Neil Austen Posted May 20, 2019 Report Share Posted May 20, 2019 Trump continues to say China pays for the tariffs. What? U.S. Importers pays for the tariffs and then pass the costs to U.S. consumers. China does not pay a single cent for U.S. tariffs. China may sell less stuff, but the ones paying more for nearly everything on their store shelves are Americans. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OftenWrong Posted May 20, 2019 Report Share Posted May 20, 2019 Globalists and their supporters are angry that Donald Trump has imposed tariffs, because it means they can no longer cash in on China's unfair advantage. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bush_cheney2004 Posted May 20, 2019 Report Share Posted May 20, 2019 6 minutes ago, OftenWrong said: Globalists and their supporters are angry that Donald Trump has imposed tariffs, because it means they can no longer cash in on China's unfair advantage. Agreed....tariffs are the monkey wrench that Trump is using to disrupt status quo globalism, regardless of who pays. Trump is doing exactly what he said he would do about China and the slow WTO bureaucracy that protects entrenched globalism. As an American consumer, I have not been impacted by tariffs at the retail level, and the latest round of hikes will take weeks to be realized on Chinese goods still in transit to U.S. ports. Farmers are getting squeezed right now. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eyeball Posted May 20, 2019 Report Share Posted May 20, 2019 3 hours ago, OftenWrong said: Globalists and their supporters are angry that Donald Trump has imposed tariffs, because it means they can no longer cash in on China's unfair advantage. Hmmm... Quote The term "globalist" has been used a pejorative for political enemies who are perceived as too "cosmopolitan" or favoring international projects over national ones. For example, during the election and presidency of United States president Donald Trump and members of his administration used the term globalist on multiple occasions, associating the term specifically with Jewish critics of the Trump Administration. The administration was accused of using the term as an anti-Semitic "dog whistle", to associate their critics with a Jewish conspiracy. Wiki Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eyeball Posted May 20, 2019 Report Share Posted May 20, 2019 3 hours ago, bush_cheney2004 said: Agreed....tariffs are the monkey wrench that Trump is using to disrupt status quo globalism, regardless of who pays. Trump is doing exactly what he said he would do about China and the slow WTO bureaucracy that protects entrenched globalism. You in the meantime sound like a left wing loon chortling over capitalism's imminent nadir and the triumph of anarchy. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bush_cheney2004 Posted May 20, 2019 Report Share Posted May 20, 2019 35 minutes ago, eyeball said: You in the meantime sound like a left wing loon chortling over capitalism's imminent nadir and the triumph of anarchy. Capitalism is doing fine thank you very much....Trump is just more creative destruction. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OftenWrong Posted May 20, 2019 Report Share Posted May 20, 2019 8 hours ago, eyeball said: Hmmm... Feeling silly, are we? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eyeball Posted May 20, 2019 Report Share Posted May 20, 2019 15 minutes ago, OftenWrong said: Feeling silly, are we? Amused actually. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OftenWrong Posted May 20, 2019 Report Share Posted May 20, 2019 1 minute ago, eyeball said: Amused actually. Amused that China and other third-world countries, who use their lower standards to make even more profit should be penalized by applying tariffs? Or something else Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eyeball Posted May 20, 2019 Report Share Posted May 20, 2019 5 minutes ago, OftenWrong said: Or something else You and BushCheney seem to think you're talking about the same thing. That's amusing. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OftenWrong Posted May 20, 2019 Report Share Posted May 20, 2019 4 minutes ago, eyeball said: You and BushCheney seem to think you're talking about the same thing. That's amusing. If by that you mean, I would go with doing business with USA while you perhaps side with the Chinese, I agree. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GostHacked Posted May 20, 2019 Report Share Posted May 20, 2019 8 hours ago, bush_cheney2004 said: Capitalism is doing fine thank you very much....Trump is just more creative destruction. Yes capitalism is doing fine ... in China. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eyeball Posted May 20, 2019 Report Share Posted May 20, 2019 20 minutes ago, OftenWrong said: If by that you mean, I would go with doing business with USA while you perhaps side with the Chinese, I agree. No, that's not what I meant. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Carlus Magnus Posted May 20, 2019 Report Share Posted May 20, 2019 Tarriffs are a Sales Tax. Trump is doing fine using these taxes to promote the kind of activity that benefits the US. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Hardner Posted May 20, 2019 Report Share Posted May 20, 2019 6 minutes ago, Carlus Magnus said: Tarriffs are a Sales Tax. Trump is doing fine using these taxes to promote the kind of activity that benefits the US. A sales tax, paired with an export tax. The weird thing is that Trump's base, despite hating China and all, includes farmers that count China as customers. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Carlus Magnus Posted May 20, 2019 Report Share Posted May 20, 2019 Tarriffs aren't the end of the world. There are other markets out there. Trump Admin just got Japan to drop restrictions on US Beef. Opening up a new $200 Million a year market. https://news.yahoo.com/1-japan-opens-doors-full-134305953.html 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OftenWrong Posted May 20, 2019 Report Share Posted May 20, 2019 49 minutes ago, eyeball said: No, that's not what I meant. I have no idea why you insisted on bringing antisemitism into this. Maybe you and @Michael Hardner can let us in on the joke, since he finds your comment so amusing. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OftenWrong Posted May 20, 2019 Report Share Posted May 20, 2019 Nice. 2-0 for OftenWrong, hey? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eyeball Posted May 20, 2019 Report Share Posted May 20, 2019 (edited) 3 hours ago, OftenWrong said: I have no idea why you insisted on bringing antisemitism into this. You're the one who brought antisemites into this not me. That was what made it so funny. What's going to be even funnier is watching you pretend you don't know what the fuck you're talking about. Edited May 20, 2019 by eyeball Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OftenWrong Posted May 20, 2019 Report Share Posted May 20, 2019 3 hours ago, eyeball said: You're the one who brought antisemites into this not me. That was what made it so funny. What's going to be even funnier is watching you pretend you don't know what the fuck you're talking about. I was talking about multi-national corporations and their ability to influence laws in countries that they do business in. People cannot vote for corporations, so they must seek out and elect government leaders who are willing to limit the power of the corporations. Absolutely nothing to do with the Jews. I know what I am talking about, but have no idea what you are talking about. You see rather discombobulated, Bob. Now go and twist your knickers in a bunch. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eyeball Posted May 21, 2019 Report Share Posted May 21, 2019 3 hours ago, OftenWrong said: I was talking about multi-national corporations and their ability to influence laws in countries that they do business in. People cannot vote for corporations, so they must seek out and elect government leaders who are willing to limit the power of the corporations. Yes we warned you people about globalization decades ago but all you did was lol, refer to Mao et al and vote for politicians that couldn't be influenced by corporations fast enough. Quote Absolutely nothing to do with the Jews. It had everything to do with antisemitism when you said globalists in the context of anger towards Trump. DONALD TRUMP KEEPS CALLING ADVERSARIES ‘GLOBALISTS,’ DESPITE WARNINGS IT’S ANTI-SEMITIC Quote Globalism: A Far-Right Conspiracy Theory Buoyed by Trump “Globalism is a principle driver for the fears that animate the radical right in the United States,” said Ryan Lenz, the editor of Hatewatch, a blog published by the Southern Poverty Law Center. “It is the enemy, ultimately.” What Is Globalism? Globalism is often used as a synonym for globalization, the system of global economic interconnection that has been critiqued for decades by liberal groups like labor unions, environmental organizations and opponents of the International Monetary Fund and the World Bank. But for the far right, the term encapsulates a conspiratorial worldview based on racism, xenophobia and anti-Semitism, according to Mark Pitcavage, a researcher at the Anti-Defamation League. In any case if you can be taken at your word and assuming you actually do understand wtf is going on, its good to see you finally joining liberal groups like labour unions, environmental organizations and opponents of the International Monetary Fund and the World Bank. This still leave the mystery of why Bushcheney agreed with you. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
