madmax

Interesting. I watched and participated with a Union in a Plant Takeover to prevent the "bankrupt" company from relocating. They contined to fight and locate a buyer who was interested in operating the company in Ontario. They were successful, and that company is operating without a nickle of taxpayer monies and is profitable because it never really was bankrupt. Morally bankrupt owner perhaps. The Provincial and Federal government were no help, and actually supported the companies decision to relocate. You must do alright for yourselves. Autoworkers also make very good money. Soon they will not, when they are displaced.

I don't know what union you have? Most unions do not have benefits, but have companies that supply benefits, or the company provides benefits from a supplier because the union has bargained benefits into the contract. It normally in the companies and the benefit providers interest to put restrictions on benefits. That said, I would also suspect their will be a clause that will have only one benefit provider liable until exhausted and the other kicks in. Today, anyone in Ontario with benefits of anykind is doing well. From the 1000s of people I have helped get new work, all of them came from places with benefit plans, just over 4% have returned to fields where benefit are provided by the company. The 4% landed in Government and union jobs and a smaller number landed in good companies that remain progressive. Regardless, the plans you speak of are not the kind that Autoworkers in Ontario have. They do have Cadillac (is a cadillac still good :)benefit plans.

Whoa, I have been reading this thread with interest. Smallc, are you sure you are in Manitoba? Not bad on the knowledge. With regards to the "liabilities" they are/were more of a factor in the USA, where in GMs case they ditched their liabilities and if you have followed events on Ontario, even lowering the wages to $21, for Ford was ineffectual, because wages are not the problem, although it makes good politics. You are right on the Tundra. The subject is complex, and politics reduces things to the lowest common denominator and sometimes myth will determine what happens over facts. The Major Market for North American Cars is the USA. Ontario Supplies the USA. Even today, Canadian Car sales were up. It is still very surprising. However, we do not serve as much of our domestic market as we used to because of more imports. Thus Toyota, Honda, and the other 3 are effected by offshore imports with no ties to the North American market. Regardless, none of this can change what is happening in the US. People are walking away from homes and cars, and I have relatives there walking away from everything and giving it back to the banks. A huge problem in Ontario is that Provincially and Federally the Government has been hefting over Billions of monies to Ford & GM and there are no strings attached. These large taxpayer driven slush funds are used to move operations overseas or to Mexico. Now, why the heck should the tax payer bailout companies with no benefit to our economy? GM goes under or they move to CHina? Hmm, Why use tax payer monies to help relocate a private operation offshore? So, if GM goes under the jobs are gone. If GM gets CDN dollars, the Jobs are still gone. They aren't tied to keeping work here. The Private Auto Companies and the Federal and Provincial government built this mess. This is the worst of both worlds. When Chrysler got the bailout in the US back in the early 80s (Remember Reagan), they came out with little cars, and fuel milage that is equal to the smart car. These cars were dirt cheap, and sold like hotcakes. So not all bailouts are failures, companies fail themselves, like US Banks Some people fail to remember a company called KIA. And people forget this a few short years before Hyundai purchased the bankrupt Kia And Hyundai is signifanctly California based today. When we think of Subaru, GM, is a major shareholder and Toyota only 8%. There is little of any company that isn't weaved into and with another. There used to be a Phrase. What does GM make? A) MONEY Apparently not so true today. I find GM cars boring. Infact when I think of GM purchasing Chrysler, I think of the merger as Boring Cars that Breakdown instead of interesting Cars that work. I have a fondness for the designers at Chrysler. A vehicle will be sold at the market value. If tier 1, 2, or 3 suppliers costs are lowered, you do not lower the price of the vehicle. It makes no sense to sell something for less then people are willing to pay for it. Assembly is done with parts coming from all over the Globe. You get what you pay for, and what gets past all the ISO stuff. Most parts for all autocompanies have the same suppliers bidding and competing for contracts. This occurs all over the globe. Travel costs are very expensive and suppliers tend to want to be around the major assembly facilities. Just look at Auto Plants and the support industries that develop around them. With regards to the North American Owned companies, the suppliers have been picking up stakes for sometime and have been issued directives since 2005 to relocate their facilities to Mexico or CHina. If companies like GM, suggested years ago that their suppliers should move, (and many of those that can, already have), then it is apparent that GMs longterm goal has been to make major reductions in Canadian Assembly. THis is why Mexico now makes more vehicles then Canada. Have Mexico give GM the bailout. Obviously, if GM wants that Truck Plant two build the hybrid in Oshawa over Mexico, since we already funded them .5 billion for R&D, then that is different. But right now, I see corporations with their hand out, and no responsibility for their actions. I see government in a giving mood, with no accountability. I see the worker and taxpayer getting poor return on their investment. Money, isn't going to change anything for GM and Ford, and we have to think about what is in this for Canada.

