madmax

Yeah, I don't know whats going on. His barbs are backed up with facts and he seems to have his ducks in a row. No worries. Just wait, he will trip up. Then........

Nothing gets past you But......you don't drive much. And I am interested in your low mileage car. Perhaps there is some common ground on the car ban?

banning cars. 7% vote. No seats. I can't figure this out.

Its just a political party. I doubt that any person on these forums, has blind support for their party of choice. Well, I think there is one fanatical, delusional poster for the time being, but that will pass.

I don't think anyone is surprised by Flaherty's inability to manage fiscal responsibility. He was useless in the Ontario Government. However, It shouldn't surprise anyone that the CPC were trying to hide their fiscal incompetence with an early election. You might want to look at Dion who ignored all the sound advice given to him to jump on the economy, and drop the Green Shift. If you followed the Ontario Election last year. It reminded me of the Liberals beating the heck out of John Tory and him not being able to lay a glove on the McGuinty Liberals. Both the Ontario Liberals and the Federal CPC have adopted the same policy at the same time to softsell these deficit to the public.

The Liberals have spent alot of money in these good times. I do not believe they are prepared for what is coming down the pipes. However, it is clear to me the CPC have wasted huge surpluses. While the Liberals spent like drunken sailors, you shouldn't bring up the Federal Tories. They have frittered away huge surpluses.

The Ontario Liberals increased spending from 67billion to 97Billion IIRC. There is nothing to show for it in terms of Health Care and nursing. However, there are lots of people on the government payroll clearing $100,000 since the OLP took office that both the PC and NDP believe need this salaries are in need of review.

Federal Green Party candidate Frank Nightingale has come out in favour of keeping the coal-fired generating plant in Nanticoke, pegged by many environmentalists as one of North America's worst polluters. I met Frank, once in Dundas, with this person "Stephana Johnston" who were both promoting keeping the coal fired generating plant in nanticoke open. They used the anti-nuclear argument to promote coal. WHile the argument is accurate. Here is the spin The GP wants to tax pollution vs end it. Could you imagine, they moved the taxes to the coal fired generated plant as a source of FEDERAL revenue, and then the Ontario Liberals close it down? Infact this was the irony between the Federal Liberal Policy in adopting the GP platform. It was at complete odds with its Provincial Cousins. Of course the Provincial GP are of the same opinion as the Provincial Liberals.

Thank you Mr. Canada. There seems to be alot of make it up as she goes, in this thread. The historical facts and basis for our system of government are not that difficult to find. That .20 should help Not here to dispute your position. I would fully expect to see this position, from the LPC, CPC, and many many many many other parties. I would not expect this argument to be put forth by GP candidates under any circumstances, irony of irony being they started from an anti nuclear protest party. And no Nuclear is far from perfect. It is costly. The Carbon footprint behind the creation of the power, uranium mining etc. is larger then marketed. That said, those arguments should be coming from the GP. The Party of the environment. Otherwise, there is nothing that separates the GP candidate from the CP candidate. Or the CP is more environmentally friendly the GP wants to admit. Thats someone elses torch and argument to carry not mine

No, I disagree with your comments above. Don't know how you came to those radical conclusions. However.... http://www.nationalpost.com/story.html?id=903788 At no point have I indicated the OLPC are heroes. The Harper campaign was not forthcoming if they plan to run deficits. What I see is another lying politician misleading the public, which is what they do.

The NDP has stronger environmental policies then the Green Party. And often far ahead of the GP until 2006 when one could split hairs. However, the GP can continue with their Greenshift (A program used nowhere in the world), while the LPC, having taken up the mantle have now rejected bringing such a system forward, because it is stupid and doesn't make anysense. Therefore, the LPC had the strongest chance of hitting a home run for the environmental movement. Had the LPC taken the Cap and trade view, of California or Obama or McCain, they wouldn't have met any more resistance then the two Presidential candidates. However, by buying into a turkey, the Dion camp ended up taking most of the Turkey to stornaway after the Thanksgiving weekend, where it smelled so bad it couldn't be redistributed to the poor. It had to be thrown out. The NDP has always provided a voice for the environment on the Federal Stage. The NDP gained seats this election. Unfortuneately the LPC lost seats in this election. Unfortuneately the GP received no seats in this election. The latter two groups have set back the environment in the minds of public opinion. This will be very difficult to overcome in the next election cycle. Expect the LPC to move back to the economy (Its the economy stupid line wasn't used, but DION missed the boat) BTW the GP in your riding, the rural riding, with the largest environmental polluter and the single largest emitter of GHG in North America, didn't vote for the GP to clean it up. The GP candidate finished 5th with 2041 votes of the 48,394votes cast . That is it. 4% of the vote. All parties have proposed environmental initiatives long before the existence of the GP. The Green Party was formed by an anti nuclear group in Europe. The GP of Canada likes it Pro Nuclear Candidate. Hypocritical political parties have existed since the beginning of time.

