Syrian Civil War

[dre]

And the next dictator will also get away with nerve gas...and perhaps an EMP weapon...or even a full blown thermonuclear weapon. Where's that 'red line' now?

There never WAS a redline. The use of chemical weapons has never resulted in any real enforcement action by the international community.

[DogOnPorch]

There never WAS a redline. The use of chemical weapons has never resulted in any real enforcement action by the international community.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chemical_Weapons_Convention

We have the convention and the non-signatories. And you're correct: No enforcement...so throw that convention away. All this just shows that any previous efforts were for nothing. A non-signer getting away with a nerve gas attack isn't going to compel others hold to their promises. Quite the opposite.

[-TSS-]

I dunno, both the republican and democrat parties have a long tradition of tolerating or even sponsoring semi-secular dictators like Assad, Hussien, Mubarak, etc

The US wants someone they can make a deal with. When Hussein was that guy it didnt matter how he treated his own people.

You're right on this one. Like the US used to deal with some ruthless Central-American dictators by describing them as that they are pigs but they are our pigs.

[dre]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chemical_Weapons_Convention

We have the convention and the non-signatories. And you're correct: No enforcement...so throw that convention away. All this just shows that any previous efforts were for nothing. A non-signer getting away with a nerve gas attack isn't going to compel others hold to their promises. Quite the opposite.

Like I said there was no scenario where he WASNT going to "get away with it". Even proponents of a military strike did not want to remove Assad.

Based on what Im reading, Syria will have to hand over its facilities, all of its chemicals, precursors, and binary elements, and sign the Chem Weapons convention. Like I said, theres no perfect solution, but this acheives way more than the other options on the table so far.

[DogOnPorch]

Like I said there was no scenario where he WASNT going to "get away with it". Even proponents of a military strike did not want to remove Assad.

Based on what Im reading, Syria will have to hand over its facilities, all of its chemicals, precursors, and binary elements, and sign the Chem Weapons convention. Like I said, theres no perfect solution, but this acheives way more than the other options on the table so far.

Or else what? Syria will do something token for the cameras. Obama will give a sigh of relief...the war will continue.

[GostHacked]

Have we seen this so called evidence yet? Why not?

[Moonlight Graham]

Frankly, I find the Obama administration to be very naive. It's almost like it wasn't fully briefed on the Middle East situation. If they were briefed...well...OMG...lol.

Why are they naïve?

Their position on this offer is the same as John McCain remarked, which is that the US needs to be very suspicious and skeptical of this offer but that it still must be explored.

[Shady]

Human Rights Watch is confirming Syria's use if chemical weapons.

http://m.theglobeandmail.com/news/world/human-rights-watch-says-evidence-suggests-syrian-regime-troops-behind-alleged-chemical-attack/article14212955/?service=mobile

[GostHacked]

Human Rights Watch is confirming Syria's use if chemical weapons.

http://m.theglobeandmail.com/news/world/human-rights-watch-says-evidence-suggests-syrian-regime-troops-behind-alleged-chemical-attack/article14212955/?service=mobile

Strongly suggests, and may have been sarin .. not exactly slam dunk stuff.

[DogOnPorch]

Why are they naïve?

Their position on this offer is the same as John McCain remarked, which is that the US needs to be very suspicious and skeptical of this offer but that it still must be explored.

The mere suggestion that Israel retreat to the 1967 Six Day War start lines thus granting the Arabs the 'do-over' scenario shows incredible naivety about the Middle East. I imagine Israel will do that the day the US gives Texas over to the Mexicans. But, hey...he went and said it anyways.

[DogOnPorch]

Strongly suggests, and may have been sarin .. not exactly slam dunk stuff.

There is a chance that, like the "Palestinians" and their various "massacres", we're just seeing the Pallywood scenario on a grand scale. Green helmets, anyone?

[GostHacked]

There is a chance that, like the "Palestinians" and their various "massacres", we're just seeing the Pallywood scenario on a grand scale. Green helmets, anyone?

Hmm thought we were talking about Syria here.

Edited September 10, 2013 by GostHacked

[DogOnPorch]

Hmm thought we were talking about Syria here.

Hmmmm...must you always be led by the hand?

