Moonlight Graham

That's a pretty good idea. I completely agree. Fun is a poor excuse to own a machine designed to kill, especially those designed to kill humans. To those that like to hunt, your above scenario is adequate. For those that like to shoot pistols and other fun toys at the range, too bad. To those that want them for protection, statistically they make you much more likely to be a victim of gun violence, so there goes that defense. To those that want guns to prepare for the hypothetical day your democratic government will turn against you and you must rise up against it, that's pretty paranoid given the historic stability of western democratic governments.

Mind the rules:

Why didn't gun homicides go down like total violent crime did? Why are total murder rates going down but not gun murders? Seems the repeal and other possible state policies likely are a factor that prevented gun murders & gun violence from going down. Also: "serious but non-fatal gun injuries caused during assault have actually increased in the last decade by 20 percent".

Murder rates? But what about gun homicides: http://globalpublicsquare.blogs.cnn.com/2012/07/27/time-to-face-facts-on-gun-control/

you'd have about the same chance of getting hit by lightning than getting killed via gunshot in the US, so not worried. And most gun murders are by people the victims know, so just kind your acquaintances lol.

I can somewhat understand Honey Boo Boo because she had a very popular show and it's kind of a freak-fest. But Ben Affleck made a very good film this year, and it didn't exactly kill at the box office. I just don't get it. Why not, say, Christopher Nolan...he made Batman! How about Psy? OPPAN GANGNAM STYLE!!!

See Ghosthacked's response above. Exactly. Why are they? A completely correct opinion based on logic. 88 guns per 100 citizens. Scoreboard. Had handguns been illegal, there's a decent chance this shooting may not have occurred. But I don't know the story about the longer gun that was found in his car. Yes this shooting could have happened in Canada, and similar ones have. So what do you think could have prevented this shooting? I'm not saying gun laws are the entire solution, but it's a start.

Ben Affleck???

Was this gun stored in a locked cabinet and/or with a trigger lock? What about the ammo? Why are handguns even legal? Why does a person need to own a machine that is designed to kill other human beings? Some of it has to be that so many Americans have guns that it compels people who normally wouldn't want to own a gun to feel the need to buy one just to feel safe and even the playing field. Like a civilian "security dilemma". I'm not blaming everything on gun laws, the US also has a demented gun-loving culture that compels them to want to own them. BTW, as per the quote of BC, a suicide isn't a homicide, and those stats aren't calculated into homicide stats. But US suicides via guns are extremely high as well, 5.75 per 100k people, compared to the UK which is 0.16 per 100k. Not sure it matters in the end, as Canada and the US have about equal suicide rates overall.

BTW they shouldn't even release the name of this killer or his picture, it gives them the exposure they're looking for. They want to go down in a blaze of glory and immortality in many cases it seems.

Why? 88 guns per 100 American civilians. That's 270 million guns owned by civilians. The US has a massive gun culture, rooted in its history (legal and otherwise) and the nature of its founding, but also the massive militarization of the country that takes pride/patriotism in the weapons of war it creates/uses. Many Americans are obsessed with portable murder machines, and see it as a right to own them and train how to use them.

thanks Greg, i'll check it out.

I agree with jbg, there is something lost in western industrialized societies today about a sense of community. How many neighbours on your street or in our apt. building do you know, or do you talk to more than once a year? I think people are disconnected today, and it's unhealthy because most humans lived within close communities, villages, and large families for most of human history until the industrial revolution increased mobility and turned small towns where everyone knew each other into isolating urban sprawls. I think people today are extremely isolated. Once you leave high school, a sense of community can often disappear for a person. I remember growing up as a kid and I & my family knew every other family on our street and conversed with them regularly and the kids all played with each other. Now I'd be lucky to wave to a neighbour living 5 doors down in my car as I pass or talk to them once in a blue moon when some kind of emergency happens. Hilary Clinton might think "It Takes a Village to Raise a Child" but we don't live in villages anymore, which is part of the general problem today IMO with high levels of depression and social isolation. edit: gun-access and mental illness awareness issues also need to be better addressed obviously. I'm also not saying the above was a specific factor in this shooting since we know little details yet, but of these sorts of incidents in general.

Also been listening to some alternative/indie rock stuff: The Jezabels, great new indie band from Australia, a bit of a post-rock feel, saw them live couple months ago Saw Mother Mother last month, fantastic live.

Heard of the band but never really listened to them, wow the lead singer/guitarist is phenomenal. That guy is pure rock n' roll. One of my fav's is John Frusciante: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gZsbODz0V3Y http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HNkOoRYRTwA

BTW what province(s) are your observations referring to?

What do you think of this argument? It's alarming to me the number of guns Americans have. There are an estimated 270 million guns in the hands of civilians in the United States. "More guns, less restrictions" is obviously not making the US a safer place with less gun violence. Btw, Canada has about 30 guns per 100 people compared to 88/100 in the US.

Read this article by Fareed Zakaria after the Colorado movie theater shootings in July, but it's still applicable given the recent Connecticut school shooting: full article: http://globalpublics...on-gun-control/

they're involved?

I don't know how easy this would be to implement, but would be very useful. With the new forum upgrade I often click on my profile and click "My Content" > "Only Posts" to track my posts to see if anyone has responded to them so I can respond back. It would seem an excellent feature to have the forums track when another poster quotes you in one of their posts so that you can respond back, or at least look at it. I, and I'm sure many others, spend a lot of time on these forums simply going through threads I've posted in to see if anyone has replied to my posts. Such a feature would save time, and notify users when someone has quoted an older post of theirs in a thread they haven't looked at in a while and thus may likely never see and/or respond to.

Also, to everyone and anyone on MLW who suffers from health problems, or knows someone close who does, I wish you all good luck in recovery and good health.

Lots of great info cyber, thanks. You seem to know a lot about the system. Wow I can't believe a triage nurse wouldn't suggest a clinic (in your experience). It makes sense that they can't turn you away, but you can often get into a clinic much faster than in the ER (at least in my city), especially for non-emergencies, so the suggestion would be helpful for patients. I think a big issue is once business hours are over most walk-in clinics close, so the ER is the only choice for many after 4pm. My family doctor has an after-hours clinic we have access to which helps the burden of ER wait-times. Hospital psych ward is free. Seeing a psychiatrist/psychologist based in hospital as an out-patient is also free. Many psychologists/psychiatrists with a private practice aren't covered, even if you have a referral, but you can find ones that are covered/free. Certain institutions like universities/colleges will offer free counseling services also. Most prescription meds for any medical needs can be covered by provincial plans (like the Trillium Drug Program: http://www.health.gov.on.ca/en/public/programs/drugs/opdp_forms.aspx) if you have a low enough income, you just pay a deductible based on your income.

He's trying to get the growing Muslim vote in Toronto obviously. Maybe he should have done his homework though. The sponsors named in the article are the 2 largest sponsors of the event according to its website. Maybe more importantly though is the actual content of the convention. It may be a peaceful, mainstream, socially positive Islamic convention for all we know.

Ya screw it, my definition doesn't work. Hmm that's also a very good definition. So now I'm confused. But of course, what is deemed "positive" for human society is relative and subjective, isn't it? I think healthy is the key term in your definition. However, I think what is positive and healthy for one society can be a bit different depending on the culture of the society. There may possibly be some universals, like murder being wrong, but other differences may be okay. Also, I've always been attracted to the Utilitarian "greatest happiness principle": In A Fragment on Government Jeremy Bentham claims "it is the greatest happiness of the greatest number that is the measure of right and wrong". But then there is an issue of minority and individual rights.

I wish I owned Loblaws.