Ukraine Can't Win the War

[Nationalist]

57 minutes ago, User said:

No... what? Posting a link is not an argument. 

If you won't read the link that explains why and how Ukraine is losing, that's your problem. 

[Scott75]

2 hours ago, User said:

OK, so by "losing" they are slowly being ground down by Russia over the next 100 years... OK. 

Did World War I take 100 years for the allies to win? With that in mind, take a look at that map comparison from my last post.

[User]

5 hours ago, Scott75 said:

Did World War I take 100 years for the allies to win? With that in mind, take a look at that map comparison from my last post.

LOL, WWI? At this rate, WWI was won long before Russia will ever win here. 

7 hours ago, Nationalist said:

If you won't read the link that explains why and how Ukraine is losing, that's your problem. 

If you can't explain what your point is, then you have no point to consider. 

[Scott75]

23 hours ago, User said:

  

On 11/28/2025 at 4:39 PM, Scott75 said:

Did World War I take 100 years for the allies to win? With that in mind, take a look at that map comparison from my last post.

LOL, WWI? At this rate, WWI was won long before Russia will ever win here.

As I pointed out to you in a previous post, Russia's taken a lot more ground in the past 2 years than Western Front Advances between January 1915 and November 1916. Quoting my previous post:

 

On 11/28/2025 at 9:05 AM, Scott75 said:

Ukraine's been a lot of soldiers from the start of Russia's war in Ukraine and it's also lost a lot of territory since the start as well. Simplicius. a well known anonymous blogger on substack, wrote a long article detailing Russia's response to Trump's peace plan. I'll skip straight to the end, where he points out an interesting comparison:

**

An interesting comparison map of WW1 advances over an almost two year period to the advances of Russian forces just over the same most-recent period:

**

 

Full article:

https://simplicius76.substack.com/p/putin-lays-final-word-on-settlement

 

World War I took around 4 years to run its course. I wouldn't be all that surprised if the same occurs with the war in Ukraine. That being said, I acknowledge that it may last another year or 2 to get to 6 years, kind of like War War II. Barring a nuclear war with the U.S., wherein everyone loses, I doubt it'd long laster than that. 

[User]

3 minutes ago, Scott75 said:

As I pointed out to you in a previous post, Russia's taken a lot more ground in the past 2 years than Western Front Advances between January 1915 and November 1916. Quoting my previous post:

So... why isn't the war over then if this is only about how much ground was taken compared to WWI?

Any other random, meaningless comparisons you would like to make?

 

[SpankyMcFarland]

So Mr Putin, just to confirm, you want to keep what you’ve stolen, steal a lot more while you’re at it, resume business with the West, cancel all the war crimes malarkey and ensure you can steal the rest of the country down the road? Sounds reasonable. Where do we sign?

[User]

14 hours ago, SpankyMcFarland said:

So Mr Putin, just to confirm, you want to keep what you’ve stolen, steal a lot more while you’re at it, resume business with the West, cancel all the war crimes malarkey and ensure you can steal the rest of the country down the road? Sounds reasonable. Where do we sign?

So... is this is exactly how you felt about Crimea? Or do you think Ukraine should keep going until they take back that too?

War crimes? So... now you want the world to conquer Russia outright to bring them to justice?

You say these things like its all just so simple, and it is not. 

[SpankyMcFarland]

12 minutes ago, User said:

War crimes? So... now you want the world to conquer Russia outright to bring them to justice?

Of course not, no, but there’s no reason to do Russia’s dirty work and campaign to drop the war crimes charges. The thousands of atrocities committed by Russians in Ukraine are Putin’s problem. Let him deal with it. Where the line is drawn between the two sides and other details should be separate from the war crimes matter. What leaders like Putin hate about this is that their foreign travel is restricted. 

Edited November 30, 2025 by SpankyMcFarland

[User]

2 minutes ago, SpankyMcFarland said:

Of course not, no, but there’s no reason to do Russia’s dirty work and campaign to drop the war crimes charges. The thousands of atrocities committed by Russians in Ukraine are Putin’s problem. Let him deal with it. 

Depends on if you want peace or not... 

Listen, the options are basically 3 things:

1. The war continues to drag on with the paltry support of NATO countries just doing barely enough. Maybe in 10 years Russia quits... maybe they come up with ways to escalate, maybe is just keeps going for years until Ukraine is ground down. But war continues, the meat grinder continues. This has nothing to do with Trump. It was this way before him, and other NATO countries could do more if they wanted. So, singling out Trump here is just you trying to politicize this to attack Trump. 

2. The US and/or other NATO countries significantly increase military / logistical aid to truly support Ukraine so they can force Russia back or make it so painful for Russia they have no choice but to concede defeat on better terms. 

The problem here is that there is clearly no appetite for this, and it was this way before Trump. So, singling out Trump here is just you trying to politicize this to attack Trump. 

3. Some kind of peace deal is brokered now. This is not going to be pretty, as it exists now, Ukraine and others do not have leverage over Russia to force them to do much of anything... (see points 1 and 2), so this is going to be a deal that is ugly to some extent for Ukraine, no way around it, but the war comes to an end, Ukraine survives, the death and carnage stop. So... this is what Trump is pursuing. Criticize him, I do to, but I will do it fairly, not just because I hate Trump and want to politicize anything and everything I can to do so. 

