Islamic Demands for "Sensitivity" Over Cartoons Ring Hollow;

[jbg]

well they can check my IP address for all I care, I don<t know anything about that poster. what leads them to believe that its me? Does he also oppose hatred and discrimination, xenophobia, homophobia and gets insulted for doing so?

What is your IP address? And what is the "ratio" of your sensible posts to your idiotic ones?

[Michael Hardner]

What is your IP address? And what is the "ratio" of your sensible posts to your idiotic ones?

It`s easy to spoof an IP address, still, I think.

If it is Lictor he will tire of this.

[Jack Weber]

It`s easy to spoof an IP address, still, I think.

If it is Lictor he will tire of this.

Until he makes his (in)glorious return...

He's been here the last two nights...It's been about a month...

[Sir Bandelot]

Woman charged for destroying controversial Jesus art in Colorado

Kathy is an ordinary American with some sincerely held religious beliefs, and like a lot of Americans and a lot of people in Colorado she was pretty upset by some of the displays at a city-owned museum,” one of her attorneys, Cliff Stricklin, told CNN Friday.

Gee JBG, I guess it's not a problem in America. Because you people are so very tolerant and good yourselves, by your very nature.

[DogOnPorch]

Woman charged for destroying controversial Jesus art in Colorado

Kathy is an ordinary American with some sincerely held religious beliefs, and like a lot of Americans and a lot of people in Colorado she was pretty upset by some of the displays at a city-owned museum,” one of her attorneys, Cliff Stricklin, told CNN Friday.

Gee JBG, I guess it's not a problem in America. Because you people are so very tolerant and good yourselves, by your very nature.

So are American Christians going to hit the streets and riot?

[DogOnPorch]

Meanwhile...a bomb explodes in a mosque no doubt burning many Korans...oddly, the 'Muslim World' remains completely silent.

http://www.cbc.ca/world/story/2010/10/08/afghan-bombing.html

[jbg]

Gee JBG, I guess it's not a problem in America. Because you people are so very tolerant and good yourselves, by your very nature.

There's a huge difference between an isolated incident and a pattern.

[Sir Bandelot]

So are American Christians going to hit the streets and riot?

There were no riots in Denmark when Theo van Gogh was killed, either. Because slack-jawed western liberals do not have the cahones to stand up for what they believe in. Because, tHey do not actually believe in anything, other than "laissez faire". Conservatives do have stronger opinions and are willing to voice them loudly. And that is where the difference lies, it is not drawn by national boundaries.

Edited October 11, 2010 by Sir Bandelot

[Michael Hardner]

And that is where the difference lies, it is not drawn by national boundaries.

This debate gets so tiresome... anecdote after anecdote... people comparing culturally dissimilar incidents.

If someone can prove that religion causes violence, please do so. Otherwise, I say keep these anecdotes to yourself - they're not interesting, they're not relevant, and they don't make for good debate here.

[Sir Bandelot]

This debate gets so tiresome... anecdote after anecdote... people comparing culturally dissimilar incidents.

If someone can prove that religion causes violence, please do so. Otherwise, I say keep these anecdotes to yourself - they're not interesting, they're not relevant, and they don't make for good debate here.

They are not entirely dissimilar. There is a commonality that exists in the minds of people all over the world, despite cultural differences. The battle is not between Islam and Christianity per se, it's between liberalism and conservatism, in any culture. That is what I am interested in exploring in these debates. My view is, this struggle moves in time from one to the other, like a pendulum. When there is movement or public favor for the one, it must eventually come to a point where the negative aspects outweigh the positives, and people begin to prefer the opposite. I believe we are coming to a point where liberalism is the new dirty word.

Edited October 11, 2010 by Sir Bandelot

[Michael Hardner]

They are not entirely dissimilar. There is a commonality that exists in the minds of people all over the world, despite cultural differences. The battle is not between Islam and Christianity per se, it's between liberalism and conservatism, in any culture. That is what I am interested in exploring in these debates. My view is, this struggle moves in time from one to the other, like a pendulum. When there is movement or public favor for the one, it must eventually come to a point where the negative aspects outweigh the positives, and people begin to prefer the opposite. I believe we are coming to a point where liberalism is the new dirty word.

