H1N1 "Pandemic"

[wyly]

I'm skeptical of the impact H1N1 will have but I'm trying to keep an open mind. Much has been made about people going to their doctor or ER with flu symptoms. I'm trying to find a source that will keep track of what percentage of people are diagnosed with H1N1 as opposed to regular flu......and how many people are dying due to seasonal flu as well as H1N1. As the months roll by, those numbers would be very important in understanding whether H1N1 is actually taking hold.....while at the same time, educating the public on the potential seriousness of seasonal flu. For those who are not opposed to vaccines, it may encourage more of them to get an annual flu shot.

well than you suck at researching the info is readily available....death toll in Alberta for H1N1 is now 12 at the beginning of flu season, the more common seasonal flu's killed 17 last year in Alberta, the Alberta government is predicting between 120 and 400 deaths from H1N1....testing for H1N1 was so overwhelming H1N1 that they no longer test for it unless it's critical...

[GostHacked]

Thanks for the trip down memory lane.....youngins out there don't realize we've already seen this H1N1 movie before.

I would have been 5 at the time. But with a little searching online, it did not take long to find it. And yes we have seen the movie before. Although this is the sequal, it has the same ending... which will set us up another flu bomb in another 33 years.

[Keepitsimple]

well than you suck at researching the info is readily available....death toll in Alberta for H1N1 is now 12 at the beginning of flu season, the more common seasonal flu's killed 17 last year in Alberta, the Alberta government is predicting between 120 and 400 deaths from H1N1....testing for H1N1 was so overwhelming H1N1 that they no longer test for it unless it's critical...

Thank you for your kind comments. Do you have a website or citation? - the problem I have with your numbers is that seasonal flu kills between 2000 and 8000 people in Canada every year - an overall year-to-year average of 4000. 17 seems to be a pretty small number for Alberta's share.

Keep in mind that Alberta's current total of 12 H1N1 deaths is cumulative for all of 2009 - right back to the earlier "crisis" when Mexico was in the limelight.

[Keepitsimple]

There has been some shifty reporting over the term H1N1 - as if it's something new. Most people think that H1N1 is the "Swine Flu" and if you get H1N1, you're subject to all the dangers portrayed in the media. In fact, H1N1 is a sub-type of Influenza A and has been with us a long time. It's the most common type of flu virus and is responsible for about 50% of all flus worldwide. There are many "strains" of H1N1 - Swine Flu being one of them. So it's not whether you have H1N1 - it's whether you have Swine Flu - which they now call Pandemic H1N1. Confusing? You bet.

Link: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Influenza_A_virus_subtype_H1N1

For those who might want to see how prevalent H1N1 viruses have been over the years, here's a link to the Center for Disease Control in the US:

Link: http://www.cdc.gov/flu/weekly/fluactivity.htm

Edited November 2, 2009 by Keepitsimple

[Molly]

You should be more specific about what inferences you expect folks to draw from that info, Keepitsimple. I'm gathering that you intend it to suggest that there is no hazard, or that it's same old-same old, and that 'lies are being told'.

IF that is what you expect to be drawn, then I would suggest that you have oversimplified to the point of meaninglessness.

I'm imagining one pair of very sharp, high quality scissors in a big box of blunted, plastic paper scissors... being dismissed as safe for children, since the box contains only 'scissors'.....

Of course this is one more in the complex family of closely related flus.... and it happens to be a bit of an odd (potentially malevolent)one. Did you expect it to defy classification? Did you expect sound-bite news blurbs to explore flu genetics in detail?

[Keepitsimple]

You should be more specific about what inferences you expect folks to draw from that info, Keepitsimple. I'm gathering that you intend it to suggest that there is no hazard, or that it's same old-same old, and that 'lies are being told'.

IF that is what you expect to be drawn, then I would suggest that you have oversimplified to the point of meaninglessness.

I'm imagining one pair of very sharp, high quality scissors in a big box of blunted, plastic paper scissors... being dismissed as safe for children, since the box contains only 'scissors'.....

Of course this is one more in the complex family of closely related flus.... and it happens to be a bit of an odd (potentially malevolent)one. Did you expect it to defy classification? Did you expect sound-bite news blurbs to explore flu genetics in detail?