2nd eh. That is something. What were they thinking in Edmonton. Well to quote Jdobbin. " Maybe his wife can give him a job."

I don't think I have ever been in a thread, where I disagree with a person on 100% of the comments made. For me this is about unheard of considering the people in this forum. I mean, there is Argus, and White Doors, and Guyser and Army Guy, and Jdobbin and a whole slew of opininated, hard headed a biased individuals. Infact some poster here don't even have a soul . Still we have had some people booted off who are simply childish or have poor behaviour, so I don't include the riffraff in the following comments. But I don't believe I have ever followed a thread this long, and continue to see so much misinformation or completely unfactual data being thrown around as basis for a position. I read a post, and read something totally incorrect, and I immediately start to dig up the data. Oh yes, google, how art thou, and yet, basic facts and information are completely ignored. Then I see, people with whom I often disagree, make valid points from their perspective and these too are tossed into the wastebasket of lost discussions. I understand a party having talking points. I have a recommendation. Listening Points. I know there are some politically savy people here who understand how ridings turn over time. When someone quickly discounts that Money cannot buy a riding they are missing out on some very valid reasons. If you have a base of 7% you can drop $93,000 in a riding and you are not going to win. You will have spent alot of money. You can buy all the adds you want, but if the people aren't buying what you are saying it is money wasted. Political Hacks know this. You do want to spend money in a riding where you can push your candidate over the top. Spending money is like diminishing returns or spending those extra dollars to get that .05 horsepower to win. The first 400HP were easy. It gets harder the closer you get to a victory. Don't discount these truisms. Someone knowledgeable was offering a reasonable start to a discussion. The next thing a number of people have said here, and is factually correct. Is that the US has a better environmental record then we do. Well ITS TRUE on a many fronts. Not only California being the leader, but even in a GWB environment of 8 years, they out-performed the "Kyoto Friendly Liberals", and the "environmentally unfriendly" Conservatives, while doing their own thing. (Just forget about destroying a nation for now:) I won't even bother with the misinformation regarding socialist europe. And then there is Riverwind. Pretty much referencing Suzukis comments accurately. I have checked the comment many times, just to make certain they are not out of context. Kengs333 THis might surprise you. But some of these guys are here to help and to have a good discussion. Continue to blow them off if you like. But you may start to find yourself alone and isolated. That's no fun. Later madmax

Wow, that is a good one. My Life is ok, I have only lost lots of money on paper. The Job, (the Wife), the House, were all lost over this past year and a half. We are just seeing the tip of the iceberg. THat doesn't mean the ship is going to hit the iceberg. That said, in my region, there have been 3 plant closures since the 14th and two more announced. One Big Box store. Housing sales are now parked. It is no longer a buyers market. It is a sitters market. Sit and wait. Construction has just went flat, one of the few things to keep on chugging. And a big box store has announced it is closing in a couple weeks. I am in good shape as I run a training and placement centre. Business is booming. Not good for the people on the other end of the stick. But everyone in this region has seen this coming for over a year, so no one is either surprised, or shocked. The growth of the low pay service sector jobs still appear to be around for the time being. Otherwise, the options are the same. "Leaving on a Jet Plane" Oh, and the Provincial Finance Minister has decided to run a modest deficit just to queu us up for the deep doo doo coming ahead.

I can't comment on the tourism part sector specifically. But the Manufacturing Sector is NOT coming back to Canada because of a sudden drop in the dollar. There are also many factors involved other then the dollar which determine the profitability of the operaton. Clearly the price of steel has seen a sudden drop. The two factors of a lower dollar and affordable steel should aid certain industries that benefit from these factors. However, most industry sources concur that these would be great factors in good economic times, none of these factors has any effect on US consumption or their ability to pay. Seems many orders are being cut, cancelled or defaulted on because of US companies inability to pay, because the line of credit has disappeared with the banking industry through no fault of their own. The Federal governments haven't given a rats ass to manufacturing, and so I fully expect them to continue to comment like Armchair Industrialist knowitalls as they watch certain economic variables go up and down. But that is all they do, watch and comment. Listening to CIBC and the Financial Post, they don't encourage tax cuts, (Pulling a Layton), and want to run deficits, (Pulling a DIon), so, with the unpredictable Flaherty at the helm, sit back and watch. Could get deficits and tax cuts, for more deficits. Of course the Banking Industry suggested they aren't going to make alot of money, so the tax cuts wouldn't help them. Same position the manufacturers told Flaherty a year ago. Of course if you are making money, tax cuts gives you more money. The Banks view, was to wait until the Banking industry recovered, then give them the tax cuts. How thoughtful

Seems that your comments fit right in with the GP leaders. So, here is the medias perspective after the free lunch the GPs had. No free lunch for the GP.

