gatomontes99 Posted March 18 Report Posted March 18 Quote Vladimir Putin agrees to halt strikes on Ukraine energy targets for 30 days, after a lengthy phone call with Donald Trump Volodymyr Zelensky says he supports the energy truce but insists Russia isn't "ready" to end the war, in his first response to the call The Russian president set out several conditions for a fuller ceasefire during the 90 minute call, including that any settlement should "eliminate the root causes of the crisis", the Kremlin says Fresh Ukraine peace talks will also begin in the Middle East immediately, the White House says https://www.bbc.com/news/live/c3e4xzd8qq8t Looks like they are on the way to a deal. The left will decry peace. 3 Quote The Rules for Liberal tactics: If they can't refute the content, attack the source. If they can't refute the content, attack the poster. If 1 and 2 fail, pretend it never happened. Everyone you disagree with is Hitler. A word is defined by the emotion it elicits and not the actual definition. If they are wrong, blame the opponent. If a liberal policy didn't work, it's a conservatives fault and vice versa. If all else fails, just be angry.
TreeBeard Posted March 18 Report Posted March 18 At least you’re optimistic. Do you think Putin can be relied upon to keep the peace? Quote
gatomontes99 Posted March 19 Author Report Posted March 19 25 minutes ago, TreeBeard said: At least you’re optimistic. Do you think Putin can be relied upon to keep the peace? For some period of time. It will depend on how strong the security arrangements are and whether or not a future admin is willing to enforce them. 1 Quote The Rules for Liberal tactics: If they can't refute the content, attack the source. If they can't refute the content, attack the poster. If 1 and 2 fail, pretend it never happened. Everyone you disagree with is Hitler. A word is defined by the emotion it elicits and not the actual definition. If they are wrong, blame the opponent. If a liberal policy didn't work, it's a conservatives fault and vice versa. If all else fails, just be angry.
Scott75 Posted March 19 Report Posted March 19 12 minutes ago, gatomontes99 said: For some period of time. It will depend on how strong the security arrangements are and whether or not a future admin is willing to enforce them. Based on what I've read from both sides, I'm cautiously optimistiic. From the U.S.: https://www.nytimes.com/2025/03/18/world/europe/trump-putin-call-ukraine-russia-war.html?unlocked_article_code=1.404.wmJI.1ZVnw_YE3nvQ&smid=url-share From Russia: https://www.rt.com/russia/614396-putin-trump-call-ukraine/ 1 Quote
gatomontes99 Posted March 19 Author Report Posted March 19 9 minutes ago, Scott75 said: Based on what I've read from both sides, I'm cautiously optimistiic. From the U.S.: https://www.nytimes.com/2025/03/18/world/europe/trump-putin-call-ukraine-russia-war.html?unlocked_article_code=1.404.wmJI.1ZVnw_YE3nvQ&smid=url-share From Russia: https://www.rt.com/russia/614396-putin-trump-call-ukraine/ Obviously the deal has to have strong language back with material losses if Russia breaks it. And the same goes for Ukraine. I don't trust either party here. 1 Quote The Rules for Liberal tactics: If they can't refute the content, attack the source. If they can't refute the content, attack the poster. If 1 and 2 fail, pretend it never happened. Everyone you disagree with is Hitler. A word is defined by the emotion it elicits and not the actual definition. If they are wrong, blame the opponent. If a liberal policy didn't work, it's a conservatives fault and vice versa. If all else fails, just be angry.