 

 

[SpankyMcFarland]

 

On the war, I want to see it end immediately for multiple reasons which I explained before. But there are several serious impediments to a lasting peace. Firstly, Putin doesn’t seem to regard Ukraine as a legitimate independent state. Secondly, nothing Russia signs on to can be trusted. Thus the security guarantees for Ukraine would have to be absolutely explicit. Otherwise Russia is likely to try to take much more of the country when it thinks it can.

The two parties that really matter here are Ukraine and Russia. I merely believe that the Witkoff proposal would not work for Ukraine. I also believe that Rubio should control the process. Neither Witkoff nor Kushner are experts in this area and Witkoff has caused considerable confusion already. However, it is good that negotiations are ongoing. Let’s see where they go. 
 

 

 

 

[User]

16 minutes ago, SpankyMcFarland said:

I also believe that Rubio should control the process.

“This is not just about ending a war this is about ending a war in a way that creates a mechanism and a way forward that will allow them to be independent and sovereign and never have another war again,” Secretary of State Marco Rubio said at the start of the meeting.
https://nypost.com/2025/11/30/us-news/ukraine-peace-deal-must-ensure-theres-never-another-war-again-rubio/

[eyeball]

1 hour ago, User said:

You say these things like its all just so simple, and it is not. 

Sure it is, we all just stand up to the bully and tell him to fùck off and give Ukraine whatever they need to drive the point home.

[User]

4 minutes ago, eyeball said:

Sure it is, we all just stand up to the bully and tell him to fùck off and give Ukraine whatever they need to drive the point home.

"we all"

LOL, if it were so simple, why has that not happened yet?

Why are you not on the front lines of Ukraine right now?

[eyeball]

3 minutes ago, User said:

"we all"

LOL, if it were so simple, why has that not happened yet?

Why are you not on the front lines of Ukraine right now?

I'm a senior citizen with osteoarthritis for one thing.

It probably hasn't happened because no one knows for sure if the US won't drop their ambivalence and go all in with Putin.

[John Stone]

 

The newly independent country (1991) of Ukraine was briefly the third-largest nuclear power in the world?

 In the years that followed, Ukraine made the decision to completely denuclearize (1994).

In exchange, the U.S., the U.K. and Russia guaranteed Ukraine's security in an agreement known as the Budapest Memorandum.

.....there is a lesson to be  learned here. 

[eyeball]

8 minutes ago, John Stone said:

..there is a lesson to be  learned here.

Yes, we should send Ukraine some nukes.

[User]

18 minutes ago, eyeball said:

I'm a senior citizen with osteoarthritis for one thing.

It probably hasn't happened because no one knows for sure if the US won't drop their ambivalence and go all in with Putin.

So, when you said "we all" you really did not mean "we all" at all. 

All of a sudden, it isn't so simple to tell Putin to F off. 

20 minutes ago, eyeball said:

It probably hasn't happened because no one knows for sure if the US won't drop their ambivalence and go all in with Putin.

This is beyond dumb... the US has been backing Ukraine since day one and continues to do so now. You might as well say we don't know if Canada is going to join with Russia. 

As I said, this is not so simple, and you continue to not be a serious person here. 

[SpankyMcFarland]

37 minutes ago, User said:

“This is not just about ending a war this is about ending a war in a way that creates a mechanism and a way forward that will allow them to be independent and sovereign and never have another war again,” Secretary of State Marco Rubio said at the start of the meeting.
https://nypost.com/2025/11/30/us-news/ukraine-peace-deal-must-ensure-theres-never-another-war-again-rubio/

Each country involved needs to have a coherent approach where one person is the principal negotiator. We saw a lot of confusion on the US side in the last few weeks. What Rubio says should be the intent of the US but we have to be realistic about the other side. Putin would dearly like to repeat what North Vietnam did after negotiating a peace deal with the US. 
 

 

Edited November 30, 2025 by SpankyMcFarland

[eyeball]

3 minutes ago, User said:

So, when you said "we all" you really did not mean "we all" at all. 

I meant Ukraine's allies and friends.

So no that doesn't count the US.

[User]

Just now, eyeball said:

I meant Ukraine's allies and friends.

So no that doesn't count the US.

Yeah, you do this a alot on this forum, where you say one stupid thing, get called out, then move on to the next stupid thing. 

 

[eyeball]

4 minutes ago, User said:

Yeah, you do this a alot on this forum, where you say one stupid thing, get called out, then move on to the next stupid thing.

I know you think America is being smart about its policy towards Ukraine but you're in pretty sketchy company. Like Russia and North Korea.

[John Stone]

22 minutes ago, eyeball said:

Yes, we should send Ukraine some nukes.

Canada doesn't have nukes - we just criticize those countries that do. 

The lesson might be - don't trust hack politicians no matter the stripe. 

[User]

1 minute ago, eyeball said:

I know you think America is being smart about its policy towards Ukraine but you're in pretty sketchy company. Like Russia and North Korea.

You are here making asinine comments about how America is siding with Russia or isn't a friend to Ukraine. You are so far away from making smart comments, not even in the multiverse of smart. 

 

[eyeball]

Just now, John Stone said:

Canada doesn't have nukes - we just criticize those countries that do.

We also supply those who do with uranium.  Maybe not with weapons in mind anymore but by selling uranium to countries with nuclear weapons programs and civilian power generation we help free up other uranium sources they can use for weapons production.

[eyeball]

3 minutes ago, User said:

You are here making asinine comments about how America is siding with Russia or isn't a friend to Ukraine.

They're not asinine, they're in line with what billions around the world can see as clear as day just about anytime Trump opens his mouth about the war.