Army Guy Posted July 27, 2009 Report Share Posted July 27, 2009 Army Guy, if you spot someone in Real Life, having anything to do with the planting of an IED over there, shoot them a lot. The video that I've seen of Omar only shows an innocent kid `playing war'. If you'd have caught him planting an IED, I'd want to kill him myself. But I seriously doubt this kid intended to hurt anyone. This country has been at war for more than 30 years now, Children don't play "war" over here, during my 3 tours i never seen any kids running around with sticks or fake guns playing war.....they live through the real events of war everyday... Life in Afghan is much different than it is in Canada, Comparing our children and thier lives, is 2 completely differnet things altogether, Children over there don't play war, they daily lives are spent looking for food, working, hauling water, occasional you may see them playing soccer, but not often....an empty belly, poor living conditions, poor sanitation, poor health care, sets a grim tone, and fills thier days completely....that and thier customs are very different...for instance once they have passed thier passage to becoming men they are considered adults this is normally done around age 11...this means they will carry out duties reglated to men, defending the village or clan is one of them, so they take up arms at an early age is normal...."why play war, when you'll be doing it soon enough" Purchasing a AK-47 in Afghan is considered a must, like buying your kid a bike in North America...it is used to hunt, and defend your family... IED's are a major problem in Afghan, and NATO takes it deadly serious, it spends alot of it's assets seaching or preventing IED teams from laying thier deadly goods, from Sat, to UAV's to combat air patrols, to soldiers on patrols, or observation teams watching the major routes....anyways you get the idea...to attract the attention of any of these assets all you have to do is be on the roads, once you start adding up a few things such as a pick and shovel NATO starts to prepare combat assets to engage or investigate, once they start digging on the roads it is assumed they are hostile, and engagement is authorized in most cases....That engagement is normally the use of deadly force, such as a helo or fast air attack, or an arty strike My piont is WHY would a group of people Play war knowing full well the consquences of thier actions could end up in thier deaths....they take this risk for one reason only to kill NATO soldiers, not for the adrinaline rush, or for play, but to do thier part in terrorizing NATO, and the people of Afghan. And i say the people because NATO is not thier only targets. Bomb making facilties and people who frequent them are a high priority target for any NATO operation, it has already been proven that the mud hut complex that was destroyed in the fire fight that seen our young Mr Khadr wounded was a Bomb making facility....pictures and vidios were taken of bomb making material and componets found in the ruins. every Afghan civilian knows this....It's published, every patrol that goes out makes this known to the public....Bomb makers in Afghan have a very short life span, they are hunted relentlessly, civilians also know that even knowing of thier existance could bring trouble...so they are often given up or pionted out quickly when asked.... My piont is Mr Khadr was involved is some very serious terrorist actions, which over in Afghan would bring about his death, no questions asked....However now a majority of Canadians want to bring him back to Canada to let him have his day in court....the same courts that require a high degree of evidence or proof to convict...but we quickly forget that in a combat zone collection of edvidence is not even on the priority list, in fact it is not even a requirement, other than taking a few pictures of the scene, used for other inquiries such as battle damage assetments, identy of enemy soldiers killed, damage to civilian assets, etc etc.... It is for this very reason in which he was going to a military court in the first place, where this is clearly understood...if we tried every terrorist caught in a war zone in a civilian court none or very little would be convicted....shit could we even convict Bin Ladin.... As a soldier i often ask myself why is that my ROE's and all the conventions, and inter-national and Canadian law i can take the life and we are fully justified in doing that, and yet we take this same indivdual and place him in our courts and we do not have enough info or evidence for a conviction....Something is wrong here. Each and every Canadian must ask themselfs WHY is it that Omar should not be held accountable for his actions, do we set different standards for young offenders who have commited serious offences. Do we consider terrorist activites a major crime....Why is it we are willing to sweep this under the table. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
benny Posted July 27, 2009 Report Share Posted July 27, 2009 This country has been at war for more than 30 years now, Children don't play "war" over here, during my 3 tours i never seen any kids running around with sticks or fake guns playing war.....they live through the real events of war everyday...Life in Afghan is much different than it is in Canada, Comparing our children and thier lives, is 2 completely differnet things altogether, Children over there don't play war, they daily lives are spent looking for food, working, hauling water, occasional you may see them playing soccer, but not often....an empty belly, poor living conditions, poor sanitation, poor health care, sets a grim tone, and fills thier days completely....that and thier customs are very different...for instance once they have passed thier passage to becoming men they are considered adults this is normally done around age 11...this means they will carry out duties reglated to men, defending the village or clan is one of them, so they take up arms at an early age is normal...."why play war, when you'll be doing it soon enough" Purchasing a AK-47 in Afghan is considered a must, like buying your kid a bike in North America...it is used to hunt, and defend your family... IED's are a major problem in Afghan, and NATO takes it deadly serious, it spends alot of it's assets seaching or preventing IED teams from laying thier deadly goods, from Sat, to UAV's to combat air patrols, to soldiers on patrols, or observation teams watching the major routes....anyways you get the idea...to attract the attention of any of these assets all you have to do is be on the roads, once you start adding up a few things such as a pick and shovel NATO starts to prepare combat assets to engage or investigate, once they start digging on the roads it is assumed they are hostile, and engagement is authorized in most cases....That engagement is normally the use of deadly force, such as a helo or fast air attack, or an arty strike My piont is WHY would a group of people Play war knowing full well the consquences of thier actions could end up in thier deaths....they take this risk for one reason only to kill NATO soldiers, not for the adrinaline rush, or for play, but to do thier part in terrorizing NATO, and the people of Afghan. And i say the people because NATO is not thier only targets. Bomb making facilties and people who frequent them are a high priority target for any NATO operation, it has already been proven that the mud hut complex that was destroyed in the fire fight that seen our young Mr Khadr wounded was a Bomb making facility....pictures and vidios were taken of bomb making material and componets found in the ruins. every Afghan civilian knows this....It's published, every patrol that goes out makes this known to the public....Bomb makers in Afghan have a very short life span, they are hunted relentlessly, civilians also know that even knowing of thier existance could bring trouble...so they are often given up or pionted out quickly when asked.... My piont is Mr Khadr was involved is some very serious terrorist actions, which over in Afghan would bring about his death, no questions asked....However now a majority of Canadians want to bring him back to Canada to let him have his day in court....the same courts that require a high degree of evidence or proof to convict...but we quickly forget that in a combat zone collection of edvidence is not even on the priority list, in fact it is not even a requirement, other than taking a few pictures of the scene, used for other inquiries such as battle damage assetments, identy of enemy soldiers killed, damage to civilian assets, etc etc.... It is for this very reason in which he was going to a military court in the first place, where this is clearly understood...if we tried every terrorist caught in a war zone in a civilian court none or very little would be convicted....shit could we even convict Bin Ladin.... As a soldier i often ask myself why is that my ROE's and all the conventions, and inter-national and Canadian law i can take the life and we are fully justified in doing that, and yet we take this same indivdual and place him in our courts and we do not have enough info or evidence for a conviction....Something is wrong here. Each and every Canadian must ask themselfs WHY is it that Omar should not be held accountable for his actions, do we set different standards for young offenders who have commited serious offences. Do we consider terrorist activites a major crime....Why is it we are willing to sweep this under the table. Afghanistan needs its own army; it will have it by attracting its children to join one. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Army Guy Posted July 27, 2009 Report Share Posted July 27, 2009 Although this video has been used as evidence already in this thread, I'll entertain your post. How much of the video actually (Not Allegedly) shows him `planting' IEDs? Hmmm? None?He's filmed in nightvision by someone and there's a brief shot of some robed figure with a pick-ax allegedly digging the pit in which a land mine is allegedly placed. But there isn't a shred of video proof that Omar was directly involved in the planting of a land mine just like there's no proof he threw a grenade. Once again this type of thinking only proves my piont, just a few posts ago you clearly said that all IED teams be shot , shot alot you said....In Afghan you clearly explain exactly what our snipers would see, thru night vision equipment, they report back thru the chain of command exactly what they saw, a group