I have to give you credit. You have been tenacious. I am not surprised at how flippant McGuinty is on this issue. What is good for the goose is not good for the gander.

.....when you retired ? EARNED FREEDOM!!! You never know the age of a poster. I am 7 years old, well according to my wife I am. Seriously, thanks for the answer.

If you party wants to organize a Policy Convention, do it with your own money. Raise your money and fund your convention. Political Parties have been doing this for centuries. If a party doesn't have the funds for a convention, then it shouldn't have one, unless it chooses to go into debt. If you don't have money, don't hold a convention. I see no reason to have public funds provided so that political parties can have big conventions, while people go hungry. This is just political pork. The parties collecting the $1.95 do not need this money. They are the largest parties.

Whats a pension fund worth today? Maybe when you win this fight, they will be worth something again.

Hey, I got a call centre call asking for money for Dion. I asked where they were calling from, well, it was in Canada (thats good) and I asked "are you having a good time asking people to cough up money to support a tax increase". She started laughing and said, she wasn't a Liberal, but was she not having to much success and politely ended the call. That is more reason not to support giving a party taxmoney. Obviously they have money to spend on telemarketing firms.

oh Well the NDP has raised more then the LPC. So can you explain how the party you support is better at fund raising then mentioned above? No worries then. This proves it should be eliminated. You will do nicely comparatively speaking. I disagree. There are better uses for that money. There are people in need. The $1.95 that goes to the CPC does not build one road, airport, court, or help parliment. It also doesn't go to EI or transfer payments to the Provinces for their Welfare programs. It goes into CPC warchest to be used as attack funds against Liberal Leaders who then get run out of town for their "ideas". I have an idea. I am putting it out there. Others also share that idea. At this point in time, to get this idea out there, and accepted, I don't need $1.95 from the government. I also don't believe that if the government gave me $2million you would change your mind. I don't think that you need $1.95 to challenge my idea, nor would you spending $2million change my mind. However, you may yet come up with a point I have overlooked in my haste, that could reinforce the need for giving $1.95 to political parties. But right now, it appears like a point of self interest for the larger parties with their bellies up to the trough.

Sounds like you have a problem. I can't help you. Nor do I think that political parties should be given tax payers cash, because the party you support and help (You are a volunteer or paid hack?) can't successfully fundraise. I just don't have a violin big enough today and I do support the need for Welfare across Canada. Those who need it should get it. Those who don't shouldn't. There is nothing in your statement above that tells me that the party you support should get cash, because the people are too apathetic to volunteer on behalf of the party.

Erm.. eh.,. uhhhh,.... sht. Pulling teeth out... You can do it, just remember those two words...... I concur.

