Ukraine Can't Win the War

[SpankyMcFarland]

1 hour ago, John Stone said:

Re: Understanding Russia is. 

I'd argue understanding Putin is more crucial. Contrary to popular belief, Putin is not a communist - I'm sure he'd laugh at anyone describing him as such. Putin is an autocrat - a thug - leading / controlling a pack of oligarchs that have robbed a pillaged the national treasury. Arguably Putin is the richest man in the world - by far. But his control is tenuous and hazardous. 

Good reads:

The Man Without a Face: The Unlikely Rise of Vladimir Putin / Masha Gessen

Red Notice / Bill Browder

Freezing Order / Bill Browder

Masha Gessen was onto Putin even before then, way back when I still hoped for reconciliation with Russia. 
 

Quote

But here is the thing about Vladimir Putin. He has never been much of a secret agent. He has never, that is, made a secret of his agenda. Back in 2000, when speaking to his biographers, he was open about his plan to centralize power in Russia and to eliminate gubernatorial elections. In December 2000, addressing a celebratory gathering of F.S.B. brass, Putin declared, as if it were a joke, "I would like to report that a group of agents planted in the government is carrying out its assignment!" He was not really kidding. More recently, Putin has made two sets of important public statements. Speaking at a rally in Moscow in November 2007, he said he would continue his campaign against Russian politicians and entrepreneurs from the 1990s. And speaking at a security conference in Munich in February 2007, Putin indicated that Russia had no intention of cooperating with NATO and would not hesitate to use force to protect its interests. He was not kidding this time, either.

https://archive.vanityfair.com/article/2008/10/dead-soul

 

Edited November 25, 2025 by SpankyMcFarland

[Moonbox]

22 hours ago, User said:

No, the US/Trump doesn’t have this leverage.

The point was made that it *could* be leverage but NATO certainly doesn’t seem to be willing to do that right now, nor are they.

Your question was what leverage was there against Russia.  It was a stupid question which you've already acknowledged the answer to - just another one of your worthless smoke screens, like "define a just peace".  🤡

The willingness to apply that pressure is what Spanky was questioning, specifically in the context of Trump, who seems unwilling to apply any against his pal Putin, and plenty against Ukraine.   

The Europeans, for their part, have been waking up and are now more important contributors to the Ukraine war effort than the US.  They're making themselves increasingly more important to Ukraine's survival, while the Orange Baboon makes himself increasingly more of an obstacle.  

22 hours ago, User said:

Also, love how you completely ignored your previous lies being called out and just want to move on instead of having enough decency to just admit you lied. 

What was I lying about, exactly?  That you're a die-hard Trump sycophant?  That wasn't a lie, though you accusing your debate opponents of lying is even more common than accusing them of running away from you.  I never compared you to Nationalist either.  I just find it amusing to see you, with your emphatic anti-Putin convictions, flail and cope with the reality that Trump has been a gift to Putin's war effort. 

I'll ask a THIRD time:   

Which part of Trump repeatedly stating that Ukraine started the war, saying that Zelensky is a dictator, fronting Russian wishlists as peace proposals (draft or otherwise), halting weapon shipments and threatening to cut off intelligence sharing do you figure has been helpful to Ukraine, rather than to Russia's benefit?  Which part of that should Ukraine be grateful for?  

 

[User]

9 hours ago, Moonbox said:

Your question was what leverage was there against Russia. 

Yes, I know what my question was... what is your point now other than stating the obvious and avoid the stupidity of your jumping in as you did?

9 hours ago, Moonbox said:

The Europeans, for their part, have been waking up and are now more important contributors to the Ukraine war effort than the US.  They're making themselves increasingly more important to Ukraine's survival, while the Orange Baboon makes himself increasingly more of an obstacle.  

Which is why the war is still slogging on? 

The United States continues to deliver billions of dollars in committed funding to the Ukraine war that is slated to be delivered through 2028 at this pace.