But conservatism and liberalism battle each other on a constantly changing landscape. Social change, economic change, changes in technology and communication are constantly happening so that liberals and conservatives are often debating yesterday's issues not tomorrow's.

This thunderclap that we're seeing now, from cultures crashing together, started years ago and to my mind they're an inevitable result of increased economic co-operation, and the decline in influence of local cultures and governments. I suspect that you'd get no significant change in immigration levels, or immigration sources if Harper had a majority. He's an economist.

[Black Dog]

On the substance you miss the point as well. You are saying that the cartoons are insulting, and ignoring the even more hateful construction of a mosque at the site of a Muslim massacre.

Your premise is flawed. Unless you actually think the decision o erect a Islamic centre a few blocks from ground zero are a deliberate act of triumphalism by some Muslim conspiracy. But even you aren't that crazy/stupid. Are you?

[Black Dog]

I'd feel beter about the "community center" or mosque if there was some ecumenical outreach to the greater community. For example, when our synagogue is under reconstruction we regularly use nearby church facilities for worship or other gatherings. If the Muslims open themselves up that way I am more likely to welcome the "community center" or mosque. Don't hold your breath though; on or about April 15, 1972 an interloper was beaten to death by worshipers in a Harlem mosque.

Yeah, no. On April 14, 1972, two NYPD cops were attacked after barging into a Fruit of Islam (the paramilitary wing of the Nation of Islam) mosque, allegedly in response to a phony 9-11 call. One died under mysterious and unresolved circumstances: he may have been eaten or he may have been killed by his own partner by accident. But that's neither here nor there, since anyone with half a brain knows that the Nation of Islam shares little in common with the the radical Islamism that originated in the Middle East.

Edited October 12, 2010 by Black Dog

[Bonam]

This debate gets so tiresome... anecdote after anecdote... people comparing culturally dissimilar incidents.

If someone can prove that religion causes violence, please do so. Otherwise, I say keep these anecdotes to yourself - they're not interesting, they're not relevant, and they don't make for good debate here.

Anecdote after anecdote eh? Just how many anecdotes does it take? If we have ten thousand anecdotes does that start to represent a statistical trend perhaps?

[Michael Hardner]

Anecdote after anecdote eh? Just how many anecdotes does it take? If we have ten thousand anecdotes does that start to represent a statistical trend perhaps?

Well, point taken... but no.

[jbg]

Your premise is flawed. Unless you actually think the decision o erect a Islamic centre a few blocks from ground zero are a deliberate act of triumphalism by some Muslim conspiracy. But even you aren't that crazy/stupid. Are you?

Triumphalism, yes. Is a conspiracy involved? No.

But that's neither here nor there, since anyone with half a brain knows that the Nation of Islam shares little in common with the the radical Islamism that originated in the Middle East.

Except a propensity for violence. Does anyone ask "how many people die during a Jewish Yom Kippur service"? People often ask the death toll for the Haaj pilgrimage.

[Black Dog]

Triumphalism, yes. Is a conspiracy involved? No.

Then you are stupid/crazy.

Except a propensity for violence. Does anyone ask "how many people die during a Jewish Yom Kippur service"? People often ask the death toll for the Haaj pilgrimage.

I've owned you so many times on this topic I'm kind of surprised you would use this example again, but self-awareness is clearly not your strong suit.

For those who haven't followed, here's a few threads where jbg has argued (poorly) that the stampedes that are an all-too frequent occurrence during the Haji, when 4 million people drop in on Mecca simultaneously, are the byproduct of the inherent savagery and disregard for human life of all Muslims.

Link one

Link two

Edited October 12, 2010 by Black Dog

[Argus]

Triumphalism, yes. Is a conspiracy involved? No.

Except a propensity for violence.

Maybe you just see it that way because you're Jewish. :-)

The long history of respectful and peaceful Muslim behaviour towards Jews

When Israeli planes smashed Egyptian airfields in the opening hours of the Six-Day War, announcers on Radio Cairo took to the airwaves, calling on Arabs in neighbouring countries to attack any Jews they could find. In the Libyan capital of Tripoli, then home to about 5,000 Jews, rioters responded with an orgy of murder, arson and looting that lasted three days. Even after the survivors had fled to Israel and the West, leaving Libya effectively judenrein, the anti-Semitic bloodlust remained unquenched. It was “the unavoidable duty of the city councils,” opined one Libyan newspaper, “to remove [Jewish] cemeteries immediately, and throw the bodies of the dead, which even in their eternal rest soil our country, into the depths of the sea … Only then can the hatred of the Libyan people toward the Jews be satiated.”

[DogOnPorch]

Fixed the link ...

http://fullcomment.nationalpost.com/2010/10/11/jonathan-kay-an-anti-jewish-pathology-reaching-back-1400-years/

[jbg]

For those who haven't followed, here's a few threads where jbg has argued (poorly) that the stampedes that are an all-too frequent occurrence during the Haji, when 4 million people drop in on Mecca simultaneously, are the byproduct of the inherent savagery and disregard for human life of all Muslims.

Link one

Link two

Maybe you just see it that way because you're Jewish. :-)

The long history of respectful and peaceful Muslim behaviour towards Jews (link fixed per DOP)

When Israeli planes smashed Egyptian airfields in the opening hours of the Six-Day War, announcers on Radio Cairo took to the airwaves, calling on Arabs in neighbouring countries to attack any Jews they could find. In the Libyan capital of Tripoli, then home to about 5,000 Jews, rioters responded with an orgy of murder, arson and looting that lasted three days. Even after the survivors had fled to Israel and the West, leaving Libya effectively judenrein, the anti-Semitic bloodlust remained unquenched. It was “the unavoidable duty of the city councils,” opined one Libyan newspaper, “to remove [Jewish] cemeteries immediately, and throw the bodies of the dead, which even in their eternal rest soil our country, into the depths of the sea … Only then can the hatred of the Libyan people toward the Jews be satiated.”

THere's just no comparison between the levels of violence.

[Argus]

THere's just no comparison between the levels of violence.

No, there isn't, and I think that's the issue with these bleeding heart lefties. They simply are incapable of comprehending the depths of hatred felt by so many in the Muslim world for Jews, or how that hatred has been stoked by their governments as a matter of public policy for the last fifty years.

[wulf42]

All religious people have a deep mental illness. They can't handle reality and choose to live their lives guided by ancient texts and fairy gods.

Give that man a cigar! you have hit the nail on the head, As soon as people of the Earth drop ALL idiotic religion from society the happier we will all be.... . All this killing and whining for something that does not exist anyway really makes you wonder how we evolved as a Species.

Edited October 24, 2010 by wulf42

[jbg]

Give that man a cigar! you have hit the nail on the head, As soon as people of the Earth drop ALL idiotic religion from society the happier we will all be.... . All this killing and whining for something that does not exist anyway really makes you wonder how we evolved as a Species.

Yes.

And expect the fundamentalist Muslims to be the first to drop religion because it is hateful and violent. </sarcasm>

[Sir Bandelot]

I think that's the issue with these bleeding heart lefties. They simply are incapable of comprehending the depths of hatred felt by so many in the Muslim world for Jews, or how that hatred has been stoked by their governments as a matter of public policy for the last fifty years.

I don't believe I'm a "lefty" but I am capable of comprehending the depth of hatred felt, by so many in the Jewish world also. The hatred is stoked by the policy of their governments, yes. This is like a war, neither side loves the other. So are you going to pick sides? Because that really won't help to solve the problem.

Forgiveness is not one of their major traits.

[jbg]

Forgiveness is not one of their major traits.

Random violence is not one of the Jews' major traits either.