jbg Posted August 15, 2010 Report Share Posted August 15, 2010 (edited) When will a liberal speak against anything Muslim? Not in your life time. Don't you see? It's the newspaper's fault for causing this, not the Muslim fundamentalists' fault for hate, intolerance and threats of murder and war over some silly pictures. Of course when those of the Christian faith show concern over movies depicting Jesus as a lusting adulterer or whatever he was in the Last Temptation of Christ, then the liberals can criticize faith groups, but when it happens to Muslims, no one criticizes their much more violent response. Total hypocrisy. I chose Sharkman's post concerning "cartoon jihad" to demonstrate the hypocrisy between Muslims' violence-backed demands for "sensitivity" and their insistence on constructing a mosque in New York City, at "Ground Zero" where Muslims militants butchered thousands. The choice of a site for the construction shows no "sensitivity" at all, particularly where New York's governor offered nearby State parkland for the site. The article below (link) shows the Muslims' (and certainly the ministers were not non-representative violent hooligans) insistence on a level of sensitivity they are unwilling to show: Row deepens over Danish cartoons Arab foreign ministers have condemned the Danish government for failing to act against a newspaper that published cartoons of the Prophet Muhammad. At the Arab League conference in Cairo, they said they were "surprised and discontented at the response". Islam forbids any depiction of Muhammad or of Allah. The Jyllands-Posten newspaper published a series of 12 cartoons showing Muhammad, in one of which he appeared to have a bomb in his turban. The Arab League's ministers council said the cartoons were an insult to Islam. *************** There have been street protests both in Denmark and in Muslim countries following the publication of the cartoons. The newspaper insists on freedom of expression and says it has the right to print whatever words and pictures it chooses. It said both the paper and the cartoonist had received death threats. A recent letter to the editor of a Massachetts/New Hampshire paper highlights this issue perfectly (link, excerpts belows): August 10, 2010 Letter: Mosque siting is lacking in sensitivity To the editor: The current controversy over the construction of a mosque near Ground Zero reminds me of the 1989 controversy over the construction of a Catholic contemplative convent adjacent to Auschwitz where nuns planned to undertake a life of vigil prayer for all victim groups who died at the site, Jews, Poles, gypsies and others. There was vigorous protest by Jewish advocate groups who felt that the convent, while well meaning, failed to emphasize the particular and genocidal nature of Auschwitz regarding the Jewish people and their far greater numbers in the ranks of the dead. They also protested the convent's Christian symbols at a site which was in effect a Jewish grave. By 1993, the Catholic Church had conceded the justice of this protest and had effected the convent's removal from the proximity to the grounds. Ground Zero is the site of the murder of thousands of souls in the name of Islam. Granted, those building the proposed mosque in no way defend or share the ideology of this action. But their sincerity as peacemakers would be more obvious if they had the sensitivity to move further on down the line, so to speak. Freedom of religion is not the question here, nor is the validity of Islam as one of the world's great religions — a unique reach toward God as are all faiths. The question is quite simply sensitivity to grief. ******************** But where's the angst on the other side? Why did the mosque not anticipate this dilemma and act with more sensitivity on its own? That would have been religion at its finest and a great example to believers and non-believers everywhere. (name of author omitted) North Andover It seems to me that "sensitivity" and "inclusiveness" are two-way streets. Apparently not everyone agrees Edited August 15, 2010 by jbg Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BubberMiley Posted August 15, 2010 Report Share Posted August 15, 2010 (edited) All religious people have a deep mental illness. They can't handle reality and choose to live their lives guided by ancient texts and fairy gods. There. I (a liberal) said something bad about islam. Now you guys don't have to be so obsessive. But you better be tolerant of me. Edited August 15, 2010 by BubberMiley Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jbg Posted August 15, 2010 Author Report Share Posted August 15, 2010 But you better be tolerant of me. I've always been tolerant of both you and your alternate screen name. I've never made death threats against people who I don't agree with. Or organized a suicide attack. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BubberMiley Posted August 15, 2010 Report Share Posted August 15, 2010 I've always been tolerant of both you and your alternate screen name. I've never made death threats against people who I don't agree with. Or organized a suicide attack. Good for you. You haven't descended fully into the madness of religion yet. Although you do subscribe to some bizarre, delusional behaviour, according to my "alternate screen name." Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jbg Posted August 15, 2010 Author Report Share Posted August 15, 2010 Good for you. You haven't descended fully into the madness of religion yet. Although you do subscribe to some bizarre, delusional behaviour, according to my "alternate screen name." Hardly. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BubberMiley Posted August 15, 2010 Report Share Posted August 15, 2010 Laurel and Hardly? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ratio Posted August 16, 2010 Report Share Posted August 16, 2010 I chose Sharkman's post concerning "cartoon jihad" to demonstrate the hypocrisy between Muslims' violence-backed demands for "sensitivity" and their insistence on constructing a mosque in New York City, at "Ground Zero" where Muslims militants butchered thousands. The choice of a site for the construction shows no "sensitivity" at all, particularly where New York's governor offered nearby State parkland for the site. The article below (link) shows the Muslims' (and certainly the ministers were not non-representative violent hooligans) insistence on a level of sensitivity they are unwilling to show: Row deepens over Danish cartoons Arab foreign ministers have condemned the Danish government for failing to act against a newspaper that published cartoons of the Prophet Muhammad. At the Arab League conference in Cairo, they said they were "surprised and discontented at the response". Islam forbids any depiction of Muhammad or of Allah. The Jyllands-Posten newspaper published a series of 12 cartoons showing Muhammad, in one of which he appeared to have a bomb in his turban. The Arab League's ministers council said the cartoons were an insult to Islam. *************** There have been street protests both in Denmark and in Muslim countries following the publication of the cartoons. The newspaper insists on freedom of expression and says it has the right to print whatever words and pictures it chooses. It said both the paper and the cartoonist had received death threats. A recent letter to the editor of a Massachetts/New Hampshire paper highlights this issue perfectly (link, excerpts belows): August 10, 2010 Letter: Mosque siting is lacking in sensitivity To the editor: The current controversy over the construction of a mosque near Ground Zero reminds me of the 1989 controversy over the construction of a Catholic contemplative convent adjacent to Auschwitz where nuns planned to undertake a life of vigil prayer for all victim groups who died at the site, Jews, Poles, gypsies and others. There was vigorous protest by Jewish advocate groups who felt that the convent, while well meaning, failed to emphasize the particular and genocidal nature of Auschwitz regarding the Jewish people and their far greater numbers in the ranks of the dead. They also protested the convent's Christian symbols at a site which was in effect a Jewish grave. By 1993, the Catholic Church had conceded the justice of this protest and had effected the convent's removal from the proximity to the grounds. Ground Zero is the site of the murder of thousands of souls in the name of Islam. Granted, those building the proposed mosque in no way defend or share the ideology of this action. But their sincerity as peacemakers would be more obvious if they had the sensitivity to move further on down the line, so to speak. Freedom of religion is not the question here, nor is the validity of Islam as one of the world's great religions — a unique reach toward God as are all faiths. The question is quite simply sensitivity to grief. ******************** But where's the angst on the other side? Why did the mosque not anticipate this dilemma and act with more sensitivity on its own? That would have been religion at its finest and a great example to believers and non-believers everywhere. (name of author omitted) North Andover It seems to me that "sensitivity" and "inclusiveness" are two-way streets. Apparently not everyone agrees what happened to just being tolerent... muslims arent the problem, its sick racist haters who procoke them and insult their religion of peace. freedom of speech dopesnt give anyone the right to say hurtful things or injur other peoples feelings... grow a brain. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Remiel Posted August 16, 2010 Report Share Posted August 16, 2010 freedom of speech dopesnt give anyone the right to say hurtful things or injur other peoples feelings... Theoretically, absolute freedom of speech would entail exactly that right. However, a right to say anything does not make saying any particular thing right. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ratio Posted August 16, 2010 Report Share Posted August 16, 2010 (edited) Theoretically, absolute freedom of speech would entail exactly that right. However, a right to say anything does not make saying any particular thing right. that's so ignorant, freedom of speech is HATESPEECH if it offends... seriously wake up... what good is freedom of speech if it can spread intolerence and racism? And hatespeech is a crime. this is the 21st century, its time to stop the hate. we shouldnt tolerate people who say anything hurtful about our wouonderful diversity. Edited August 16, 2010 by Ratio Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest TrueMetis Posted August 16, 2010 Report Share Posted August 16, 2010 (edited) what happened to just being tolerent... muslims arent the problem, its sick racist haters who procoke them and insult their religion of peace. freedom of speech dopesnt give anyone the right to say hurtful things or injur other peoples feelings... grow a brain. Well actually that's exactly what free speech gives people the right to do. It's actually and integral part of free speech, as you don't need free speech if no one ever says anything offensive. Edited August 16, 2010 by TrueMetis Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ratio Posted August 16, 2010 Report Share Posted August 16, 2010 Well actually that's exactly what free speech gives people the right to do. It's actually and integral part of free speech, as you don't need free speech if no one ever says anything offensive. well then we need to realize that this is 21st century canada... and that freedom of speech needs to be revised... we cant tolerate intolerence, and if free speech spreads prejudice and hurts feelings (especially the feelings of minorities) then it cant be apart of our country. its time to stop the sick racist games. theres a fine line between free speech and reading mein kampf... some things just HAVE to be illegal. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bush_cheney2004 Posted August 16, 2010 Report Share Posted August 16, 2010 ....theres a fine line between free speech and reading mein kampf... some things just HAVE to be illegal. Yippee...we have another book burner! Wanna ban cartoons too? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest TrueMetis Posted August 16, 2010 Report Share Posted August 16, 2010 well then we need to realize that this is 21st century canada... and that freedom of speech needs to be revised... we cant tolerate intolerence, and if free speech spreads prejudice and hurts feelings (especially the feelings of minorities) then it cant be apart of our country. its time to stop the sick racist games. theres a fine line between free speech and reading mein kampf... some things just HAVE to be illegal. I agree but just because something your someones feeling doesn't mean it should be illegal. People are monkey's but being called that pisses people off, so should it be illegal to call people monkey's even though it's the truth? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ratio Posted August 16, 2010 Report Share Posted August 16, 2010 I agree but just because something your someones feeling doesn't mean it should be illegal. People are monkey's but being called that pisses people off, so should it be illegal to call people monkey's even though it's the truth? if you called a black person a monkey, you would (and SHOULD) be sent to jail... calling someone who is developmentally disabled "less intelligent" is hate.. no matter what you say, its should be illegal. I guess it sorta depends on the background of the persons being offended but seriously, freedom of speech doesnt protect hate speech ... You shouldnt be allowed to hurt peoples feeligns by saying rude, insensitive, racist things. Thats the contract, thats what livign in canada is about. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ratio Posted August 16, 2010 Report Share Posted August 16, 2010 Yippee...we have another book burner! Wanna ban cartoons too? that's right keep backing up racism and hate toons, I figure your a racist judging by your name... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest American Woman Posted August 16, 2010 Report Share Posted August 16, 2010 Yippee...we have another book burner! Wanna ban cartoons too? More like another troll ...... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DogOnPorch Posted August 16, 2010 Report Share Posted August 16, 2010 Oh...man... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jbg Posted August 16, 2010 Author Report Share Posted August 16, 2010 what What happened to just being tolerent... muslims arent Muslims aren't the problem, its it's sick racist haters who procoke provoke them and insult their religion of peace. freedomFreedom of speech dopesnt doesn't give anyone the right to say hurtful things or injur other peoples peoples' feelings... I guess you can't read. Erecting a building in such a symbolic manner is far more hurtful than "saying" something.grow a brain.Learn to spell (see edits above for suggestions). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ratio Posted August 16, 2010 Report Share Posted August 16, 2010 I guess you can't read. Erecting a building in such a symbolic manner is far more hurtful than "saying" something. Learn to spell (see edits above for suggestions). there you go going grammar nazi on me... and defending hatespeech ... it figures, Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jbg Posted August 16, 2010 Author Report Share Posted August 16, 2010 there you go going grammar nazi on me... and defending hatespeech ... it figures, On the substance you miss the point as well. You are saying that the cartoons are insulting, and ignoring the even more hateful construction of a mosque at the site of a Muslim massacre. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ratio Posted August 16, 2010 Report Share Posted August 16, 2010 On the substance you miss the point as well. You are saying that the cartoons are insulting, and ignoring the even more hateful construction of a mosque at the site of a Muslim massacre. um whats the big deal with a mosque? Freedom of religion ring a bell? Not letting them put up a mosque is racist, intolerant and bigotted... and Islam is a religion of Peace, the people who did the wtc attacks were ust misguided... it shouldnt be an excuse to spread ignorance, hatred , racism and bigottry: we need these immigrants... they enrich our lives. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bush_cheney2004 Posted August 16, 2010 Report Share Posted August 16, 2010 um whats the big deal with a mosque? Freedom of religion ring a bell? Not letting them put up a mosque is racist, intolerant and bigotted... and Islam is a religion of Peace, the people who did the wtc attacks were ust misguided... Freedom of religion comes after fredom of speech....you can't silence us. it shouldnt be an excuse to spread ignorance, hatred , racism and bigottry: we need these immigrants... they enrich our lives. The USA has plenty of immigrants...it's Canada that seems to have a big problem with a very small ship! LOL! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jack Weber Posted August 16, 2010 Report Share Posted August 16, 2010 Mr.Ratio... You sound like one of the simpering bedwetters at Rabble.ca that thought shouting down the uproarious boor,Anne Coulter,was a preferrable response than actually debating her and calling her on her idiocy.Your insular thoughts on Free Speech sound like that of an immature child who does'nt have the intellectual capacity to deal with the uglier side of things,so it's easier for people like you to simply shut them up.Even worse,make it illegal...Talk about a thought and speech NAZI!! So you think the Westergaard cartoons were racist and should never have been shown because they were offensive...I'll bet you think Mr.Westergaard should have been thrown in jail for those cartoons? Have you ever seen the cartoons in Islamic papers depicting Christ and Christians???Jews???Non-Believers??? If you had,and you clearly have'nt,you might think twice about being openminded about the frail attitudes of some in the Islamic community... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bonam Posted August 16, 2010 Report Share Posted August 16, 2010 what happened to just being tolerent... muslims arent the problem, its sick racist haters who procoke them and insult their religion of peace. freedom of speech dopesnt give anyone the right to say hurtful things or injur other peoples feelings... grow a brain. Methinks someone decided to create a counter alt to our recent addition Mohammed... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bud Posted August 16, 2010 Report Share Posted August 16, 2010 it's a community centre, not a mosque. not to say that this reaction towards the wrongly called project would be okay if it was a mosque. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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