Popular Post herbie Posted March 19 Popular Post Report Posted March 19 (edited) The highschool bully and your teacher have come to an agreement that he will stop beating the shit out of you and the teacher will stop punishing him if you will simply stop trying to fight back and hand over 25% to the bully and half of what's left to the teacher. Good deal, eh? BTW don't forget to tell your teacher 'Thank You'. Edited March 19 by herbie 1 4 1 Quote
TreeBeard Posted March 19 Report Posted March 19 Shouldn’t Russia be forced to pay reparations? Ukraine should also be admitted to NATO. 1 3 Quote
robosmith Posted March 19 Report Posted March 19 (edited) 3 hours ago, TreeBeard said: Shouldn’t Russia be forced to pay reparations? Ukraine should also be admitted to NATO. At least use all the Russian wealth in foreign banks and sell the oligarch's yachts to rebuild Ukraine. Edited March 19 by robosmith 1 Quote
Scott75 Posted March 19 Report Posted March 19 4 hours ago, gatomontes99 said: Obviously the deal has to have strong language back with material losses if Russia breaks it. And the same goes for Ukraine. I don't trust either party here. I've seen read and skimmed some articles from some authors that I think are pretty good and I'm somewhat less optimistic about what happened. Still, a bit of optimism. I think the following article by a substacker who goes by the name of Simplicius is quite good: https://simplicius76.substack.com/p/historic-putin-trump-call-is-small Quoting from the introduction and conclusion of his article: ** The long awaited discussion between Putin-Trump has finally taken place, reportedly clocking in at a historic two-and-a-half hours, which according to some sources is the longest call between an American and Russian president since at least the Cold War. As expected, it was another nothing-burger, with Putin essentially repeating precisely the same talking points as have already been conveyed time and again to the US, most recently during Witkoff’s Moscow visit last week. [snip] For now, the above clearly fruitless call infact gives opportunity for Trump to re-characterize it as a ‘success’, which allows him to sell the ongoing negotiations as positive and friendly, which keeps the hyenas and hawks off his back, allowing him to put off being forced to ‘act tough’ and tighten the proverbial vise on Russia. This could be what the secret backdoor ‘plan’ with Russia is all about: keep stringing these useless “negotiations” along while pretending they are “making headway”, all while giving Ukraine a symbolic amount of “aid”, while in effect waiting for Russia to slowly finish Ukraine off until such time that Kiev becomes “amenable” to real war-ending concessions. As stated, we will know if this is precisely the plan based on how Trump proceeds with any further ‘pressures’ or ‘leverage’ on Russia. Recall Scott Bessent has also previously threatened that Russian sanctions are currently a mere 5 on a scale of 10 and could be brought up to a 10. It’s obvious that Trump must keep up a domestic ‘strongman’ image by “threatening Russia”, otherwise the media will eat him alive as being a Russian asset, Putin’s puppet, and the like. So we must judge him by his actions, not merely his words. There are some hopeful indications here and there: for instance, news today that the US is considering leaving its post as NATO’s Supreme Allied Commander: This could mean Trump is serious about throwing Ukraine to the Europeans. But we’ll have to see, he’s already quickly back-tracking on his anti-war campaign platform by senselessly attacking Yemen, so expectations are not exactly high. Which forking path will he take? Share your thoughts. ** I've skimmed through another article from Larry Johnson over at another site called SONAR21 that I thought was interesting and definitely more optimistic, at least from the U.S./Russia angle. Quoting the introduction: ** Putin Gives Trump a Meaningless Concession, But Sticks to June 2024 Position The much anticipated phone conversation between Donald Trump and Vladimir Putin took place on Tuesday, as expected. There was quite a bit of propaganda flack flying about prior to the call… for example, the Ukrainians told the NY Times that Trump was going to concede Russia’s right to control Odessa. It was also rumored that Putin might relinquish control of the Zaporhyzhia Nuclear Power Plant (ZNPP). That didn’t happen. The White House account of the meeting emphasized that Trump got Putin to agree to suspend attacks on energy infrastructure in Ukraine. This was only a symbolic concession by Putin, because such attacks are not a critical element of Russia’s military campaign. With Spring in the air, halting attacks on power plants does not detract from Russia’s offensive operations