No disagreement.

Actual Dion fought for the 5 % to 7% of the "Centrist GP" tent. The LPC are used to campaigning on the ideas of the NDP. Implementing them is another story. The LPC of the 90s reacted to Reform pressure, for fiscal responsibility and not running deficits. THe LPC will not be taking marginal GP ideas as a campaign plank. However, the fear that Canadians have is that if the LPC were ever elected, the would implement the Carbon Tax. That the LPC would have a hidden agenda. Considering that the NDP was more Centrist in this past election then the LPC. One has to wonder, how much further away from the mainstream would a leader be willing to move the party? And considering that the CPC campaigned on a nothing although steady as she goes and somewhat Centrist platform. It was undermined by individual radical thoughts (ie Harper). It should be clear that the rush should be towards the middle.

Argus in employed by the Federal Government IIRC. Enjoy his pleasant demeanor. You will get used to it. He answers more clearly when not on the taxpayers tab.

And a number of independents.

An electoral district (also known as a constituency or a riding in the Canadian English political jargon) is a geographically-based constituency upon which Canada's representative democracy is based. It is officially known in Canadian French as a circonscription, but frequently called a comté (county). Doesn't matter which riding if 93% of the people you live next to disagree with your political viewpoint. I believe in a Proportional Rep system. However, we probably would still have Progressive Conservatives federally if that were the case. Kim Campbell would have retained her seat, even though she lost it, and the PCs would have had maybe 70 to 80 MPs instead of 2. Regardless, I find your comments troubling.

The CCF, Reform, Social Credit, National Party, NDP have all advocated for Democratic Reform long before the existance of the GP. Democratic Reform is party of Democracy. Whinging appears to be part of the GP partisan plea.

Also remember, that in ridings, people didn't want the Liberal Candidate or Leader, and choose either CPC, NDP or GP, (Maybe something else too). People that might not have liked the CPC candidate or leader, may have moved from CPC to NDP, Lib, GP or BQ or other...... I have yet to see what the "left" in Canada is when talking to coworkers. When someone says I don't like Dion but I like Harper and Jack, that is pretty wide open in thought. When someone says, Dions an idiot, but I like May but I am voting for Harper, it really throws the pundits for a ride. And when telepolls call and some do name parties, often people with no interest in Politics answer GP, just because they can give an answer without worry. More Irony is someone hating the LPC platform of 2008 and voting GP to let the riding go to the CPC, but won't vote CPC because of the cuts to Art Funding. It is not black and white, or left and right out there. And the next irony, being the GP and LPC often call to "unite the left", while the Gp claim they aren't right, left or Centre, and the LPC consider themselve the "Natural Governing Party". Democracy did work... as is mentioned above. The CPC almost got a touchdown, and the NDP stopped them on the 10 yard line. Canadians didn't let Harper and the CPC get that touchdown. They have got to the 10 yard line, and it would seem they have another 3 downs. (If they use 4 downs, Canadians are in trouble ) I think all parties support 3 down football

The GP have been unable to crack the nut, and land a seat. One might ask what would happen to the GP if the Federal Funding was removed. The GP is a party that has a very long gestation period. Many Political Parties have secured a seat within a 25 year period. The CPC is the party in power, with 144 seats. The Prime Minister is Stephen Harper. The GP is a party not in power, with Zero seats. The Leader of the GP watches from the Gallery, the business of government. To some, some here perhaps. Looking on from the gallery, is on the fringe. In fact, the Animal Alliance Party and the Christian Heritage Party leaders can join the Leader of the GP at anytime in the gallery. Along with any group of students on a school trip.

It is apparent to me, that you disregard all factual information, and continue on with outlandish and unsubstantiated claims, much like Elizabeth May. You are a perfect fit. Just ignore the dialogue and continue on living in a bubble. the GP is just a political party. One that sold out the environment before securing a seat during its 25 years of existence. That is something.