of people digging a hole on a roadside....and in most case HQ would authorize an egagement...Snipers would then pri each indiv there by threat level ie who has a wpn, explosive, etc etc right down to those that have no wpns....because as a group they are all complicit in the act, and under the conventions and laws are considered a military target to be engaged. normally that means death....Which is a war zone , i get that ....however take the same picture or vid from that same war zone and we have squat according to you not enough to warrent any criminal procedings....i don't get it.... Having this amount of evidence is a rare find, normally we would not have any of this , a vid, or evidence found at the site....because of serveral factors, how do we proscute these terrorist....if they are lucky to survive the attack....what i see happening is soldiers taking these decissions themselfs, Knowing that if it does make it to court nothing will become of it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
benny Posted July 27, 2009 Report Share Posted July 27, 2009 Once again this type of thinking only proves my piont, just a few posts ago you clearly said that all IED teams be shot , shot alot you said....In Afghan you clearly explain exactly what our snipers would see, thru night vision equipment, they report back thru the chain of command exactly what they saw, a group of people digging a hole on a roadside....and in most case HQ would authorize an egagement...Snipers would then pri each indiv there by threat level ie who has a wpn, explosive, etc etc right down to those that have no wpns....because as a group they are all complicit in the act, and under the conventions and laws are considered a military target to be engaged. normally that means death....Which is a war zone , i get that ....however take the same picture or vid from that same war zone and we have squat according to you not enough to warrent any criminal procedings....i don't get it.... Having this amount of evidence is a rare find, normally we would not have any of this , a vid, or evidence found at the site....because of serveral factors, how do we proscute these terrorist....if they are lucky to survive the attack....what i see happening is soldiers taking these decissions themselfs, Knowing that if it does make it to court nothing will become of it. No matter how many years you revisit this video, the age of the actors in it will not increase one bit. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moxie Posted July 27, 2009 Report Share Posted July 27, 2009 He did not meet the age requirement to be a child soldier but don't let facts get in the way of your propaganda benny. I hope he's sent to Afghanistan where he shall be tried by a jury of women, the self same women he wanted to imprison in their homes for a lifetime. I don't want him brought back to Canada and I do not care what happens to him today, tomorrow and the next year. I care about the women his ideology would of enslaved, the Taliban whom he was a member are a vile murdering bunch of vermin and he's one of them. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
benny Posted July 27, 2009 Report Share Posted July 27, 2009 He did not meet the age requirement to be a child soldier but don't let facts get in the way of your propaganda benny. I hope he's sent to Afghanistan where he shall be tried by a jury of women, the self same women he wanted to imprison in their homes for a lifetime. I don't want him brought back to Canada and I do not care what happens to him today, tomorrow and the next year. I care about the women his ideology would of enslaved, the Taliban whom he was a member are a vile murdering bunch of vermin and he's one of them. It is not about women, it is about oil. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eyeball Posted August 1, 2009 Report Share Posted August 1, 2009 Innocent playing war? in Afganistan? Do you accuse our solders of playing war? He was there aiding our enemies, there was no "play". I'm reminded of the official rhetoric that describes our military interference in Afghanistan in the context of Canada being a player on the world's stage. Everyone's playing around it seems. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
benny Posted August 1, 2009 Report Share Posted August 1, 2009 I'm reminded of the official rhetoric that describes our military interference in Afghanistan in the context of Canada being a player on the world's stage. Everyone's playing around it seems. Yes but suspicion arises when one is too serious to play. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
xul Posted August 2, 2009 Report Share Posted August 2, 2009 He's not in our land and hopefully he never will be. I think the governemnt should send a strongly worded letter demanding Omar be sent back and then never raise the matter again. It seems like you are the only Canadian here who understands how the system works... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
benny Posted August 2, 2009 Report Share Posted August 2, 2009 It seems like you are the only Canadian here who understands how the system works... He certainly understands the difference between workdays and weekends! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
