Tailban holding Canadian

M.Dancer · April 6, 2009

Correct me if I'm wrong but I've always thought that the Taliban had always made demands such as prisoner exchange or dictates for infidels to leave, etc.., That it's always been for a cause...or their rights...
I'm surprised that the Taliban would demand for monetary ransom.

So in other words after all their posturing, it's nothing but just a common criminal after all.

I would say there are the Taliban..and then the taliban.....the small t taliabn are opportunists who will take the Taliaban's money to do their bidding as well as freelance work. It is the smal t Taliban that NATO hopes to disengage from the big T...they just have to make working for the Big T not cost effective.

Topaz · April 6, 2009

I have read her website from time to time and what I found was info. that the west didn't want us to know about with the was of Iraq and Afg. I'm not saying she right or wrong she just doing what she thinks is right just like we in the west are. To visit her website its... http://www.jihadunspun.com/index.php

August1991 · April 6, 2009

According to this article, Ms Qahaar was a hardcore alcoholic prior to becoming a born-again Christian:
http://www.straight.com/article-210122/giestbrecht

That's an interesting link, Kimmy.

It has been suggested that this is a ploy to raise money through a pseudo-kidnapping.

I'm more inclined to go with Molly's opinion above that this woman has mental health issues. This is a variant of extreme tourism with a particular angle: I am surprised by the number of westerners who have forgotten how we in the west became western, or even what the term means. Too many people take the Enlightenment for granted.

Moonbox · April 6, 2009

I have read her website from time to time and what I found was info. that the west didn't want us to know about with the was of Iraq and Afg. I'm not saying she right or wrong she just doing what she thinks is right just like we in the west are.

Everyone thinks what they're doing is 'right'. The problem is a lot these people have their facts and morals pretty heavily twisted up.

I'm not saying the 'west' is standing on a particularly strong moral ground, but I will say that it's standing on firmer grounds than people like Saddam Hussein, the Taliban, Pakistan etc.

waldo · April 7, 2009

your readiness to equate a horrific murderous beheading to substance abuse death clearly shows your detachment. Your curt, caustic, “the author’s of their own demise” summation… brings you comfort! Comfort!
to find the irony you describe is one thing – to callously announce it another… but to brazenly revel in it shows a special insensitivity.

Is it more sad if someone dies by grisly murder than if someone dies by car crash or drug overdose? Dead is dead, it seems to me.

Like the drug overdose casualty or the drunk driving casualty, the cause of her death is, ultimately, her own choices. She sought her killers out, she made the decision to associate with them, believing them to be her allies. She may as well have jammed a needle into her wrist.

Like all the Lower Mainland gangsters that have been slain this year, she's in danger because she chose to involve herself in situations that sensible people avoid. I will feel the same about her death as I do about theirs: said that a Canadian person wasted their life foolishly by becoming involved in something so stupid, but beyond that of little consequence to anyone except her own friends and family.

the rather significant consequence to you is certainly on display within this thread… as your profile states, this thread gives an opportunity to repeatedly “enjoy Kimmy today” – where Kimmy seeks comfort in the misfortunes of others.

this possible beheading of Canadian Beverly Giesbrecht lets Kimmy seek alternative comfort away from the more usual domestic drunk driving, drug overdose and ‘gangster’ killings… we can sense a greater degree of comfort-digginess will register with news of an eventual beheading. Will Kimmy have the gang over to watch the video – will there be party hats?

betsy · April 7, 2009

Death by beheading is quite shockingly gruesome. It probably is painfully a slow torturous death.

The video of the first western guy who got beheaded got to the core...I haven't seen that and I have no intention of seeing it.

What makes it all the more scary is the coldness of the perpetrators who's actually doing the killing. They have a purpose. It's meant to shock us into fear.

Remember that other English woman who married a Muslim and was doing charity works for that community, was abducted and executed? Her husband and the people she was helping pleaded for her. Marriage and doing good things for the community did not give her immunity.

If this poor woman die, let her death be not for naught.

Let it be a clear warning to all that converting to Islam, and being an activist for the jihadists' cause does not mean you are no longer seen as an infidel.

I pray Al Jazeera will do the best they can to help her. They must know somebody who's got connection...

Edited April 7, 2009 by betsy

mikedavid00 · April 7, 2009

So another Canadian has their live on the line

...by her own choice.

