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It is exactly because you are talking about the entire NFL player data domain that member Shady would still technically be correct, irrespective of player combines. Assuming a normal distribution for player speed in both the NFL and CFL, there would indeed be more faster (and slower) NFL players.

But the only "proof" Shady has offered is combine results which only account for a certain, small group of players. An unproven sample certainly is not technically correct on any level. And means nothing when talking about actual averages. So as a proof it goes out the window.

Now if there are some faster players in the NFL than the CFL, I could agree. If there are some bigger players in the NFL, I could agree and even agree that there are some stronger players. Sure.

But "some" does not equate to "better" especially when there is a significant difference in the rules at play.

And I like both equally well. :)

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But the only "proof" Shady has offered is combine results which only account for a certain, small group of players. An unproven sample certainly is not technically correct on any level. And means nothing when talking about actual averages. So as a proof it goes out the window.

Doesn't matter....Shady is still correct for players in the aggregate, and can point to player combines for the purpose of evaluating raw player skills at the outset of what will eventually be these same player careers.

Now if there are some faster players in the NFL than the CFL, I could agree. If there are some bigger players in the NFL, I could agree and even agree that there are some stronger players. Sure.

There are all three in the NFL....bigger...faster...stronger....and more of them.

But "some" does not equate to "better" especially when there is a significant difference in the rules at play.

Better is a subjective term until criteria are established. The owners, players, coaches, and advertisers have certainly made this professional decision already.

And I like both equally well. :)

Yet players and coaches certainly express an unequal preference.

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For me the difference between the CFL and the other one is familiarity.

I grew up with the Als.

I learned to love the Argos

I enjoyed the rough riders

I enjoyed the roughriders....

I know where every city is...

I have met over the years many CFL players...my old friend has 2 Grey Cup rings..

I would no more compare the two north american leagues than i would compare 2 women in the presence of my wife...

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For me the difference between the CFL and the other one is familiarity.

;) Maybe.

Guarantee, though, if I'm channel-flipping and come across a CFL game, I'll almost certainly watch it, but if it's NFL (or any permutation of the 4 down, little field game) I'll even more certainly keep on flipping.

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For me the difference between the CFL and the other one is familiarity.

I grew up with the Als.

I learned to love the Argos

I enjoyed the rough riders

I enjoyed the roughriders....

I know where every city is...

I have met over the years many CFL players...my old friend has 2 Grey Cup rings..

I would no more compare the two north american leagues than i would compare 2 women in the presence of my wife...

Why would you want to learn to love the Argos??

That's like acquiring a taste for pus???

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Doesn't matter....Shady is still correct for players in the aggregate, and can point to player combines for the purpose of evaluating raw player skills at the outset of what will eventually be these same player careers.

An unproven sample hardly - and I can't over-emphasize this enough because of the veterans in the leagues - reflects reality. Raw player skills - aggregate or not - simply does not reflect on the league overall and does not account for the disparity between "raw" test results and actual game conditions.

Otherwise, using that kind of logic, you can base the performance of an air force on the physical fitness tests of unproven recruits. Come on now...

There are all three in the NFL....bigger...faster...stronger....and more of them.

Does not equate to "better."

Better is a subjective term until criteria are established. The owners, players, coaches, and advertisers have certainly made this professional decision already.

Then I challenge you - despite what the owners, players, coaches and advertisers have decided - to find that criteria. I am betting you can't. In fact, I know you can't.

Yet players and coaches certainly express an unequal preference.

So does the pay. But you still haven't established any actual criteria, just your humble opinion.

The fact here is that I like both equally well. Which is all that can be said isn't it?

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Actually, Clarrett had bad combine numbers. So there isn't much to explain. Leaf and Leinart weren't really that spectacular either. What, the CFL hasn't had draft busts? Especially at QB? Nice try my friend.

Two actually off the top of my head...Undrafted,but came up with "great credentials" from the NFL...

The aforementioned Vince Ferragammo,who quarterbacked the LA Rams to the Super Bowl in '79...I doubt you were alive to see that one...

And Tim Rosenbach,from the Arizona Cardinals,in Hamilton in '94...

Complete and total busts...Neither could figure out the extra man...

As for Leaf and Leinart..They were both highly drafted and,in Leaf's case,higher than Peyton Manning..

So much for "Combine Science"...

Edited by Jack Weber
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You guys are acting like there are CFL player and NFL player like there are MLS player and EPL players.

Any football player would try to make it in the big leagues first. Every player in the CFL, I'd imagine either went undrafted or cut by an NFL team.

Warren Moon, Doug Flutie and Cameron Wake. All three are legendary CFL players that later made it to the NFL and made an impact. But first they tried it in the NFL and initially failed. (You could argue Warren Moon's failure was race related)

The NFL sees the CFL as a feeder league. Why do you think the NFL Network shows 2 CFL games a week in the US?

This thread is about the style or either league. I've seen some great plays from CFL players. The style just isn't as interesting to me. But I'm going to try this year to give the CFL as much attention as I do NCAA and NFL fooseball.

Edited by Boges
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You guys are acting like...

It's an opinion thread (i.e. "sucks") we get that. But it's a fun one. :)

Heck, I prefer watching good college games over some NFL games. Rams versus Seahawks? Bleh. To me the CFL is more like the college style of play, a little more wide open and little quicker in play.

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It's an opinion thread (i.e. "sucks") we get that. But it's a fun one. :)

Heck, I prefer watching good college games over some NFL games. Rams versus Seahawks? Bleh. To me the CFL is more like the college style of play, a little more wide open and little quicker in play.

I made that point previously.

I like the term "Pro-Style". I find it a more appealing style to me.

You could argue CFL players aren't "Pro-Style" players even though the CFL is a pro league.

Chad Henne is a Pro-Style QB, Tim Tebow isn't really.

Edited by Boges
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I made that point previously.

I like the term "Pro-Style". I find it a more appealing style to me.

You could argue CFL players aren't "Pro-Style" players even though the CFL is a pro league.

Chad Henne is a Pro-Style QB, Tim Tebow isn't really.

The CFL is a pro league so "Pro-Style" doesn't work for me much. A metaphor is a substitute designed to signify a like-concept, not replace it entirely. It would equally true to me to say that I like the good college ball because it is like the CFL style.

Then again I like the northern style better than the southern style. If you know what I mean. :D

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The CFL is a pro league so "Pro-Style" doesn't work for me much. A metaphor is a substitute designed to signify a like-concept, not replace it entirely. It would equally true to me to say that I like the good college ball because it is like the CFL style.

Then again I like the northern style better than the southern style. If you know what I mean. :D

The "Northern" Style of NCAA Football sucks.

Why do you think an SEC team has won the title since 2006. Before them a Big 12 and Pac 10 team won. The last Little 11 team to win the title was tOSU when the Mo Clarett Luckeyes beat the U. They're called the Luckeyes cuz a PI flag was thrown a half an hour after the play in OT.

See I can talk US football in a much more informed manor than CFL.

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Compared to this league, NFL and the CFL are hideous.

http://www.lflus.com/

Krista Ford will hit the football field this fall as captain of the Toronto Triumph, the first official Lingerie Football League team in Canada.

The 20-year-old niece of Toronto Mayor Rob Ford will play middle linebacker for the team.

The Lingerie Football League brands itself as a fan-driven sport offering “action, impact and beauty,” and already has 11 teams in the United States. Ms. Ford’s team will compete in the league’s eastern conference against the Cleveland Crush, Baltimore Charm, Philadelphia Passion, Tampa Breeze and Orlando Fantasy.

http://www.theglobeandmail.com/news/national/toronto/mayors-niece-to-hit-lingerie-field-as-captain/article2087988/

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The "Northern" Style of NCAA Football sucks.

Why do you think an SEC team has won the title since 2006. Before them a Big 12 and Pac 10 team won. The last Little 11 team to win the title was tOSU when the Mo Clarett Luckeyes beat the U. They're called the Luckeyes cuz a PI flag was thrown a half an hour after the play in OT.

See I can talk US football in a much more informed manor than CFL.

Northern NFL style a la Packers & Steelers...

Northern NCAA ball is taking a breather...

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An unproven sample hardly - and I can't over-emphasize this enough because of the veterans in the leagues - reflects reality. Raw player skills - aggregate or not - simply does not reflect on the league overall and does not account for the disparity between "raw" test results and actual game conditions.

A correlation of combine scores (and other attributes) to higher performance attributes has yet to be undertaken. Doesn't mean it can't be done. It is a logical place to start.

Otherwise, using that kind of logic, you can base the performance of an air force on the physical fitness tests of unproven recruits. Come on now...

Military recruits (and veterans) are screened in just this manner....from pull ups to visual acuity to body mass index.

Does not equate to "better."

Then I challenge you - despite what the owners, players, coaches and advertisers have decided - to find that criteria. I am betting you can't. In fact, I know you can't.

Do you also want me to knock a "D" cell off your shoulder a la Robert Conrad? Such criteria already exist, as do league records.

So does the pay. But you still haven't established any actual criteria, just your humble opinion.

The market's opinion is far greater than mine. NFL revenue and world television audience share is larger than the CFL's.