Its great the Europeans are "waking up" but if this war is so important to them, why are they not doing more right now? All you folks seem interested in is bashing Trump and ignoring the facts. 

9 hours ago, Moonbox said:

What was I lying about, exactly? 

This question is dishonest. I already told you, after you made up this garbage: "you quickly fell in line and started echoing and defending his bullshit"

I said:

"You can clearly see in this thread I still send plenty of time arguing against the BS people like Nationalist spew.

Why must you make up such obvious BS about me? "

So, why don't you stop being the cowardly liar you are and own up to this instead of demanding I move on to your stupid distractions?
 

9 hours ago, Moonbox said:

That you're a die-hard Trump sycophant?  That wasn't a lie

Well, it is not true. You know that. You are a liar. 

9 hours ago, Moonbox said:

I never compared you to Nationalist either. 

OK, didn't say you did. You really love making pointless comments.

9 hours ago, Moonbox said:

I just find it amusing to see you, with your emphatic anti-Putin convictions, flail and cope with the reality that Trump has been a gift to Putin's war effort. 

What flailing? What coping?

Come back when you can make an actual argument instead of adding to your list of lying, baseless assertions about me. 

 

[Nationalist]

8 hours ago, User said:

Yes, I know what my question was... what is your point now other than stating the obvious and avoid the stupidity of your jumping in as you did?

Which is why the war is still slogging on? 

The United States continues to deliver billions of dollars in committed funding to the Ukraine war that is slated to be delivered through 2028 at this pace.

Its great the Europeans are "waking up" but if this war is so important to them, why are they not doing more right now? All you folks seem interested in is bashing Trump and ignoring the facts. 

This question is dishonest. I already told you, after you made up this garbage: "you quickly fell in line and started echoing and defending his bullshit"

I said:

"You can clearly see in this thread I still send plenty of time arguing against the BS people like Nationalist spew.

What BS? 

That Ukraine is losing? They are.

That Ukraine has no military reserves left? They dont.

That NATO won't send troops and engage Russia directly? They won't.

That Ukraine needs a peace deal? They do.

[Moonbox]

11 hours ago, User said:

The United States continues to deliver billions of dollars in committed funding to the Ukraine war that is slated to be delivered through 2028 at this pace.

Funding approved under the Biden administration.  

11 hours ago, User said:

Its great the Europeans are "waking up" but if this war is so important to them, why are they not doing more right now? All you folks seem interested in is bashing Trump and ignoring the facts. 

They are doing more, and they're doing increasingly more as time passes.  Bashing Trump on the Russia file is 100% deserved, because he's been bad for Ukraine and good for Russia.  The only person ignoring the facts is you, and the fact that you've refused to address or even acknowledge my direct question THREE TIMES now is proof of it. 

I'll ask again, A FOURTH TIME:

Which part of Trump repeatedly stating that Ukraine started the war, saying that Zelensky is a dictator, fronting Russian wishlists as peace proposals (draft or otherwise), halting weapon shipments and threatening to cut off intelligence sharing do you figure has been helpful to Ukraine, rather than to Russia's benefit?  Which part of that should Ukraine be grateful for?  

Keep running away and putting your head in the sand, but my point stands.  You support Ukraine, but trip over yourself defending Trump's obvious harmful actions and attitudes towards them, and all the help he's been to Putin.  It's shameful, but also good comedy.  

11 hours ago, User said:

OK, didn't say you did. You really love making pointless comments.

You brought Nationalist up, not me LOL.  I've already acknowledged I know you're pro-Ukraine and anti-Putin.  My criticism of you is based on your cognitive dissonance around also being a diehard Trumpy, who by word and action, seems pretty pro-Putin. 

11 hours ago, User said:

Well, it is not true. You know that. You are a liar. 

