Finance Minister Jim Flaherty Resigns

[PIK]

Again what are you talking about? Canada never paid off its debt and isn't about to. It's over $600B.

The deficit, don't play stupid ,you knew what I was talking about.

You need to learn the difference between

Debt

and

Deficit

And quite Frankly, the Conservative Record while in office is nothing to write home about considering it ran the highest defict in Canadian History, while at the same time , very successful in massaging their message of good fiscal governance.

and 2015 is not here yet.... lets see where we are at when the numbers roll in. It may be their first balanced budget, it may not..

That is what I an trying to find out, the highest defict ever and paid down in 6 yrs and how long did the liberals take to pay down the last smaller one ,while in good times. 10-13yrs??

[Smallc]

Then, if you're talking about the deficit, it took the Liberals something in the order of 4 years.

[The_Squid]

Canada's economy, from stateside, looks healthier than it did during the last three decades of the last century.

Cite please.... What economic measures are you talking about?

[Moonlight Graham]

For a politician, Flaherty seemed like a decent sort of guy, probably the CPC member I could stomach the most, so this is a big loss for the CPC.

However, IMO Flaherty was overrated as a Finance Minister. He didn't, nor did the CPC, put in place the banking regulations etc that helped save our economy from further disaster during this last recession. People see that Canada weathered the recession well and and say "wow, Harper/Flaherty are good at handling the economy!" Meanwhile, if you ask people what anyone in the Harper government did differently that made Canada weather the recession well most people can't give an answer. It's kind of like calling Phil Jackson the greatest basketball coach when he's always got players like Michael Jordan, Scottie Pippen, Shaq, and Kobe Byrant on his teams.

But hey, sometimes you have to give people credit for not screwing things up when they're dealt a good hand.

Edited March 19, 2014 by Moonlight Graham

[The_Squid]

For a politician, Flaherty seemed like a decent sort of guy, probably the CPC member I could stomach the most, so this is a big loss for the CPC.

However, IMO Flaherty was overrated as a Finance Minister. He didn't, nor did the CPC, put in place the banking regulations etc that helped save our economy from further disaster during this last recession. People see that Canada weathered the recession well and and say "wow, Harper/Flaherty are good at handling the economy!" Meanwhile, if you ask people what anyone in the Harper government did differently that made Canada weather the recession well most people can't give an answer. It's kind of like calling Phil Jackson the greatest basketball coach when he's always got players like Michael Jordan, Scottie Pippen, Shaq, and Kobe Byrant on his teams.

But hey, sometimes you have to give people credit for not screwing things up when they're dealt a good hand.

It was Liberal policies from the previous governments that weathered the financial storm. Canada would have actually done even better if it weren't for some bad decisions from this government, like the GST cut...

[PIK]

Alot of people liked that cut, without it we would be paying 2% more on heating bills??? I would like to see hudak come out with at least taking the HST off of hydro bills and other heating bills.

Edited March 19, 2014 by PIK

[The_Squid]

Alot of people liked that cut, without it we would be paying 2% more on heating bills??? I would like to see hudak come out with at least taking the HST off of hydro bills and other heating bills.

Just because some people liked it doesn't mean that it's good economic policy. I'd like to pay no taxes.... But that's crappy policy.

[Topaz]

The one person who could be putting himself between a rock and a hard place is the new minister of natural resources. Since he is from the northern Ontario, if his constituents want him to do one thing and the PM doesn't agree, which way will he go and peeve off the people, and he won't return in 2015. I'm not sure if another MP has been in this kind of situation before.

[Smallc]

Every MP is in that kind of situation, quite regularly.

[ReeferMadness]

Goodbye Flaherty, hello Oliver. Who cares? Nothing changes until Harper leaves. The whole party is a one man show and even the cabinet ministers are nobodies.

[On Guard for Thee]

Just because some people liked it doesn't mean that it's good economic policy. I'd like to pay no taxes.... But that's crappy policy.

And when the final tally is in, I bet we find that once again a conservative government, who prattlles on about "good fiscal management" will be shown to have accomplished anything but. Just look at the numbers they got handed from Martin in '06 and the numbers now. And don't be foo;ed by a balanced budget, look at the debt.

[jbg]

Goodbye Flaherty, hello Oliver. Who cares? Nothing changes until Harper leaves. The whole party is a one man show and even the cabinet ministers are nobodies.

