Minister Guilbeault Must Go Along With The Other Liberal-NDP Radicals

[Zeitgeist]

So not only must we live like people in a developing country, not getting bags at the checkout of grocery stores, we can’t even have environmentally friendly non-plastic bags.  I knew we we shooting ourselves in the feet when Trudeau gave a radical green activist a Cabinet position, but I didn’t realize that Guilbeault is this stupid.  No wonder Canada is struggling in productivity.  We’re not allowed to innovate and improve our quality of life.

https://www.cbc.ca/amp/1.6928724

Edited August 6, 2023 by Zeitgeist

[OftenWrong]

It's simply government stupidity and inertia, which the fed is absolutely famous for.

Here's the truly ironic part that highlights the government ineptitude.

"To me, [the regulation] doesn't make sense. You can sell a compostable bag on the shelf, but you can't have it at the checkout," said Kendra Sozinho, the assistant store manager.

As I mentioned some time ago, everyone in the country is facing this dilemma these days. Instead of using the grocery bag as my garbage bag (making it "dual-use"), we now buy a box of plastic bags off the shelf. These are for garbage, hence single-use. In addition to, the heavy-reinforced nylon and plastic bags we bought to use as grocery bags that will go into the landfill later on. These heavier bags must equate to at least 20-30 of the older plastic bags. Not even discounting how many of the grocery plastic bags were put into the recycling bin, not landfill.

So I will bet you one dollar that all this government effort and attention equates to a MINIMAL reduction in plastic bags going in the landfill. Am still throwing out the same number of garbage bags per week.

Exactly why government powers need to be reigned in, kept in check and the government must be heavily criticized at all times by citizens, to keep them in line.

[Zeitgeist]

Canada has become such a country of gullible suckers. We have more energy in the ground than just about anywhere, yet we tax and regulate ourselves into poverty pretending to “fight climate change.”  Down in Florida right now where someone bags my groceries at the checkout.  Life is easier here. I’m constantly reminded of how far Canada has fallen.  Big apartments and homes are a third of the price of what we pay in Ontario, where people are throwing every spare cent they have to live like lemmings in shoe-box-sized condos.  Living standards have tanked in Canada, but our ridiculous federal government claims we’re saving the planet as a million new carbon footprints immigrate to Canada in one year, driving up the demand for housing and adding stress to our inadequate transportation infrastructure. Idiocy.

Edited August 6, 2023 by Zeitgeist

[eyeball]

9 hours ago, OftenWrong said:

So I will bet you one dollar that all this government effort and attention equates to a MINIMAL reduction in plastic bags going in the landfill.

The issue with compostable plastics is the threat posed to programs intended to take food scraps and other organic material out of landfills.

From the article in the OP.

Karen Wirsig, the senior program manager with Environmental Defence, worries about what would happen if compostable bags and containers were diverted to the green bin system.

"Imagine if we just replaced all that with so-called compostables. It would overflow all our organics programs, and we wouldn't have any room for actual organics," Wirsig said. "In the end, we would not have healthy, good soil amendment."

To get a sense of scope think about images you've seen of ships laden with bales and containers of plastic and mountains of these in countries they often wind up in before being high-graded and dumped into the sea or burned.  

Landfill operators are being mandated to stop methane emissions produced by decaying organic material placed in landfills.  Composting programs are a lot less expensive than installing cap and capture systems.

Quote

Am still throwing out the same number of garbage bags per week.

There'll always be some but most low-grade plastics should be going to recycling. 

[Zeitgeist]

1 hour ago, eyeball said:

The issue with compostable plastics is the threat posed to programs intended to take food scraps and other organic material out of landfills.

From the article in the OP.

Karen Wirsig, the senior program manager with Environmental Defence, worries about what would happen if compostable bags and containers were diverted to the green bin system.

"Imagine if we just replaced all that with so-called compostables. It would overflow all our organics programs, and we wouldn't have any room for actual organics," Wirsig said. "In the end, we would not have healthy, good soil amendment."

To get a sense of scope think about images you've seen of ships laden with bales and containers of plastic and mountains of these in countries they often wind up in before being high-graded and dumped into the sea or burned.  

Landfill operators are being mandated to stop methane emissions produced by decaying organic material placed in landfills.  Composting programs are a lot less expensive than installing cap and capture systems.

There'll always be some but most low-grade plastics should be going to recycling. 

What if some of the energy we produce emits some pollution?  Therefore all electricity should be banned.  Stupid right?   These are the kinds of arguments our leaders are making now.  

[eyeball]

16 minutes ago, Zeitgeist said:

What if some of the energy we produce emits some pollution?  Therefore all electricity should be banned.  Stupid right?   These are the kinds of arguments our leaders are making now.  

What on Earth does this have to do with green bin disposal and organics composting systems being overwhelmed?  You'd cancel all of these and install cap and capture systems based on an argument involving pollution and electricity for the sake of compostable plastics? You might as well shoehorn in an argument for the return of asbestos mining while you're at it.   

 

Edited August 7, 2023 by eyeball

[Zeitgeist]

1 hour ago, eyeball said:

What on Earth does this have to do with green bin disposal and organics composting systems being overwhelmed?  You'd cancel all of these and install cap and capture systems based on an argument involving pollution and electricity for the sake of compostable plastics? You might as well shoehorn in an argument for the return of asbestos mining while you're at it.   