Not at all Molly.....that wasn't my intent. I'm just a little upset OK, a lot) that we have not really been educated on the real prevalence of Swine Flu. The public is not stupid....if they are given information to work with. This would have been a perfect opportunity to educate the public on the dangers and mortality potential of seasonal flu - while at the same time bringing to light the potential of the Swine Flu strain. Just give us the facts - wer're not dumb. That's my problem.

[wyly]

Thank you for your kind comments. Do you have a website or citation? - the problem I have with your numbers is that seasonal flu kills between 2000 and 8000 people in Canada every year - an overall year-to-year average of 4000. 17 seems to be a pretty small number for Alberta's share.

Keep in mind that Alberta's current total of 12 H1N1 deaths is cumulative for all of 2009 - right back to the earlier "crisis" when Mexico was in the limelight.

kind words, rather blunt but it's how you take, if you can't find the stats either you suck a web searches or your just not trying....17 deaths from all flus in 2008 is the offical number from the alberta government I didn't make it up...

[bush_cheney2004]

...The public is not stupid....if they are given information to work with. This would have been a perfect opportunity to educate the public on the dangers and mortality potential of seasonal flu - while at the same time bringing to light the potential of the Swine Flu strain. Just give us the facts - wer're not dumb. That's my problem.

But alas, sometimes the public prefers to be "stupid", not exploring or wishing to embrace the cold hard facts. Complications of influenza like Pneumonia kills many thousands each year, as you have indicated. Most just dismiss such concerns as the expected demise of the elderly in nursing homes, and news media even shelter us from the details with euphemisms like "natural causes".

I have a brother-in-law fighting for his life in hospital as we speak, and it's pneumonia. He's bloated like the Stay Puft Marshmallow Man, and any talk about H1N1 risk has obviously become moot for him.

[Topaz]

But alas, sometimes the public prefers to be "stupid", not exploring or wishing to embrace the cold hard facts. Complications of influenza like Pneumonia kills many thousands each year, as you have indicated. Most just dismiss such concerns as the expected demise of the elderly in nursing homes, and news media even shelter us from the details with euphemisms like "natural causes".

I have a brother-in-law fighting for his life in hospital as we speak, and it's pneumonia. He's bloated like the Stay Puft Marshmallow Man, and any talk about H1N1 risk has obviously become moot for him.

Sorry about your brother-in-law, hope he makes it, miracles do happen. It sounds like his kidneys are problems too, the reason for the bloating?

[bush_cheney2004]

Sorry about your brother-in-law, hope he makes it, miracles do happen. It sounds like his kidneys are problems too, the reason for the bloating?

Thanks for the wishes, but he has been down for the count before. I guess that means the news media would announce his possible death as an unfortunate but not surprising "risk group" statistic, while healthier weenies like me just send flowers and a card.

Not sure about the kidneys, and I'm no doctor, but methinks lungs trump kidneys in the short term. They are bombing him with antivirals and antibacterials....lots of O2 as well.

[Wilber]

Sorry to hear about your brother in law BC. Hope things go well for him.

[Wilber]

Whether the current H1N1 situation is over hyped is a matter of opinion but the fact remains, many people die of the flu every year and this strain is more lethal to younger and often healthy young people than normal strains. Disregarding any real or perceived hype and who may be responsible for it, doesn't it seem logical to take reasonable available precautions not to get a disease that will make you very sick and could in rare instances, kill you? There is no need to panic over this, (it wouldn't help anyway) but instead of ranting about the government, media or whoever (equally futile), at least be pragmatic about how you evaluate your risk and the consequences of your actions. Don't make a decision on this because of ideology or because you are pissed at someone.

[bush_cheney2004]

Sorry to hear about your brother in law BC. Hope things go well for him.

Thanks.....it makes the debate a tad more interesting.

[Wilber]

Thanks.....it makes the debate a tad more interesting.

Thank your brother in law for us but tell him not to take the debate so seriously in future.

[capricorn]

Meanwhile, critics blasted the Conservative government Tuesday for going to only one company for the H1N1 vaccine.

If Canada, like the U.S., used multiple vaccine suppliers, critics charged, the country might have avoided the bottlenecks that formed while trying to get the vaccine out to Canadians.

"Getting 50 million doses from one company is like trying to fill 50 million cups of water from the same tap," accused NDP health critic Judy Wasylycia-Leis.