 It's demonstrably true.  The efforts you waste defending and deflecting from Trump's conduct on virtually every issue, no matter how ridiculous, is the proof.  You could, of course, attempt to disprove me.  After all, you've apparently been been critical of him...so let's see it?  What are you critical of?  Marshmallow criticism about "he said a dumb thing" or couched with "but but but Joe Biden" doesn't count, by the way.   

You could, of course, take a stab at the question you've run away from THREE (soon to be four) times now.

At any rate, you mewling about dishonesty or lying is a meme on this forum.  You've overused and abused the complaint so often here that at this point it means nothing more than that you don't like what the other person was saying.  That is, of course, ignoring the oblivious hypocrisy of these complaints considering how evasive and dishonest you are.

Whining about dishonest questions when you've offered up gems like, "DUrr what leverage?   DurRR define a just peace.  DuRRR you want NATO to declare war on Russia?" is a joke. 

Complaining about people ignoring your points or questions when you've run away and refused to answer a question I've asked you clearly three (now four) times is even more pathetic.

[User]

4 hours ago, Nationalist said:

What BS? 

That Ukraine is losing? They are.

That Ukraine has no military reserves left? They dont.

That NATO won't send troops and engage Russia directly? They won't.

That Ukraine needs a peace deal? They do.

You jumped into a discussion. If you wanted to know what BS, try reading before commenting next time. The BS was what Moonbox was saying about my posting here. 

Yes, for as long as I have been on this forum and it seems since you first cheered Russia on in their invasion, you have been claiming Ukraine is losing. Yet, here we are, years later, and Russia is barely grinding beyond the borders they controlled at the start of the invasion. 

We are all well aware of your one sided view here, that you ignore how painful this war is to Russia and how things are not going great for them either as they struggle to feed their war machine. They too are depleting their reserves, and are so desperate they have to go beg North Korea to send arms and troops and try to pay contractors to fight this war for them. They don't have enough reserves to capitalize on the paltry gains they make fully. 

 

[User]

6 minutes ago, Moonbox said:

Funding approved under the Biden administration.  

And? The point remains, as you try to downplay the US and trump up Europe, it is still the US that continues to support Ukraine in large proportion here, and even the help Europe is providing, it is still the US that is helping backfill their stockpiles. 
 

7 minutes ago, Moonbox said:

Bashing Trump on the Russia file is 100% deserved, because he's been bad for Ukraine and good for Russia.  The only person ignoring the facts is you, and the fact that you've refused to address or even acknowledge my direct question THREE TIMES now is proof of it. 

This is just vague generalities. I bash Trump for the things he does deserve, where as you jumped into a discussion where Spanky has to stretch things and twist them to bash Trump. I am the one who cares about facts here and points this out. 

What facts am I ignoring? Ignoring your questions is not ignoring facts. 

I am ignoring your distractions because I don't play your stupid game where you lie about me then change the subject and refuse to acknowledge your lies and go on demanding I must respond to you in good faith when you have not done the same for me. 

9 minutes ago, Moonbox said:

At any rate, you mewling about dishonesty or lying is a meme on this forum.  You've overused and abused the complaint so often here that at this point it means nothing more than that you don't like what the other person was saying.  That is, of course, ignoring the oblivious hypocrisy of these complaints considering how evasive and dishonest you are.

Notice... you still refuse to respond to the actual things you said... because you are a liar. Worse than that, you are too cowardly to admit it or acknowledge what you did and own it. 

10 minutes ago, Moonbox said:

Whining about dishonest questions when you've offered up gems like, "DUrr what leverage?   DurRR define a just peace.  DuRRR you want NATO to declare war on Russia?" is a joke. 

No, the joke was your jumping in to the discussion to say DURRRRR Nato DURRRRR without understanding they are not actually any leverage available right now and further, you ignorantly didn't take into account their nature as a defensive alliance for members as you propose they should now become an offensive alliance to defend a non-member.

