Hal 9000

Right, and is it really leisure time at that point? It looks like a job. How many hours do these people spend with their coupons, sorting, catogorizing with charts etc. Just to save a couple hundred bucks? And to have a house jammed with toilet paper, shampoo and soda pop. No, I'll go to my job thanks. As Freddy said, it's a mental disorder. They're all obsessed. These people are nothing more than hoarders. I'd be OK with it if they dropped the stuff off at a food bank or shelter, but they never do.

I don't think its absurd. I don't know what the swing in voting numbers would be, but it will be something. Everybody is now talking about the Greek crisis, and hence the EU and if the european style of socialism is sustainable. Not saying there are big similarities, but coffee talk is different than what is brought out in a forum like this. And, many in the older generation don't distinguish one type of socialism from another. The Alberta election and fallout from that in the next couple months will have an effect as well. Many people will decide that things are pretty good and choose to just stay the course.

What? No love for the Trews? House of Ill Fame is a great record. "No time for later" or "Den of thieves" were very solid too. As for the Hip, "Day for Night" and "Fully Completely" were both superior to "Road Apples" Edit: for Avril - Let go.

Just stop! That could never and would never happen. Even the topic of forced birth control is met with outrage. What could help is giving the fathers a better chance at custody, these young single moms know that there is very very little chance of ever losing their children, in fact, sometimes the more pathetic the mother is, the more money and respite she gets.

The amount that taxpayers pay for fostering kids is staggering. At least double what we pay to welfare moms. It's cheaper for us to tell welfare moms to just stay home, watch Maury, collect your free ride and don't get into too much trouble.

The courts have consistently and continually sided with gays - even to the point of overturning democratically chosen election results. This goes back longer than 2 days.

They have succeeded, they been given the same rights and freedoms as anybody else. The question is; will they choose the road of the victim or the equal. Even WCR still refers to them as victims. The pride parade (as it is now) is or will soon be an anchor. It's a silly caricature of gay life. Keep the sentiment of gay pride, but take it out of the gutter and to the high road. That would be my advice.

It was your claim, I was just showing interest.

The point is; you can't be both a victim and an equal. Equality, like respect can't be given - every person has to earn that. I have every right and freedom as my boss, but at work, we're not equals. The people under me, have the same rights and freedoms, but are not equal to me at work. The gays have every right and frredom that I have and they can choose to either be equals or victims - they can't be both. Sure, not everybody will like their lifestyle, but who cares, gays don't like the hard core Christians either - who cares! Not all whites like blacks and vice versa. If someone, no matter who they are wants to be equal in America/Canada they have the rights and freedoms and are able to do that without consent. Does anybody have an issue with interracial marriage? Probably not, and they don't need to parade around the streets naked. When someone says interracial marriage, it's met with very little or no reaction at all. The gays will be equal when this happens, not when they have record numbers at parades or hang a flag on the burrard bridge.

Ok, if the courts aren't against them, and the majority of people support gay marriage - and they do have gay marriage, then how are they victims? And of whom?

Wow, when did gays get gunned down? Where was this?

Hal: If they're victims, who are they looking to for acceptance Michael: the courts, obviously

Uhmm, not really! Michael seems to think that the courts are against gays. And, yes the courts decided to side on human rights. None of this is against anything I've said so....

The courts? How so, we have same sex marriage, don't we? Same sex marriage has been voted on and voted down on almost every occasion - maybe every occasion. It's the courts that bend over backward for the gays.

So, you're saying that gays are both victims and yet equal at the same time- interesting! If they're victims, who are they looking to for acceptance?

If they've done that, they wouldn't be rallying for their cause. Equality, like respect is not about laws, it's about thought. If they don't realistically feel they're equal, that never will be. People don't rally when they feel equality. Look at WCR, she's still calling them victims. That means she doesn't believe them to be equal.

I get your logic, but it simply goes against nature. If someone keeps insisting they're equal, then they're not really equal - are they? You can give a person freedom and rights, but they have to earn their equality - that's just the way it is. It's not my rules, i'm just a messenger.

Not the same at all. You'll try and make it the same, but it's really not. For starters, Black history month (along with aboriginal day/week) is filled with eduction and history - something that we can all get behind and learn from, while Pride (the way it currently exists) is purely self-indulgent and antagonistic.

Ummm....

WTF are you talking about? You can't win the actual argument so you choose the default religion argument - I'm not religious, sorry!

The pride parade has always been very antagonistic, thats what most people don't like - not the gays or the lifestyle itself. I don't know anybody who actually cares what they do, who they sleep with or even who they marry. If they toned down the parade somewhat and took a more higher ground approach, they'd gain equality.

Not too many speak against the actual issue of homosexuality itself, I do see people speak out against the parades and constant ass kissing. The parade turns more people off than the actual thought of homosexuality. I suspect that once the gay community wakes up they'll realize that the parades (in their current form) are an anchor.

650,000 is a lot of people who support and accept the gay lifestyle, however acceptance and equality are not the same. Equality will only come when they don't feel the need to parade themselves through the streets and when people stop subliminally treating them as victims - as you do.

....and their parents

Good grief, I'm sorry! You really don't know, do you?