Plane attack story is a joke

[maple_leafs182]

It isn't funny.

Delays in Canada - no carry on luggage - (or limited carry on to specific items) - and increased security screenings after arriving? For gods sake when was the last time Canada launched a terrorist attack against the US.. its easily been well over 8 years.

http://www.theglobeandmail.com/news/national/no-carry-on-bags-for-flights-to-us/article1413178/

http://www.google.com/hostednews/afp/article/ALeqM5hhPr1qXjBPW_BkRGmuYflPY4ah1g

It is proposterous 140 cancelations is just a start for what is A LOT of peoples lives effected by a NON EVENT.

think of all the missed flights missed bookings, missed events.. it is madness.. this is a totally obsurd over reaction.

It is totally playing into what Al Qaeda would want ... why are they playing into it.

Why do you need a fundamentalist islamic state when you can have US DHS pulling all the stops

Until the US changes its foreign policy, expect this kind of stuff to be the norm.

If you think it's bad now, wait till a successful terrorist attack happens.

[bush_cheney2004]

Until the US changes its foreign policy, expect this kind of stuff to be the norm.

If you think it's bad now, wait till a successful terrorist attack happens.

We did....remember, your Millennium Bomber screwed it up too.

Edited December 29, 2009 by bush_cheney2004

[SOMEONE]

How does he get a legit VISA in 2008 from the US when he was denied a VISA by the UK by trying to attend a fake college? The UK simply did not pass on the information. Fail.

This young man, as we learned from the media, was on the terrorist watch list since 2008, and he was given long term visa in 2008 valid through mid 2010.

This is a special visa given only for a special people who need to frequently visit the US or work or study in the US. Why would someone on the terror list be given such a visa? what was the reason for giving him this type of visa? how many times has he used it since 2008? this kind of information should be the first thing to be reported in the story, so why was it hidden?

[kimmy]

this kind of information should be the first thing to be reported in the story

What? 2 days ago you said that the first thing that should be reported is that

"AAAAHHHH the guy was HIGH he was holding a SYRINGE AAAAAHHHH the media is HIDING IS THE FACT that PENT is a drug. The guy is coming from AMSTERDAM AAAAAHHHH WHAT WAS HE DOING THERE?"

Now you think that the first thing that should have been reported was the visa and security watch list issue. Well, that's been reported since early on.

so why was it hidden?

Wait, hidden? What has been hidden? You heard about this on the news, right? I heard about this on the news... so how has it been hidden?

What I think you're really trying to say is that you want the media to express your belief that this was a fake orchestrated by the government, yes?

-k

[Guest American Woman]

This young man, as we learned from the media, was on the terrorist watch list since 2008, and he was given long term visa in 2008 valid through mid 2010.

According to what I've read, he apparently was issued the visa before being placed on any such list. He wasn't placed on the watch list of 550,000 potential terrorist threats until after his father contacted the U.S. embassy, saying he was concerned about his being radicalized, and that was just last month.

This is a special visa given only for a special people who need to frequently visit the US or work or study in the US. Why would someone on the terror list be given such a visa?

Again, it apparently was issued before he was on the terrorist watch list.

what was the reason for giving him this type of visa?

Same as any other person being given that type of visa, I would imagine.

how many times has he used it since 2008? this kind of information should be the first thing to be reported in the story, so why was it hidden?

Evidently he used the visa to visit Houston in 2008. Without incident.

Does that help you put any light on the situation?

[kimmy]

Does that help you put any light on the situation?

Wait, Auntie Monica... are you getting this information from the news media, or do you have some sort of super-secret contacts within the US State Department?

I ask because I'm just floored that anybody could know this stuff when the media is clearly HIDING THE INFORMATION!!! (!!!!) from us.

-k

[SOMEONE]

How does he get a legit VISA in 2008 from the US when he was denied a VISA by the UK by trying to attend a fake college? The UK simply did not pass on the information. Fail.

This young man, as we learned from the media, was on the terrorist watch list since 2008, and he was given an open visa in 2008 valid through mid 2010.

This is kind of long term visa is given only for a certain people who need to frequently visit the US or work or study in the US. Why would someone on the terror list be given such a visa? we need to know the reason for issuing such a long term (2-year) visa. was the guy working or studying in the US? has he visited the US on this visa and how many times? why is he visiting this time? for some reason the US authorities is hiding these info, and the people have the right to know it.

[Shady]

It's very sad that only now people are realizing how inefficient large bureaucracies can be. And even more inefficient when several large bureaucracies go about trying to work together.

[bloodyminded]

This young man, as we learned from the media, was on the terrorist watch list since 2008, and he was given long term visa in 2008 valid through mid 2010.