Like, gee... if you just type it out on a forum, its like magic! Your thinking is childish and naive and deserves little more than a DURRRRRR response. 

 

[Moonbox]

8 minutes ago, User said:

And? The point remains, as you try to downplay the US and trump up Europe, it is still the US that continues to support Ukraine in large proportion here, and even the help Europe is providing, it is still the US that is helping backfill their stockpiles. 

The point is that it's the US that's doing it, despite Trump, not because of him.  There are enough old-school Republicans that recognize the threat Russia poses that they won't indulge Trump and push back on his shameful attempts to throw Ukraine under the bus.  

12 minutes ago, User said:

This is just vague generalities. I bash Trump for the things he does deserve, where as you jumped into a discussion where Spanky has to stretch things and twist them to bash Trump. I am the one who cares about facts here and points this out. 

Like what?  What are you bashing him on?  I don't post here that much anymore, but I've seen you defend Trump for the most egregious and ridiculous things he's done and said (like Jan 6th), and never seen you offer more than token criticism, so prove me wrong buddy!  Your conduct in this thread certainly isn't helping your case!  😆

14 minutes ago, User said:

What facts am I ignoring? Ignoring your questions is not ignoring facts. 

I am ignoring your distractions because I don't play your stupid game where you lie about me then change the subject and refuse to acknowledge your lies

I listed the facts for you.  All of the things I listed in the question you've evaded FOUR times now are facts.  You're calling them distractions because you don't have answers for them.  You won't even acknowledge them.  Here they are, a FIFTH time:

Which part of Trump repeatedly stating that Ukraine started the war, saying that Zelensky is a dictator, fronting Russian wishlists as peace proposals (draft or otherwise), halting weapon shipments and threatening to cut off intelligence sharing do you figure has been helpful to Ukraine, rather than to Russia's benefit?  Which part of that should Ukraine be grateful for? 

19 minutes ago, User said:

Notice... you still refuse to respond to the actual things you said... because you are a liar. Worse than that, you are too cowardly to admit it or acknowledge what you did and own it. 

I called you a Trump sycophant.  You are.  Not liking the claim doesn't make it a lie. You twisting your brain into a pretzel trying to rationalize and deflect his disgraceful conduct is.  🙃

Regardless, you don't get to whine and moan about people not responding when you've refused to answer a clear and honest question FOUR times now.  All it does is highlight the game you're playing. 

Like a 5 year old playing checkers, you're making up the rules as you go.  Your opponent needs to individually address the piles of disingenuous and pedantic smokescreens and deflections you throw up, but you don't even have to answer one simple question, asked repeatedly. 

That's the rub here.  As soon as these debates try focus on something you don't like, the automatic and assured response is, "NONONONO YOU'RE LYING! 🤡

 

[User]

1 minute ago, Moonbox said:

The point is that it's the US that's doing it, despite Trump, not because of him.  There are enough old-school Republicans that recognize the threat Russia poses that they won't indulge Trump and push back on his shameful attempts to throw Ukraine under the bus.  

Not despite Trump... I swear you people have no idea how the US government system works. Trump is still the EXECUTIVE branch tasked with faithfully executing the laws, these things do not just magically continue to happen regardless of him. 

Well, Trump has no more thrown Ukraine under the bus metaphorically speaking than anyone else has as they all stood around and watched Russia invade in the first place while they spent years dangling joining the European Union or NATO to them as Russia piece by piece took Crimea, started shadow wars in the Donbas... 

I don't like what Trump has said or some of the things he has done, but his motives here are to end the war in the best way he can. 

You unrealistically think the only way to end this war is through victory... but have no path to victory other than crying but Trump! 

Where is Europe? Where are the other NATO nations? The only path happening right now is the slow grinding down of Ukraine while they all scrape up barely enough support to string Ukraine along. 

In a perfect world, I would like to see NATO dump a ton of military aid and equipment into Ukraine to force a Russian withdrawl... but that is not happening. In a more perfect world, Biden and NATO nations should have done that the moment Russia started moving tanks to the border instead of standing around for months saying don't do it. 

And now all you clowns do on this forum is use this shit to attack Trump in the dumbest and often purely dishonest ways. 
 

9 minutes ago, Moonbox said:

Like what?  What are you bashing him on?  I don't post here that much anymore, but I've seen you defend Trump for the most egregious and ridiculous things he's done and said (like Jan 6th), and never seen you offer more than token criticism, so prove me wrong buddy!  Your conduct in this thread certainly isn't helping your case! 

You love to play dumb... or is it that you really are just this dumb? I have criticized Trump in numerous places in numerous threads including this one. I just did above too. There you go. 

10 minutes ago, Moonbox said:

I listed the facts for you.  All of the things I listed in the question you've evaded FOUR times now are facts.  You're calling them distractions because you don't have answers for them.  You won't even acknowledge them.  Here they are, a FIFTH time:

 Its a question, not a list of facts then, and I already told you I am not playing your game until you acknowledge your lies. 

11 minutes ago, Moonbox said:

I called you a Trump sycophant.  You are.  Not liking the claim doesn't make it a lie. You twisting your brain into a pretzel trying to rationalize and deflect his disgraceful conduct is.  🙃

I am not though and that is not all you said either. You made a statement of fact about my posting here that was materially false. 

You are sad pathetic lying child who refuses to own up to your own petty conduct then you cry about why I won't ignore that and answer your questions... 

 

[Moonbox]

1 hour ago, User said:

Well, Trump has no more thrown Ukraine under the bus metaphorically speaking than anyone else has as they all stood around and watched Russia invade in the first place while they spent years dangling joining the European Union or NATO to them as Russia piece by piece took Crimea, started shadow wars in the Donbas... 

Typical User deflection - whataboutism.  

Even then, it's bullshit.  While it's true that Biden and Europe/NATO etc didn't do enough and waffled and prevaricated on Ukraine out of fear, there's a big difference between not doing enough to help to help Ukraine or taking too long to do it, vs actively undermining them as Trump has.  

1 hour ago, User said:

I don't like what Trump has said or some of the things he has done, but his motives here are to end the war in the best way he can. 

Best for who?  Trumps actions and words seem more intent on ending the war on Putin's term's than Ukraine's.  

I'LL ASK A SIXTH TIME:

Which part of Trump repeatedly stating that Ukraine started the war, saying that Zelensky is a dictator, fronting Russian wishlists as peace proposals (draft or otherwise), halting weapon shipments and threatening to cut off intelligence sharing do you figure has been helpful to Ukraine, rather than to Russia's benefit?  Which part of that should Ukraine be grateful for? 

No doubt you'll run away again and refuse to answer, because it's embarrassing for you.  

1 hour ago, User said:

You unrealistically think the only way to end this war is through victory... but have no path to victory other than crying but Trump! 

There's that dishonesty you keep complaining about!  For someone who accuses people of dishonesty at the drop of a hat, it's pretty remarkable how regularly you resort to it yourself!  

Aside from the fact that there are innumerable ways for the war to end, the dichotomy you present here is utter nonsense. You're also pretending to be in my head, making up a strawman to argue against that doesn't reflect my opinions or words.  GREAT JOB ON ALL ACCOUNTS 👍

2 hours ago, User said:

I am not though and that is not all you said either. You made a statement of fact about my posting here that was materially false. 

You are sad pathetic lying child who refuses to own up to your own petty conduct then you cry about why I won't ignore that and answer your questions... 

This sort of wet babyshit is tragic comedy.  

Calling a subjective judgment of your attitudes on Trump "materially false" is retarded, and just further demonstrates how limp and pedantic your debating skills are. 

When your debating skills evolve beyond whining and accusations of dishonesty the moment someone disagrees with you, let us know. 🫡

[User]

1 hour ago, Moonbox said:

Typical User deflection - whataboutism.  

