bush_cheney2004 Posted October 28, 2009 Report Posted October 28, 2009 Yeah, it is not like the flu is a communicable disease or something. Just like SARS...or something....What? Me Worry? Quote Economics trumps Virtue.
Sir Bandelot Posted October 28, 2009 Report Posted October 28, 2009 Here's another nice little aside to this media-driven panic. "I have a headache..." "Oh my god!!! That could be the swine flu, rush little Johnny to the emergency ward!" Meanwhile there's 500 other people already there, coughing and sniffling. Wait in line. Almost all of them don't need to be there, except that they are ill with either a flu or cold, and scared for their very lives. Quote
bush_cheney2004 Posted October 28, 2009 Report Posted October 28, 2009 Anybody who is really worried should have adopted respiratory barrier protection long ago....just like Michael Jackson (but he died anyway of perfectly natural causes! ) Hell, go with a cheap HazMat suit if you like, and bottled air! If you get hit hard and go down for the count, they will blast you with anti-virals, coincident anti-bacterials, ventilator, and last rites. Can't ask for more than that! Quote Economics trumps Virtue.
wyly Posted October 28, 2009 Report Posted October 28, 2009 Anybody who is really worried should have adopted respiratory barrier protection long ago....just like Michael Jackson (but he died anyway of perfectly natural causes! )Hell, go with a cheap HazMat suit if you like, and bottled air! If you get hit hard and go down for the count, they will blast you with anti-virals, coincident anti-bacterials, ventilator, and last rites. Can't ask for more than that! jackson's death was not natural, it's being investigated as a homicide... Quote “Conservatives are not necessarily stupid, but most stupid people are conservatives.”- John Stuart Mill
bush_cheney2004 Posted October 28, 2009 Report Posted October 28, 2009 jackson's death was not natural, it's being investigated as a homicide... That's OK...Jackson lives on in a theatre near you. He died naturally...just like Elvis. Quote Economics trumps Virtue.
Topaz Posted October 28, 2009 Report Posted October 28, 2009 Of the dozens of people I know who get the shot every year, no one has gotten sick. Of the 100s of thousands who get the shot, very few get sick. Now we know whythe government said you can't sue the drug company if you get sick or worse. I believe they didn't do a very good job with the tests. Quote
wyly Posted October 28, 2009 Report Posted October 28, 2009 That's OK...Jackson lives on in a theatre near you. He died naturally...just like Elvis. purely based on your posts if you could see yourself as others do you'd be very embarassed... Quote “Conservatives are not necessarily stupid, but most stupid people are conservatives.”- John Stuart Mill
Smallc Posted October 28, 2009 Report Posted October 28, 2009 That's OK...Jackson lives on in a theatre near you. He died naturally...just like Elvis. And that has anything to do with this, even remotely, how? I can't believe people are so skeptical of modern medicine. This is just crazy. Quote
bush_cheney2004 Posted October 28, 2009 Report Posted October 28, 2009 purely based on your posts if you could see yourself as others do you'd be very embarassed... But I can't...and even if I could, I don't care what others think.....but apparently you do. Quote Economics trumps Virtue.
wyly Posted October 28, 2009 Report Posted October 28, 2009 And that has anything to do with this, even remotely, how? I can't believe people are so skeptical of modern medicine. This is just crazy. which the point of the thread debate...we're not dealing with logical rational people... Quote “Conservatives are not necessarily stupid, but most stupid people are conservatives.”- John Stuart Mill
bush_cheney2004 Posted October 28, 2009 Report Posted October 28, 2009 And that has anything to do with this, even remotely, how? Jackson had the means to take extreme precautions that you can only imagine.....didn't do him any good in the end. I can't believe people are so skeptical of modern medicine. This is just crazy. Well, Thalidomide was very "modern" in its day. Quote Economics trumps Virtue.