Pierre Trudeau used to say that all Parliamentarians were nobodies 300 yards (before he came up with metrics) from Parliament Hill. So is Cabinet Ministers' lack of real discretion anything new?

[BC_chick]

And when the final tally is in, I bet we find that once again a conservative government, who prattlles on about "good fiscal management" will be shown to have accomplished anything but. Just look at the numbers they got handed from Martin in '06 and the numbers now. And don't be foo;ed by a balanced budget, look at the debt.

But but but... a Liberal government would've done worse so they're better than governments that never were! Lamest excuse ever, not mention ridiculously moot. I can't believe seemingly intelligent people actually mention that as an argument.

The fact remains that in this universe (not a parallel one that never existed) they were given a balanced budget by the LPC and they are leaving 10 years later with a debt that my daughter will be paying for the rest of her life.

[Argus]

Alot of people liked that cut, without it we would be paying 2% more on heating bills??? I would like to see hudak come out with at least taking the HST off of hydro bills and other heating bills.

Ontario can't afford tax cuts at this time.

[Argus]

But but but... a Liberal government would've done worse so they're better than governments that never were! Lamest excuse ever, not mention ridiculously moot. I can't believe seemingly intelligent people actually mention that as an argument.

Why? Choosing one part over another is only good insofar as one is better than another. If you criticize the tories for what they did even while supporting another party which would have done the same then... well, why would you? It's not like we have any doubt about the plans of the Liberals for their campaign promises were extremely expensive and they demanded huge economic incentives be offered up.

The fact remains that in this universe (not a parallel one that never existed) they were given a balanced budget by the LPC and they are leaving 10 years later with a debt that my daughter will be paying for the rest of her life.

You make it sound like there wasn't an enormous debt when they took over. There was. You also neglect the fact the worst recession in a generation screwed up government finances by now only depriving them of income but increasing their social welfare payouts. People seem to forget the Liberals had huge budgetary deficits for their first few years. What happened then? The worldwide recession ended, that's what happened then.

[On Guard for Thee]

How come Harper is hiding Joe Oliver I wonder?

[PIK]

Goodbye Flaherty, hello Oliver. Who cares? Nothing changes until Harper leaves. The whole party is a one man show and even the cabinet ministers are nobodies.

And if trudeau gets in we will have no idea who is making up policy, becuse it won't be trudeau. As he always says he will defer to the experts. lol

[hitops]

There are huge differences between deficit pay-down today and during the 90's. Back then, everybody was doing well, it was almost impossible to have a bad economy and basically every country in the western world did well in that category, no matter who was in power. This time, we are pretty much the only country with good performance. That's a huge and very important difference.

Flaherty was overall fairly good, but I think his management of mortgage rules almost totally eliminates all the good. There is no larger threat to Canadian's today than the housing bubble, which is a directly result of Flaherty. Allowing 40-year, 0% down mortgages to be covered by the CMHC allowed for fake prosperity, was the most foolish long-term financial srategy in modern memory, and is now a looming disaster for a huge number of people. This was a lefty, social-engineering type strategy that is about to, predictably, backfire.

Edited March 21, 2014 by hitops

[WWWTT]

Flaherty is one of the best financial ministers we've had. It was the opposition when a minority gov't who demanded they spend more and more

http://fullcomment.nationalpost.com/2014/03/18/john-ivison-jim-flaherty-leaves-his-successor-a-budget-thats-the-envy-of-the-g7/

Whoever gets the job, they should raise a glass of Jameson’s to Whitby, Ont.’s most famous descendant of the ferocious O’Flaherty’s of Galway.

The new finance minister will inherit a budget on the brink of balance; the lowest business tax rates in the G7; a securities regulation regime that finally looks like it may consolidate; and a number of innovative and popular savings initiatives like the Tax Free Savings Account.

Mr. Flaherty put a distinctive mark on the way the tax system treats disabled people, and those that care for them — a personal cause driven by his own experience as the father of a son with developmental challenges.

But it was his role in the global financial crisis that was perhaps his finest hour

Cite please.... What economic measures are you talking about?

http://www.pressprogress.ca/en/post/whats-all-praise-jim-flahertys-record

Here you go!

As far as I'm concerned, this joker/clown/escape artist is leaving while the getting is good (or something like that)!

Soon enough we're all going to find out how big of a bumbler this guy really is.

It seems like there's always another conservative retiring, sounds like the rats are jumping after setting the boat on fire!

Good riddance!

