Ahmadinejad:'Hated Israel will be annihalated'

[DogOnPorch]

Israel is over twice the size it was originally when it was established.

No it isn't.

[eyeball]

So when they invaded one hour old Isreal, what was that? Racial Zeitgeist?

It was certainly an early indication that the western powers that created Israel didn't really think things through.

Apparently the West still has much the same problem when it comes to preventing blow back.

[M.Dancer]

Apparently the West still has much the same problem when it comes to preventing blow back.

Blow back is a two way street. In arabic, they call it Nakba

[ToadBrother]

You want to play this dishonest game of making ridiculous comparisons, suit yourself. I don't want any part of it.

Other than calling the comparison ridiculous, you haven't actually critiqued it. I don't think it takes a brain surgeon to figure out why.

[ToadBrother]

Hard to answer really. And I guess it is more of a hunch or a feeling that Israel should not exist. I mean I might change my mind once I know more. History can be really construed sometimes.

I can't really express into words properly what I am thinking so I'll have to take some time on that. I've mulled it over the last day to see what I can post in reply here. And really at this point I can't really say. I'll try my best to put it into proper words. But in the end I won't change any minds.

Israel exists. That is sufficient for me. Arguing about whether Balfour was wrong seems about as useful as arguing about whether the Congress of Vienna should have created the Kingdom of Belgium.

[M.Dancer]

as arguing about whether the Congress of Vienna should have created the Kingdom of Belgium.

That's an issue that I still cannot speak about in polite company.

[DogOnPorch]

That's an issue that I still cannot speak about in polite company.

[GostHacked]

Israel exists. That is sufficient for me. Arguing about whether Balfour was wrong seems about as useful as arguing about whether the Congress of Vienna should have created the Kingdom of Belgium.

Right or wrong it is others that took his words for what they were.

I've been reading up on the Balfour Declaration for the past couple hours. From what I can understand is that the declaration was abandoned in about 1938-39 by the British. So the policy was killed before the actual creation of Israel.

They abandoned it based on the Peel Commission report.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/White_Paper_of_1939

The idea of Jewish immigration to the area was never quite abandoned. It was included in each policy/mandate since the notion of a reestablished Jewish homeland. Each proposition is quite different. And it seems there was no real agreement on it all.

I guess this is where the UN steps in with the 1947 proposition. Still reading.

[DogOnPorch]

Want further confusion?

Sykes-Picot Agreement

[Rue]

Right or wrong it is others that took his words for what they were.

I've been reading up on the Balfour Declaration for the past couple hours. From what I can understand is that the declaration was abandoned in about 1938-39 by the British. So the policy was killed before the actual creation of Israel.

They abandoned it based on the Peel Commission report.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/White_Paper_of_1939

The idea of Jewish immigration to the area was never quite abandoned. It was included in each policy/mandate since the notion of a reestablished Jewish homeland. Each proposition is quite different. And it seems there was no real agreement on it all.

I guess this is where the UN steps in with the 1947 proposition. Still reading.

You might want to spend more then a couple of more hours reading. Lol. I don't think the British abandoned the Belfour declaration. Far from it. The Jewish leaders at the time accepted it and the Arab League of Nations rejected it. The British did not abandon it-they proposed it. It was not up to the British to accept. Its acceptance depended on both the Jews and Arabs of Palestine agreeing to it. The Arab League intervened and rejected it.

In fact the British violated their League of Nations mandate and illegally created the nations of Iraq and Jordan as part of its dividing up of the Middle East with France in the Pictot agreement. Both nations acted illegally. France tried to create colonies in Lebanon and Syria and Britain placed Prince Faisals to sons on thrones in Iraq and Jordan.

Jordan was illegally seized from 78% of the land mandated for a Jewish state. Jordan was created as a Palestinian state which it still states on its coat of arms. It had a law of return for any Arab who claimed to be a Palestinian offering them automatic citizenship while forbidding Jews not only citizenship but living in the country.