Hezbollah is active in Syria. They regularly put on fake casualty shows. So, there is that chance that this event was faked. I'm not saying it WAS faked. Just there's a percentage chance that it was faked due to those involved in the affair. Hezbollah are liars, murderers and terrorists. I wouldn't put it past them or a few other groups on both sides of the Syrian Civil War.

[GostHacked]

Hmmmm...must you always be led by the hand?

Hezbollah is active in Syria. They regularly put on fake casualty shows. So, there is that chance that this event was faked. I'm not saying it WAS faked. Just there's a percentage chance that it was faked due to those involved in the affair. Hezbollah are liars, murderers and terrorists. I wouldn't put it past them or a few other groups on both sides of the Syrian Civil War.

So you jumped from Palestinians to Hezbollah.

[DogOnPorch]

So you jumped from Palestinians to Hezbollah.

They're all the same thing with cute names.

[Argus]

What exactly is 'soft bigotry' ?

Pretty obvious from my last post. It's okay for a British company to sell this stuff to Canada or Spain, say, but if Syria or Botswana or some other third world country wants it the companies are supposed to go "Whoah there, lil fellah. I'm not sure you can be trusted with this sort of stuff. You run off and play now."

Kind of like when some fourteen year old tries to buy cigarettes. He's not mature enough, you see. We have to oversee him because we know he won't make good choices.

And that's okay, except we don't let the fourteen year old vote either.

Edited September 10, 2013 by Argus

[dre]

They're all the same thing with cute names.

Only to you because youre an ethnocentric zealot that hates them all. In the real world though these groups are not the same at all.

[sharkman]

So you bring out the school yard name calling? Okay. I know you are but what am I?

[DogOnPorch]

Only to you because youre an ethnocentric zealot that hates them all. In the real world though these groups are not the same at all.

In the real world, all these groups are known as Arabs. Yasser Arafat was born in Cairo yet managed to be King of the Palestinians. It's called Pan-Arabism and you can believe that I dreamed it up if you wish.

[dre]

So you bring out the school yard name calling? Okay. I know you are but what am I?

Its not namecalling, in fact I doubt he would even deny it. He is by definition ethnocentric. He openly and proudly favors a different outcome for one group VS another based on their ethnicity. And he gets so excited about it, that zealous fits pretty well.

[DogOnPorch]

So you bring out the school yard name calling? Okay. I know you are but what am I?

Apparently dre has not heard of the Arab League.

[DogOnPorch]

Its not namecalling, in fact I doubt he would even deny it. He is by definition ethnocentric. He openly and proudly favors a different outcome for one group VS another based on their ethnicity. And he gets so excited about it, that zealous fits pretty well.

Sure it is. It's rather childish...but I suspect you've had a few tonight to make you go so far as to actually resort to name-calling. That's a defense I can accept.

[dre]

In the real world, all these groups are known as Arabs. Yasser Arafat was born in Cairo yet managed to be King of the Palestinians. It's called Pan-Arabism and you can believe that I dreamed it up if you wish.

This is just a strawman. I never said you dreamed pan-arabism up, I said you are zealous and ethnocentric, and perfectly happy to paint millions of people with a very broad brush based on their ethnicity.

Like I said in the other thread, this is nothing more than garden variety racism. You even throw out the classic terminology like "they have different names but they are all the same".

Never mind the fact that the term "palestinian" is describes a people that have lived in the west bank for the last century and Hezzbolah represents lebanese shia and was created in response to the 1982 invasion of Lebanon by Israel.

Theyre all the same! Just a bunch of n__g_rs!

Edited September 11, 2013 by dre

[DogOnPorch]

This is just a strawman. I never said you dreamed pan-arabism up, I said you are zealous and ethnocentric, and perfectly happy to paint millions of people with a very broad brush based on their ethnicity.

Like I said in the other thread, this is nothing more than garden variety racism. You even throw out the classic terminology like "they have different names but they are all the same".

Never mind the fact that the term "palestinian" is describtes a people that have lived in the west bank for the last century and Hezzbolah represents lebanese shia and was created in response to the 1982 invasion of Lebanon by Israel.

Theyre all the same! Just a bunch of n__g_rs!

Have another drink.

[dre]

Have another drink.

Actually im at work right now until 1AM but after that I just might take your advice