Doug Ford - leader of Ontario PCs

[H10]

7 minutes ago, taxme said:

I can't see how any political leader can win if they say(Horvath)that they want to make Ontario a sanctuary province. Only self-flagellating masochists would vote for a foolish talking person like that and I am pretty sure that liberals would have no problem with the idea of making Ontario a sanctuary province. It would be in their interest to try and get the ethnic vote. 

I don't agree with sanctuary province, let them become citizens and pay taxes like everyone else.

[OftenWrong]

Just now, H10 said:

Which is precisely what they will do, no one is going to waste  a vote on liberals come election day.  It will be an NDP landslide to block a bad candidate as liberal voters all run away.

https://newsinteractives.cbc.ca/onvotes/poll-tracker/

Notice how, on the poll tracker even though it shows the two parties pretty close to equal in the poll, it still shows PC with an 81% chance of winning a majority, and 5% chance of winning a minority? There's a reason why that is.

[H10]

1 hour ago, Centerpiece said:

Good to see so many despondent posters jump back into the fray. I think the last poll by Forum was an outlier with the NDP at 47% - but there's no doubt it's a real horse race. It appears neck and neck right now. The PCs tend to have a very good ground game to get the vote out so that might give them a bit of an advantage. All told, who the heck knows what's going to happen? This is Ontario - home of the self-flagellating masochists. The interesting side show is that in order to actually win, the NDP would have to pummel/destroy/annihilate the Liberal vote - which more than likely would cause them to lose party status. 

Expect  to see an orange tidal wave.  With the liberals have no chance of winning, who would bother to vote for them? Liberals voters are left wing, NDP are left wing, and have a chance to win, why vote for a party with no chance to win?  Half the liberal voters always just voted for liberals because ndp historically had no chance to win.  Ford will block a minimum wage increase which will hurt 1.5 million workers.  That alone is equivalent to the Hudak fire 100,000 people gaff in my mind.  Who the hell is going to vote for a pay cut?

[H10]

3 minutes ago, OftenWrong said:

https://newsinteractives.cbc.ca/onvotes/poll-tracker/

Notice how, on the poll tracker even though it shows the two parties pretty close to equal in the poll, it still shows PC with an 81% chance of winning a majority, and 5% chance of winning a minority? There's a reason why that is.

Yes, because for now, the NDP vote is concentrated as the last few liberal holdouts debate if they should for NDP or hope Liberals come back, but come election day, you are going to see a orange wave.  For now, the conservatives have narrow broader support as the Liberals voters are shifting into NDP.  When that shift is complete, NDP will win ridings they never had a chance to win before.

[Rue]

The seat distribution favours the Tories in the event the Liberal vote goes NDP. For the NDP to get a land slide they wo uld need not only the liberal vote but the left of centre Tory vote.

At this point the NDP is appearing to be getting the Liberal vote. Whether they move on and get sufficient Tory votes is the question. The NDP has traditionally always been concentrated in specific city ridings in Toronto, Windsor and in mining towns or some blue collar towns. Whether its spread out enough this time round is the question.

Clearly a lot of people are not goingt o vote Liberal but predicting an NDP wave is a bit premature.

[Rue]

By the way H10 I am like most Ontarians smack in the centre and I want Wynne out but  I think Horvath's wishful thinking promises of more spending are just feel good sound bite farts she won't be able to deliver on. I don't like Ford but I hate Wynn even more. As a person its hard to find anything negative to say about Horvath. She's always been low key and avoided filth politics. I give her that.

I guess the reality is whether its NDP or Tory that goes in they both will be faced with disasterous over spending limiting them to being forced to make some serious cut backs. Sure the NDP would be more compassionate about those cut backs but I am not sure we can afford that.  The province is bankrupt no matter who runs it. I am holding my nose whoever I vote for. I think Ford is the most realistic and its not his message that bothers me its him as a person. I don't like how he behaved as a municipal politician. I thought he was a disgrace to the city of Toronto and made matters with his brother worse by lying for him. That's not easy to forget. My prediction is a Tory minority at this point.

Edited May 25, 2018 by Rue

[H10]

5 minutes ago, Rue said:

By the way H10 I am like most Ontarians smack in the centre and I want Wynne out and I think Rae's NDP era was a disaster and I think Horvath's wishful thinking promises of more spending is insulting but I do think its resonating. Ford represents going on a diet, Horvath more over-eating. Ironically they are both chubby and talking o chubby Ontarians who are not in the mood to be told go on a diet.  I will admit she is doing a good understated job. Then again Ford is nice and toned down. Both of them have avoided name calling for the most part.

Ford will increase spending like Harris and Eves. The debt will increase no matter who wins. 

[Centerpiece]

Interesting Liberal conundrum. They are in such danger of being decimated - even losing party status - that they now have no choice but to abandon attacks on Ford and throw the kitchen sink at the NDP. Wynne is fighting for the party's political life. 

[BubberMiley]

1 hour ago, taxme said:

In what way is Ford a "Trumpy" candidate? What has he said that gives you that idea? Just wondering? After all you did say that Ford has not released any kind of platform yet. At least Trump did when he was running for president. A bit of a difference there I would say. 

http://www.mapleleafweb.com/forums/topic/27519-doug-ford-leader-of-ontario-pcs/?do=findComment&comment=1292540

[WIP]

7 minutes ago, Centerpiece said:

Interesting Liberal conundrum. They are in such danger of being decimated - even losing party status - that they now have no choice but to abandon attacks on Ford and throw the kitchen sink at the NDP. Wynne is fighting for the party's political life. 

Too late! The Libs are sinking in quicksand and a last minute round of attack ads on the NDP will look like desperation! They gambled that Horvath and the NDP couldn't get their campaign running again this time and they lost! All of us who make keeping rightwing conservatives out of power the #1 priority will mostly have to pick the NDP candidate...depending on local voting patterns and poll numbers of course.

[taxme]

38 minutes ago, H10 said:

I don't agree with sanctuary province, let them become citizens and pay taxes like everyone else.

They should come in legally and not sneak in the back door. They have no right to become Canadian citizens at all. Just boot them all out the bloody door. Works for me. 

[WIP]

37 minutes ago, OftenWrong said:

https://newsinteractives.cbc.ca/onvotes/poll-tracker/

Notice how, on the poll tracker even though it shows the two parties pretty close to equal in the poll, it still shows PC with an 81% chance of winning a majority, and 5% chance of winning a minority? There's a reason why that is.

Yeah, and those poll trackers worked so well for Hillary Clinton two years ago, didn't they?

I still say today's post-Harper Conservatives have made so many enemies in the middle and on the left that no Tory candidates are trusted anymore! Especially when they promise virtually the same funding as the other two parties while cutting taxes and balancing the budget....like Doug Trump.

[WIP]

23 minutes ago, H10 said:

Ford will increase spending like Harris and Eves. The debt will increase no matter who wins. 

I'm reminded again that Milton Friedman advised Ronald Reagan and his cabinet back in 1980..when the Dems controlled Congress to just go ahead and slash taxes without trying to fight Congress over spending..and just blow a hole through the deficit. Friedman's reasoning was that as debt levels increased, future presidents of either party would have no choice other than to cut spending on domestic priorities....and this has been a conservative strategy ever since!

[taxme]

On 5/15/2018 at 11:51 AM, BubberMiley said:

No, they pretty much always have a platform, often a very detailed one. Neither Ford nor Trump offer much in terms of policy and nothing in terms of how they would pay for it without raising taxes or going into debt. 

And 95% of politicians aren't right-wing populists. That's ridiculous.

And few politicians try to use the MSM as a symbol of their oppression like Ford and Trump do too. They are very much cut of the same clothe and they appeal to exactly the same limited demographic in the same way.

The problem with the MSM in America is that they will not give any good grades for what Trump is doing. They only want to make him always look bad. I guess the reason for that is that the their hero's the dumbocrats have no good ideas themselves as to how to make America great again. Ford cannot be any worse than those two other misfits that like to call themselves politicians. Those two offer nothing be grief and sorrow and more taxes for the taxpayer's of Canada. How can Ford make things any worse than what Wynne has done already? You think that the NDP will be any different than the lieberals? Come on, get real. 

[H10]

1 minute ago, WIP said:

I'm reminded again that Milton Friedman advised Ronald Reagan and his cabinet back in 1980..when the Dems controlled Congress to just go ahead and slash taxes without trying to fight Congress over spending..and just blow a hole through the deficit. Friedman's reasoning was that as debt levels increased, future presidents of either party would have no choice other than to cut spending on domestic priorities....and this has been a conservative strategy ever since!

This seems more realistic, conservatives create massive deficits through massive spending programs and tax cuts, then claim we have a debt problem, which they created and of course, only conservatism can stop.  It is a pretty clever plan when you think about it.  Create a problem, then claim you are the only solution to the problem you made.  That would be like a tire store owner who also owns a sprinkler/security company slashing tires at night and burning down other tire shops to get business and the only solution of course is to hand him your money.

[OftenWrong]

7 minutes ago, WIP said:

Yeah, and those poll trackers worked so well for Hillary Clinton two years ago, didn't they?

One should first understand what polls actually mean before using them, let alone criticizing them.