 

My point is, add more green bins and composting capacity to accommodate the compostable bags, or are we aiming to have harder lives now?  I thought green innovation was the goal of these policies.  A company creates non-plastic compostable bags and our government refuses to allow them.  Stupid country.

[herbie]

On 8/6/2023 at 7:25 AM, Zeitgeist said:

we can’t even have environmentally friendly non-plastic bags.

WTF are you talking about? That's what you have to bring with you to put your purchases in right now. If you forget they offer to sell you one.

[CdnFox]

On 8/6/2023 at 5:20 PM, eyeball said:

The issue with compostable plastics is the threat posed to programs intended to take food scraps and other organic material out of landfills.

From the article in the OP.

Karen Wirsig, the senior program manager with Environmental Defence, worries about what would happen if compostable bags and containers were diverted to the green bin system.

"Imagine if we just replaced all that with so-called compostables. It would overflow all our organics programs, and we wouldn't have any room for actual organics," Wirsig said. "In the end, we would not have healthy, good soil amendment."

To get a sense of scope think about images you've seen of ships laden with bales and containers of plastic and mountains of these in countries they often wind up in before being high-graded and dumped into the sea or burned.  

Landfill operators are being mandated to stop methane emissions produced by decaying organic material placed in landfills.  Composting programs are a lot less expensive than installing cap and capture systems.

There'll always be some but most low-grade plastics should be going to recycling. 

Yeah - that was all complete bullsnark.  (the article stuff i mean).  There was no chance in the slightest of any meaningful or noticeable increase at the landfills.

In fact -there have been a number of studies showing that cloth bags actually produce more carbon to make by far and wind up in the landfills as PERMANENT garbage as they tend to wear out relatively quickly.

This was all just virtue signalling.  Compostable plastics would actually have been a better choice environmentally.  A bit of a knee jerk reaction i'm afraid.

It's also been noted that the practice can be severely negative in times of pandemic or llness as most bacteria or virii can live on those multi use non woven polypropyline (most of the fabric-like bags we see now) for days.

Another example of the gov't deciding that it would rather do SOMEthing than the right thing.

 

[CdnFox]

15 minutes ago, herbie said:

WTF are you talking about? That's what you have to bring with you to put your purchases in right now. If you forget they offer to sell you one.

No it isn't - First off the bags that you bring with you now for the most part are non woven polypropyline. They're just multi use.

Cotton bags are bio degradable but the very LEAST environmentally friendly because of the manufacturing and i haven't seen anyone distributing those anymore.

What kind of bags are YOUR stores giving you?

(probable stupid answer in 3....  2....  1..... )

[OftenWrong]

1 hour ago, CdnFox said:

probable stupid answer in 3....  2....  1..... )

Not to mention vague,

obtuse,

non-sequitor,

and only slightly funny!

 

[herbie]

Oh Jeez Mr Petty himself wants to argue reusable bags aren't environmentally friendly. Ones you use for years aren't as good as plastic you use once and toss.

Well guess what if - the alernative you want for PM thinks like that he's too f*cking dumb to be a PM. Dumb enough to promote Danielle Smith as Minister of Environment.

So buy a paper bag for 35c and wear it over your heads.

Edited January 5 by herbie

[CdnFox]

5 minutes ago, herbie said:

Oh Jeez Mr Petty himself wants to argue reusable bags aren't environmentally friendly. Ones you use for years aren't as good as plastic you use once and toss.

Well guess what if - the alernative you want for PM thinks like that he's too f*cking dumb to be a PM. Dumb enough to promote Danielle Smith as Minister of Environment.

So buy a paper bag for 35c and wear it over your heads.

 

1 hour ago, OftenWrong said:

Not to mention vague,

obtuse,

non-sequitor,

and only slightly funny!

 

Wow -   you called that perfectly   You even got the order right!!!

 

Edited January 5 by CdnFox

[CdnFox]

3 minutes ago, herbie said:

Oh Jeez Mr Petty himself wants to argue reusable bags aren't environmentally friendly. Ones you use for years aren't as good as plastic you use once and toss.
 

well that's what the science says.  I know how facts enrage you but just try to hold it together   As i noted the materials and costs involved with the reusable bags is so much vastly higher than the single use plastics that it's virtually impossible to use them enough to make them better than the single use bags on average. 

Sowweeee little guy.

Quote

Well guess what if - the alernative you want for PM thinks like that he's too f*cking dumb to be a PM.

Wow that was hard to read.  LOL - i can always tell when you're getting upset by the facts, your command of english starts to slip    But -  as i said that's what the scientists say.  So - are you saying if the pm thinks like a scientist he shouldn't be pm?  I can see why you'd think that being stupid is better considering you vote for the left and they are pretty dumb, but no - it's actually better to be smart turns out.  You'll have to take my word for it.

Quote

Dumb enough to promote Danielle Smith as Minister of Environment.

Yeah....  she's provincial? He'd be federal?  i'll explain the difference to you one of these days so you can participate in these conversations better.

Quote

So buy a paper bag for 35c and wear it over your heads.

why would you buy a paper bag?  You've already got the cloth one. Is that a family tradition or something, your mom would put a paper bag over your head when you went  out so you think everyone does that?   Oh - and fun fact, paper bags are actually the worst of all three environmentally