She's laying in the bed she made for herself. She chose her own destiny and there's nothing we can do about it but take it as a learning lesson.

There's many here on the forum who support terrorism, who support 9-11, who support Mehar Arar, the Kader family, Tamils, etc. the list goes on.

Let this by a lesson to those people.

eyeball · April 7, 2009

There's many here on the forum who support terrorism, who support 9-11, who support Mehar Arar, the Kader family, Tamils, etc. the list goes on.
Let this by a lesson to those people.

Bullshit. A lot of people simply understand that supporting dictatorships will often lead to terrorism. What's patently clear is that many on this forum think supporting dictatorships is acceptable and even preferable in some cases. Equating understanding with support is just as stupid but I suppose there will always be people who insist on learning their lessons the hard way.

tango · April 7, 2009

So ... I guess no one's taking seriously the possibility that she's a Canadian spy? :lol:

Big T must not be paying this particular little t, if they are reduced to kidnapping for ransom.

She doesn't seem too 'mentally ill' to me, at least her thought processes here ...

Sep 11, 2008

http://www.jihadunspun.com/index-side_inte.../index.php&

This year, the seventh anniversary of the attacks on America fall within this blessed month of Ramadan providing us with a special opportunity to give thought to our current condition. Since America unleashed its hellfire on Afghanistan following the 2001 attacks, Muslims around the world have been killed, injured, detained, humiliated and demonized in a ceaseless war that America has loosely termed a ‘war on terror” but that has no specific definition or end.

Three thousand Americans died in the attacks on America that fateful day in 2001 and seven years on, the Muslim death toll now exceeds a million, the number of detainees countless and the destruction to Muslim land in the trillions of dollars. While the war was first said to be against Osama bin Laden, America then turned their guns on Afghanistan and the Taliban who refused to turn Bin Laden over without proof of his guilt. Then came Iraq, and since then, America has deliberately instigated a war against Islam itself. Today, any Muslim who does not agree with American foreign policy is a terrorist and the practice of Islam itself is equated as “terrorism”.

By now it must be clear to every Muslim, non-Muslim, agnostic and atheist that the number one threat to world peace is America itself. This has been clearly demonstrated in their sordid actions over the past seven years. And while this can not be emphasized enough, that does not mean that we must not take a critical look at our own actions that are failing to stop the aggression against us.

And then this ...

Oct 22, 2008

By Khadija Abdul Qahaar | Jihad Unspun

Assalamualeikum Wa Rahmatulahi Wa Barakatu

In The Name Of Allah The Most Gracious The Most Merciful

Dear Brother And Sisters,

May this reach you in the best of health and strongest of Imaan. Ameen.

I apologize for writing this letter of request particularly to you those of you who has been such a great contributor to our site but unfortunately I must. As you know, the JUS team is in Pakistan making a documentary film and shoring up direct contacts for our news report which have become very weak in recent years due to third hand reporting and a variety of other challenges.

While we have made tremendous progress, Pakistan is now erupting into a full scale war zone. We have been in some very sensitive areas and even Islamabad is now locked down. As foreigners we must leave the country however we do not have the funds to get out. Our visas are expiring and they will not be renewed as the Canadian and British embassies are demanding all foreign national to leave due to the security situation.

Allah knows that I really dislike having to ask but please know how hard we work for Allah. We have managed to get very good material out of the country to our production group but our physical safety is now paramount. I make this personal and urgent appeal to you to send whatever contribution you can to assist us to return to Canada and Britain (I am Canadian, our other member with me is from Britain and we also have some local Pakistanis who can not leave the country I am afraid). As a woman, I have already had a few close calls in the tribal areas as kidnappers and thieves are running loose even in Peshawar but alhamdulilah Allah has helped us.

I can see why she's not popular in Ottawa, though.

Have they even mentioned this?

Edited April 7, 2009 by tango

tango · April 7, 2009

...by her own choice.
She's laying in the bed she made for herself. She chose her own destiny and there's nothing we can do about it but take it as a learning lesson.

There's many here on the forum who support terrorism, who support 9-11, who support Mehar Arar, the Kader family, Tamils, etc. the list goes on.

Let this by a lesson to those people.

mikedavid ... you are too ... funny.

Original newscast when she went missing ...