[H10]

Just now, taxme said:

The problem with the MSM in America is that they will not give any good grades for what Trump is doing. They only want to make him always look bad. I guess the reason for that is that the their hero's the dumbocrats have no good ideas themselves as to how to make America great again. Ford cannot be any worse than those two other misfits that like to call themselves politicians. Those two offer nothing be grief and sorrow and more taxes for the taxpayer's of Canada. How can Ford make things any worse than what Wynne has done already? You think that the NDP will be any different than the lieberals? Come on, get real. 

What good has Trump done?

Ford doesn't even have a platform in writing and its two weeks before the election.  How the hell is he going to run the province, when he can't even make a platform in time?

Ford can make it worse by having no plan causing the shutdown of th eprovince like other hell hole nations run by incompetent right wing leaders.

 

Ever seen Bulgaria, that is where we are heading under an incompetent leader, they really should have picked someone else to lead.

[WIP]

3 minutes ago, taxme said:

The problem with the MSM in America is that they will not give any good grades for what Trump is doing. They only want to make him always look bad. I guess the reason for that is that the their hero's the dumbocrats have no good ideas themselves as to how to make America great again. Ford cannot be any worse than those two other misfits that like to call themselves politicians. Those two offer nothing be grief and sorrow and more taxes for the taxpayer's of Canada. How can Ford make things any worse than what Wynne has done already? You think that the NDP will be any different than the lieberals? Come on, get real. 

I've tried to remind a frequent conservative poster here that it was Conservative or....at least a string of PC governments in the past who set the course for Ontario Hydro, first by prioritizing nuclear sinkholes (with a couple of coal-fired stations) and then coming up with this wonderful privatization idea that created Hydro One and was supposed to get the province out of debt. But that frequent flyer considers everything that happened more than five years ago THE PAST...so I don't bother anymore!

[H10]

Just now, WIP said:

I've tried to remind a frequent conservative poster here that it was Conservative or....at least a string of PC governments in the past who set the course for Ontario Hydro, first by prioritizing nuclear sinkholes (with a couple of coal-fired stations) and then coming up with this wonderful privatization idea that created Hydro One and was supposed to get the province out of debt. But that frequent flyer considers everything that happened more than five years ago THE PAST...so I don't bother anymore!

They don't want to talk about selling a $5 billion ighway for $1 billion to a spanish company.  Conservatives destroyed the province.

[WIP]

5 minutes ago, OftenWrong said:

One should first understand what polls actually mean before using them, let alone criticizing them.

If only the people who created those polls understood them! All I know is CNN was fun viewing on Election Night as Clinton's odds of winning went from 99% thru the floor, and CNN's panel of "experts" were panicked and left stumbling and mumbling.

[taxme]

9 minutes ago, WIP said:

Yeah, and those poll trackers worked so well for Hillary Clinton two years ago, didn't they?

I still say today's post-Harper Conservatives have made so many enemies in the middle and on the left that no Tory candidates are trusted anymore! Especially when they promise virtually the same funding as the other two parties while cutting taxes and balancing the budget....like Doug Trump.

That liberal poll was meant to make the dummies believe that she would win the election so vote for her. Thank gawd the people did not believe that poll. So, the NDP and the lieberals can be trusted, eh? LOL. What planet are you from? Those two so called political party's are a laugh in themselves. Look at what Wynne has done to Ontario. Do you really think that the NDP will do any better? Sure, what will get the NDP elected will be her wanting to make Ontario a sanctuary province. WOW, saying that should get her a majority government alright. LOL. That is just what the Ontario taxpayer's need is more welfare refugee bums on their tax paying payroll. What have the Ontario voters got to lose by voting for Doug(Trump)Ford? Maybe a less corrupt and less crooked spend crazy liberal/socialist government? Between those two loser party's I am not sure as to which one I would put first in the dumb or dumber column. 

[WIP]

3 minutes ago, H10 said:

They don't want to talk about selling a $5 billion ighway for $1 billion to a spanish company.  Conservatives destroyed the province.

In Hamilton, we had to buy back the city's waste treatment plant and deal with the costs of upgrades after it had all been privatized to some grifter who failed to live up to agreements to upgrade and modernize the facilities after a rate increase. And conservatives wonder why Hamilton is so unfriendly to their market agenda.

[taxme]

11 minutes ago, OftenWrong said:

One should first understand what polls actually mean before using them, let alone criticizing them.

The only poll that really works is the one that takes place on election day. 

[bush_cheney2004]

Amazing how Trump dominates the psyche and dynamics of an election in a foreign country.

Trump has magic powers in Canada.

[taxme]

6 minutes ago, WIP said:

If only the people who created those polls understood them! All I know is CNN was fun viewing on Election Night as Clinton's odds of winning went from 99% thru the floor, and CNN's panel of "experts" were panicked and left stumbling and mumbling.

And they are still stumbling and mumbling to this day. They just cannot accept the fact that they lost the election. Trump kicked their azzes which was well deserved. Go, Trump, go.