along the entire line of contact. The Kremlin’s readout of today’s conversation between Vladimir Putin and Donald Trump, however, provided a more measured and demanding perspective compared to the White House’s account. Key points from the Kremlin’s readout include: Putin supported Trump’s proposal for a 30-day halt on attacking energy infrastructure in Russia and Ukraine. Russia identified significant issues related to ensuring effective control over a potential ceasefire, including the need to stop forced mobilization in Ukraine and the rearmament of Ukrainian armed forces. Putin emphasized that a key condition for ending the war should include a complete cessation of foreign military and intelligence assistance to Kyiv. The Kremlin stressed a prisoner exchange scheduled for March 19, involving 175 people from each side, along with an additional 23 seriously wounded Ukrainian servicemen as a goodwill gesture. Russia expressed interest in reviving some of its diplomatic activities in the United States, such as reopening closed consulates in San Francisco and Seattle. The readout highlighted Putin’s appreciation for Trump’s willingness to contribute to ceasing hostilities and preventing loss of life, while emphasizing the importance of addressing the “root causes of the crisis” and acknowledging “Russia’s legitimate security concerns.” The Kremlin made no reference to Ukraine’s role in peace negotiations, instead pointing out “serious risks with the attempt to negotiate with the Kyiv regime.” Overall, the Kremlin’s account suggests that while progress was made on certain issues, a comprehensive ceasefire agreement has not yet been finalized. While Donald Trump and his team were happy with the results of the chat, the same cannot be said for Zelensky and the Europeans. They ain’t happy. Today’s conversation sent a clear message to Ukraine, the Brits, the French and the Germans that they are not relevant to any negotiations to end the war in Ukraine. Prior to the call with Donald Trump, Putin spoke at the congress of the Russian Union of Industrialists and Entrepreneurs and revealed that he fully understands the nature of the threat posed by the West. He provided this fascinating analysis of sanctions: Sanctions are neither temporary nor targeted measures; they constitute a mechanism of systemic, strategic pressure against our nation. Regardless of global developments or shifts in the international order, our competitors will perpetually seek to constrain Russia and diminish its economic and technological capacities. ** Quote
Nationalist Posted March 19 Report Posted March 19 10 hours ago, herbie said: The highschool bully and your teacher have come to an agreement that he will stop beating the shit out of you and the teacher will stop punishing him if you will simply stop trying to fight back and hand over 25% to the bully and half of what's left to the teacher. Good deal, eh? BTW don't forget to tell your teacher 'Thank You'. That's how it goes, when you lose a war. Quote Its so lonely in m'saddle since m'horse died.
Michael Hardner Posted March 19 Report Posted March 19 1 hour ago, Nationalist said: That's how it goes, when you lose a war. Old school... Iraq won its war against Kuwait, then we liberated Kuwait. That was a precedent set by conservative leaders that we wouldn't stand for adventures from rogue states. 1 3 Quote Click to learn why Climate Change is caused by HUMANS Michael Hardner
gatomontes99 Posted March 19 Author Report Posted March 19 22 minutes ago, Michael Hardner said: Old school... Iraq won its war against Kuwait, then we liberated Kuwait. That was a precedent set by conservative leaders that we wouldn't stand for adventures from rogue states. How many Nukes did Iraq have? 2 Quote The Rules for Liberal tactics: If they can't refute the content, attack the source. If they can't refute the content, attack the poster. If 1 and 2 fail, pretend it never happened. Everyone you disagree with is Hitler. A word is defined by the emotion it elicits and not the actual definition. If they are wrong, blame the opponent. If a liberal policy didn't work, it's a conservatives fault and vice versa. If all else fails, just be angry.
Nationalist Posted March 19 Report Posted March 19 (edited) 41 minutes ago, Michael Hardner said: Old school... Iraq won its war against Kuwait, then we liberated Kuwait. That was a precedent set by conservative leaders that we wouldn't stand for adventures from rogue states. A rogue state? Mike...do you even know why both Bushs insisted on attacking Iraq? Hint: They knew Iraq had no WMD all along. They knew that because fckin' Rumsfeld had previously been selling arms...to fckin' Iraq. Edited March 19 by Nationalist 1 Quote Its so lonely in m'saddle since m'horse died.
