myata Posted March 8 Report Share Posted March 8 (edited) Surprising here is not the outcome, it happened in history and not once. But the ease with which it has happened. Why? The binary political system naturally drives different groups and cliques together: the primary goal is not to advance certain view and agenda in the interests of the society but to win and rule, in the interests, mostly, of itself. Around it there's a cloud of words, postures and performances but it changes little in the essence. So in my understanding of it, the Republican party has and had for a while at least these groups in it: 1. The angry populists 2. The political establishment 3. and hopefully, the Constitutional fraction that respects the values and claims of freedom and democracy. The first group was always there and kept forming projects and caucuses: Tea Party, Freedom (ironically) caucus, and others throughout history. Revealing these days is that the establishment part really had no foundation, principles: it would undersign anything and anyone that would give them a chance to win. That of course was the cause of its own demise: they needed populist loudmouths like Trump; came to depend on them to guide them to the power, having created and sustained no viable alternatives to this course. But trumps, they do not need them, because they can talk to their cults directly. Never thought it could happen. Oh well. But what puzzles me really is the third group. In all of this, it has never come into the public view. Never attempted to form a consistent position, and message to the public. No known even informal groups common to the other side. Why? Sure we heard names but those are individuals, Chaney, Haley. But from the perspective of the outside world, it appears as the sane, Constitutional and principled wing of GOP just doesn't exist. A paradox? I have no explanation. And so, in the time of uncertainty as the voice of a charismatic populist is amplified by the first faction and the second simply folds in, there's nothing left to stop the rising tide of populism. That was easy. Edited March 9 by myata 2 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ironstone Posted March 8 Report Share Posted March 8 I think it's more important to discuss just how far left the Democrats have moved since Bill Clinton. Right now, they are firmly in Bernie Sanders territory. Joe did appoint Bernie as an economic advisor...a socialist as an economic advisor. 2 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deluge Posted March 8 Report Share Posted March 8 17 minutes ago, ironstone said: I think it's more important to discuss just how far left the Democrats have moved since Bill Clinton. Right now, they are firmly in Bernie Sanders territory. Joe did appoint Bernie as an economic advisor...a socialist as an economic advisor. People have forgotten that the democrat party more or less created Donald Trump. The more stupid and overbearing the democrats get, the more pushback they will receive from the citizenry. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
myata Posted March 8 Author Report Share Posted March 8 16 minutes ago, ironstone said: I think it's more important Why do you think it's more important? While I contend that the partisan, binary political system generally exacerbates and encourages move to the extreme ends of the spectrum, Democrats have not yet threatened the foundations of the free market system, so "left" is really a stretch or misnomer here. On the other hand, not only selected individuals but a large group that is taking over the Republican party, has quite openly been playing into the hands of totalitarian dictators like Putin; and hinting not once of doing away with NATO just at this time. If the new axis of totalitarian tyrants is on the America's doorstep while it willingly undermined and destroyed the alliances built by generations, what would be the higher priority, and a threat? 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
myata Posted March 8 Author Report Share Posted March 8 1 minute ago, Deluge said: the democrat party more or less created Donald Trump. I'll comment only once here, this is quite characteristic of the rising loudmouth populism headed by none else but a pathologically lying buffoon. We are free of any responsibility for anything we do, while you're to blame for all that is happening. This level of mentality of course is nowhere near sufficient to face and overcome increasingly complex challenges of this time. So the outcome of this adventure is very well known if and long before it begins. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deluge Posted March 8 Report Share Posted March 8 (edited) 35 minutes ago, myata said: I'll comment only once here, this is quite characteristic of the rising loudmouth populism headed by none else but a pathologically lying buffoon. We are free of any responsibility for anything we do, while you're to blame for all that is happening. This level of mentality of course is nowhere near sufficient to face and overcome increasingly complex challenges of this time. So the outcome of this adventure is very well known if and long before it begins. This is such a stupid take. Only a hardened leftist could come up with such lopsided bullshit. Edited March 8 by Deluge 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CdnFox Posted March 8 Report Share Posted March 8 41 minutes ago, Deluge said: People have forgotten that the democrat party more or less created Donald Trump. The more stupid and overbearing the democrats get, the more pushback they will receive from the citizenry. For sure. And it's hardly the first time in history Donald trump is very much a product of the woke. He's what happens when people get sick of being called horrible deplorable people constantly, of being threatened to lose their jobs if they don't say the right things that the woke have told them to. If they're told being white is evil and being while MALE is toxic and borderline satanic. Now people just want to punch the democrats and their woke loser friends in the eye and Trump is their fist of choice. IT was inevitable. 6 minutes ago, Deluge said: this is quite characteristic of the rising loudmouth populism headed by none else but a pathologically lying buffoon. Now now - nobody said you were heading it Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
robosmith Posted March 8 Report Share Posted March 8 1 hour ago, ironstone said: I think it's more important to discuss just how far left the Democrats have moved since Bill Clinton. Right now, they are firmly in Bernie Sanders territory. Joe did appoint Bernie as an economic advisor...a socialist as an economic advisor. Nope. Bernie is firmly AGAINST Joe's policy on the Israeli/Hamas war and other things. Compared to Bernie, Joe is right wing. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
robosmith Posted March 8 Report Share Posted March 8 1 hour ago, Deluge said: People have forgotten that the democrat party more or less created Donald Trump. In reality, that would be FOS LIES that acted as his campaign arm. 1 hour ago, Deluge said: The more stupid and overbearing the democrats get, the more pushback they will receive from the citizenry. This year it is Trump who get the push OUT due to the MAGA CULT extremism on dictating control of women's health. That latest AL SCO decision was the gift that keeps on giving. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
godzilla Posted March 8 Report Share Posted March 8 what the US population has to worry about is that historically once the strong man is selected then its strongman forever until major upheaval. as i've mentioned in other posts. Trump has normalized lies, violence, cognitive distortions and bias. these things used to be called out and vilified within both parties in the US. now its celebrated. its a long road back. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ironstone Posted March 8 Report Share Posted March 8 20 minutes ago, robosmith said: Nope. Bernie is firmly AGAINST Joe's policy on the Israeli/Hamas war and other things. Compared to Bernie, Joe is right wing. No surprise that Bernie is more sympathetic to Hamas than Israelis. The Dems as a whole have moved pretty far left, and then there is the squad, who are even farther left. They are pretty influential within the party. They complain loudest that the party is not far enough left as they would like. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deluge Posted March 8 Report Share Posted March 8 24 minutes ago, robosmith said: In reality, that would be FOS LIES that acted as his campaign arm. No, it's the lies, corruption and tyrannical approach of the democrats. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
robosmith Posted March 8 Report Share Posted March 8 3 minutes ago, Deluge said: No, it's the lies, corruption and tyrannical approach of the democrats. You're BLIND cause you MAGA CULTS cannot see that Trump is the most pathological LIAR in politics. It's not even close. Of course, you can't see it cause you don't even know the truth. They never tell you that on FOS LIES. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deluge Posted March 8 Report Share Posted March 8 8 minutes ago, robosmith said: You're BLIND cause you MAGA CULTS cannot see that Trump is the most pathological LIAR in politics. It's not even close. Of course, you can't see it cause you don't even know the truth. They never tell you that on FOS LIES. There's only one cult in this country, and it's the democrat party. Democrats are communist liars, and they need to be voted out of every political office that there is. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CdnFox Posted March 8 Report Share Posted March 8 1 hour ago, godzilla said: what the US population has to worry about is that historically once the strong man is selected then its strongman forever until major upheaval. So you're saying biden is a weak man? Quote as i've mentioned in other posts. Trump has normalized lies, violence, cognitive distortions and bias. these things used to be called out and vilified within both parties in the US. now its celebrated. its a long road back. The Democrats normalize that. Trump just does it better than them Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eyeball Posted March 8 Report Share Posted March 8 3 hours ago, ironstone said: Joe did appoint Bernie as an economic advisor...a socialist as an economic advisor. Did you know that economics is a social science? Think about that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