The fact here is that I like both equally well. Which is all that can be said isn't it?

No, much more can/has been said....by the players themselves.

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A correlation of combine scores (and other attributes) to higher performance attributes has yet to be undertaken. Doesn't mean it can't be done. It is a logical place to start.

It might be, but it hasn't. So it ain't any fact. Just truthiness.

Military recruits (and veterans) are screened in just this manner....from pull ups to visual acuity to body mass index.

Right. But base standards are not a measurement of actual performance. And no, you don't measure the performance of an air force by the physical fitness tests of the potential recruits. You know this as well as anyone.

Do you also want me to knock a "D" cell off your shoulder a la Robert Conrad? Such criteria already exist, as do league records.

Meaningless. Especially league records.

The market's opinion is far greater than mine. NFL revenue and world television audience share is larger than the CFL's.

Which one could say about MacDonald's Big Macs. But Harvey's makes a hammmm-burger, a beautiful thing.

No, much more can/has been said....by the players themselves.

Really? The players themselves have an opinion on which is the better game to watch? Hmmm... you've got me there. :D

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It might be, but it hasn't. So it ain't any fact. Just truthiness.

You don't know this for certain...it is your truthi guess.

Right. But base standards are not a measurement of actual performance. And no, you don't measure the performance of an air force by the physical fitness tests of the potential recruits. You know this as well as anyone.

Since I have actually undergone such fitness testing and medical evaluations (Air Force and Navy), I am happy to tell you that you are wrong. Disqualification for medical and physical performance attributes is not only common, but necessary.

Meaningless. Especially league records.

...or any records by your way of thinking. Others disagree.

Which one could say about MacDonald's Big Macs. But Harvey's makes a hammmm-burger, a beautiful thing.

Establish criteria...measure...and announce the winner. Not so hard...even for burgers.

Really? The players themselves have an opinion on which is the better game to watch? Hmmm... you've got me there. :D

Yes....the players buy more Madden NFL units than...ummm...I'm trying to think of the CFL video game title but it's not available!

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The NFL is great on TV

It is tied with NBA for least interesting major sport on TV.

The production values in the NFL are superb, but the game itself is agonizingly slow. Too much defence and too much 3 yards at a time offence, but worst of all is the interminable, endless wretched bombardment of commercials. Really, it is unwatchable with all those nitwits analyzing every nanosecond of every play.

At least the CFL has so many mistakes that the result is wildly unpredictable and it is possible to remian conscious through the whole telecast.

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Fit tests and med evaluations equal performance?

er....no.

Not even in the US

Yes...especially in the US. There are specific benchmarks and qualifications that must be achieved for recruiting, training, qualifications, and duty status before ever demonstrating "performance". Such criteria have been established over decades of experience and millions of service members and are specifically correlated to performance (and non/poor-performance) for many military specialties (MOS).

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Yes...especially in the US. There are specific benchmarks and qualifications that must be achieved for recruiting, training, qualifications, and duty status before ever demonstrating "performance". Such criteria have been established over decades of experience and millions of service members and are specifically correlated to performance (and non/poor-performance) for many military specialties (MOS).

Yep.....the CF used to require a mile run in 10 minutes from a recruit....x many sit ups in a minute, push ups, chin ups...and so on.

I do remember the feeling I had that if you didn't puke, you weren't really trying

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It is tied with NBA for least interesting major sport on TV.

The production values in the NFL are superb, but the game itself is agonizingly slow. Too much defence and too much 3 yards at a time offence, but worst of all is the interminable, endless wretched bombardment of commercials. Really, it is unwatchable with all those nitwits analyzing every nanosecond of every play.

At least the CFL has so many mistakes that the result is wildly unpredictable and it is possible to remian conscious through the whole telecast.

Wow! You are in the vast minority with that opinion.

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It is tied with NBA for least interesting major sport on TV.

Yet it has some of the highest audience share ratings.

The production values in the NFL are superb, but the game itself is agonizingly slow....

Ah hah....so this is why the CFL has a "faster" paced game...poor production values?

At least the CFL has so many mistakes that the result is wildly unpredictable and it is possible to remian conscious through the whole telecast.

Yes...ESPN (banned in CRTC Canada)...shows CFL highlights and lowlights on a slow day.

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Yes...especially in the US. There are specific benchmarks and qualifications that must be achieved for recruiting, training, qualifications, and duty status before ever demonstrating "performance". Such criteria have been established over decades of experience and millions of service members and are specifically correlated to performance (and non/poor-performance) for many military specialties (MOS).

In other words, fit tests and med evals dont equal performance.

Base standards say one can move on, nothing more.

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