Army Guy

Don't get me wrong i love this country but our justice sys does suck sometimes....this being one of them....This man might as well hang a sign out in front of his store "free shit for all criminals, drugies, low lives, etc.etc ...and higher prices for those of us who pay for our goods and services.... Mod rules and excessive force, are concerns but what about some of the obvious ones....like this guy being a repeat offender for one....Ya it's a petty crime, but to this store owner he's being robbed of his lively hood, taking away from his family, not to mention his contributions to the the honest whole of his community....We other citizens are paying for this idiots steeling in other ways as well higher prices, more taxes...etc etc....and what about lack of policing....ya i know busy doing other shit....but are we forcing our citizens to take the law into thier hands.... So to Mob rules and excessive force, i say to bad....can't fell the pain don't do the crime....I think this law does need to be amended....i also think this crack whore needs to do some community service....not jail time....much less reduced jail time....

Not a very good idea, although the military has a vested interest "thier lives" it could also lead to abuse that could see us in a totally unacceptable form of government.... The use of our Armed forces is based on 3 concepts Civil control of the military, Command of the armed forces, and defence administration in all it's aspects. Civil control is what we are talking about now, which means control of our armed forces by civilians elected to Parliament. It is parliament that must ensure that decisions and risks that are political are made by politicians rather than soldiers, officals, or others that are not responsible to parliment. The Cabinet under the control of the PM is responsible agent for the defination of the defense policy, and control of the CF. Those responsibilties have been delagated from the people of Canada to the governing party.... All that being said that delagation is limited, NO government has unristricted power over the CF, There is already a seris of checks and balances within our laws and constition meant to control the authority of the government, the Armed forces, and civil bureaucracies. It is shared among the GG, PM, Minister of national Defence,CDS. This arrangement prevents the Government in using our military for partisan purposes... That being said it an unwritten statement that any conflict we get into will be a just one, approved by the people and the government of the day, re election depends on it....Including those that we have binding defence agreements on, such as NORAD, NATO etc etc....all need to be aproved in parliment... I got my ref from National Defence Headquaters: Center of decision written by Douglas Bland.

wyly: Hey, i know were on the same side, and your right in every way, the government which we elected, did pick the mission....I know Afghan would not have been my chioce,some place with white beaches and very small swim suits would have been mine.......however, we are there now, and the Canadian people lack the will to change that, so until 2011 our soldiers will suck it up, and no doubt beyond 2011....

What nobody is demanding an inquiry or some sorts....I wonder what that Ottawa law professor is doing now.... This whole thing is so sad it's rather funny in a sick way, only because some Canadians will actually believe this shit.......paying off the bad guys...not to attack...i Guess nobody told the bad guys.....

Some interesting reading. Post

Really, perhaps that is because they have a military that reflexs there needs and GDP. Something that Canada refuses to do...there is nothing in it for the avg citizen or politician except more taxes....

I'd be curious to know just how Gen Hillier used the military for polictical purposes that where not within his job discription...That being said Any dept head ie RCMP, Military, etc is more politician than cop, or soldier, that is how things get done in ottawa, in the case of Gen Hillier, as our military history will show, if your not extremely good at both, well your military looks the way ours does today....Yes men never built anything great... What sets Gen Hillier and the military apart from the other Dept heads , is that he is responsiable for very lives for which he commands, he makes the tough decisions about life and death, he plans, he puts into action any defense , or offensive operation this nation takes part in... In speaking out in regards to his troops, equipment, or the military overall that is his job, his first responsiablity is to his troops thier safety, well being etc etc ....that is drilled into every military member, from Pte to gen....and in my opinion he did that in spades....regardless of the forum he did it in... As for influencing our countries national policy, Calling the Taliban names is hardly influencing anything....Remember it was our government that task our soldiers to close with and destroy the enemy....the Scumbags that Hillier refers to ... were being vaporized by every wpn sys in our inventory ....all well and good, just don't tell the population how we do it....and what ever you do don't call them names on TV....give me a break.... Public servents that serve no public, but rather the nation, and the Queen interests, unless they place the nation at risk or thier commands are unlawful.... Yes there is a safety net there.... I guess it is a matter of opinion, of what the Gen Betrayed, As a military member that served under him on serveral occasions i'd follow him to the gates of hell any day....In fact most troops would, not only did he influence our policticians into getting some of the equipment and making some changes we desparately needed...but in doing so he saved lives....our lives....and in doing so he kept the faith, to us, his postion, and to this nation....and if he hurt a few feelings along the way, to bad....

Piont well taken , Canada should be the last nation to be throwing rocks, about other nations commitments or abilities....What i don't understand is how hard we work at not meeting those commitments....

Hillier was one of a kind, the kind that only comes along once or twice in a life time....imagine a CDS with large enough balls that actually fit the postion he was in. As for NATO, Canada needs this defence alliance more than the alliance needs Canada, we are not ready to pay for our own defence, not yet, perhaps not for another generation....to bad our kids will have to pay for our mistakes, or lack of action. Afghan mission was said to be the make it or break it time for NATO, and it is failing...overall , there are still afew nations that have stepped up to the plate, ours being one of them, atleast to the piont where what ever the next alliance may be or we sign on to we will atleast get looked at as a nation that has something to contribute but it is not going to be cheap.

I think we are blowing this all out of portion here, Canada has not tortured anyone ....And we've made sure that we fully comply with the conventions, and all we've signed on for. We've stated to the world we don't torture anyonenor do we condone it, we have serveral inquiries into the matter, and they've found little, and what they have found has been corrected.....So as a nation we've done our part.... What more is it that you want our Nation to do ? Sanctions, cutting off ties with other nations that have condone it or done it, What action will allow you to have a clear conscience.... I think we in the west have shot ourselfs in the foot when we where asked to come up with the defination of torture....i mean really depriving one of sleep, making them listen to loud disco music, or making them get into a stress postion....Shit i've had all that in one Spin class given by some physico PSP instructor....now that is torture.... And on the other hand, the talban consider those and other western methods, warm up methods, they like to get straight into the more physical methods, beatings, electric shock to the testies, drowning, before getting into the heavy stuff, like stripping off all your skin and staking you to the ground to bake in the heat and mid day sun.....or kill your father in front of you so you get a clear picture of what it is like to go to school..... But torture is torture is it not.....as we have declared it , agreed with the discription, and signed our names to it....perhaps we should have been clearer..... I think when we boil it down all some Canadians are guilty of is not giving a shit about who tortures terrorists, as long is it is not us.....something i can sleep with....

Triple post, sorry it's monday....

double post.

The US M-4 Carbine is the same wpn sys as our C-8 hvy barrel, albiet a few small changes...........I've used both the C-7A2 and the C-8, on tour and had no problems with either. The problem may lie in the type of lubricant they are using, or HOW clean they keep there wpns....Afghan is a very unforgiving land, and the Poo dust diffently plays a huge role on all equipment we have....keeping it lubed with any type of oil will spell disaster for someone who depends on a wpn to suvive with....We where using a dry spray on lub, same stuff we use for artic or winter warfare and never had stopages that that put my life on the line.... That being said i did have stoppages but nothing out of the ordinary or could not be solved in seconds.....that and most have a second back-up wpn, such as pistols or shotguns. I'm not impling that this rockie mistake was made by those troops, but they where using a proven wpns design that has served them well in the past....

I get the same thing when i'm at the bar.....I transfer the alcohol from the bottle to my tummy then into the toilet all night.....Never thought once to give it such a fancy job title though....It's got a nice ring to it, might look good on a t-shirt...

I'm with Jerry on this one, in fact it beats my current retirement scheme of buying Loto tickets.....In fact this good an excellent enconemy booster.....maybe we should make up the laws now that all this 2.5 mil must be spent in Canada....

Your JOKING right, only 2 questions, Shit i lived in northern ontario for 10 years, only visted Toronto 5 or 6 times and i got most of the questions right....Maybe she never slept on the couch for forgetting your wifes birthday, or spent serveral nights on the same couch for forgeting a wedding date, much less your SON's birthday, which hospital he was born in, which city he was born in....while i don't everything about those days i would not consider them trival things....unless info....shit those are 3 or 4 questions right there.... So i'll take your test .....give me a list of WYLY question that could be used to indentify me ones that would expose me for an imposter....

Really, NATO, UN, Inter-National courts, Canadain courts ref to the Taliban as terrorist, not militia, soldiers, reseves, or what ever you want to call them....no they have chosen the term terrorist.....As there use of terror tactics is thier primary wpn.... While your at it, look up the defination of Militia, and compare it to Afghan local Taliban organization.... The main difference is the taliban plants IED's to terror not only NATO, but the people of Afghan as well....take a look at the areas in which they are planted the location alone should tell you alot about thier intent. And while true NATO does not have a stellar proformance in regards to civilians killed in the battle space....atleast they are trying...One could pull up the latest stats and you'll find the taliban kill 10 to 20 times more civilians than NATO.... You have no idea what, is like to live with terror, or the power it has over the people....people who every minute of thier lives is spent just surviving....and they are a small group when compared to the entire Afghan population .... Do you have proof that he was told not to negotiate....or is that something the media split for you to lap up..... President Karazi runs the nation, NATO are his guests, NATO does not wag the dog.... Who told you that....give us a source that will back that up, something like saying all black men have big dicks.....it's myth.....one that you've told so many times that you believe it.... Shit right outside the gates of Kanadar there is an intra net caffee, might have 50 to 60 laptops in it , and it's packed all day and all night....so they have access to the same intra net as you and me....or did you think there was one for bumpkins and one for the west.... once again your really showing your lack of knowledge on this subj....Yes thier history is full of war, infact the last 30 years has been steady war....the people themselfs want peace...i know hard to believe....and while that may be Taliban party line to resist the invader.....NATO is a guest, ask to stay on by the elected government.... Bullshit....one can not have a majority at home again'st the mission and sit there and tell me it does not effect the mission in any way....now i know you know nothing about this topic....as for the Taliban growing stronger....more bullshit brought on by the media or some gen trying to get more troops over there so we can finsih the job....the media split it you lap it up and pronouce it as gosple.....check out the body counts the TALIBAN can not sustain this kind of damage without feeling it....they might be alot busier planting IED's or attacking some police station....but they are not gaining ground....they are not controling the country side NATO is....last time i checked NATO owned the air, the roads, the night....in 3 tours i've yet to see a bunch of armed Taliban cruiseing the roads in a pick up of armoured veh....or flying any fast air.... Bullshit, your not very good at this history stuff are you.....What do you call NAZISM if not an idea , what about the japanese culture prior to WW II , historians have claimed it was a religious based group, with the empour being compared to god himself....both where defeated soundly....and yet there is still Germans and Japanese cultures here today doing quite well i might say....Shit the entire crusades where based on religion and yet how did the christians make out ..... It's not a job but a way of life...and your safety is our primary concern...along with protecting your rights and freedoms so you can go to work tommorow....i'm just guessing but your job did not require you to sign an unlimited liabilty contract did it....not unless your job is with the police dept, fire dept, or military is it... Yes they do in some cases need to step it up, but for the most part they are doing what needs to be done, and with our assistance they'll get it done....i guess you don't know what our freedoms and rights have cost us....and how important they are to our everyday life today....Some Canadians have fogotten that, freedom has a price....and what a huge gift it is to have it....or better yet have the ability to offer it to someone else...

There has not been a ban on what military members can say until just recently, and that ban only covers the future of Canada's involvement after 2011....Members have been cautioned to only speak on thier experiances, and areas of thier expertise , not to spectulate, or talk about anything they are unsure of....So any comments by military pers have not been the party line but thier own opinions....no spin... They're is some proof in that... The mission is voluntary....meaning a soldier has to ask to go....If they did not believe in the mission volunteers would be hard to find.... The soldiers vioces are repeating the same thing....over and over....we need the peoples support, ....that we are accomplishing something good....and progress is being made.....we are making a difference.... And i know that it is difficult to separate party line to real soldiers opinions but when soldiers are asked they will speak thier minds....all you have to do is ask.... As for the Canadian people needing as much info as possiable there is more than one source, and if you truely want info it is available...all you do is have to look....Soldiers are growing tired of not being heard....and for most they think you've already made up your minds and can not be conviced other wise....so they are growing silent ....It's one of the major reason i decided to post on this forum....trying to get our voices heard or correcting some of the misinformation that is out here.... But you are correct about our governmnet not doing a good job on passing info down ....

Bullshit.....The taliban are just a small group terrorists, who are fighting for thier rights to terror whom ever and when ever the want.....Your making a mountain out of a mole hill, The Taliban idea has already been defeated, the majority of Afghans have already publicly voiced thier opinion on that very topic....As for diplomacy working your right, nobody is going to give them what they want....why should we... And your wrong about the primitive mindset, don't count them out , they are well aware of thier history and ours....they know that the real battle ground is in the western world....that we will cave in eventually... To sum up they can be defeated, where we need to strengthen is on the home front....were this conflict is being lost.... Who says it can't be done the media....or the troops doing the fighting....pick one....shit you claim you support the troops....which one is it....Canadian military history is full of jobs that can not be done, in fact were pretty good at rewriting history....and this job is just one of them....The new US general has already stated that they where going to copy the Canadian way of doing things....and put this 3 block war theory into practice....with more troops, money, and support it just may work....but then again according to you we should be throwing in the towel and letting the Taliban run all over these people.... We've extended the people of Afghan our gift and offer of help....now are we to retract that and say we're sorry but this is a lost cause....

Guys....it's really not such a big deal...Colorado is home to NORAD HQ's you know the big bomb shelter....anyways the contract set in place so a few hundrd at most can still carry out thier french training while posted there....not all the few hundrd are taking french maybe a dozen or so at anyone given time....Still think it's worth the money to fly down instructors from quebec, and the end qustion would be will these people be able to talk french to any french speaking person in the world ...yes, including Quebec....i think so....Atleast DND is trying to comply with our language requirements....

Every conflict or war has an ideal behind it, and while you quote some good examples of failures history is full of sucessful wars and conflicts that if properly planned and executed could over come any type of conflict or situation... Hence why NATO and most western nations now practice what is called the 3 block war for insurgency warfare....in which on one block your engaged in combat, the other block humanitarian missions, and the last block carrying out rebuilding , assisting governmental agencies etc etc all can be happening at the same time same city next door to each other.... The the US wrote the book on the 3 block war because it's hard to win the hearts and minds with bombs and bullets alone.... The taliban knows that the people in the western countries within NATO will grow tired of the conflict they also know they are winning on our home fronts....thats you and every other Canadian out there that has made up thier minds and considers this mission a failure....And yes it will go down in the history books as a Taliban victory it was not due to the soldiers actions but the actions of those that claim they support them....

I disagree , first you said MANY Canadians , if they don't have a clear picture or stay well informed on the Afghan mission i doubt they are taken the time to do that with the larger picture.... I will agree with you that some Canadians are well informed and do have the larger picture, and can put the Afghan mission into context.... I also disagree that some one with a clear picture and understanding of Afghan can not comment on the mission....while thier may be topics that may be over thier heads for the most part i think they have plenty to offer on the topic of Afghan...

So that leaves me with this question, where do you find yourself in this conflict ? do you consider yourself well informed ?.....Personally i think most Canadians really do think they are informed , and they've made up thier minds that this is a shit mission.....and they don't want to hear anything else, i guess they are not as open minded as they think they are. A minister, or for that matter any CEO sucess or failure is dependent on the people below them....One person can not be expected to know everything about a Dept, or company....i agree they should have a good background knowledge but more importantly suround themselfs with people who's expert in one field within the dept...until you've covered the entire dept or companies forta so to speak....That minister must be able to lead and know how to dig out or use those experts to solve any problem that they may face....Does that make sense.... I know that is what we do in the military, thier is to many things to become a expert in, so what we do is build our sections/ Platoons with experts in certain fileds, IE drivers, gunners, Machine gunners, snipers, Anti Tank teams etc etc as a whole we are unbeatable ....individually we are sub par....

That was my point...BC link was in reference to MBTs (or recce assault vehicles)... I think it sounds good....but we can't lose sight that a tank comes with a lot of motivational tools. Specifically a smooth bore canon. One of those motivational tools is the wieght , it will shake the very ground your standing on, i don't now how many times we've seen the Taliban dug in, and ready for a long fire fight....but the minute those leo's showed up, they where off running....like scared rabits....nothing stikes fear into any soldier to hear , and feel tanks coming from as far away as 500 meters.... and when they finally do show up, the thing is just huge....well 70 tonnes of steel and extra armour will do that, get it traveling at over 70 km a hour and it's awesome....

Thanks Dancer, Every Soldier is a volunteer, so many volunteer in fact they have to screen them, medically, mental health, Padre, even your spouse has to sign off as approving along with many others....any problems in those areas member is rejected from tour until the problem is fixed. Anyone that is saying they where forced into going is a lair. That being said some trades are smaller than others there is Soldiers that have 5 or more tours...in Afghan....just to put that into some context thats 2 1/2 years of combat experience, 2 1/2 years away from wives, children, and family....