Edited April 7, 2009 by tango

Oleg Bach · April 7, 2009

...by her own choice.
She's laying in the bed she made for herself. She chose her own destiny and there's nothing we can do about it but take it as a learning lesson.

There's many here on the forum who support terrorism, who support 9-11, who support Mehar Arar, the Kader family, Tamils, etc. the list goes on.

Let this by a lesson to those people.

That's silly - no one on this forum grants support ot terrorism...beheading - torture - or murder. So what if they take a resonable approach to the Kahar family issue and explore all attitudes and all facts...besides what is a terrorists...You could class a pan handler as a terrorist...perhaps to you global warming is a terrorist - or an unwed mother on welfare? I suppose the real definition of a terrorist is anyone that wants help form you and you refuse so they attempt to take your wealth by force - I suppose that is the way America views who is a terrorists - poor people who are hungry...or rich Saudi Arabians who are bored and need a purpose - In the future, please to not insinuate that we have crimminals that debate - declare or converse within this forum...It simply is not true and for one to say that WE at Mapleleafweb.....are terrorist - could very well deem you as a terrible and terrific terrorist.. :rolleyes:

kimmy · April 8, 2009

the rather significant consequence to you is certainly on display within this thread… as your profile states, this thread gives an opportunity to repeatedly “enjoy Kimmy today” – where Kimmy seeks comfort in the misfortunes of others.
this possible beheading of Canadian Beverly Giesbrecht lets Kimmy seek alternative comfort away from the more usual domestic drunk driving, drug overdose and ‘gangster’ killings… we can sense a greater degree of comfort-digginess will register with news of an eventual beheading.

Kimmy does not seek comfort in the misfortune of others.

Kimmy is saddened when Canadians die needlessly. When Kimmy is confronted with the sadness of a needless death, Kimmy seeks comfort. In cases when the person's needless death is a result of their

Recently, Kimmy was horrified to hear that a young mom was shot to death in her car, with her baby in the back seat. Kimmy's dismay was greatly reduced when she discovered that the dead mom was a member of a violent Vancouver drug gang. Self-inflicted.

Kimmy was also horrified to hear that a Canadian had been kidnapped by the Taliban. Kimmy's dismay was again greatly reduced when she discovered that the victim had gone to seek out the Taliban, believing them to be her homies. Self-inflicted.

Ms Qahaar, like drunk drivers, gang members, hardcore drug users, and many other people who choose to engage in risky activities, is in danger for one reason, and one reason alone: she put herself there. While that must be very sad to her friends and family, I feel very little sympathy for her. If you feel differently, perhaps you should start trying to raise $2 million to free her.

Will Kimmy have the gang over to watch the video – will there be party hats?

There will be no party hats. However, I might send name in for a Darwin Award. She appears to have reproduced, however, which may render her ineligible.

You didn't answer my question: why do you continue to refer to her as Beverly Giesbrecht?

Do you doubt the sincerity of her religious conversion?

Do you not respect the choice she made to become Khadija Abdul Qahaar?

Are you the sort of person who still refers to Muhammad Ali as Cassius Clay?

She doesn't seem too 'mentally ill' to me, at least her thought processes here ...

Many people seem to label anything they don't understand or agree with "insane".

Some people say Robert Pickton must be insane, because no sane person could have done those terrible things.

And here we have people saying Beverly Giesbrecht may be insane, because no sane person would change her name to Khadija Qahaar and convert to Islam and campaign on behalf of the Taliban.

I've read articles arguing that feminism is a symptom of insanity, I've read articles arguing that conservatism is a symptom of insanity.

All of which is crap, in my opinion.

I think Robert Pickton may be entirely sane and simply enjoys killing prostitutes.

I think Ms Qahaar may have been entirely sane and simply chose to reject a typical western world view in favor of an entirely different one.

I believe attributing someone's actions as mental illness is inappropriate unless there is an actual diagnosable condition with specific symptoms. While I'm no mental health professional, I see little reason to suspect Ms Qahaar to have any such condition. She's clearly intelligent, clearly has the ability to reason and think logically, and while I don't agree with her interpretation of facts, that is in itself no reason to doubt her sanity. There are lots of people much saner than I am who I disagree with.

And while I myself simply can't grasp the value many people place on religion, the sheer number of people for whom religion is a powerful force precludes the possibility that embracing religion is a symptom of mental illness, in my opinion.