WWWTT

[overthere]

The fact remains that in this universe (not a parallel one that never existed) they were given a balanced budget by the LPC and they are leaving 10 years later with a debt that my daughter will be paying for the rest of her life.

another one who doesn't know the difference between debt and deficit.

It was Liberal policies from the previous governments that weathered the financial storm.

Yeah, Harper failed miserably in not continuing the policy of giving hundreds of millions of dollars to Montreal ad agencies. They've really suffered in the last few years. What a bastard

Edited March 22, 2014 by overthere

[BC_chick]

another one who doesn't know the difference between debt and deficit.

You're right, my wording was very unclear while I was actually talking about both. The Liberals paid down the debt with surplus after surplus and while the CPC came in with the same idea that policy went out the window and the debt mushroomed after so many straights deficits.

And I stand by what I say - you can't compare it to a government that didn't exist. Their record speaks only for itself.

Flaherty was overall fairly good, but I think his management of mortgage rules almost totally eliminates all the good. There is no larger threat to Canadian's today than the housing bubble, which is a directly result of Flaherty. Allowing 40-year, 0% down mortgages to be covered by the CMHC allowed for fake prosperity, was the most foolish long-term financial srategy in modern memory, and is now a looming disaster for a huge number of people. This was a lefty, social-engineering type strategy that is about to, predictably, backfire.

This is where I'd go as far as saying the only reason we've had an ok economy is *because* of the housing market and all the productivity that has gone into development and purchase. It's smoke and mirrors, they just prolonged the inevitable and it's going to hurt worse, way worse, than in would've had they just let the full correction happen in 09 the way most of the world experienced the era.

I would have lost half the equity in my condo, but I still think we'd be in a better place as a country than we are today with this mess of a housing market. I really do.

[BC_chick]

Why? Choosing one part over another is only good insofar as one is better than another. If you criticize the tories for what they did even while supporting another party which would have done the same then... well, why would you? It's not like we have any doubt about the plans of the Liberals for their campaign promises were extremely expensive and they demanded huge economic incentives be offered up.

You make it sound like there wasn't an enormous debt when they took over. There was. You also neglect the fact the worst recession in a generation screwed up government finances by now only depriving them of income but increasing their social welfare payouts. People seem to forget the Liberals had huge budgetary deficits for their first few years. What happened then? The worldwide recession ended, that's what happened then.

As I explained in another post, the LPC paid down the debt with surpluses. CPC brought it back to early to mid-nineties levels.

And I do agree it's been a difficult era. I think Obama is going through a lot of the same thing in the sense that both were given a tough hand with their timing (yet you'd never have a Republican admit that about Obama), but I do think in spite of it all, Canada did not do as great as the CPC would have us believe.

You and I had this discussion already. We live in a two-tier system now where people who weren't in the housing market 10 years ago can no longer afford. This is not a real economy. It's shaky and we've been losing out manufacturing sector to real estate and development. It's a disaster waiting to happen. Spain anyone?

[Topaz]

Before the Tories, the Liberals left a surplus, after paying down 40 Billion, which is very lucky for the Tories because what would they have done with no surplus and additional debt besides the debt they created? So the Tories took the surplus and sis what with it and then created more debt by spending it where? Was it by reducing the GST? Now it seems to me, that when the Liberals did their thing with the finances there were complaints but not as many as there are now because Harper has hurt many middle-class Canadians and probably higher earners with the interest income tax. The Tories have also hit the military which they even complained about. I think Flaherty was ok but not as great as the Tories make him out to be but I do agree with him on the income splitting and having Harper as a boss can't be easy.

[cybercoma]

Flaherty is one of the best financial ministers we've had.

He destroyed federal revenues, then proceeded to give tax credits and breaks to the wealthy. Now they're complaining that there's no money for federal services, but they continue to draft expensive "Tough on Crime" legislation and buy military hardware like it's going out of style. Those things may not be so bad, but he's also spent billions on trumped up ceremonies and commemorative sites. I live in New Brunswick and they built an entire new and completely unnecessary facility for Oceans and Fisheries, despite gutting the Act a couple budgets ago. One of the best finance ministers we've ever had? Not even close.

[cybercoma]

Well he was forced to spend waaay to much by the opp

Forced by the opposition? Sorry you don't like the way Responsible Government works. Here's a link explaining what responsible government is, since I'm not confident you have any idea how parliament operates.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Responsible_government