Whataboutism is the cry of people like you who don't want to own up to the facts. 

1 hour ago, Moonbox said:

Even then, it's bullshit.  While it's true that Biden and Europe/NATO etc didn't do enough and waffled and prevaricated on Ukraine out of fear, there's a big difference between not doing enough to help to help Ukraine or taking too long to do it, vs actively undermining them as Trump has.  

So, first you say it is BS, then you go on to concede its true. You are right, there is a huge difference. If Biden/Western nations had actually acted BEFORE the invasion, they could have very well prevented any of this from ever happening. But  you just want to hate Trump. 

Beyond Trump saying a couple of stupid things, what is he actually doing to undermine them? You sound like a stupid police officer who is telling someone they are obstructing and interfering with his investigation because they are standing 30 feet away filming and flipping them off. 

1 hour ago, Moonbox said:

Best for who?  Trumps actions and words seem more intent on ending the war on Putin's term's than Ukraine's. 

Best for the world and the people dying every day. 

Again, the terms as they exist today are what they are... you bring peace under them OR you sink more into the war to change them. 

So, who is willing to do that? It certainly isn't Europe you keep bragging about. 

1 hour ago, Moonbox said:

I'LL ASK A SIXTH TIME:

When you are man enough to own up to your dishonesty. 

1 hour ago, Moonbox said:

There's that dishonesty you keep complaining about!  For someone who accuses people of dishonesty at the drop of a hat, it's pretty remarkable how regularly you resort to it yourself!  

Then what is your solution? Right now, you are here crying about Trump. 

1 hour ago, Moonbox said:

Aside from the fact that there are innumerable ways for the war to end, the dichotomy you present here is utter nonsense. You're also pretending to be in my head, making up a strawman to argue against that doesn't reflect my opinions or words.  GREAT JOB ON ALL ACCOUNTS 👍

OK, lets hear them. 

1 hour ago, Moonbox said:

This sort of wet babyshit is tragic comedy.  

Calling a subjective judgment of your attitudes on Trump "materially false" is retarded, and just further demonstrates how limp and pedantic your debating skills are. 

When your debating skills evolve beyond whining and accusations of dishonesty the moment someone disagrees with you, let us know. 🫡

Again, you made comments of fact on what I actually post here that were false. You are just too much of a cowardly liar to own up to it. So keep on crying about my not pretending otherwise and continuing to engage in your stupid questions. 

 

[Nationalist]

7 hours ago, User said:

You jumped into a discussion. If you wanted to know what BS, try reading before commenting next time. The BS was what Moonbox was saying about my posting here. 

Yes, for as long as I have been on this forum and it seems since you first cheered Russia on in their invasion, you have been claiming Ukraine is losing. Yet, here we are, years later, and Russia is barely grinding beyond the borders they controlled at the start of the invasion. 

We are all well aware of your one sided view here, that you ignore how painful this war is to Russia and how things are not going great for them either as they struggle to feed their war machine. They too are depleting their reserves, and are so desperate they have to go beg North Korea to send arms and troops and try to pay contractors to fight this war for them. They don't have enough reserves to capitalize on the paltry gains they make fully. 

 

The Ukraine is losing. Everyone seems to know that but you.

[User]

1 hour ago, Nationalist said:

The Ukraine is losing. Everyone seems to know that but you.

You have been saying that for years now... 

[Nationalist]

3 hours ago, User said:

You have been saying that for years now... 

Yes. And it's been true the whole time.

You want Ukraine to "win"? Go fight.

What do you think would happen if Trump decided to send the US military to fight Russia? Huh? Think the US citizens would be good with that?

Fck no.

You want the war without the mess. Let others fight for you. 

I was raised to fight my own battles. 

If NATO wants Ukraine, go fight. After all...it was the US that kicked this off with a coup. Go find out how glorious it is to fight for your life in a war over the most corrupt nation in Europe. Hell, send your kids and grandchildren too.