xul Posted August 3, 2009 Report Share Posted August 3, 2009 He certainly understands the difference between workdays and weekends! Do you really believe that Canadian government will not willingly do what he has suggested? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
benny Posted August 3, 2009 Report Share Posted August 3, 2009 Do you really believe that Canadian government will not willingly do what he has suggested? When I think about Canadian government I imagine myself as its leader. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
xul Posted August 3, 2009 Report Share Posted August 3, 2009 When I think about Canadian government I imagine myself as its leader. Holding a few shares of a corporation doesn't make everyone the chairman of board or CEO....and the current CEO has showed his "value" on dealing with such kind of issues in past years and he knows most common shareholders care their financial interests more than their ad-lib humanitarian roles, so he can ignore such kind of minor requests from his shareholders and do whatever he wants without worrying to be kicked out of office. This is my understanding of the system. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
benny Posted August 4, 2009 Report Share Posted August 4, 2009 Holding a few shares of a corporation doesn't make everyone the chairman of board or CEO....and the current CEO has showed his "value" on dealing with such kind of issues in past years and he knows most common shareholders care their financial interests more than their ad-lib humanitarian roles, so he can ignore such kind of minor requests from his shareholders and do whatever he wants without worrying to be kicked out of office. This is my understanding of the system. Outsourcing can only be a short-term fix. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Radsickle Posted August 14, 2009 Report Share Posted August 14, 2009 Each and every Canadian must ask themselfs WHY is it that Omar should not be held accountable for his actions, do we set different standards for young offenders who have commited serious offences. Do we consider terrorist activites a major crime....Why is it we are willing to sweep this under the table. Again you try to make it seem like I don't want Omar to be held accountable yet I've restated many times that I want him to be held accountable... to fellow Canadians and according to Canadian Laws. Please stop trying to overlook this part. I just want him out of the disgraceful Gitmo torture chamber and in a proper system of justice that our neighbours haven't supplied. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
benny Posted August 14, 2009 Report Share Posted August 14, 2009 Omar is in Cuba really. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bush_cheney2004 Posted August 14, 2009 Report Share Posted August 14, 2009 Again you try to make it seem like I don't want Omar to be held accountable yet I've restated many times that I want him to be held accountable... to fellow Canadians and according to Canadian Laws. Please stop trying to overlook this part. I just want him out of the disgraceful Gitmo torture chamber and in a proper system of justice that our neighbours haven't supplied. Maybe they're not your "neighbours" after all......you want him...come and get him. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
benny Posted August 14, 2009 Report Share Posted August 14, 2009 Maybe they're not your "neighbours" after all......you want him...come and get him. Obama is closer to me than to you. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Radsickle Posted August 14, 2009 Report Share Posted August 14, 2009 (edited) Maybe they're not your "neighbours" after all......you want him...come and get him. Dude, I'm at the point where I would shoot you, especially because of your forum name. Edited August 14, 2009 by Radsickle Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bush_cheney2004 Posted August 14, 2009 Report Share Posted August 14, 2009 Dude, I'm at the point where I would shoot you. Well, at least you didn't call me a "twit" again....tough guy! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bush_cheney2004 Posted August 14, 2009 Report Share Posted August 14, 2009 Obama is closer to me than to you. So is Charles Manson. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
benny Posted August 14, 2009 Report Share Posted August 14, 2009 (edited) Dude, I'm at the point where I would shoot you, especially because of your forum name. W Bush and D Cheney are already two ghosts, two living-deads. Edited August 14, 2009 by benny Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Radsickle Posted August 14, 2009 Report Share Posted August 14, 2009 twit would be a compliment. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bush_cheney2004 Posted August 14, 2009 Report Share Posted August 14, 2009 twit would be a compliment. But the best you can do......that's OK. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
benny Posted August 14, 2009 Report Share Posted August 14, 2009 Impossible to imagine W Bush travelling around the world at the rescue of some Americans like what is doing Bill Clinton. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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