This is a special visa given only for a special people who need to frequently visit the US or work or study in the US. Why would someone on the terror list be given such a visa? what was the reason for giving him this type of visa? how many times has he used it since 2008? this kind of information should be the first thing to be reported in the story, so why was it hidden?

Whether or not someone dropped the ball, the notion that this was a US government plot in some way is hard to swallow, to say the least. (And I'm trying to put it generously.)

[Wilber]

Whether or not someone dropped the ball, the notion that this was a US government plot in some way is hard to swallow, to say the least. (And I'm trying to put it generously.)

Whether or not someone dropped the ball? A young Nigerian Muslim male who had been brought to the attention of authorities by his father, was recently in Yemen and put on a watch list, pays cash for a one way ticket to the US, shows up with no luggage and apparently that rings no bells. Must have been too busy organizing the theater of taking away nail clippers, water bottles etc from crew members and frisking grannies with hip replacements to notice. The official reaction, more theater.

[bloodyminded]

Whether or not someone dropped the ball? A young Nigerian Muslim male who had been brought to the attention of authorities by his father, was recently in Yemen and put on a watch list, pays cash for a one way ticket to the US, shows up with no luggage and apparently that rings no bells. Must have been too busy organizing the theater of taking away nail clippers, water bottles etc from crew members and frisking grannies with hip replacements to notice. The official reaction, more theater.

Fair enough. Ignore the dependent clause.

[eyeball]

It's very sad that only now people are realizing how inefficient large bureaucracies can be. And even more inefficient when several large bureaucracies go about trying to work together.

What's really sad is how long its taking people to realize how incredibly destructive some bureaucracies can be. And even more destructive when they try to do their work in secret.

[kimmy]

Well, when stuff does not jive, then you have a problem. Only one of version of the story can be true. If it does not make sense to you, then you gotta look at everything.

If you're the sort who is prone to posting stuff like

"AAAAAHHHH PETN is a DRUG he had a SYRINGE why is the media hiding the fact that he was HIGH AAAAHHH he was in AMSTERDAM AAAAAH WHAT WAS HE DOING THERE AAAAAHHHH there was a SHARP DRESSED MAN AAAAHHHHH how did he get a VISA when he was on the terror watch list AAAAAHHHHH"

then probably no explanation will convince you that this was anything than AN INSIDE JOB AAAAHHHHH. (This one would be a MIHOP, right?)

However, the following summary addresses reasonable questions with reasonable answers:

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/americas/8432481.stm

AAAHHHH PETN is a high explosive AAAAAHHHHH the syringe contained a chemical detonator AAAAHHHH he had his visa long before he was on their watch list AAAAHHHH the watch list isn't a no-fly list, AAAAAHHHH etc.

btw, I've got a prediction. I bet that a lot of people who are ridiculing US security and intelligence efforts for not putting this guy on a no-fly list based on one report from a worried parent are probably people who are really, really offended that the US won't give Maher Arar the benefit of the doubt.

MSM is the Coles notes of news media as well with no more spin than what Jones' displays. I'd put Jones' and O'Reilly in the same category.

I agree that there is some similarity between Jones and O'Reilly. Both are gigantic assholes.

However, while O'Reilly is generally understood to be a source of opinion, Jones' true believers think he is an alternative news source.

-k

[bloodyminded]

btw, I've got a prediction. I bet that a lot of people who are ridiculing US security and intelligence efforts for not putting this guy on a no-fly list based on one report from a worried parent are probably people who are really, really offended that the US won't give Maher Arar the benefit of the doubt.

While I agree with you on a general principle here, I disagree with the Arar example.

The US doesn't need to give Arar the benefit of the doubt. An inquiry found him not only not guilty (which is sufficient, by the way) but actually innocent. It was a total exoneration.

[Wilber]

btw, I've got a prediction. I bet that a lot of people who are ridiculing US security and intelligence efforts for not putting this guy on a no-fly list based on one report from a worried parent are probably people who are really, really offended that the US won't give Maher Arar the benefit of the doubt.

I'm not one who supports sticking people on no fly lists without a good reason but this guy had also spent time in Yemen before this trip. This combined with the way he bought a one way ticket should have garnered at least some extra attention. It was a breakdown in intelligence and communication that was primarily responsible for this guy getting on that aircraft, not security screening at Schiphol.

[Guest American Woman]

I'm not one who supports sticking people on no fly lists without a good reason but this guy had also spent time in Yemen before this trip. This combined with the way he bought a one way ticket should have garnered at least some extra attention. It was a breakdown in intelligence and communication that was primarily responsible for this guy getting on that aircraft, not security screening at Schiphol.

Was it a one way ticket?

A Nigerian official says the man accused of trying to bring down a U.S. airliner bought his ticket with cash in Ghana eight days before the flight departed Nigeria.