Michael Hardner Posted March 19 Report Posted March 19 1 hour ago, Nationalist said: A rogue state? Mike...do you even know why both Bushs insisted on attacking Iraq? Hint: They knew Iraq had no WMD all along. They knew that because fckin' Rumsfeld had previously been selling arms...to fckin' Iraq. I was talking about Kuwait not the second war. The US funded Iraq in the 1980s in their war against Iran. Quote Click to learn why Climate Change is caused by HUMANS Michael Hardner
Nationalist Posted March 19 Report Posted March 19 33 minutes ago, Michael Hardner said: I was talking about Kuwait not the second war. The US funded Iraq in the 1980s in their war against Iran. America and NATO need to learn to stay out of local squabbles. Quote Its so lonely in m'saddle since m'horse died.
Michael Hardner Posted March 19 Report Posted March 19 1 hour ago, Nationalist said: America and NATO need to learn to stay out of local squabbles. It was the whole UN that time. And because it's an international pact. 1 Quote Click to learn why Climate Change is caused by HUMANS Michael Hardner
robosmith Posted March 19 Report Posted March 19 5 hours ago, Nationalist said: That's how it goes, when you lose a AN ILLEGAL war. ftfy.... now lets hear you whine about how fixing your LYING POST is dishonorable. 🤮 Quote
robosmith Posted March 19 Report Posted March 19 2 hours ago, Nationalist said: A rogue state? Mike...do you even know why both Bushs insisted on attacking Iraq? Hint: They knew Iraq had no WMD all along. They knew that because fckin' Rumsfeld had previously been selling arms...to fckin' Iraq. Tell the truth, because ^this is ILLOGICAL Selling weapons to anyone does not give special insight into how many weapons, and what kind, they already have hidden somewhere. Quote
Hodad Posted March 19 Report Posted March 19 1 hour ago, Nationalist said: America and NATO need to learn to stay out of local squabbles. Thanks, Father Coughlin. Great advice. 1 Quote
robosmith Posted March 19 Report Posted March 19 1 hour ago, Nationalist said: America and NATO need to learn to stay out of local squabbles. Because YOU SAY SO, Mr. Fantasy geopolitical "expert"? LMAO Quote
CdnFox Posted March 19 Report Posted March 19 16 hours ago, gatomontes99 said: Obviously the deal has to have strong language back with material losses if Russia breaks it. And the same goes for Ukraine. I don't trust either party here. I think that's going to be the hang up. I don't think they're anywhere close to a deal. I think the best that can be said is Russia is hoping to stop attacks on their oil at electrical infrastructure which have been ramping up for 30 days while they get there wind back, but I honestly don't think they're any closer to an actual peace deal today than they were 4 weeks ago. And this whole business of eliminating the root cause suggests that what Vlad really wants is zelensky and any pro-american government gone and a pro-russian government installed one way or another. We will see, but I doubt that we will see an actual end of the war anytime soon. I'm not very confident we're even going to see a ceasefire at this point Quote
herbie Posted March 19 Report Posted March 19 7 hours ago, gatomontes99 said: How many Nukes did Iraq have? enough to make the USA invade again... of are you claiming standing up for Ukraine requires invading Russia? Not just booting them out of Ukraine? Was it to risky for MAGA chickenshits to push the Norks back to the 38th parallel too? Quote
Nationalist Posted March 19 Report Posted March 19 4 hours ago, Michael Hardner said: It was the whole UN that time. And because it's an international pact. Ya the UN is another organization that needs an enema. 4 hours ago, Hodad said: Thanks, Father Coughlin. Great advice. You're welcome. Quote Its so lonely in m'saddle since m'horse died.
Nationalist Posted March 19 Report Posted March 19 4 hours ago, robosmith said: Because YOU SAY SO, Mr. Fantasy geopolitical "expert"? LMAO Because the create more problems than they're worth. Quote Its so lonely in m'saddle since m'horse died.
Michael Hardner Posted March 19 Report Posted March 19 13 minutes ago, Nationalist said: Ya the UN is another organization that needs an enema. I think we're better off with a pact against invasions. I think that a Canadian Nationalist would likely agree with me, my guess. Quote Click to learn why Climate Change is caused by HUMANS Michael Hardner
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