Yzermandius19 Posted November 23, 2019 Report Share Posted November 23, 2019 1 minute ago, intratec said: If people going nuts for your antics doesn't qualify I don't know what does. It's easy to get a real small group fired up, it doesn't translate to winning over enough voters to win an election though. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
intratec Posted November 23, 2019 Report Share Posted November 23, 2019 1 minute ago, Yzermandius19 said: I don't want Biden to prevail. Firing up fringe far lefties is not charisma. Having a small vocal fan base doesn't win elections. I didn't say charisma is the end all be all. As I said, Biden could very well win without it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yzermandius19 Posted November 23, 2019 Report Share Posted November 23, 2019 1 minute ago, bush_cheney2004 said: Oh yes it is.....Sleepy Joe cannot do it...never could. Now he faces witness hearings in the U.S. Senate if Trump is impeached. Hope he can stay awake for that. Fringe far lefties don't need to be fired up is not as important as not alienating the center. Biden is more charismatic to everyone who isn't a far lefty. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
intratec Posted November 23, 2019 Report Share Posted November 23, 2019 1 minute ago, Yzermandius19 said: It's easy to get a real small group fired up, it doesn't translate to winning over enough voters to win an election though. It's not that small. It's not like he's trouncing everyone. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yzermandius19 Posted November 23, 2019 Report Share Posted November 23, 2019 Just now, intratec said: I didn't say charisma is the end all be all. As I said, Biden could very well win without it. One of the reasons he can win without it is his competition has even less of it than he does. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
intratec Posted November 23, 2019 Report Share Posted November 23, 2019 Just now, Yzermandius19 said: Fringe far lefties don't need to be fired up is not as important as not alienating the center. Biden is more charismatic to everyone who isn't a far lefty. Nah, he's not, he's just another Hillary Clinton. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yzermandius19 Posted November 23, 2019 Report Share Posted November 23, 2019 Just now, intratec said: It's not that small. It's not like he's trouncing everyone. The Bernie Bros are not a big enough base to win, and neither are Warren's fans. Biden's base is bigger, his floor is higher than their ceiling. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bush_cheney2004 Posted November 23, 2019 Report Share Posted November 23, 2019 1 minute ago, Yzermandius19 said: Fringe far lefties don't need to be fired up is not as important as not alienating the center. Biden is more charismatic to everyone who isn't a far lefty. Flat out wrong....Joe Biden is a lot of things, but charismatic is not one of them. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
intratec Posted November 23, 2019 Report Share Posted November 23, 2019 Just now, Yzermandius19 said: One of the reasons he can win without it is his competition has even less of it than he does. He's Obama's VP, he'd never get the attention without that going for him. There's plenty of other old white democrats to choose from. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yzermandius19 Posted November 23, 2019 Report Share Posted November 23, 2019 Just now, intratec said: Nah, he's not, he's just another Hillary Clinton. Hillary Clinton is more charismatic than anyone in the 2020 Dem field. /shrugs Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yzermandius19 Posted November 23, 2019 Report Share Posted November 23, 2019 (edited) 2 minutes ago, bush_cheney2004 said: Flat out wrong....Joe Biden is a lot of things, but charismatic is not one of them. Never said he was, just said he's more charismatic than his competition, this time around, because the competition sucks. Edited November 23, 2019 by Yzermandius19 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yzermandius19 Posted November 23, 2019 Report Share Posted November 23, 2019 (edited) 1 minute ago, intratec said: He's Obama's VP, he'd never get the attention without that going for him. There's plenty of other old white democrats to choose from. Indeed. Obama's VP is enough to give him a higher floor than Bernie or Warren's ceiling. How fired up your base is, doesn't matter if your base isnt that big. Edited November 23, 2019 by Yzermandius19 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bush_cheney2004 Posted November 23, 2019 Report Share Posted November 23, 2019 Just now, Yzermandius19 said: Never said he was, just said he's more charismatic than his competition. Still flat out wrong....see 2016...."Bernie Sanders" Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yzermandius19 Posted November 23, 2019 Report Share Posted November 23, 2019 (edited) 1 minute ago, bush_cheney2004 said: Still flat out wrong....see 2016...."Bernie Sanders" Bernie Sanders is not charismatic. He has a small hardcore base of supporters, and no appeal outside that, Biden has appeal beyond his base, and it's a larger base. If it was Biden and Clinton one-on-one in 2008, he would have done better against her than Bernie Sanders did in 2016. Edited November 23, 2019 by Yzermandius19 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
intratec Posted November 23, 2019 Report Share Posted November 23, 2019 (edited) 4 minutes ago, Yzermandius19 said: Hillary Clinton is more charismatic than anyone in the 2020 Dem field. /shrugs Like watching paint dry while getting screeched at by a lunch lady. She was to be the first woman president, riding on Obama's legacy, nothing more, only to be completely blindsided by Trump. Edited November 23, 2019 by intratec Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yzermandius19 Posted November 23, 2019 Report Share Posted November 23, 2019 Just now, intratec said: Like watching paint dry while getting screeched at by a lunch lady. She was the be the first woman president, riding on Obama's legacy, only to be completely blindsided by Trump. Agreed. But this field has even less charisma than she had, that's how weak this field is, and people are still trying to pretend Biden is doomed. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
intratec Posted November 23, 2019 Report Share Posted November 23, 2019 I don't think he's doomed. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bush_cheney2004 Posted November 23, 2019 Report Share Posted November 23, 2019 2 minutes ago, Yzermandius19 said: Bernie Sanders is not charismatic. He has a small hardcore base of supporters, and no appeal outside that, Biden has appeal beyond his base, and it's a larger base. If it was Biden and Clinton one-on-one in 2008, he would have done better against her than Bernie Sanders did in 2016. Nevertheless, Sanders (2016) outperformed Biden (2008) against Hillary Clinton. Joe Biden is a dozing stiff hoping to ride Obama good times into the White House. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yzermandius19 Posted November 23, 2019 Report Share Posted November 23, 2019 Just now, intratec said: I don't think he's doomed. Lots of supposed political experts keep writing him off, despite him being the frontrunner, and it's completely unwarranted. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yzermandius19 Posted November 23, 2019 Report Share Posted November 23, 2019 Just now, bush_cheney2004 said: Nevertheless, Sanders (2016) outperformed Biden (2008) against Hillary Clinton. Joe Biden is a dozing stiff hoping to ride Obama good times into the White House. That's because Obama stole Biden's voters. Bernie had no one to split the vote with. It was not because he was more charismatic. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
intratec Posted November 23, 2019 Report Share Posted November 23, 2019 Just now, Yzermandius19 said: Lots of supposed political experts keep writing him off, despite him being the frontrunner, and it's completely unwarranted. Agreed. But that's because they're enchanted. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bush_cheney2004 Posted November 23, 2019 Report Share Posted November 23, 2019 Just now, Yzermandius19 said: Lots of supposed political experts keep writing him off, despite him being the frontrunner, and it's completely unwarranted. Here are some "frontrunners" who didn't win jack: https://fivethirtyeight.com/features/bidens-leading-the-primary-race-but-front-runners-dont-always-get-nominated/ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yzermandius19 Posted November 23, 2019 Report Share Posted November 23, 2019 (edited) 2 minutes ago, bush_cheney2004 said: Here are some "frontrunners" who didn't win jack: https://fivethirtyeight.com/features/bidens-leading-the-primary-race-but-front-runners-dont-always-get-nominated/ Some frontrunners losing is not grounds to write off Biden. Edited November 23, 2019 by Yzermandius19 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bush_cheney2004 Posted November 23, 2019 Report Share Posted November 23, 2019 (edited) 1 minute ago, Yzermandius19 said: Some frontrunners losing is not grounds to write off Biden. "Frontrunner" must mean a lot more to you than actual American voters. Edited November 23, 2019 by bush_cheney2004 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yzermandius19 Posted November 23, 2019 Report Share Posted November 23, 2019 (edited) 1 minute ago, bush_cheney2004 said: "Frontrunner" must mean a lot more to you than actual American voters. Being a frontrunner, for as long as he's been the frontrunner, is not a bad thing, especially this late in the game. None of the other frontrunners were frontrunners as long as Biden, except Clinton, and there is no Obama in 2020 to stop Biden like there was for Hillary in 2008. You have one example of a frontrunner this durable losing, and it's a clear outlier. Being a frontrunner for this long, and at this point in the game, is far more important to actual American voters, than you think it is. Edited November 23, 2019 by Yzermandius19 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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