No?

Pfft...

[SpankyMcFarland]

It’s hard to see how the gap between Russia and Ukraine can be bridged by any negotiations at the moment.

Quote

Vladimir Putin has said that the outline of a draft peace plan discussed by the US and Ukraine could serve as a basis for future negotiations to end the war – but insisted Ukraine would have to surrender territory for any deal to be possible.

Quote

The Russian president’s uncompromising remarks – in which he again described Volodymyr Zelenskyy as “illegitimate” – suggested that, despite White House optimism, there is little sign of movement on the core sticking points needed to end the war.

Speaking to reporters during a working visit to Kyrgyzstan, Putin said Russia would halt its offensive only if Ukrainian forces withdrew from unspecified areas currently under Kyiv’s control. “If Ukrainian troops leave the territories they occupy, then we will stop fighting,” he said. “If they don’t, we will achieve our aims militarily.”

He also repeated his claim that Ukraine’s leadership was “illegitimate”, arguing that this made it legally impossible to sign a binding agreement with Kyiv and that any future settlement would require broader international recognition.

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2025/nov/27/putin-insists-ukraine-surrender-territory-for-peace-deal-possible

[SpankyMcFarland]

17 hours ago, Nationalist said:

The Ukraine is losing. Everyone seems to know that but you.

Both sides are losing a great deal of blood and treasure on a daily basis. Only one side can choose to stop and go home. 

[Scott75]

16 hours ago, User said:

  

17 hours ago, Nationalist said:

The Ukraine is losing. Everyone seems to know that but you.

You have been saying that for years now... 

 

It's been true since the start. It's just becoming impossible to ignore at this point.

[User]

2 hours ago, Scott75 said:

 

It's been true since the start. It's just becoming impossible to ignore at this point.

Sure... and you guys will keep claiming this. Describe what you mean by losing. 

Because as has been obvious since day one, "losing" means Russia will win this war in 100 years... maybe. 

[User]

15 hours ago, Nationalist said:

Yes. And it's been true the whole time.

You want Ukraine to "win"? Go fight.

You want Ukraine to give up? You go fight. 

15 hours ago, Nationalist said:

What do you think would happen if Trump decided to send the US military to fight Russia? Huh? Think the US citizens would be good with that?

Fck no.

Any other irrelevent strawmen you want to argue against?

15 hours ago, Nationalist said:

You want the war without the mess. Let others fight for you. 

I was raised to fight my own battles. 

So why are you not over there fighting for Russia then?

15 hours ago, Nationalist said:

If NATO wants Ukraine, go fight. After all...it was the US that kicked this off with a coup. Go find out how glorious it is to fight for your life in a war over the most corrupt nation in Europe. Hell, send your kids and grandchildren too.

No?

Pfft...

Or, just continue to support Ukraine with arms and other logistics, and do so more. 

 

[Nationalist]

16 hours ago, User said:

Sure... and you guys will keep claiming this. Describe what you mean by losing. 

Because as has been obvious since day one, "losing" means Russia will win this war in 100 years... maybe. 

No.

https://apnews.com/article/russia-ukraine-war-pokrovsk-d33999044aea4cf2173cbcf294bd8843

 

[Scott75]

17 hours ago, User said:

  

19 hours ago, Scott75 said:

 

It's been true since the start. It's just becoming impossible to ignore at this point.

Sure... and you guys will keep claiming this. Describe what you mean by losing. 

Ukraine's been a lot of soldiers from the start of Russia's war in Ukraine and it's also lost a lot of territory since the start as well. Simplicius. a well known anonymous blogger on substack, wrote a long article detailing Russia's response to Trump's peace plan. I'll skip straight to the end, where he points out an interesting comparison:

**

An interesting comparison map of WW1 advances over an almost two year period to the advances of Russian forces just over the same most-recent period:

**

 

Full article:

https://simplicius76.substack.com/p/putin-lays-final-word-on-settlement

 

Edited November 28, 2025 by Scott75

[Moonbox]

On 11/26/2025 at 6:28 PM, User said:

Beyond Trump saying a couple of stupid things, what is he actually doing to undermine them?