Topaz Posted October 28, 2009 Report Posted October 28, 2009 I don't know who you blame with the long line ups and up to 6 hours waiting for the flu shot. Is it the feds, the provinces or the municpalities that people have to wait and wait. I liked what some parts of the US did. They had drive-ins, were people stayed in their cars and rolled up their sleeves and drove off. Since the 12 year old boy died, more people are coming out and yet there are people in line that shouldn't be there yet, its a mess in some locations. Quote
M.Dancer Posted October 28, 2009 Report Posted October 28, 2009 Now we know whythe government said you can't sue the drug company if you get sick or worse. I believe they didn't do a very good job with the tests. You believe a lot of things.... Quote RIGHT of SOME, LEFT of OTHERS If it is a choice between them and us, I choose us
Topaz Posted October 28, 2009 Report Posted October 28, 2009 You believe a lot of things.... Weel, I rather be open-minded than narrow minded or have one track mind, something the new conservatives have. Quote
M.Dancer Posted October 29, 2009 Report Posted October 29, 2009 or have one track mind, something the new conservatives have. That's rather narrow minded of you. Quote RIGHT of SOME, LEFT of OTHERS If it is a choice between them and us, I choose us
Wilber Posted October 29, 2009 Report Posted October 29, 2009 Indeed and as a result we are seeing stronger diseases, more virulent drug resistant illnesses. Penicillin isn't nearly as effective as it was in years past. We are deluding ourselves to think we are above the balance of nature. What's the other side of living longer? Higher populations, more densely populated regions, which are a breeding ground for disease; this also causes the issue of high demands on resources which creates a host of other problems. As I said for all our science and medicine we haven't been able to eradicate the simple flu or cold and why? Because nature always wins, everything has a control on it, including humans. As we adapt, whether physiologically or technologically so too will the diseases and viral strains adapt. There is much we don't understand and sometimes we make things worse by our meddling then we fix. A long lifespan does not mean anything, sciences has shown viruses to be the most adaptive and resilient then anything else on the planet. If you believe that someday science will solve all our ills that's great for you, I however do not share your optimism. We will never be able to control all factors and it's a fool’s errand to try. As I said, there has been zero evidence to show that the swine flu is any more deadly than other flu strains. The only difference is this particular flu has gotten a lot more media attention. You can only have drug resistant diseases if you have drugs. What does it matter whether a flu or other virus is drug resistant if it kills you anyway? A big reason drugs like penicillin have become less effective is because of over prescribing by doctors and patients who stop taking them as soon as they start to feel better before they have taken the whole prescription. That is how these viruses mutate. If the body doesn't kill them completely, they become resistant. You say we are not above the balance of nature then you say we have screwed up the balance by living too long. Which is it? I would say we are not above the laws of nature but we have become quite good at using many of them to our advantage. Diseases like polio still kill and maim in third world countries because there are no universal vaccination programs. Not my idea of paradise. Before the development of a vaccine for yellow fever, West Africa and what are now vacation paradises in the West Indies were grave yards for Europeans. The disease single handedly prevented the building of the Panama Canal until its cause was identified and a vaccine developed. If you think the world would be a better place if most people didn't make it out of their thirties, then you go first. I'll end with the obvious, the more people who are infected by a disease the greater the chance it will mutate. Flu and other viruses were mutating for millenia before there were vaccines or antibiotics. I am getting my annual flu shot on Saturday and will get the H1N1 shot when all those who are designated high risk have had their turn. Why? To protect me from folks like you. Quote "Never trust a man who has not a single redeeming vice". WSC
Smallc Posted October 29, 2009 Report Posted October 29, 2009 Well, Thalidomide was very "modern" in its day. So we should become suspicious of all medicine Quote
bush_cheney2004 Posted October 29, 2009 Report Posted October 29, 2009 So we should become suspicious of all medicine No..we should be suspicious of all "miracles". Quote Economics trumps Virtue.
bush_cheney2004 Posted October 29, 2009 Report Posted October 29, 2009 .....I'll end with the obvious, the more people who are infected by a disease the greater the chance it will mutate. Flu and other viruses were mutating for millenia before there were vaccines or antibiotics. I am getting my annual flu shot on Saturday and will get the H1N1 shot when all those who are designated high risk have had their turn. Why? To protect me from folks like you. It's not altogether clear to me that you will not transmit the virus just like anyone else, even with vaccination. The vaccine is really for you...not the rest of us. Quote Economics trumps Virtue.
Smallc Posted October 29, 2009 Report Posted October 29, 2009 No..we should be suspicious of all "miracles". Medicine has nothing to do with miracles, no matter how you want to spin things. Quote
Smallc Posted October 29, 2009 Report Posted October 29, 2009 It's not altogether clear to me that you will not transmit the virus just like anyone else, even with vaccination. The vaccine is really for you...not the rest of us. Public health people have repeated over and over again that it will help prevent transmission. It will not be able to multiply within your body nearly as easy even if you have had contact with it. It's much harder to pass along. Quote
bush_cheney2004 Posted October 29, 2009 Report Posted October 29, 2009 Public health people have repeated over and over again that it will help prevent transmission. It will not be able to multiply within your body nearly as easy even if you have had contact with it. It's much harder to pass along. Harder but certainly not impossible, and absolutely no efficacy for external point transmission (i.e. hands). I'm sure it does help, but I am very leary of anyone who smugly advertises that they are made harmless because they've been vaccinated. Quote Economics trumps Virtue.
M.Dancer Posted October 29, 2009 Report Posted October 29, 2009 ....but I am very leary of anyone who smugly advertises that they are made harmless because they've been vaccinated. And so you should be....a vaccine may be a fire wall if enough get it but it is primarily a way to protect your own ass...in this family we all get it..only we nay have been a tad late as my son is in the hospital ER with a nasty cough and a fever that has lingered since last friday..on monday our paediatrician said he was fine, lungs clear and the fever should be gone in no time.... SO far no worries....although my daughter is destroyed and beside her self cause she's been a shit to him (because he's been catered to,) and pooh poohing his sickness....now she feels guilty... Quote RIGHT of SOME, LEFT of OTHERS If it is a choice between them and us, I choose us
bush_cheney2004 Posted October 29, 2009 Report Posted October 29, 2009 And so you should be....a vaccine may be a fire wall if enough get it but it is primarily a way to protect your own ass...in this family we all get it..only we nay have been a tad late as my son is in the hospital ER with a nasty cough and a fever that has lingered since last friday..on monday our paediatrician said he was fine, lungs clear and the fever should be gone in no time.... Correct focus...it's all about keeping those lungs clear. We can't get vaccinated even if we wanted to, because other groups have priority. Quote Economics trumps Virtue.
bush_cheney2004 Posted October 29, 2009 Report Posted October 29, 2009 Medicine has nothing to do with miracles, no matter how you want to spin things. Make choices for yourself.....not me. Quote Economics trumps Virtue.
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