Topaz Posted February 15, 2011 Report Share Posted February 15, 2011 After listening to a radio program on the working poor, I thought I would post it here. One caller said in Australia, minimum wage is $17.00 and there are no tips like for waiters and waitresses. For it to work here, the government could get rid of welfare because it wouldn't be needed, everyone would have get an education of some sort. The money saved from getting rid of welfare could go to help with the increase in wages and the businesses already have the get the benefit from tax cuts. I also think the governments should have more apprenticeships for people out there that lose their jobs. Do you think something along these lines to work in Canada? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Oleg Bach Posted February 15, 2011 Report Share Posted February 15, 2011 After listening to a radio program on the working poor, I thought I would post it here. One caller said in Australia, minimum wage is $17.00 and there are no tips like for waiters and waitresses. For it to work here, the government could get rid of welfare because it wouldn't be needed, everyone would have get an education of some sort. The money saved from getting rid of welfare could go to help with the increase in wages and the businesses already have the get the benefit from tax cuts. I also think the governments should have more apprenticeships for people out there that lose their jobs. Do you think something along these lines to work in Canada? Nice if you could go back 25 years to the Jane and Finch corridor and NOT run off all the fathers in order that the mothers of their children could get subsidised...it was a mistake - Now you have these young ruthless men packing heat...failed plan and very sexist - not to mention racist ...I could see some big buisness guy in the old days who effected social policy..."No big penised black guy is going to have kids and NOT work in one of my companies breathing fumes"... Wefare is the poverty industry - there are a million bureacrats who are totally dependant on the poor to surive - what are you going to do with them if you solve the so-called welfare problem...we live in a slave state --- you have to literally pay for your freedom everyday - and once in a while they release a token slave by letting them win the lottery ...The whole system is oppressive - and if you are on welfare long enough - trying to love on less that 7000 dollars a year ...if you are not nuts to begin with then in time you will be harrassed out of your mind.. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cybercoma Posted February 15, 2011 Report Share Posted February 15, 2011 After listening to a radio program on the working poor, I thought I would post it here. One caller said in Australia, minimum wage is $17.00 and there are no tips like for waiters and waitresses. For it to work here, the government could get rid of welfare because it wouldn't be needed, everyone would have get an education of some sort. The money saved from getting rid of welfare could go to help with the increase in wages and the businesses already have the get the benefit from tax cuts. I also think the governments should have more apprenticeships for people out there that lose their jobs. Do you think something along these lines to work in Canada? How does $17/hr min. wage, eliminating welfare and forcing people to get an education "of some sort" create jobs? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bonam Posted February 15, 2011 Report Share Posted February 15, 2011 After listening to a radio program on the working poor, I thought I would post it here. One caller said in Australia, minimum wage is $17.00 and there are no tips like for waiters and waitresses. For it to work here, the government could get rid of welfare because it wouldn't be needed, everyone would have get an education of some sort. The money saved from getting rid of welfare could go to help with the increase in wages and the businesses already have the get the benefit from tax cuts. I also think the governments should have more apprenticeships for people out there that lose their jobs. Do you think something along these lines to work in Canada? If you raise minimum wage to $17.00, everything will cost much more. Whether it's products in a store, food in a restaurant, etc (since the people working there will now cost much more). Basically, it would cause massive inflation overnight, and the people now making $17.00 would be hardly better off than they were at the old minimum wage. Meanwhile, all the people making say $20-$30 an hour would effectively be made poor. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
punked Posted February 15, 2011 Report Share Posted February 15, 2011 If you raise minimum wage to $17.00, everything will cost much more. Whether it's products in a store, food in a restaurant, etc (since the people working there will now cost much more). Basically, it would cause massive inflation overnight, and the people now making $17.00 would be hardly better off than they were at the old minimum wage. Meanwhile, all the people making say $20-$30 an hour would effectively be made poor. They really wouldn't because the people making 20-30 dollars and hour would demand more or they would leave their jobs to take a much easier job which pays about the same amount. They don't earn 20-30 dollars because that is what they are worth they earn because they are "worth" twice as much an hour then someone working at Tim Hortons. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bonam Posted February 15, 2011 Report Share Posted February 15, 2011 They really wouldn't because the people making 20-30 dollars and hour would demand more or they would leave their jobs to take a much easier job which pays about the same amount. They don't earn 20-30 dollars because that is what they are worth they earn because they are "worth" twice as much an hour then someone working at Tim Hortons. Well, it would take a long time for all such raises to take place, a very long time, unlike the doubling of minimum wage which would happen on a specific date set by the government. Also, if you are correct, all that would happen as a result of this increase in minimum wage is that everything would be twice as expensive, everyone would earn twice as much money, and we'd be exactly back where we started, except our dollar would be worth half as much as it is. I see no particular benefit to this. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Hardner Posted February 15, 2011 Report Share Posted February 15, 2011 And... when are we going to talk about reducing the hours in a work week ? The 40 hour week is an ancient idea, from the early 20th century, I believe. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shady Posted February 15, 2011 Report Share Posted February 15, 2011 And... when are we going to talk about reducing the hours in a work week ? The 40 hour week is an ancient idea, from the early 20th century, I believe. How about we let businesses decide for themselves, on what type of work schedule works best for them? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Hardner Posted February 15, 2011 Report Share Posted February 15, 2011 How about we let businesses decide for themselves, on what type of work schedule works best for them? They don't decide that today - there's a cap at hours per week. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Topaz Posted February 15, 2011 Author Report Share Posted February 15, 2011 For some that say it couldn't be done, it is being done in Australia and the article that I will post said they did over a period of three years, when their economy started to be strong. As far as prices going up, they are going up NOW and the working poor and some lower level middle-class are struggling to pay their bills and put food on the table. For this to work you have to leaders that have compassion for the fellow man. http://english.peopledaily.com.cn/90001/90778/90858/90863/7010903.html Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shady Posted February 16, 2011 Report Share Posted February 16, 2011 They don't decide that today - there's a cap at hours per week. Not really. Anyone can agree to work more hours than the typical 40. Regardless, I don't see the need to make any changes. Despite your claim to know what's best for all businesses, industry, and their employees. On a side note, I think you'd make a great dictator. So far you're all about telling people what kind and type of news they should watch. You're all about telling what type of health care people should have access to. And now you're all about telling businesses and their employees how many hours they should work. I think we have ourselves a forum Mussolini! Ever heard of liberty and freedom? Try and respect is once in a while. :angry: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
guyser Posted February 16, 2011 Report Share Posted February 16, 2011 On a side note, I think you'd make a great dictator. So far you're all about telling people what kind and type of news they should watch. You're all about telling what type of health care people should have access to. He does? I would like to see those posts. And now you're all about telling businesses and their employees how many hours they should work. I think we have ourselves a forum Mussolini! Ever heard of liberty and freedom? Try and respect is once in a while. :angry: Mussolini set the limit in Ontario for number of trucking hours?...Miners...DOmestic workers....shall I go on? So much for liberty and freedom huh? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moonlight Graham Posted February 16, 2011 Report Share Posted February 16, 2011 I wish i were an economist so i could answer these questions. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
August1991 Posted February 16, 2011 Report Share Posted February 16, 2011 From what I can gather, the national minimum wage in Australia is not $17 but $15 per hour. (The Australian dollar is worth slightly less than a Canadian dollar.) I don't know if all workers in Australia are covered by this law. Individual states may have different policies and there are often exceptions. From the first full pay period on or after 1 July 2010 the national minimum wage is $569.90 per week (before tax), or $15 per hour (as rounded to the nearest 10 cents). Before the first full pay period on or after 1 July 2010, employees covered by the national minimum wage were entitled to be paid at least the previous federal minimum wage rate of $543.78 per week or $14.31 per hour (before tax). Link----- Minimum wage law? If the government passed a law making it illegal to buy or sell a car for less than $20,000, the law would have no effect on buyers/sellers of BMWs and Porsches. It is the drivers of an Elantra that would be affected. They wouldn't be able to buy one. ----- If the government wanted to help the working poor, there are better ways to do this than minimum wage laws. Low earned income faces high marginal tax rates in payroll deductions (CPP/EI etc) and other work related expenses. These deductions could be turned into payroll subsidies. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WIP Posted February 16, 2011 Report Share Posted February 16, 2011 If you raise minimum wage to $17.00, everything will cost much more. Whether it's products in a store, food in a restaurant, etc (since the people working there will now cost much more). Basically, it would cause massive inflation overnight, and the people now making $17.00 would be hardly better off than they were at the old minimum wage. Meanwhile, all the people making say $20-$30 an hour would effectively be made poor. Whatever the minimum wage is set at, why is the rightwing solution to unemployment and welfare to cut benefits off those who are in the system? The standard claim is that welfare or unemployment lowers their incentive to work....well, why not put some rungs on the ladder, so someone who was on welfare and able to work, would have a good reason to...instead of taking a minimum wage job and losing whatever benefits they currently have on welfare or disability. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Muddy Posted February 16, 2011 Report Share Posted February 16, 2011 Every time we raise minimum wage we lose jobs to places like China. Ask your self this. If you were manufacturing widgets for $5.00 a piece and just surviving and wages went up $6.00 driving the price of your widget up to $5.50 a piece and you could have the same widget made and landed from off shore for $4.50 what business decision would you take. You no longer need machinery,a plant to heat and hydro,workmens comp labour unrest etc. just a warehouse. Have you made your decision yet? I have the greatest respect for the working poor. I was once one. I didn`t like it so I went into business for myself. What I dislike is the lazy and those who figure that the capitalist system owes them a job. After all there are only so many over paid civic workers jobs. I am happy guy. I don`t have a formal education ,but I own a thriving business with first class people working for me ,all long term and on salary. I do not apologize for my great fortune. It has been all hard honest work ,NOT LUCK. Just raising minimum wage is not the answer for the working poor. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Smallc Posted February 16, 2011 Report Share Posted February 16, 2011 From what I can gather, the national minimum wage in Australia is not $17 but $15 per hour. (The Australian dollar is worth slightly less than a Canadian dollar.) If when you say slightly lower, you mean nearly identical, you're right. The Australian dollar, as of this moment, is worth $1.01 Canadian. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Keepitsimple Posted February 16, 2011 Report Share Posted February 16, 2011 (edited) For some that say it couldn't be done, it is being done in Australia and the article that I will post said they did over a period of three years, when their economy started to be strong. As far as prices going up, they are going up NOW and the working poor and some lower level middle-class are struggling to pay their bills and put food on the table. For this to work you have to leaders that have compassion for the fellow man. http://english.peopledaily.com.cn/90001/90778/90858/90863/7010903.html Might be good to get your facts straight. The Australian work week is based on 38 hours. As your article says - they've raised the Minimum Wage to $481 US per week. That's about $12.65 US per hour....approximately the same in Canadian Dollars. Not quite the big deal. Fair Work Australia announced the change to the 544 dollars ( 460 U.S. dollars) minimum wage in Melbourne, bringing it up to 570 dollars (481 U.S. dollars) a week. Edited February 16, 2011 by Keepitsimple Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
William Ashley Posted February 16, 2011 Report Share Posted February 16, 2011 (edited) I'm not out for votes As people who know my stances probably already know - I support dropping (removing/erasing) the income taxes as well as removing a federally mandated minimum wage (should it exist) - provnices of course could set civil limits. It is up to employers to set wages, and it is up for employees to either accept that wage or not. I however advocate for advantages within a proposed NHIP (national health insurance plan) for the poor - NHIP would replace any federally transfered funds for medicare - and put in its place a crown corporation that offers health insurance (private providers would be able to compete) Within the plan there would be basic health care on a credit basis (funds have to be repaid if the money appears in the future - based on the annual rate for that basic plan - or they could be worked off with social credit (from a list of volunteer activities approved by the government to count for Social Credit) Likewise The Right to Work Program aims to remove Unemployment for those willing to work. The program works by making available unsold goods from the program to those who take part, as well as profit share in proceeds raised through the program. The program would work on Federal Program requirement of a non essential nature - supplying Pay For Projects with unmet labour, supplying the federal government, and competing for federal requests, to compete with the private market in areas of medium skilled and non skilled labour. Likewise "Payfor" and requests for initiation of crown corps on a federal agent as mechanism for IPO as well as buyinto to work offers a means of federally regulated cooperative businesses on a proposal to proposal basis. (the advantage over private startup is that it allows a lot of the adminitrative and technical aspects to be imbedded in the program, as well as offering some advantages such as greater access to programs such as The Right to Work. Social Credit in itself would be available outside the program from a program to program basis. It is really up for those in poverty to lift themselves from Poverty not depend on others to do so for them, so the Social Party line is to give them oppourtunities and to remove the shackles and provide them with the freedom to self success. Those who are disabled and unable to work present a dilema, however