For someone who's spent the last two pages of this thread crying about dishonesty, it's absurd how much dishonesty you cram into a single post like this, and how much it does to prove everything I'm saying about you.  Let's unpack:

1.  I've already provided a list of answers to your question, bolded and italicized, SIX TIMES, in my LAST SIX REPLIES.  Don't worry, I'll do it again here a SEVENTH TIME (feel free to answer if you're not too cowardly, but we both know you won't):

Which part of Trump repeatedly stating that Ukraine started the war, saying that Zelensky is a dictator, fronting Russian wishlists as peace proposals (draft or otherwise), halting weapon shipments and threatening to cut off intelligence sharing do you figure has been helpful to Ukraine, rather than to Russia's benefit?  Which part of that should Ukraine be grateful for? 

2.  Summarizing and minimizing all of the above down to Trump "saying a couple of stupid things" is either outright dishonest, or delusional.  You can choose.  Either way, it's good way of demonstrating how far up Trump's ass your head is, and how much of a sad zealot/sycophant you are.  This aren't "Oopsie, slip of the tongue" moments either.  These are deliberate behaviors he repeats, and they were predicted based on everything he'd said before he was re-elected too.  

On 11/26/2025 at 6:28 PM, User said:

Again, you made comments of fact on what I actually post here that were false. You are just too much of a cowardly liar to own up to it. So keep on crying about my not pretending otherwise and continuing to engage in your stupid questions. 

You know about the boy who cried wolf, right?  Same idea here.  

You calling someone a liar stopped meaning anything somewhere between the 100th and 1000th time you did it on this forum.  You do it at the drop of a hat, against anyone that pushes back against your goofy smokescreens, and all it means at this point is that you don't like what they're saying.  🤡

When I call you a Trump sycophant and provide my reasons, that's as much a "comment of fact" as me calling you ugly and describing your unsightly facial features.  That you don't seem to understand the difference between a subjective and objective statement not only makes your compulsive hair-trigger accusations of lying even more pathetic, it also neatly highlights what a ridiculous person you are.  

 

 

[User]

18 minutes ago, Moonbox said:

Summarizing and minimizing all of the above down to Trump "saying a couple of stupid things" is either outright dishonest, or delusional. 

Except that is half of what you proposed, is his saying some stupid things. Ukraine is not entitled to our support and Zelensky undermined Trump in the Whitehouse. The threats were to let him know he doesn't just get our support no matter what, and guess what? It was resumed. 

So... in the end, you got didly squat beyond crying about Trump saying stupid things, most if not all of which have been walked back. Ukraine is still getting military support. 

20 minutes ago, Moonbox said:

You know about the boy who cried wolf, right?  Same idea here.  

Notice how, instead of dealing with what lies you said, you ignore them. You are called a liar, because you lied. Instead of dealing with that you want to cry about being called a liar. 

Stop lying. Be a man, own up to what you said and admit you were wrong. 

 

[User]

4 hours ago, Nationalist said:

No.

https://apnews.com/article/russia-ukraine-war-pokrovsk-d33999044aea4cf2173cbcf294bd8843

 

No... what? Posting a link is not an argument. 

[User]

4 hours ago, Scott75 said:

Ukraine's been a lot of soldiers from the start of Russia's war in Ukraine and it's also lost a lot of territory since the start as well. Simplicius. a well known anonymous blogger on substack, wrote a long article detailing Russia's response to Trump's peace plan. I'll skip straight to the end, where he points out an interesting comparison:

OK, so by "losing" they are slowly being ground down by Russia over the next 100 years... OK.