egghead Posted May 21, 2019 Report Share Posted May 21, 2019 On 5/19/2019 at 6:57 PM, bush_cheney2004 said: Agreed....tariffs are the monkey wrench that Trump is using to disrupt status quo globalism, regardless of who pays. Trump is doing exactly what he said he would do about China and the slow WTO bureaucracy that protects entrenched globalism. As an American consumer, I have not been impacted by tariffs at the retail level, and the latest round of hikes will take weeks to be realized on Chinese goods still in transit to U.S. ports. Farmers are getting squeezed right now. You don't feel the tariffs because Companies in China "eat" the tariffs, and gave ~10% off to the US importers. With 25% tariffs, you will see the difference between before tariffs and after tariffs Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bush_cheney2004 Posted May 21, 2019 Report Share Posted May 21, 2019 3 minutes ago, egghead said: You don't feel the tariffs because Companies in China "eat" the tariffs, and gave ~10% off to the US importers. With 25% tariffs, you will see the difference between before tariffs and after tariffs Maybe, but U.S. customs has been collecting billions of dollars from U.S. importers for decades, long before Trump. The wholesale cost of imported goods on the harmonized tariff schedule is far less than distributor or retail prices. Farmers were in trouble before Trump's added tariffs, especially dairy farmers, where there is too much subsidized production. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OftenWrong Posted May 21, 2019 Report Share Posted May 21, 2019 19 hours ago, eyeball said: Yes we warned you people about globalization decades ago but all you did was lol, refer to Mao et al and vote for politicians that couldn't be influenced by corporations fast enough. If the position decades ago was to oppose China, then I don't see any inconsistency here. Everything is just right. At no point was there inconsistency in our position to take action that limits China's power, preferably such that our own power increases. That is the game here, still is and ever was. I know these are complex matters that require much careful thought and consideration, which is not exactly everyone's forte. As to your absurd ravings about some definition of "globalists", you keep insisting on it, but that is the definition you have chosen, not I. It has nothing to do with what is being discussed here, and I see no reason to change my use of it. If it is true that Donald Trump likes to use it as well, that's fine. President Donald Trump and I agree on that one. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eyeball Posted May 21, 2019 Report Share Posted May 21, 2019 (edited) 36 minutes ago, OftenWrong said: If the position decades ago was to oppose China, then I don't see any inconsistency here. Everything is just right. At no point was there inconsistency in our position to take action that limits China's power, preferably such that our own power increases. That is the game here, still is and ever was. The game was not just China though, however much you'd like to pretend it was. You yourself very clearly and very specifically said multi-national corporations and their ability to influence laws in countries that they do business in - countries you said, not just one country, China. You've very clearly said that you oppose the same globalization that you people have been spitting on others for opposing for decades. You've got some bloody nerve opining about inconsistency. Quote I know these are complex matters that require much careful thought and consideration, which is not exactly everyone's forte. Well, you should try thinking and considering harder I guess. Here's my advice, get back on that stupid elephant and ride it properly. Quote As to your absurd ravings about some definition of "globalists", you keep insisting on it, but that is the definition you have chosen, not I. It has nothing to do with what is being discussed here, and I see no reason to change my use of it. If it is true that Donald Trump likes to use it as well, that's fine. President Donald Trump and I agree on that one. It is absurd that lefties have to hound you people on the specific definitions and exact meanings behind every word you say but its because you're all weasels to the core - take the abovementioned example of you switching globalization's goalposts from countries to just one for example - as it still is and ever was you said. Why the fuck do you think they called it globalization and not Chinaization? As always, it's still a mystery just what BushCheney meant when he said he agreed with you. Edited May 21, 2019 by eyeball Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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