You might want to read a bit more. The Belfour declaration was proposed by Britain after it first illegally seized 78% of Palestine to try prevent a Jewish state.

The Belfour declaration proposed to tiny enclaves, one Palestine and one Jewish to be administered indefinitely by the British. It was a recipe for creating a permanent condition of crisis and dysfunction to legitimize Britain remaining. It is what the British liked to do. Artificially carve up areas of the world with borders that ignored natural tribal patterns and then use all the conflicts the arbitrary borders caused to divide and conquer.

It isn't rocket science.

It also isn't rocket science to know Britain did what Britain has always done, play one party off of another to create a feud between them so it could exploit the feud for its own gains.

The wild card in this was Hitler and Nazi Germany. Just as the League of Nations was about to call a meeting to declare the creation of Trasnjordan illegal and for the Arabs and Jews to come back to the table without British and French interference, WW2 broke out and we saw Palestinian nationals led by the Mufti of Jerusalem forge a Pan-Arab movement that allied with Hitler against the French and British in the Middle East. France quicjkly was knocked out of the war and French colonies like Morrocco, Algeria and Tunisia sat out the war as Vichy indirect Nazi areas of influence. The British however waged a war against the Germans all though the rest of North Africa with the Nazis obtaining support from the pro Nazi political parties and Muslim Brotherhoods in Syria, Egypt and Iraq.

Anwar Sadat, Gamel Nasser and their political party in Egypt, and the Bath parties of Syria and Iraq were openly pro Nazi and imitated it in their uniforms and policies right down to the anti-semitism. It was no concidence after WW2 the SS and elite Nazis flooded Egypt, Syria and Iraq where they ran their host countries' military, secret police forces, and communication ministries.

The Mukbarat we now enjoy in many Arab nations is the incarnation of the Gestapo. The goose stepping, German helmet, German riding pants and boots are still seen in the ceremonial guard uniforms of the Egyptians, and Syrians and the Hitler mustache was all the rage in the Arab world during the 50's and 60's.

The Nazi salute and goos stepping is a feature of every Hamas and Hezbollah parade and rally.

Edited March 29, 2010 by Rue

[sharkman]

I dug up something recently that should shed a new light on Ahmadinejad. During his speech to the UN in September of 2005, Mahmoud claims that a bright light shone around him and the leaders of the world were made by an unseen hand to sit and listen. The unseen hand opened their ears and eyes and they all had this amazed look on their faces as they could do nothing but listen. I am not making this up.

Ahmadinejad adds that he is not exaggerating.

"I am not exaggerating when I say they did not blink; it's not an exaggeration, because I was looking", he says. "They were astonished as if a hand held them there and made them sit. It had opened their eyes and ears for the message of the Islamic Republic."

I know some time has passed, but I think we need to be aware that a complete moonbat is running the show in Iran, and he almost has nukes.

Many of them are related to his devotion to the 12th Imam, also known as Imam Mahdi, who according to Muslims has disappeared and will return at the end of time to lead an era of Islamic justice.

During his September speech at the UN, Ahmadinejad called for the reappearance of the 12th Imam.

In mid-November, during a speech to Friday prayers leaders from across Iran, Ahmadinejad said that the main mission of the revolution is to pave the way for the reappearance of the 12th Imam.

As you can see by the above quote, he also thinks that a 12th Imam will re-appear from the past to bring Muslim justice, and Ahmadinejad is trying his best to usher in the appearance. I wonder if the voices in his head tell him that attacking Israel will bring Mr 12 back?

Edited May 20, 2010 by sharkman

[Moonlight Graham]

For clarification purposes, while he did refer to Israel as "the most hated nation in the world," Ahmadinejad was actually talking about the "Israeli regime," not Israel, when talking about annihilation and a bad omen, which are two different things. This is the translated quote, which is different from how it's being presented:

".....with God’s grace, this regime will be annihilated and Palestinians as well as other regional states will get rid of this bad omen." link

And again he refers to the Israeli regime:

"If the Zionist regime want to repeat the same mistakes they previously made, they must be gotten rid of once and for all, so that the region will be saved from their nuisance for ever." link

I find it odd that I can't find any news coverage of this in any mainstream media outlets.