godzilla Posted March 8 Report Share Posted March 8 RNC installs new leadership as Trump tightens hold on GOP RNC resolution to ban paying Trump’s legal bills is ‘dead’ soon the RNC will be paying Trumps personal civil trial penalties... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CdnFox Posted March 8 Report Share Posted March 8 1 hour ago, godzilla said: RNC installs new leadership as Trump tightens hold on GOP RNC resolution to ban paying Trump’s legal bills is ‘dead’ soon the RNC will be paying Trumps personal civil trial penalties... Wow - that'll make them REALLLLY vengeful if he gets back in I would think. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ironstone Posted March 8 Report Share Posted March 8 2 hours ago, eyeball said: Did you know that economics is a social science? Think about that. There was a time in Bernie's life where he was passionate about taxing the billionaires and the millionaires more. Then when Bernie himself became a multimillionaire, he was only passionate about taxing the billionaires more. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eyeball Posted March 8 Report Share Posted March 8 6 minutes ago, ironstone said: Then when Bernie himself became a multimillionaire, he was only passionate about taxing the billionaires more. Do you have anything that might qualify, quantify or corroborate that somehow? If it's just some op-ed slag piece from Infowars don't bother. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ironstone Posted March 8 Report Share Posted March 8 5 minutes ago, eyeball said: Do you have anything that might qualify, quantify or corroborate that somehow? If it's just some op-ed slag piece from Infowars don't bother. https://edition.cnn.com/2019/04/10/politics/bernie-sanders-taxes-millionaire/ Then there is the broader problem of Sanders’ wealth as it relates to his core campaign message that “millionaires and billionaires” have cornered far too much wealth and power in this country – and need to be reined in by a more activist federal government. Now that Sanders is one of those “millionaires and billionaires,” it could complicate that message – and his appeal as the underfunded outsider taking on the monied interested in Washington. https://www.cnn.com/2019/09/24/politics/bernie-sanders-ultra-wealth-tax-billionaires/index.html Unless you’ve lived on another planet for the last five years, you know that Bernie Sanders isn’t a big fan of the uber-wealthy. He’s been railing against the detrimental effects of millionaires and billionaires on the nation’s economy for years. But on Tuesday afternoon, Sanders took it even a step farther. In a tweet touting his newly unveiled plan to tax the ultra-wealthy, the Vermont senator wrote this: “There should be no billionaires. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
myata Posted March 9 Author Report Share Posted March 9 (edited) 11 hours ago, godzilla said: its a long road back. There's no road back with the entropy, it's a one-way street. Only if via a disruption event. Edited March 9 by myata Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eyeball Posted March 10 Report Share Posted March 10 On 3/8/2024 at 3:36 PM, ironstone said: Now that Sanders is one of those “millionaires and billionaires,” it could complicate that message Not in and of itself according to how you put it. Neither of the articles you've posted even come close to describing as you did, that Bernie Sanders has watered down his passion for taxing billionaires or even millionaires. On 3/8/2024 at 3:36 PM, ironstone said: “There should be no billionaires. That's right, such runaway wealth is unconscionable on a world of increasingly limited means that's filled with such an increasing level of need. It's been going on far too long, for decades. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ironstone Posted March 10 Report Share Posted March 10 9 hours ago, eyeball said: That's right, such runaway wealth is unconscionable on a world of increasingly limited means that's filled with such an increasing level of need. It's been going on far too long, for decades There are some billionaires who are actually pretty far left. Depending on where you stand, George Soros might be the best or worst example. So you agree with Bernie in that there should be no billionaires, but millionaires are perfectly fine? People like you want to just seize the wealth of the billionaires and...redistribute as you see fit? You should know full well how this would end. The billionaires are put out of existence, then you turn your attention to the millionaires and then seize all their wealth. But it wouldn't just end there would it? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nationalist Posted March 10 Report Share Posted March 10 Of course it was easy. Clinton shoots his jizz all over the oval office... Bush drags us all into a war based on lies... Barry sells out to Iran... By 2015 the American public were collectively sick of their government. Trump recognized that. Hilary-Billary did not. I do think the left has recognized this now, as they are busy implementing "change". The problem is, their "change" is destructive. So yes...it was easy to "take over the GOP". Change is coming. The question is which change? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.
Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible.