Rebound Posted August 11, 2023 Report Share Posted August 11, 2023 On 8/3/2023 at 4:41 PM, robosmith said: Trump's "delusion" defense I don’t think that defense will work, because it does not matter whether Trump thought the election was stolen or not. What matters are the criminal acts and whether he knew they were criminal acts. And he did. For instance, OJ Simpson went to prison for taking sports memorabilia items which had been stolen from him. Simpson believed they were his stolen property, but that doesn’t make breaking and entering legal. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eyeball Posted August 11, 2023 Report Share Posted August 11, 2023 1 hour ago, Rebound said: I don’t think that defense will work, Trump's defense team notwithstanding... From the article cited. Politically, however, the "delusion defense" would force Republicans into the uncomfortable position of defending a candidate who can't be trusted to distinguish reality from conspiracy Why on Earth do they think this will be an issue with Republican supporters? 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WestCanMan Posted August 11, 2023 Report Share Posted August 11, 2023 3 hours ago, Rebound said: I don’t think that defense will work, because it does not matter whether Trump thought the election was stolen or not. Of course it matters if he knew or not. If Trump thought that the Dems didn't cheat for once, and he pretended that he knew they did cheat, then he'd be encouraging Americans to protest at the capitol based on false info. That's dicey. It matters a lot what Trump believed. It's not a crime for him to say things that he believes to be true. Quote What matters are the criminal acts and whether he knew they were criminal acts. And he did. What criminal acts? Trump never encouraged violence or anything but a peaceful protest. When he found out that the protests weren't peaceful he sent out two tweets and a video within 3 hrs. By contrast, Obama was still inciting racial violence over M Brown's death a month after it happened, and Obama had to say things that he knew were lies in order to do incite that racial violence. Bottom line is that leftards love election cheating, election interference, crimes and malfeasance by police to influence elections, riots, racial division, and suddenly they went apoplectic over less than 1/4 of a day's rioting on Jan 6th. Leftists are basically shitty, worthless people. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
robosmith Posted August 11, 2023 Author Report Share Posted August 11, 2023 (edited) 24 minutes ago, WestCanMan said: Of course it matters if he knew or not. And ne definitely knew that he lost. Even Barr told him there was no evidence of fraud. The only ones who told him he won were the shopping lawyers, which is why the "advice of counsel" will NOT work as a defense. Of course, I don't expect a statistician from Canada will know that US law, cause they don't mention it on FOS LIES. Edited August 11, 2023 by robosmith Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
myata Posted August 11, 2023 Report Share Posted August 11, 2023 13 hours ago, WestCanMan said: Your sudden burst of honesty about You always forget - or just cannot get? it's about the reality, not words. They aren't the same, see "fixed North Korea", "stolen election" and many other of the Clown Idol's lies. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rebound Posted August 11, 2023 Report Share Posted August 11, 2023 6 hours ago, WestCanMan said: Of course it matters if he knew or not. If Trump thought that the Dems didn't cheat for once, and he pretended that he knew they did cheat, then he'd be encouraging Americans to protest at the capitol based on false info. That's dicey. It matters a lot what Trump believed. It's not a crime for him to say things that he believes to be true. What criminal acts? Trump never encouraged violence or anything but a peaceful protest. When he found out that the protests weren't peaceful he sent out two tweets and a video within 3 hrs. By contrast, Obama was still inciting racial violence over M Brown's death a month after it happened, and Obama had to say things that he knew were lies in order to do incite that racial violence. Bottom line is that leftards love election cheating, election interference, crimes and malfeasance by police to influence elections, riots, racial division, and suddenly they went apoplectic over less than 1/4 of a day's rioting on Jan 6th. Leftists are basically shitty, worthless people. Dude, then get it through your ultra-thick skull: Trump definitely, absolutely, positively KNEW he lost. His daughter knew it. His entire political team knew it. He knew it because one expert after another told him face to face that he’d lost. He lied to his own supermodel wife about the pornstars (plural) who he had sex with while she was pregnant. And he cheated on his three wives before that. So don’t think the man won’t lie to you. He did. To be more clear: Nobody told Donald Trump that he had won. Nobody, except maybe pillow guy and Sydney Powell, who are both being sued for over $1 billion each over their election lies. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
myata Posted August 11, 2023 Report Share Posted August 11, 2023 (edited) Trump's nomination would be a serious challenge not just for the Republican party but the American democracy itself. The problem is not the personality or individual; it's the intellectual and responsibility level of the discourse that is pulled from the kind of a marginal sect right into the mainstream politics by the nature of the binary system. Then it becomes a standard and a new low. And at certain level down this hole, the democracy ceases to exist. With his election win lies he's banging right on those levels. They are no different from any African or South American dictator already. Edited August 11, 2023 by myata 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BeaverFever Posted August 13, 2023 Report Share Posted August 13, 2023 (edited) Here’s a thorough and entertaining legal breakdown of the details of the case against Trump and