I also find it odd. I can't find this story or the quote or coverage of it in any mainstream media. When i clicked on Mr. Canada's link of this so-called "quote", it was an article from "The Jerusalem Post: Israel's Best-Selling English Daily and Most-Read English Website". So uhhm big conflict of interest there (to say the least!), and the credibility of the story and the translation of the quote itself flies completely out the window.

Don't believe a word of it folks. Find a more independent news source.

Edited May 19, 2010 by Moonlight Graham

[kimmy]

Don't believe a word of it folks. Find a more independent news source.

Since Presstv.ir is Iran's official state-owned broadcaster, the article is about as close to "from the horse's mouth" as you can get.

-k

[sharkman]

I also find it odd. I can't find this story or the quote or coverage of it in any mainstream media. When i clicked on Mr. Canada's link of this so-called "quote", it was an article from "The Jerusalem Post: Israel's Best-Selling English Daily and Most-Read English Website". So uhhm big conflict of interest there (to say the least!), and the credibility of the story and the translation of the quote itself flies completely out the window.

Don't believe a word of it folks. Find a more independent news source.

Moonlight, perhaps you missed my comment and link. I have a source that seems pretty legitimate and has Mahmoud saying some pretty wild things. Do you have any thoughts regarding that link?

[Moonlight Graham]

Since Presstv.ir is Iran's official state-owned broadcaster, the article is about as close to "from the horse's mouth" as you can get.

You would believe anything coming from Iran's state-owned broadcaster? Severe conflict of interest from that media source too. Ahmadinejad could be writing half the articles himself for all we know!

[Moonlight Graham]

Moonlight, perhaps you missed my comment and link. I have a source that seems pretty legitimate and has Mahmoud saying some pretty wild things. Do you have any thoughts regarding that link?

The link is from a site that has been closed since Jan. 2009, but the article is actually one from Radio Free Europe. I also found an article about the whole "There was a light around me!" thing from The Times and there is apparently a video of Ahmadinejad saying these things, so the article/story seems legit.

Your article also says this:

Hossein Bastani, an Iranian journalist based in France, told RFE/RL that Ahmadinejad's comments can be interpreted in two ways.

"One analysis is that this government believes that it came to power with the votes of the so-called lowest class of the Iranian society and these are classes that believe more in such supernatural tales," Bastani said. "Therefore, this government tries, by propagating such rumors, to gain a dogmatic, charismatic, and holy status among those whom they think support them. The second view is that despite the fact that they are trying to fool people, maybe they also believe in these things that are being repeatedly published about them and said by them. This is more dangerous.”

That's just one analysis from from journalist, but maybe its true. More likely, Ahmadinejad is a bit of a nutjob.

sharkman said:

As you can see by the above quote, he also thinks that a 12th Imam will re-appear from the past to bring Muslim justice, and Ahmadinejad is trying his best to usher in the appearance. I wonder if the voices in his head tell him that attacking Israel will bring Mr 12 back?

Well, even though he's a bit whacked in the brain, in his defense this isn't that much worse than many of the politicians in the West who are evangelical Christian nutjobs, or even your typical Christian follower who thinks Jesus will come again, or praying for salvation etc. etc.

Heck, even Canada's own Stockwell Day thinks the earth is only about 6000 years old and that there's scientific proof that humans once walked the earth at the same time as dinosaurs!

So basically, Ahmedinejad is a religious nutter like so many others. And yes its scary this guy could have access to nukes, though the man isn't a total idiot and i doubt he would be insane enough to launch a nuke at Israel or give one to a terror group at the risk of it being traced back to Iran and knowing full well that he & Iran would be nuked completely off the face of the planet in retaliation.