Harold Demuren, the head of the Nigerian Civil Aviation Authority, says Umar Farouk Abdulmutallab's ticket came from a KLM office in Accra, Ghana. Demuren said Monday that Abdulmutallab bought the $2,831 round-trip ticket from Lagos, Nigeria, to Detroit via Amsterdam on Dec. 16.

Edited December 30, 2009 by American Woman

[GostHacked]

If you're the sort who is prone to posting stuff like . . .

then probably no explanation will convince you that this was anything than AN INSIDE JOB AAAAHHHHH. (This one would be a MIHOP, right?)

I have not said it was an inside job. I just said, some things don't add up.

btw, I've got a prediction. I bet that a lot of people who are ridiculing US security and intelligence efforts for not putting this guy on a no-fly list based on one report from a worried parent are probably people who are really, really offended that the US won't give Maher Arar the benefit of the doubt.

Well, the one thing that rings true is that no matter how much security is in place, terror attacks on the US and it's interests will still happen. They got lucky this time, because the dude failed in his attempt.

[GostHacked]

I know Somalia is a hell hole and all, but they might have better airport security than the US. Errr. sorry Amsterdam.

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/af_somalia

MOGADISHU, Somalia – A man tried to board a commercial airliner in Mogadishu last month carrying powdered chemicals, liquid and a syringe that could have caused an explosion in a case bearing chilling similarities to the terrorist plot to blow up a Detroit-bound airliner, officials told The Associated Press on Wednesday.

Edited December 30, 2009 by GostHacked

[Wilber]

Was it a one way ticket?

A Nigerian official says the man accused of trying to bring down a U.S. airliner bought his ticket with cash in Ghana eight days before the flight departed Nigeria.

Harold Demuren, the head of the Nigerian Civil Aviation Authority, says Umar Farouk Abdulmutallab's ticket came from a KLM office in Accra, Ghana. Demuren said Monday that Abdulmutallab bought the $2,831 round-trip ticket from Lagos, Nigeria, to Detroit via Amsterdam on Dec. 16.

If so I guess I was mistook. I was under the impression it was one way.

[Wilber]

I know Somalia is a hell hole and all, but they might have better airport security than the US. Errr. sorry Amsterdam.

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/af_somalia

Good for them but it doesn't sound like they saw fit to share the info with other agencies.

[GostHacked]

Good for them but it doesn't sound like they saw fit to share the info with other agencies.

That seems to be a common theme here.

[SOMEONE]

Guardian:"US plots retaliatory strikes against al-Qaida in Yemen over plane bomber"

CBC:"Dutch to use body scanners for U.S.-bound flights"

now the real intentions behind the badly orchestrated plane attack scenario are starting to unfold. A new American invasion; this time, it is Yemen, extremely strategic for world domination. but Yemen doesn't have WMD and we need a reasonable excuse for the invasion, so we have to invent one. the Yemeni government is losing control over many territories and is asking for American intervention. the "foiled Attack" is supposed to be a sufficient justification for massive air strikes, very possibly ,an invasion.

the introduction of body scanners is another bird knocked by the same stone, the wave of fear that that grabbed the hearts of the population is an important objective in this event. whenever the common citizen gets some sense of security becomes relaxed, stronger dose of fear is needed to renew his fears.

[DogOnPorch]

Yemen is a drug infested terrorist haven where 10 year old girls marry old men. Weapons are carried openly...Sharia rules. Qat alone makes the whole place a disgusting mess...terrorists just add to the fun.

[bush_cheney2004]

Yemen is a drug infested terrorist haven where 10 year old girls marry old men. Weapons are carried openly...Sharia rules. Qat alone makes the whole place a disgusting mess...terrorists just add to the fun.

For sure...like Mos Eisley on the planet Tatooine.

[Alta4ever]

Guardian:"US plots retaliatory strikes against al-Qaida in Yemen over plane bomber"

CBC:"Dutch to use body scanners for U.S.-bound flights"

now the real intentions behind the badly orchestrated plane attack scenario are starting to unfold. A new American invasion; this time, it is Yemen, extremely strategic for world domination. but Yemen doesn't have WMD and we need a reasonable excuse for the invasion, so we have to invent one. the Yemeni government is losing control over many territories and is asking for American intervention. the "foiled Attack" is supposed to be a sufficient justification for massive air strikes, very possibly ,an invasion.

the introduction of body scanners is another bird knocked by the same stone, the wave of fear that that grabbed the hearts of the population is an important objective in this event. whenever the common citizen gets some sense of security becomes relaxed, stronger dose of fear is needed to renew his fears.

You are a complete and utter fool, why bother posting this crap.

Take off the tin foil hat and go see a shrink.