Vancouver King

A fresh sounding by Forum/Toronto Star after it's recent controversial (outlier?) poll showing the NDP running first at 39 points. NDP - 34 Cons- 28 Libs - 27 Bloc - 6 Green- 4 These latest numbers join several other recent polls taken since the debate in measuring a bump for Liberals, an indication the public sees the debate's outcome much differently than most regulars on this forum - ie. the public saw Justin win the debate.

Looks like a dozen seats lost by Harper in BC and the NDP to elect about 24 here. If I live to be 100 I will never understand Harper's decision to close Vancouver's Coast Guard facility. Considering the political damage done to his party, it must rate as one of Harper's worst decisions - sacrificing a half dozen MPs to save a few hundred thousand dollars.

Why do you think every money measure passed by the Tories is aimed at that demographic that needs it the least?

Conservative times are tough times - I can't imagine Harper's re-election with two separate recessions during his watch. Canadians will cast their votes on the gov'ts record, not it's rhetoric.

The figure is not 60% wanting change, it's 77% (according to Abacus). Given Tory support in polls of roughly 30%, this must mean about a quarter of Conservative supporters want Harper gone. If you doubt such voters exist simply read Argus' many posts on Harper's stale leadership.

Let's see if I have this right: Conservatives have in heavy rotation an attack ad that says Trudeau just isn't ready, yet he shows up at the first debate with a reasonable command of the issues, albeit with a bit too much exuberance. At the same debate the PM inadvertently confirms the country is in recession - the second under his watch - and it raises the obvious question - why wasn't Harper ready?

Since Harper admitted in tonight's debate that Canada is in recession, can the forum look forward to your apology for starting this thread?

Surprised at Trudeau's competent performance. I would rank them this way:, best to worst: Trudeau Mulcair May Harper

Don't forget the Blue Jays game...

You really should have tuned into QP last session to witness Mulcair tear strips off Harper's hide. It was almost cruel but thoroughly entertaining. Don't take my word, Mulcair's performance moved Conservative PM Brian Mulroney to declare the NDP leader the best Opposition Leader since Diefenbaker.

Canadian seniors quaking due to Greek pensions, closet Tory voters - this must be a right wing nightmare.

Ontario can elect more Conservatives than New Democrats and still Mulcair can form a majority gov't., beginning with his 55 Quebec MPs.

So those are all the reasons you will be voting Conservative. Apparently you are one of the few intending to vote that way - today's Forum sounding taken within hours of Harper lying to Canadians at the GG, gives the NDP 39% national support - majority territory.

This marks the beginning of the end for Harper's loathsome regime.

According to today's Forum poll taken immediately after Harper's deceitful public lie spoken at the GG, the public will do just that - show Harper the door! NDP - 39 Cons - 28 Libs - 25 Bloq- 5 Grn - 3 The consensus is building.

Yes, but there is a special satisfaction in reading immediate consequences (via polling) for politicians who lie to the electorate as Harper did Sunday morning when he claimed his marathon campaign would not cost taxpayers extra expenses over a standard 37 day campaign. Forum polled within hours of Harper's deceit and found this result: NDP - 39 Cons- 28 Libs - 25 Bloc - 5 Grn - 3 This puts Mulcair within a hair of majority territory and more important, passes public judgement on yet another blatant Harper lie. Could it be the country is reaching an early consensus?

No, this is the point: Harper's 78 day campaign call was made to gain advantage over his political rivals by beggaring them financially - however, his call will incur substantial extra costs and taxpayers will pay the lions share of these extra costs. Like the $75 million spent on gov't ads that glorify Conservatives as much as inform the public of programs, the federal treasury is again being high-jacked to promote Harper's re-election chances. Your loyalty to your party is commendable, but on this issue you are simply wrong.

From Wendy Gillis of the Star: "First, Elections Canada will have to ramp up it's operation. ... that ($375 million) bill will now increase, thanks to added salaries for employees preparing for the election, rent for electoral office across the country and more. The Canadian Taxpayers Federation has estimated the tally could approach $500 million." "We're talking tens of millions extra for the chief electoral officer, said Jean-Pierre Kingsley, former chief electoral officer with Elections Canada. He's got to run a machine here. If you were thinking you were hiring people for 40 days, and you have to hire them for 80 days.....all of those salaries are being doubled." If anybody should be an expert in election procedure issues, it's Kingsley.

My estimate comes from the Canadian Taxpayer's Federation. Elections Canada will double salaries, double rents and other expenses. A 37 day campaign would cost $375 million, CTF says this will expand to $500 million. Taxpayer rebates to parties amounted to $60 million in 2011 and will be much larger this time and added to the $500 million. Whatever the final total, it's an affront to add unnecessary costs to Canada's current budget deficit.

OK, I'll put you down as undecided.

There are many room temperature IQ's among Conservative supporters - witness this forum.

Not quite. They were accused of inappropriate use of postage by a parliamentary committee stacked with their political adversaries - in other words a kangaroo court. Contrast that to the vision of Dean Del Mastro, in leg irons and handcuffs, being led off to jail after being found guilty by a Canadian court with an independent judge - of election related fraud..

Such are the advantages of a sitting regime which cannot contain itself from reaching into public funds to further it's re-election prospects. $75 million for gov't ads glorifying Conservatives, $100 + million for unnecessary extended election campaign, $1 billion in "goodies" handed out in last 10 days, etc. etc. There is a 30% core of voters who lose no sleep over the corruption inherent in these facts.

These sobering numbers should counter the thread drift of late. Hell, with the campaign formally underway, perhaps Harper supporters will see new relevance in polling results. EKOS: July 31st. NDP - 33.8 Cons- 30.1 Libs - 23.4 Grn - 6.1 Blc - 4.7 "(Conservatives) now have an economy that 76% believe is in recession and have an even gloomier outlook for the longer term future".

If it's a Conservative minority result, don't worry about whether Harper will step down. An informal coupling of the NDP and Liberals will rid the nation of him in short order - and fulfill voters number one priority of affecting change.