How do I do so ? That's my art, man. We don't police grammar very often, and rarely police spelling unless it's likely to be misinterpreted as an insult. Click to learn why Climate Change is caused by HUMANS Michael Hardner
waldo Posted February 1, 2016 Report Posted February 1, 2016 IF I have to guess whether it's pejorative then it probably isn't. How do I do so ? That's my art, man. We don't police grammar very often, and rarely police spelling unless it's likely to be misinterpreted as an insult. of course, with attachment/intent, this is not just simply grammar. I bow to your 'art'; however, could you extend upon that art in the interests of full, going forward, understanding and interpretation, to answer the prior posts question posed to you; specifically, again: please provide the MLW definition of how/when the generational suffixes, Jr. versus Sr., are acceptable, are warranted? thanks in advance .
Michael Hardner Posted February 1, 2016 Report Posted February 1, 2016 I defer to common English usage. There are people who come onto MLW who can barely write and we let those posts stand. Unfortunately, bad grammar eventually becomes acceptable if it's abused enough. For example, people often say "There's many" instead of "there are many" and it's never noticed. There are more examples than this, but that's one that makes me clutch my pocket watch and count to ten. I like the idea that I could swoop in and suspend a user for something like an Oxford comma, though. A moderator has got to dream. Click to learn why Climate Change is caused by HUMANS Michael Hardner
BubberMiley Posted February 1, 2016 Report Posted February 1, 2016 But using the oxford comma is the only way to write consistently and clearly all the time. You can't list the provinces from West to East without ambiguity unless you use the oxford comma. Therefore, you should always use it to be consistent. "I think it's fun watching the waldick get all excited/knickers in a knot over something." -scribblet
waldo Posted February 1, 2016 Report Posted February 1, 2016 I like the idea that I could swoop in and suspend a user for something like an Oxford comma, though. A moderator has got to dream. well... that's certainly drift! In any case, I must accept that you refuse to answer the question put to you (twice now) and this becomes just another undefined usage construct within MLW; apparently, now relegated to the catch all "subjective assessment". You know, like the MIA usage definition for trolling and related interpretations of same... the definition that members have given up asking for. it's not a hard thing to say one is wrong and to reverse an incorrect decision made... if that ever happens to me, I'm sure I'll do the right thing! .
Guest Posted February 1, 2016 Report Posted February 1, 2016 Unfortunately, bad grammar eventually becomes acceptable if it's abused enough. For example, people often say "There's many" instead of "there are many" and it's never noticed. I would of reported that.
Michael Hardner Posted February 1, 2016 Report Posted February 1, 2016 it's not a hard thing to say one is wrong and to reverse an incorrect decision made... if that ever happens to me, I'm sure I'll do the right thing! No, I'm not refusing to answer - I'm answering clearly: We will not enforce grammar rules on MLW. Click to learn why Climate Change is caused by HUMANS Michael Hardner
bush_cheney2004 Posted February 1, 2016 Report Posted February 1, 2016 It's not grammar rules..."Jr." is a generational suffix. Please argue this point using the correct nomenclature. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Suffix_%28name%29#Generational_titles https://docs.oracle.com/cd/E19509-01/820-2652/6ne872nq9/index.html#ahgdp Economics trumps Virtue.
WestCoastRunner Posted February 1, 2016 Report Posted February 1, 2016 What's interesting is that posters who use 'Jr' are supporters of Harper. Hmmmmm. Nothing derogatory there, no sirreee. I love to see a young girl go out and grab the world by the lapels. Life's a bitch. You've got to go out and kick ass. - Maya Angelou
Guest Posted February 1, 2016 Report Posted February 1, 2016 What's interesting is that posters who use 'Jr' are supporters of Harper. Hmmmmm. Nothing derogatory there, no sirreee. I use "Boy Wonder". Because I don't want there to be any doubt when I'm being derogatory.
Michael Hardner Posted February 1, 2016 Report Posted February 1, 2016 If you use 'Boy Wonder' your post will be hidden and you could be given a dressing-down. Click to learn why Climate Change is caused by HUMANS Michael Hardner
Guest Posted February 1, 2016 Report Posted February 1, 2016 If you use 'Boy Wonder' your post will be hidden and you could be given a dressing-down. Okay, I won't. Please disregard my last post...
Guest Posted February 1, 2016 Report Posted February 1, 2016 If you use 'Boy Wonder' your post will be hidden and you could be given a dressing-down. Just a question. Being derogatory towards politicians can't be against the rules, based on many posts on here, so what terms can one use for JT?
bush_cheney2004 Posted February 1, 2016 Report Posted February 1, 2016 Just a question. Being derogatory towards politicians can't be against the rules, based on many posts on here, so what terms can one use for JT? That's a good question....Prime Minister Harper and President George W. Bush were not afforded any such respect for derogatory terms/names. So what has changed because of Justin Trudeau ? Economics trumps Virtue.
Bob Macadoo Posted February 1, 2016 Report Posted February 1, 2016 That's a good question....Prime Minister Harper and President George W. Bush were not afforded any such respect for derogatory terms/names. So what has changed because of Justin Trudeau ? I have no problem using derogatory terms for 3rd persons not members on this site, I do find it ingenuous that "Junior" is not easily identified as derogatory with respect to Trudeau for our esteemed Junior Moderator.....or is that neophyte.......maybe its diminuitive too.
Guest Posted February 1, 2016 Report Posted February 1, 2016 That's a good question....Prime Minister Harper and President George W. Bush were not afforded any such respect for derogatory terms/names. So what has changed because of Justin Trudeau ? Exactly. I can't imagine what kind of hold Mr. Trudeau has on the team here. The same as he has on the CBC maybe? I wonder what it is...
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