Canada's H1N1 vaccine is made exclusively by GlaxoSmithKline, which signed a 10-year contract in 2001 with the then-Liberal government to develop and produce enough vaccine for the entire population in the event of a pandemic.

The contract was awarded to Shire BioChem, a company that gave $57,000 to the Liberal Party in 2001. The company has since been bought out by GSK, but the contract remained valid since it secured the Ste. Foy vaccine production facility.

http://toronto.ctv.ca/servlet/an/local/CTVNews/20091104/vaccine_antigen_091104/20091104/?hub=TorontoNewHome

Here's CTV's video of the story first reported last night. As noted by Graham Richardson, awarding the contract to a sole supplier was not normal practice, not surprising as the contract was awarded while the Sponsorhip program was in full swing.

I wonder if Donolo has a headache yet.

[wyly]

http://toronto.ctv.ca/servlet/an/local/CTVNews/20091104/vaccine_antigen_091104/20091104/?hub=TorontoNewHome

Here's CTV's video of the story first reported last night. As noted by Graham Richardson, awarding the contract to a sole supplier was not normal practice, not surprising as the contract was awarded while the Sponsorhip program was in full swing.

I wonder if Donolo has a headache yet.

perhaps it may have been wiser to award the contract to several suppliers but we don't know the conditions of the deal yet.

plus until the feds asked the company to switch to a formula for pregnant women they seemed to be keeping up to demand...

[capricorn]

perhaps it may have been wiser to award the contract to several suppliers but we don't know the conditions of the deal yet.

Maybe there is nothing wrong with having a sole vaccine provider. I don't know enough to know one way or another. What is laughable is that the Liberals have been criticizing the Conservatives for not having more than one provider when they're the ones who negotiated a 10 year deal with GSK. And if we look south of the border, having four or five suppliers did nothing to ensure a faster roll out of the vaccine.

The director of the public health department in St. Paul said he thinks it will be "sometime between Christmas and mid-January" before there's enough vaccine to fully immunize high-risk groups, which include pregnant women, health workers, and parents caring for newborns, children 6 months through 24 years old, and chronically ill people 25 through 64.

The federal government has ordered 250 million doses of pandemic H1N1 influenza vaccine. It believes that will be more than enough to satisfy desire for it among the country's 308 million residents. The high-priority groups include 159 million people.

As of this week, 32.3 million doses of pandemic vaccine had been made available to states and cities by the federal government, which is controlling the entire U.S. supply.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2009/11/04/AR2009110403874_2.html

plus until the feds asked the company to switch to a formula for pregnant women they seemed to be keeping up to demand...

First the World Health Organization called for a non-adjuvant vaccine for pregnant women then changed its mind and declared the adjuvant vaccine was perfectly safe. This is perhaps when a second supplier would have saved the day.

[bjre]

No, I will not get a shot for this.

For regular flu, for 2 years in Canada I got shot, I still get flu. the rest of years, I didn't get shot, sometimes I got flu, sometimes not. I believe health balanced food and some sports will better than any kind of medicine.

If this time H1N1 has not cause more death than regular flu, why regular flu has not no fully reported as H1N1.

It is not only a "Pandemic", it is almost worldwide media campaign, and keep on emphasis on there are another death. But not emphasis how many death is mixed with other kind of diseases. And report some other animals got that H1N1 and with emphasis on the virus has not changed.

I even guess it can be somewhat medical company designed with a carefully chosen from new flu that happened every year.

They might choose one for sell their medicines.

They can make a lot of money from a lot of nations. With the help of media and politicians they can earn even more.

But this is a pure guess although I think it is very possible.

p.s.

If you want to get a shot, please go ahead, I don't know that much.

[bjre]

Thanks god that there is no law to define those who don't get the shot as a criminal yet.

[Keepitsimple]

well than you suck at researching the info is readily available....death toll in Alberta for H1N1 is now 12 at the beginning of flu season, the more common seasonal flu's killed 17 last year in Alberta, the Alberta government is predicting between 120 and 400 deaths from H1N1....testing for H1N1 was so overwhelming H1N1 that they no longer test for it unless it's critical...

Wyly...I suspect you are only 17 or 18 and might need time to develop your social skills so I accept your apology in advance. Alberta's Chief Medical Officer - Andre Corriveau, had this to say:

While H1N1 has grabbed the spotlight in recent months, Corriveau said regular seasonal influenza is also a serious disease, making it a contributing factor in some 200 deaths in the province every year.

