Trudeau lying about SNC

Realitycheck · March 30, 2019

Just now, Zeitgeist said:

Without a DPA SNC, as a Canadian headquartered operation, can be banned from doing business for 10 years. It’s called using a bat to kill a fly. Criminal convictions for the individuals involved and fines for the company are the answer, and these are provided through a DPA.

SNC has already been banned from many government opportunities. 5 years ago SNC managed every federal building in the country. Today, they manage none and yet, seem to still be a perfectly viable company world-wide. World-wide. Did you read that? They don't need Canadian government business. In fact BC is considering them right now for a major provincial contract. Now, your "fly" is more of an octopus with tentacles around the globe even though it has already been handed severe penalties by other countries. It just is not right to condone criminality which is what a DPA would do.

Realitycheck · March 30, 2019

1 minute ago, mowich said:

Right you are, it wasn't illegal - unethical and questionable? That's another matter altogether.

Not the least bit unethical or questionable. I repeat, it is done every day across the country. You are just ticked because she proved that clown and the PM to be liars.

mowich · March 30, 2019

8 minutes ago, Realitycheck said:

Our milquetoast PM is paralyzed by indecision. No matter what he does, he'll piss off some group. But if he boots these two fine ladies, his opponents will cheer mightily. The government is suffering a crises of conscience. For the first time in Canadian history, two politicians hev displayed both morals and ethics and the old boys club doesn't know what do do about this shocking breach of political chicanery.

The 'old boys club' as you refer to the party knows exactly what should be done with these two women and I expect that they will be taken care of in short order. Neither of them are lacking in intelligence and had to know that they would effectively become the pariahs they are once they decided to go against their own party.

Realitycheck · March 30, 2019

5 minutes ago, mowich said:

"The federal justice minister has said the country “can and must do better” after a white farmer was acquitted in the shooting death of a young Indigenous man ...."

https://globalnews.ca/news/4018386/federal-justice-minister-gerald-stanley/

And well he should have been acquitted. A group of marauders, fresh from raiding a nearby farm, attacked his property and attempted to steal two vehicles. Had the miscreants been white, no-body would have said a thing.

Realitycheck · March 30, 2019

1 minute ago, mowich said:

The 'old boys club' as you refer to the party knows exactly what should be done with these two women and I expect that they will be taken care of in short order. Neither of them are lacking in intelligence and had to know that they would effectively become the pariahs they are once they decided to go against their own party.

All parties are members of the old boys club. I don't think the PM has the testicular fortitude to boot the ladies. Will the caucus? At their peril. The ranks of the Liberal caucus will be devastated of the do so. These two courageous women have the sympathy of the nation-save for a few purblind folks like yourself.

mowich · March 30, 2019

4 minutes ago, Realitycheck said:

Not the least bit unethical or questionable. I repeat, it is done every day across the country. You are just ticked because she proved that clown and the PM to be liars.

Ticked? Not at all, I could not be happier to see this government go down in flames as they so richly deserve to.

mowich · March 30, 2019

4 minutes ago, Realitycheck said:

And well he should have been acquitted. A group of marauders, fresh from raiding a nearby farm, attacked his property and attempted to steal two vehicles. Had the miscreants been white, no-body would have said a thing.

Oh I agree completely. I posted that as an example of someone in the position of AG who had no business commenting on a jury's verdict.

mowich · March 30, 2019

2 minutes ago, Realitycheck said:

All parties are members of the old boys club. I don't think the PM has the testicular fortitude to boot the ladies. Will the caucus? At their peril. The ranks of the Liberal caucus will be devastated of the do so. These two courageous women have the sympathy of the nation-save for a few purblind folks like yourself.

They may indeed have some sympathy among some of the Canadian public - the nation? Not so much.

Zeitgeist · March 30, 2019

8 minutes ago, mowich said:

"The federal justice minister has said the country “can and must do better” after a white farmer was acquitted in the shooting death of a young Indigenous man ...."

https://globalnews.ca/news/4018386/federal-justice-minister-gerald-stanley/

I agree with her on that. Racism and mistreatment of Indigenous people is a reality. It’s hard to know whether a jury is right or wrong without witnessing the trial or knowing all the details. Doesn’t sound like a just outcome though. People had stolen a van and were drinking on his property. He reached inside the van and says his gun went off accidentally. I guess it comes down to whether he was believable. It’s sad and tragic.

Realitycheck · March 30, 2019

4 minutes ago, mowich said:

They may indeed have some sympathy among some of the Canadian public - the nation? Not so much.

Well, they have support across Canada. so...?

Zeitgeist · March 30, 2019

15 minutes ago, Realitycheck said:

Well, they have support across Canada. so...?

Why don’t you recommend that one or both of them run for the party leadership and see where it goes? What a joke. Party politics is like a game of Hearts: Don’t start plotting and undermining the party leadership unless you really think you can get all the hearts and total control. I actually think JWR thinks or thought she could do this. Again, let the party membership decide and then let the country decide. My guess is that the Libs are gone in the next election. Scheer should at least send JWR a thank you card.

Edited March 30, 2019 by Zeitgeist

Zeitgeist · March 30, 2019

35 minutes ago, Realitycheck said:

SNC has already been banned from many government opportunities. 5 years ago SNC managed every federal building in the country. Today, they manage none and yet, seem to still be a perfectly viable company world-wide. World-wide. Did you read that? They don't need Canadian government business. In fact BC is considering them right now for a major provincial contract. Now, your "fly" is more of an octopus with tentacles around the globe even though it has already been handed severe penalties by other countries. It just is not right to condone criminality which is what a DPA would do.

So if a 10 year ban on contracts is the answer as you seem to indicate, what reason is there for SNC to continue operations in Canada?

Realitycheck · March 30, 2019

5 minutes ago, Zeitgeist said:

So if a 10 year ban on contracts is the answer as you seem to indicate, what reason is there for SNC to continue operations in Canada?

Well, for one thing, as noted above, they are not banned from provincial or civil contracts. Further, as mentioned at least twice earlier, they have a contractual obligation to stay in Quebec for at least another 5 years. Lots of work they can still bid on.

Zeitgeist · March 30, 2019

6 minutes ago, Realitycheck said:

Well, for one thing, as noted above, they are not banned from provincial or civil contracts. Further, as mentioned at least twice earlier, they have a contractual obligation to stay in Quebec for at least another 5 years. Lots of work they can still bid on.

But what is the advantage of maintaining a head office in a country where they can’t bid on federal contracts? Much infrastructure work in the provinces is paid for in part with federal funding. Also, ports, rail, military, pipelines, and some major highways are federal.

Edited March 30, 2019 by Zeitgeist

Realitycheck · March 30, 2019

5 minutes ago, Zeitgeist said:

But what is the advantage of maintaining a head office in a country where they can’t bid on federal contracts? Much infrastructure work in the provinces is paid for in part with federal funding. Also, ports, rail, military, pipelines, and some major highways are federal.

They should have taken that into consideration before the committed their many crimes.

Zeitgeist · March 30, 2019

Just now, Realitycheck said:

They should have taken that into consideration before the committed their many crimes.

See that’s where I get off the inquisition boat. There are ways to penalize the guilty parties without hurting thousands of innocent workers and deep sixing the company. So why not consider those options? It makes me wonder what other points of principle JWR would make in a position of authority and who would pay the price.

OftenWrong · March 30, 2019

14 minutes ago, Zeitgeist said:

See that’s where I get off the inquisition boat. There are ways to penalize the guilty parties without hurting thousands of innocent workers and deep sixing the company. So why not consider those options?

We bail these big companies out financially, and now they need to be bailed out legally too? My, such ethical business practices.

Canadian people have already seen that the "too big to fail" argument is totally flawed, and useless waste of money. Let them take the fall.

egghead · March 30, 2019

3 hours ago, Zeitgeist said:

You’re just radical special interest. NDP and Greens. Going nowhere.

Ya, NDP and GREENS can not win, but they can make Liberals not win :rolleyes:

PIK · March 30, 2019

1 hour ago, Zeitgeist said:

But what is the advantage of maintaining a head office in a country where they can’t bid on federal contracts? Much infrastructure work in the provinces is paid for in part with federal funding. Also, ports, rail, military, pipelines, and some major highways are federal.

And they have totally screwed up ottawa's LRT.

Zeitgeist · March 30, 2019

57 minutes ago, OftenWrong said:

We bail these big companies out financially, and now they need to be bailed out legally too? My, such ethical business practices.

Canadian people have already seen that the "too big to fail" argument is totally flawed, and useless waste of money. Let them take the fall.

I find it funny that people expect Canadian companies to thrive when we’re so willing to undermine our own in this period of economic nationalism. China prints its own money to build the infrastructure of the future, steals intellectual property, and controls the value of its currency to remain competitive. The US imposes tariffs on other countries, relying on the value of its markets to other countries’ exporters. Canada takes a gun to its businesses when they fall short of higher ethical standards than the ones businesses in other countries face. It’s fine. SNC head offices can move south and employ Americans instead of Canadians. You can buy your cell phones from Huawai as it commits fraud and incarcerates Canadians as political prisoners. As the last Canadian made GM cars role off the assembly line, take heart that you can buy an imported one from the US and continue to fill it with Saudi oil. No matter what happens legally to SNC, they won’t be building any pipelines to send Canadian oil east because there won’t be any new Canadian pipelines, as the eco warriors and hereditary chiefs maintain their roadblocks. We may have diminishing tax revenue from our oil and gas sector, but hopefully we still have enough to spend on unemployment programs for newly unemployed auto workers and engineers.

Edited March 30, 2019 by Zeitgeist

Realitycheck · March 30, 2019

1 hour ago, Zeitgeist said:

See that’s where I get off the inquisition boat. There are ways to penalize the guilty parties without hurting thousands of innocent workers and deep sixing the company. So why not consider those options? It makes me wonder what other points of principle JWR would make in a position of authority and who would pay the price.

Your horse is dead. Stop beating it. SNC will not, cannot leave Canada.

Realitycheck · March 30, 2019

43 minutes ago, Zeitgeist said:

I find it funny that people expect Canadian companies to thrive when we’re so willing to undermine our own in this period of economic nationalism. China prints its own money to build the infrastructure of the future, steals intellectual property, and controls the value of its currency to remain competitive. The US imposes tariffs on other countries, relying on the value of its markets to other countries’ exporters. Canada takes a gun to its businesses when they fall short of higher ethical standards than the ones businesses in other countries face. It’s fine. SNC head offices can move south and employ Americans instead of Canadians. You can buy your cell phones from Huawai as it commits fraud and incarcerates Canadians as political prisoners. As the last Canadian made GM cars role off the assembly line, take heart that you can buy an imported one from the US and continue to fill it with Saudi oil. No matter what happens legally to SNC, they won’t be building any pipelines to send Canadian oil east because there won’t be any new Canadian pipelines, as the eco warriors and hereditary chiefs maintain their roadblocks. We may have diminishing tax revenue from our oil and gas sector, but hopefully we still have enough to spend on unemployment programs for newly unemployed auto workers and engineers.

More fear-mongering. SNC will not, cannot leave the country.

GostHacked · March 30, 2019

5 hours ago, Zeitgeist said:

The great thing about democracy is that laws can be changed through Parliament. That’s how DPA legislation was introduced. Laws must always be in the public interest. Indeed the public determines them.

Correct, that they can be changed, and the government did change the laws to allow SNC-Lavalin to get a way with decades of corruption. This law is NOT in the public's interest. And no we (the public) did not get to determine this one.

GostHacked · March 30, 2019

1 hour ago, PIK said:

And they have totally screwed up ottawa's LRT.

Almost 2 years late, 1.5 B over budget, trains not vetted for cold environments.. and it's making a mess of traffic on a daily basis in Ottawa. Does their notion of 'share the road' mean I can drive in bus lanes when I need too? The impact it has had on the downtown core during the construction is easily seen by people who commute there every day.

GostHacked · March 30, 2019

10 minutes ago, Realitycheck said:

More fear-mongering. SNC will not, cannot leave the country.

The fear mongering is from SNC-Lavalin themselves. Threatening to move jobs out of country if charged with corruption charges and the like. That is what we call blackmail.