social care is a provincial issue not a federal issue. LIkewise the education of youth is a provincial issue. (however a goal of enhancing education through the Chancellery (heritage/education making materials available and expanding online educational content in regard to Canadian History and other Arts. (Likewise a payfor sciences council and a payfor arts council would be a program initiated by the federal government to promote funding of health and sciences initiatives, including those aimed at youth... otherwise youth based programs could be proposed by the public via payfor) Families are a provincial issue. Seniors care is a provincial issue. (Altering seniors programs to be gaurentee funded - this includes not allowing programs to be advertised in a way that demonstrates them to be perpetual - such as what has occured with CPP, OAS and GIS) , as well as offering protection from retirement savings plans - from inflationary loss - that is providing a bonus to seniors on previous federal program funding - including locking in pay amounts to the rate of inflation) Seniros would also be provided supplimental redistrobution through familial cycles (having younger relatives pay a portion of their retirement costs (note income taxes are removed). Likewise all pension funds would need to account for the funds in the plan to the extent of the offering of the plan. (meaning perpetual funds would need to have perpetual funds.. not possible so it would have to be based on a set number of years with funds accounted for --- proceeds such as interest from the fund could however be banked by the organization offering the fund) The National Drug Strategy, which includes legalization of drugs deemed so by the National Advisory (or the citizens of Canada organized in this council 1 citizen = 1 vote), includes measures for Dealers Insurance - and within this insurance includes the cost of administering rehab programs, and social damages costs (should there be any) - the aim here is to insure that rehabilitation from drugs are avaiailable to anyone who would like them (that has drug dependency or rehabilitable issues stemming from drugs sold through the program). The hopes of this program would be to allow individuals to reenter the work force at an earliest time as possible. Those who are willingly unemployed and able would get nothing, exept any programs initiated by the public via Payfor.It would be left for the provinces to deal with. Edited February 16, 2011 by William Ashley Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
segnosaur Posted February 16, 2011 Report Share Posted February 16, 2011 For some that say it couldn't be done, it is being done in Australia and the article that I will post said they did over a period of three years, when their economy started to be strong. The question that should be asked isn't "can it be done", the question should probably be "should it be done". As far as prices going up, they are going up NOW and the working poor and some lower level middle-class are struggling to pay their bills and put food on the table. You never provided a reference to this, but lets assume that its true. Australia has had a higher inflation rate (2.7% now, topping out at 5% in 2008) than Canada (2.4%, topping out at under 4% in 2008) for at least a few years, so its believable. Isn't this exactly like some posters were predicting? A raise in minimum wages causes basic prices to rise, making goods that the minimum wage earners might buy more expensive. The result: They aren't necessarily any better off. For this to work you have to leaders that have compassion for the fellow man. Why? Wouldn't it be more important for the average worker to have compassion? (i.e. refusing any raises above minimum wage to keep prices low.) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Keepitsimple Posted February 16, 2011 Report Share Posted February 16, 2011 Might be good to get your facts straight. The Australian work week is based on 38 hours. As your article says - they've raised the Minimum Wage to $481 US per week. That's about $12.65 US per hour....approximately the same in Canadian Dollars. Not quite the big deal. I think I might have got my own facts wrong.....the article that Topaz posted must be incorrect in its US conversion rate. Using the Australian dollar and a 38 hour week, it's $15 per hour AUS which is pretty well at par with the Canadian dollar. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Saipan Posted February 16, 2011 Report Share Posted February 16, 2011 Should there be changes for the working poor? Yes, they should be sent to work. Forestry in NW Ontario needs them, collect pine cones and plant trees. Same with all welfare recipients. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
madmax Posted February 16, 2011 Report Share Posted February 16, 2011 Should there be changes for the working poor? Yes, they should be sent to work. Forestry in NW Ontario needs them, collect pine cones and plant trees. The "Working Poor" should be sent to Forestry in NW Ontario? Collecting Pinecones and Planting Trees? Seems they could have a full time job rounding up nuts on MLW. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr.Canada Posted February 16, 2011 Report Share Posted February 16, 2011 The "working poor" can look for better jobs if they don't like the one they have currently, whatever that may be. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Saipan Posted February 16, 2011 Report Share Posted February 16, 2011 First came Montreal Locomotive Works http://www.google.ca/#hl=en&xhr=t&q=MLW+in+Canada&cp=13&pf=p&sclient=psy&aq=f&aqi=&aql=&oq=MLW+in+Canada&pbx=1&fp=b5fd8f32fe55c76a Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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