Link: http://www.working.com/health/Alberta+offer+free+shots/1823667/story.html

[wyly]

Wyly...I suspect you are only 17 or 18 and might need time to develop your social skills so I accept your apology in advance. Alberta's Chief Medical Officer - Andre Corriveau, had this to say:

Link: http://www.working.com/health/Alberta+offer+free+shots/1823667/story.html

I did away with polite social skills when you were still in diapers...

the average yearly death toll has been repeated daily in papars here at 17...

[Keepitsimple]

I did away with polite social skills when you were still in diapers...

the average yearly death toll has been repeated daily in papars here at 17...

That would make you about 80 or 90 years old.....so maybe it's senility. Now that you know the facts, perhaps you can start to see H1N1 in the proper context.

[Keepitsimple]

Today's update on H1N1:

(CBC) - Public health officials and journalists have overstated the importance of the swine flu, a former Ontario chief medical officer of health says.

Dr. Richard Schabas, chief medical officer of health for Hastings and Prince Edward Counties in eastern Ontario, said the H1N1 influenza outbreak needs to be put into proper perspective.

About 200,000 people die in Canada every year from all causes combined, including about 4,000 from seasonal flu.

"By the time all the dust has settled on H1N1, somewhere between 200 and 300 people will have died in this country," Schabas said Thursday during a panel on media coverage of H1N1 on CBC News The National.

Schabas criticized the media for not trying to put the story into perspective, and for being "a little too easy to spin sometimes" by public health officials.

"I'm not letting the media off the hook totally, but I think the real villains of the piece here have been those public health officials who have consistently overplayed and overstated the importance of what is happening," he said.

"By the time all is said and done, this is not a major public health event, but you'd never know that from what some people are saying."

The panel also looked at the front-page coverage given to the death of Evan Frustaglio, a 13-year-old hockey player from Toronto. Evan died on the eve of the H1N1 vaccine becoming available, and demand for the vaccine jumped overnight, catching health officials by surprise.

"It was very clear when we were reporting the lines that most of the people in there did say, 'We came because we saw the story about that little boy,' " CBC reporter Ioanna Roumeliotis said.

Evan's death and his grieving father's plea to parents to consider vaccinating their children was a tremendous human interest story, agreed Dr. Allison McGeer, an infectious disease specialist at Toronto's Mount Sinai Hospital.

But "I'm quite sure that the people who were reporting that didn't necessarily think about what the consequences of that would be or the context that was in," McGeer said. "What we saw afterwards was that it caused an enormous amount of fear and anxiety that we would all like not to have seen."

A healthy child in Canada is about 20 times more likely to be killed by a car than by the H1N1 virus, Schabas said, but that isn't going to make the national news.

"Children actually die of flu every year and a few more die of H1N1. This was not unexpected, and the way it was presented as if this was a sudden bolt out of the blue, some change in our perspective of H1N1 that's what created the anxiety. It was the way it was presented."

Link: http://ca.news.yahoo.com/s/cbc/091106/science/science_h1n1_media

Edited November 9, 2009 by Keepitsimple

[capricorn]

I heard Dr. Schabas interviewed on radio CFRA in Ottawa this morning where he went further than the comments reported by the CBC. He said authorities should stop advertising that urges Canadians to get the H1N1 vaccine. He also said Canadians are aware the shot is available and will get vaccinated if they so wish. His analysis is that H1N1 is in significant decline. In other comments he made, I got the sense he questioned whether it was in fact worthwhile to now get the vaccine.

One thing he questioned was whether the decision to complete production of the seasonal flu shot before producing the H1N1 shot was a wise move given that at the time the level of the H1N1 threat was unknown.

[Oleg Bach]

Call my hat tin foil if you must. I figure that there is some wizard behind the curtain who knows his history and understands the best way to create a submissive and compliant society is through the use of apprehension and fear. Seeing there is a leadership vacum probably that extends world wide - I would figure that the chumps are simply pulling out the old manual on population manipulation..This flu is just the flu. People can be coerced best through what the hate and what the love most - that would be their children...to me this hysteria is simply more untalented and predictable chumps who could not run a nation let alone a planet going by the play book - You would think that they would stop underestimating the public. BUT - This class is taught that we are stupid and they are of superiour intelligence - it's getting real boaring listening to these losers attempting to dominate us.