-k

Argus · April 13, 2009

So ... I guess no one's taking seriously the possibility that she's a Canadian spy?
Big T must not be paying this particular little t, if they are reduced to kidnapping for ransom.

She doesn't seem too 'mentally ill' to me, at least her thought processes here ...

No doubt. She clearly has a preference for the same kind of headgear as you do.

tango · April 13, 2009

No doubt. She clearly has a preference for the same kind of headgear as you do.

Attacking the poster instead of the post displays a deficit of discussion points.

Please try again.

Update ...

BEVERLY GIESBRECHT

Taliban shelve plan to kill Canadian hostage

But militants in Pakistan's tribal region are still holding out for ransom

REHMAT MEHSUD

Special to The Globe and Mail

April 8, 2009

PESHAWAR, PAKISTAN -- Taliban militants in Pakistan's tribal region have decided to shelve plans to kill Canadian hostage Beverly Giesbrecht, but her captors are apparently still holding out for a ransom before releasing her.

"After broad-based consultations, the Shura [leadership council] has postponed indefinitely the plan to kill the woman," said Qari, a close associate of Taliban commander Gul Bahadur, who asked to be identified by his first name only.

The abduction of Ms. Giesbrecht, 53, has become a sensitive issue, and tribesmen of the embattled area are reluctant to speak on the matter openly. However, some locals said that while there is no hard information about her release, it could come at any time.

http://www.theglobeandmail.com/servlet/sto...y/International

Edited April 13, 2009 by tango

kimmy · April 13, 2009

"Come on, guys, she's white... that must mean she's worth at least a few bucks, right? Come on, make us an offer. We'll throw in some babaganoush..."

-k

tango · April 13, 2009

She knew that her integrity would be attacked by both sides.

But Khadija appreciates the kind support from fellow Muslims world-wide.

I have to point out that everyone in this thread dissing this woman has assumed, with no evidence at all, that she is a fundamentalist Muslim, a friend of the 'terrorist' Taliban.

Being Muslim does not make one a fundamentalist nor a terrorist. A lot of people here seem to have forgotten that the people our Canadian soldiers are fighting to defend (from the Taliban) are also Muslim.

I repeat: Being Muslim does not make you Taliban or terrorist.

I am appalled at the lack of awareness and knowledge and common decency displayed here. What I see is discrimination on the basis of religion, with no basis in fact.

The woman is a journalist for Al Jazeera, a respected moderate Muslim media voice.

It appears that the big T has intervened, realizing their ass would be grass if the little t kidnapper criminals killed her.

Hell, if they beheaded her, the people here dissing her and wishing her dead would be the first ones to condemn the Taliban for it. :rolleyes:

Edited April 13, 2009 by tango

kimmy · April 13, 2009

I have to point out that everyone in this thread dissing this woman has assumed, with no evidence at all, that she is a fundamentalist Muslim, a friend of the 'terrorist' Taliban.

The evidence is her own "Jihad Unspun" website, which aside from fundamentalist content, has also been cited for regurgitating content from militant websites.

Hell, if they beheaded her, the people here dissing her and wishing her dead would be the first ones to condemn the Taliban for it.

Who wishes her dead?

I condemn the Taliban because they're barbarians and idiots. Killing this woman would further prove as much.

-k

tango · April 13, 2009

The evidence is her own "Jihad Unspun" website, which aside from fundamentalist content, has also been cited for regurgitating content from militant websites.

Evidence from her website please?

Edited April 13, 2009 by tango

kimmy · April 13, 2009

Evidence from her website please?

http://www.jihadunspun.com/IslamUnderAttac...les/pseudo1.htm

http://www.jihadunspun.com/IslamUnderAttac...ive/jtfo01.html

-k

Argus · April 13, 2009

Bullshit. A lot of people simply understand that supporting dictatorships will often lead to terrorism.

Really? The Soviets and Chinese have supported a variety of dictatorships for decades, and neither has ever been the victim of a single terrorist incident as a result. Why do you suppose that is?

What's patently clear is that many on this forum think supporting dictatorships is acceptable and even preferable in some cases.

If the alternative to a dictator who supports you and helps you is a dictator who is hostile to you and tries to kill you - then why not? Think of how much better off the US would have been if it had supported the Shah of Iran rather than encouraging him to step aside to let that nice religious fellow Khomeini take over.