This piece of Legislation was formulated back in the days of the National Party. Getting rid of Corporate and Union Donations hasn't proven to be a bad thing. There is no reason, no reason to have monies publicly funded on a per vote basis. This form of WELFARE in not important. That is total BS. Political Parties do not need a monetary safety net. If the parties are raising monies from individuals then so be it. How is it fair, that I have my tax monies given to the CPC, LPC, NDP , BQ or even the GP, while I may have voted for the Libertarians, Progressives, Canada Action Party, Marx Lennonists Marxists Lenninists, Neo Rhinos, or Newfoundland Liberation Party. Yes, the only pleasure one gets for voting for these lessor parties, is to deny an extra $1.95 isn't given to one of the above parties. But it is still tax payers monies which goes out. That is also my tax money. And why is it that a vote for the lessor party is treated like a non vote monetarily. I mean, who could really use a handout. The CPC or the other CPC (Communist Party Canada) It is absolutely ridiculous that we fund the BQ with Millions of dollars to be spent within Quebec alone. Other parties have to travel across the entire nation. The BQ does not raise alot of monies from personal donations. Why should we support separatists? Anyone who thinks that they need to have the $1.95 has no faith in their party. People not politically engaged who vote occassionally couldn't care less whether or not the $1.95 was dished out, infact most people don't know this happens. Welfare is for those in need. The concept of a means test for a political party to collect welfare is absurd. Those parties who have strength, shall receive a government handout. No, I think the LPC, CPC, NDP and GP are all in good shape and can survive off their grass roots, base support and individual donations. Clearly you agree that the GP has a strong base to support going it on their own. No need for a handout. End Political Welfare.

Giving $1.95 to the Political Parties from the Taxpayer has nothing to do with big business or unions. Monies should be donated from individuals only. There is no need for this form of Political Welfare. Why should we prop up a Political Party like the CPC that can raise $12Million on its own? Why should we give money to the NDP who can outraise the LPC. Why should we give money to the LPC since, they have been government for over Most of Canadas history? If people believe in a political party, they will cough up the cash. And People who cannot cough up cash, offer their time. Political Welfare bums

Gerard Kennedy is looking to join in.

I don't believe the CPC needs the approximate $10 Million from the $1.95/vote Tax Payer Handout. I don't believe the LPC needs the $1.95 Handout of $7Million I don't believe the NDP needs the $1.95 Handout of $5 Million I don't believe the GP needs the $1.95/vote Handout of $2 Million It is time to end this practice of Political Party Welfare.

Where is this discussion on Rabble? I would like to read their comments. You got a link?

When Blueblood responds to a thread in his field (no pun intended), It is wise to listen carefully for fear of looking foolish. I have found nothing but clarity in his posts regarding agricultural policy and the CWB.

The chickens are coming home to roost. Dwight Duncan, new arrival as Finance Minister for the Ontario Liberals has just woken up, unfortuneately he forgets to lay blame at his parties own feet, while they were taking a nap. The CPC are fiddling while the Ontario Liberals are playing the violin. http://www.thestar.com/News/Ontario/article/530716

I think the Liberals could take their ball home. The Crime bills, regardless of what you may personally think, did not have traction anywhere where the CPC needed to make gains. If there was another snap election, with "Crime" as the ballot question, it would not lead to a Majority for the CPC. Most people panned the bill, and more particularly, those little flyers mailed to people that said... "NOT ON OUR DIME" which actually "WERE ON OUR DIME". The CPC have peaked, and if they put forth a bill that is unnacceptable to the LPC, BQ and NDP, then the next election would be a free forall and I would not bet on the CPC. If the CPC put forth the budget, no matter how wacky, foolish or incompetent, no matter how intelligent, smart or competent, and the LPC voted against it, and the government went down, then the CPC would most likely receive a majority and the Liberals discover that life can be worse after Dion.

How on earth is this acceptable? How do they pick which polls are counted. I find this totally unacceptable. What the heck is a "recount" if your not "recounting" the ballots. Might as well just flipped a coin. It would, IMHO, be more fair, then the process described in this thread. Count every vote.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Conrad_Black

I am awaiting an email from Lord Black of Cross harbour. No he is not Canadian. But he is in the US. Enjoying the benefits of Lordship and US hospitality.

The Federal Government has failed the largest, most populous province in Canada, and the economic engine since confederation. There is nothing Brilliant about this. The Harper government did not create the transfer payment system of equalization. Ontario receiving transfer payments for the first time in history is the acknowledgement of incompetence and failure. maple syrup

That is correct. The CPC have been fiddling for 2 years.

Is there some reason that you deleted your posts from this thread, in order to create a new post with the same content in a separate thread. Are you trying to cover your tracks .... its called bait and switch. People could tire of your games.