his co-accused by am actual lawyer with a sense of humour Edited August 13, 2023 by BeaverFever Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BeaverFever Posted August 13, 2023 Report Share Posted August 13, 2023 Exclusive: Georgia prosecutors have messages showing Trump’s team is behind voting system breach CNN — none Atlanta-area prosecutors investigating efforts to overturn the 2020 election results in Georgia are in possession of text messages and emails directly connecting members of Donald Trump’s legal team to the early January 2021 voting system breach in Coffee County, sources tell CNN. Fulton County District Attorney Fani Willisis expected to seek charges against more than a dozen individuals when her team presents its case before a grand jury next week. Several individuals involved in the voting systems breach in Coffee County are among those who may face charges in the sprawling criminal probe. Investigators in the Georgia criminal probe have long suspected the breach was not an organic effort sprung from sympathetic Trump supporters in rural and heavily Republican Coffee County – a county Trump won by nearly 70% of the vote. They have gathered evidence indicating it was a top-down push by Trump’s team to access sensitive voting software, according to people familiar with the situation. Trump allies attempted to access voting systems after the 2020 election as part of the broader push to produce evidence that could back up the former president’s baseless claims of widespread fraud. While Trump’s January 2021 call to Georgia Secretary of State Brad Raffensperger and effort to put forward fake slates of electors have long been considered key pillars of Willis’ criminal probe, the voting system breach in Coffee County quietly emerged as an area of focus for investigators roughly one year ago. Since then, new evidence has slowly been uncovered about the role of Trump’s attorneys, the operatives they hired and how the breach, as well as others like it in other key states, factored into broader plans for overturning the election. Together, the text messages and other court documents show how Trump lawyers and a group of hired operatives sought to access Coffee County’s voting systems in the days before January 6, 2021, as the former president’s allies continued a desperate hunt for any evidence of widespread fraud they could use to delay certification of Joe Biden’s electoral victory. Last year, a former Trump official testified under oath to the House January 6 select committee that plans to access voting systems in Georgia were discussed in meetings at the White House, including during an Oval Office meeting on December 18, 2020, that included Trump. Six days before pro-Trump operatives gained unauthorized access to voting systems, the local elections official who allegedly helped facilitate the breach sent a “written invitation” to attorneys working for Trump, according to text messages obtained by CNN. Investigators have scrutinized the actions of various individuals who were involved, including Misty Hampton, a former Coffee County elections official who authored the letter of invitation referenced in text messages and other documents that have been turned over to prosecutors, multiple sources told CNN. They have also examined the involvementof Trump’s then attorney Rudy Giuliani – who was informed last year he was a target in the Fulton County investigation – and fellow Trump lawyer Sidney Powell as part of their probe, according to people familiar with the matter. A spokesperson for Willis’ office declined to comment. The letter of invitation was shared with attorneys and an investigator working with Giuliani at the time, the text messages obtained by CNN show. A ‘written invitation’ to access voting systems On January 1, 2021 – days ahead of the January 7 voting systems breach – Katherine Friess – an attorney working with Giuliani, Sidney Powell and other Trump allies shared a “written invitation” to examine voting systems in Coffee County with a group of Trump allies. That group included members of Sullivan Strickler, a firm hired by Trump’s attorneys to examine voting systems in the small, heavily Republican Georgia county, according to text messages obtained by CNN. That same day, Friess sent a “Letter of invitation to Coffee County, Georgia” to former NYPD Police Commissioner Bernie Kerik, who was working with Giuliani to find evidence that would back up their baseless claims of potential widespread voter fraud, according to court documents filed as part of an ongoing civil case. Friess then notified operatives who carried out the Coffee County breach and others working directly with Giuliani that Trump’s team had secured written permission, the texts show. CNN has not reviewed the substance of the invitation letter itself, only communications that confirm it was provided to Friess, Kerik and Sullivan Strickler employees. Friess could not be reached for comment. The messages and documents appear to link Giuliani to the Coffee County breach, while shedding light on another channel of communication between pro-Trump attorneys and the battleground state operatives who worked together to provide unauthorized individuals access to sensitive voting equipment. Exclusive: Text messages reveal Trump operatives considered using breached voting data to decertify Georgia's Senate runoff in 2021 “Rudy Giuliani had nothing to do with this,” said Robert Costello, Giuliani’s attorney. “You can’t attach Rudy Giuliani to Sidney Powell’s crackpot idea.” “Just landed back in DC with the Mayor huge things starting to come together!” an employee from the firm Sullivan Strickler, which was hired by Sidney Powell to examine voting systems in Coffee County, wrote in a group chat with other colleagues on January 1. Former New York Mayor Giuliani was consistently referred to as “the Mayor,” in other texts sent by the same individual and others at the time. “Most immediately, we were just granted access – by written invitation! – to Coffee County’s systems. Yay!” the text reads. Breaking into Coffee County Shortly after Election Day, Hampton – still serving as the top election official for Coffee County – warned during a state election board meeting that Dominion voting machines could “very easily” be manipulated to flip votes from one candidate to another. It’s a claim that has been repeatedly debunked. But the Trump campaign officials took notice and reached out to Hampton that same day. “I would like to obtain as much information as possible,” a Trump campaign staffer emailed Hampton at the time, according to documents released as part of a public records request and first reported by the Washington Post. In early December, Hampton then delayed certification of Joe Biden’s win in Georgia by refusing to validate the recount results by a key deadline. Coffee County was the only county in Georgia that failed to certify its election results due to issues raised by Hampton at the time. Hampton also posted a video online claiming to expose problems with the county’s Dominion voting system. That video was used by Trump’s lawyers, including Giuliani, as part of their push to convince legislators from multiple states that there was evidence the 2020 election results were tainted by voting system issues. Text messages and other documents obtained by CNN show Trump allies were seeking access to Coffee County’s voting system by mid-December amid increasing demands for proof of widespread election fraud. Coffee County was specifically cited in draft executive orders for seizing voting machines that were presented to Trump on December 18, 2020, during a chaotic Oval Office meeting, CNN has reported. During that same meeting, Giuliani alluded to a plan to gain “voluntary access” to machines in Georgia, according to testimony from him and others before the House January 6 committee. Days later, Hampton shared the written invitation to access the county’s election office with a Trump lawyer, text messages obtained by CNN show. She and another location elections official, Cathy Latham, allegedly helped Trump operatives gain access to the county’s voting systems, according to documents, testimony and surveillance video produced as part of a long-running civil lawsuit focused on election security in Georgia. Latham, who also served as a fake elector from Georgia after the 2020 election, has come under scrutiny for her role in the Coffee County breach after surveillance video showed she allowed unauthorized outsiders to spend hours examining voting systems there. https://www.cnn.com/2023/08/13/politics/coffee-county-georgia-voting-system-breach-trump/ 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WestCanMan Posted August 14, 2023 Report Share Posted August 14, 2023 On 8/11/2023 at 4:21 AM, myata said: You always forget - or just cannot get? it's about the reality, not words. They aren't the same, see "fixed North Korea", "stolen election" and many other of the Clown Idol's lies. All you do is spout words, never facts. It's kind of ironic that you'd draw attention to this topic. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WestCanMan Posted August 14, 2023 Report Share Posted August 14, 2023 On 8/11/2023 at 5:18 AM, Rebound said: Dude, then get it through your ultra-thick skull: Trump definitely, absolutely, positively KNEW he lost. His daughter knew it. His entire political team knew it. He knew it because one expert after another told him face to face that he’d lost. Buddy, at 10PM on election night, when CNN strangely proclaimed that the 2020 election was 100% legitimate, I knew that Trump had "lost". What do you think about the fact that the world's biggest election deniers/cheaters suddenly declared the election fraud free? Isn't that just a bit weird? Doesn't it make you wonder? Quote He lied to his own supermodel wife about the pornstars (plural) who he had sex with while she was pregnant. And he cheated on his three wives before that. So don’t think the man won’t lie to you. He did. Of course he lies about banging supermodels, pornstars and Playboy bunnies. You'd bang those women too if you got the chance, then you'd lie about it too because you lie about everything, even when you have virtually nothing at stake. Who are you to complain about someone else's lying? Do I think that Trump was being honest when he said that he thought the Dems cheated? Buddy, we all know that they cheated because it's what they do. Did you forget how many times they were caught in the last 8 years? Did you forget that they even had the FBI committing crimes for them? Entrapping hillbillies? Lying about Hunter's laptop to the extent that they got the NYPost kicked off of Twitter? Of course the Dems cheated, they just won't get caught because the people who are supposed to 'catch them cheating' are the same people who cheated with them and committed crimes on their behalf for the last 8 years. Trump would be as stupid as you if he didn't think he was cheated. Quote To be more clear: Nobody told Donald Trump that he had won. Nobody, except maybe pillow guy and Sydney Powell, who are both being sued for over $1 billion each over their election lies. You can be as clear as you want, it doesn't make your comments honest or truthful. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
theMadArtist Posted November 2, 2023 Report Share Posted November 2, 2023 I saw this MYSELF on the news! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
robosmith Posted November 2, 2023 Author Report Share Posted November 2, 2023 (edited) On 8/14/2023 at 11:38 AM, WestCanMan said: Do I think that Trump was being honest when he said that he thought the Dems cheated? Buddy, we all know that they cheated because it's what they do. Your circular reasoning is impeccably stupid. You just believe what FOS LIES tells you and COULD NOT have first hand knowledge from Canada. Trump's own STOOGE BARR (ON VIDEO TAPE) told him there was insufficient evidence of fraud to change the election outcome. As did the 60+ judges in the court cases that Trump brought. When you don't have EVIDENCE OF FRAUD, ALL YOU HAVE is the CERTIFIED VOTE COUNT. Edited November 2, 2023 by robosmith Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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