[Oleg Bach]

I don't think their's much of a difference there. If he intends to push Israel into the sea I doubt anyone especially Israel will be worrying about the symantics of what he said.

Palistine is on the coast..it is more apt to be pushed into the sea than inland Israel.

[sharkman]

Since the subject of Christian leaders is brought up, which Canadian ones thinks Jesus is presently hiding in a well? That's what Ahmadinejad apparently thinks of his 12th Imam, on top of being convinced God's hand kept the UN dignitaries still, silent, and with an amazed look on their faces as God forced them to hear what our dear leader had to say.

And I'm pretty sure that Stockwell Day doesn't expect Israel to be pushed into the sea or wiped out. Do yo have any other thoughts beside trotting out the 'Christians are nutty too' defense? Odd that you want to defend him at all, odder still that your defense is simply an attack on another group as if that makes it alright to believe that Israel should be destroyed.

So do I have this right, that as long as Ahmadinejad is not quite nutty enough to actually launch nukes, then it's okay that he has them? I'm afraid I don't concur.

Here's yet another tidbit from Mahmoud:

"'I do not doubt that the new wave which has begun in our dear Palestine and which today we are also witnessing in the Islamic world is a wave of morality which has spread all over the Islamic world. Very soon, this stain of disgrace [i.e. Israel] will be purged from the center of the Islamic world – and this is attainable.

And a little more from the same link:

"Prior to his statement, Ahmadinejad said that if you plan to chant the slogan 'Death to Israel,' say it in the right and complete way.

"The president warned the leaders of the Islamic world that they should be wary of Fitna [civil strife]: 'If someone is under the pressure of hegemonic power [i.e. the West] and misunderstands something is wrong, or he is naïve, or he is an egotist and his hedonism leads him to recognize the Zionist regime – he should know that he will burn in the fire of the Islamic Ummah [nation]…'

I don't see how anyone could defend words such as these.

[kimmy]

You would believe anything coming from Iran's state-owned broadcaster? Severe conflict of interest from that media source too. Ahmadinejad could be writing half the articles himself for all we know!

If he's writing the articles himself, that would make it unlikely that he's been misquoted, don't you think?

It seems to me that if there's one news outlet that we could trust to put Makmood in the best possible light, it would be the one whose employees could get disappeared if he doesn't like what they wrote.

I think the fact that these damning quotes can be found from his own broadcaster speaks volumes about the guy.

He's a jerkwad. End of story.

-k

[DogOnPorch]

Palistine is on the coast..it is more apt to be pushed into the sea than inland Israel.

Ummmm...here's a map of Israel. Note the watery bits to the west...aka as the Mediterranean.

[Rue]

Not sure if I am following correctly but zionism is not analogous to religious judaism. There are at least as many secular zionists as non secular.

Yes. In actual fact Zionism was created as a non religious political statement-its definition of Jews as a collective identity entitled to universal sufferage was a political one not defined by religious precepts.

Most people do not understand that or the fact that most Zionists have never been religious and that those Jewish Zionists who are religious Jewish Zionists are a minority not a majority of Israelis.

In fact it is probable most religious Zionists today are Christian Zionists not even Jewish ones.

Zionism is not necessarily analgous to Judaism. You are exactly right and this is precisely why about

50% of the ultra-orthodox Jews today, many who live in Hebron on the West Bank or in Jerusalem and have lived their since ancient days, state that Israel is an abomination because it should not be created until

the Messiah comes back and they claim the Messiah has not yet come back. This is why they are anti Zionist and a handful of them went to Iran and allowed themselves to be used by the Iranian leader at

the anti-holocaust symposium which invited anti-semites from across the world to engage in holocaust

denial and advance theories that Jews invented the holocaust as a Zionist conspiracy tool.

Thank you for stating that. As I have told you before,I appreciate your efforts when you state comments such as the above.