As for the morality of it. Are the Iranian people any more free under the theocracy of the Mullahs than they were under the Shah? Are human rights better respected? Has there been less death and bloodshed, less torture?

Argus · April 13, 2009

Being Muslim does not make one a fundamentalist nor a terrorist. A lot of people here seem to have forgotten that the people our Canadian soldiers are fighting to defend (from the Taliban) are also Muslim.
I repeat: Being Muslim does not make you Taliban or terrorist.

I am appalled at the lack of awareness and knowledge and common decency displayed here. What I see is discrimination on the basis of religion, with no basis in fact.

The woman is a journalist for Al Jazeera, a respected moderate Muslim media voice.

It appears to me that some of those on the Left believe that any Muslim not currently holding a knife which is dripping with the blood of someone they've beheaded can be described as a "moderate" whatever that means.

On the other hand, if you're a Canadian Christian and disapprove of gay marriage you're some kind of extremists religious zealot from the far, far right.

JerrySeinfeld · April 13, 2009

I think Mark Steyn once summed up this kind of ironic situation best (I believe before this actual real life situation took place) when he said (paraphrased):

"For all those apologists who extoll the virtues of the "downtrodden" Islamists, if you ever did show up at their cave, they'd saw your head off before you had a chance to say "but I'm on your side""

Perfect.

madmax · April 13, 2009

On the other hand, if you're a Canadian Christian and disapprove of gay marriage you're some kind of extremists religious zealot from the far, far right.

You would have a great time cheerleading with your Muslim Religious brothers who support your disapproval of gay marriage.

A Conservative MPP who fought for equality of gays,

In opposition, Gillies served as his party's critic for Skills Development, Labour and the Environment. Gillies took an interest in labour and human rights issues, and was one of the first P.C. MPPs to work for gay rights in Ontario.

and it was 10 years later when Gay Marriage came in under Conservative Mike Harris.

The first legal same-sex marriages performed in Ontario were of Kevin Bourassa to Joe Varnell, and Elaine Vautour to Anne Vautour, by Rev. Brent Hawkes on January 14, 2001.

Gay rights was one of the biggest "Betrayals" of the Bob Rae government to the Gay community.

http://www.xtra.ca/public/viewstory.aspx?A...B_TEMPLATE_ID=2

Yup, neat quote in their about how the NDP no longer was the "default party" of Gays, but that "GAY TORIES BEGAN TO PEEP OUT OF THE CLOSET"

Gay isn't a right or left thing, but it is a "religious" issue and ironically it is Christian ministers who are marrying Gay couples, not Muslim Imams.

Better find another straw man.

JerrySeinfeld · April 13, 2009

Gay isn't a right or left thing, but it is a "religious" issue and ironically it is Christian ministers who are marrying Gay couples, not Muslim Imams.
Better find another straw man.

Totally.

Plus, Barack Obama is against gay marriage.

The strawman BS espoused by the left to some how equate a Muslim zealot with "right winger" is a poor effort at logic.

The reason right wingers like to talk about gay marriage and women's rights in the context of a debate about Islam's assimilaion with the west is because it exposes a glaring contradiction:

How can a left wing mutli-culti apologist be in favor of "tolerating" backward Muslim views toward women and gays on one hand, yet still say they favour Gay "rights" and women's rights on the other.

It's a joyfully hilarious contradiction which, rather than participate in, we right wingers are content to watch with amusement on the sidelines. :lol:

Oleg Bach · April 13, 2009

Marriage is bound by sex - to have sex you need a female and a male. Gay marriage is a stab at the traditional (family) or tribal system..it is not put forth because our law makers love and respect gays - it is put forth because they hate the union that is power - that is man and woman as a force. As for the Taliban - If these jerks even contemplate killing one of ours ...we should do what the Israelis do...send an emissary to talk to the individuals who are threatening the beheading - identify them and their extended familys and let them know that we will send people to behead every last one of them..woman and children and elders - THEN see how they react - It is western fear they prey on...If you want to win everything you have to be prepared to lose it all....."those who try to save their lives will lose them and those that are not afraid will find life and life more abundantly" Time to use old fashioned Christian doctrine on these SOBS and start some old fashioned crusade sword chopping... :lol: